[POLL] How do YOU think Vampire Skill Line should function?

Rovaeden

I believe one of the reasons, if not the main reason that ZOS butchered the Vampire re-vamp is because they are trying to get a single skill line to do too much.
They either need to make a full triple tree skill line or they need to focus on something.
I believe that focusing the Vampire skill line on being 100% Utility would make it thematically fun to play with while also adding various abilities that the community has been asking for for years, such as a gap closer.
I believe this could help solve the problem of Vampire being either so powerful it is considered best in slot vs being basically worthless like it is now.

Thoughts?

Vevvev

Entirely Utility Focused but Balanced

I voted the way I did because I didn't get a 50/50 combat/utility with a balanced support option. Vampirisim changes the way you live your life and it should include combat and utility options, but should not be stuck as mag only or stam only thing.

The old vampire supported both play styles rather well but the new one is heavily in favor of magicka vamps instead of stamina ones. All stamina vampires get is the passives, an expensive ultimate, and maybe a single vampiric drain morph because it restores 5% of lost stamina ((which is not exactly very useful)). If Eviscerate had a stamina morph that dealt physical damage and caused bleeding, or scaled off max stats, it'd be a lot more versatile than it is now. You can see the devs did put some thought into making stamina vamps a thing but didn't exactly make it easy for them.

DocFrost72

First and foremost, vampires should suck.

Lintashi

I want vampire to be equally good for all classes and roles, without giving advantages or disadvantages. Getting rid of unnatural recovery was a good start, but increased skill cost and reduced health regen made it completely unviable for healers and tanks. I would center vampires abilities around stealth, much as it is now, but made active skills almost the same to dps trees for classes- to include both stam/mag version of each skill, one gap closer, one not bis self heal/shield, one aoe or channeling, one spammable ranged, one melee. Most difficult thing would be balancing them to be different animations, but same in usefullnes to what we have now. So chosing a vampire would be giving you vampire looking abilities, but was not requirement, or nerf to other part of your class/role.

Rovaeden

Entirely Utility Focused but Balanced

DocFrost72 wrote: »

First and foremost, vampires should suck.

Ba Dum Tish!

caperb

75% Combat Focused, 25% Utility

Vampirism in Elder Scrolls has always been very combat focused with a lot of spells. Vampirism should be 0% stamina and just a little bit of utility (or none), which we got now. I think ZOS did a pretty decent job for once, though vampire isn't playable for all characters anymore.

caperb

75% Combat Focused, 25% Utility

Rovaeden wrote: »

I believe one of the reasons, if not the main reason that ZOS butchered the Vampire re-vamp is because they are trying to get a single skill line to do too much.

Also, they didn't butcher the skillline. What they did is:
- made it more focused on magicka, as vampire in Elder Scrolls should be. Werewolf is the stamina counterpart, go play a furry if you want that.
- tweaked some skills in they way they work, but not fundamentally.
- added a lot of skills focused on combat
- made sure the improved vampire skilline synergises very well with some classes and playstyles.

Rovaeden

Entirely Utility Focused but Balanced

caperb wrote: »

Rovaeden wrote: »

I believe one of the reasons, if not the main reason that ZOS butchered the Vampire re-vamp is because they are trying to get a single skill line to do too much.

Also, they didn't butcher the skillline. What they did is:
- made it more focused on magicka, as vampire in Elder Scrolls should be. Werewolf is the stamina counterpart, go play a furry if you want that.
- tweaked some skills in they way they work, but not fundamentally.
- added a lot of skills focused on combat
- made sure the improved vampire skilline synergises very well with some classes and playstyles.

So, basically you are saying you have no idea, because you have not personally played with it yet.

No problem.


I can wait.

Cronopoly

Entirely Combat Focused but Balanced

75% Combat Focused, 25% Utility, but Balanced with all combat skills having both Stam and Mag morphs

Spectral_Force

50% Combat Focused, 50% Utility

Rovaeden wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

First and foremost, vampires should suck.

Ba Dum Tish!

Missed the opportunity to call the last option "Don't care, vampires suck!" Or would that make people pick that just because it's funny? :thinking:

I went with about a 50/50 split, because I think Vampire skills should be augmenting your existing rotation, and it should be equally lucrative to all roles. Focusing too much on combat skills would end up alienating healers (because they are paying the same opportunity cost in terms of vampire weaknesses, but for less gain, since their choice of abilities is narrower). At the same time, focusing too much on utility skills has a risk of making the Vampire skill line universally desired (like it was pre-Greymoor) if it becomes a solution to every problem.
Ideally, I'd like to see builds that only take Vampirism for one or two abilities alongside Vampire-focused builds, and I reckon a 50/50 split would give you a nice balance for that. I believe Vampire characters should be primarily Magicka-focused, though there should be one or two abilities and/or morphs that are useful to Stamina characters as well (either Stamina morphs or abilities that do something universally useful, like Mist Form).

Vietfox

75% Combat Focused, 25% Utility

Based on magicka

Sarannah

There is no vote option for all-round, for all roles. Vampire could have been made into multiple skillines, where players would be able to pick only one skilline. One skilline for tank, one for DPS, one for healer.

lzzy

Sarannah wrote: »

There is no vote option for all-round, for all roles. Vampire could have been made into multiple skillines, where players would be able to pick only one skilline. One skilline for tank, one for DPS, one for healer.

Your idea reminds me of Morrowind's three bloodlines: Aundae, Berne and Quarra that give different bonuses depending on who infects you. That'd have been pretty interesting.

Rovaeden

Entirely Utility Focused but Balanced

Sarannah wrote: »

There is no vote option for all-round, for all roles. Vampire could have been made into multiple skillines, where players would be able to pick only one skilline. One skilline for tank, one for DPS, one for healer.

Honestly, this would be my ideal.
Three distinct skill lines for Vampire (and Werewolf) would allow proper development and balancing of the lines without trying to cram everything into one line and making it end up a mess.

Deathlord92

I want vampire balanced for both stamina and mag builds I believe everyone who likes being a vampire should be able to enjoy it in there builds. Some of us elder scrolls players have been playing vampire since oblivion and maybe even in the older elder scrolls games if you could be one I started in oblivion though.

Sealish

Entirely Combat Focused for Magicka

In my ideal world, both Werewolf and Vampire would do either Physical or Magic damage scaling off your highest resource... but since ZOS doesn't really like to do that too often, I think it should be Magicka based since Werewolf is Stamina based.

I personally think that the skill line should be an entirely combat based skill line that uses Health to cast abilities with a heavy focus on absorbing resources (Health/Magicka/Stamina) from your targets as rider effects. This would make it play much differently than any playstyle currently in the game, but would make it so that people don't feel they need to get it for the utility. It would also allow for the resource cost increase on abilities at high stages to be offset with the resource absorption.

As it stands, even if I didn't ever plan to try the combat skills, the skill line is a must-have for me for the fast stealth walk (and to a lesser extent, invisible run) to make thieving more fun. I feel like ALL non-combat utility skills should be available to all characters on universal skill lines without combat or character altering concequences (Example: Sneak at normal speed and Invisible run -> Dark Brotherhood, Reduced Stealth Radius from Racial Passives -> Ledgerman).

Starlock

Could you give an example of what you mean by "combat" and "utility?" I mean, right now the new skill line is 100% combat related with the exception of the "Blood Ritual" passive...

Rovaeden

Entirely Utility Focused but Balanced

Starlock wrote: »

Could you give an example of what you mean by "combat" and "utility?" I mean, right now the new skill line is 100% combat related with the exception of the "Blood Ritual" passive...

Very broadly, combat means the ability deals damage, resists damage or some would say heals damage.

Utility means the ability affects non-damage related gameplay such as mobility, resource return or reduction, or general quality of life.