LA and HA changes not making it to the live server

BohnT2

@ZOS_BrianWheeler the decision to scratch all of the changes due to the communities feedback is really nice and makes me looking forward to further off-cycle pts patches.

However I do think some of the changes should still make it to the live servers as they make the game better without huge or any drawbacks.

- scaling light and heavy attacks with your highest resource
There is surely someone Roleplay focused who wants to play a sword wielding sorcerer or a destro staff swinging stamina warden. Also in PvP this helps mainly magicka specs with running 1h+s (templar, DK, necromancer) and even helps bringing back meele magicka nightblade

- removal of the move speed penalty of heavy attacks
That's a straight buff for everyone and helps people in both PvE and PvP, both newer and experienced ones

- Reduced channel time for destruction staff and bows
This immensely helps magicka classes and closes a gap that has been in the game for a long time without making it overbearing.

- scaling of heavy attacks
This gives people a benefit for their actions without having a feeling of "losing" all effort because you had to stop the channel a milliseconds too early

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

Irfind

^ this but nooo we* get nothing

*players who liked some off the changes

Xologamer

BohnT2 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler the decision to scratch all of the changes due to the communities feedback is really nice and makes me looking forward to further off-cycle pts patches.

However I do think some of the changes should still make it to the live servers as they make the game better without huge or any drawbacks.

- scaling light and heavy attacks with your highest resource
There is surely someone Roleplay focused who wants to play a sword wielding sorcerer or a destro staff swinging stamina warden. Also in PvP this helps mainly magicka specs with running 1h+s (templar, DK, necromancer) and even helps bringing back meele magicka nightblade

- removal of the move speed penalty of heavy attacks
That's a straight buff for everyone and helps people in both PvE and PvP, both newer and experienced ones

- Reduced channel time for destruction staff and bows
This immensely helps magicka classes and closes a gap that has been in the game for a long time without making it overbearing.

- scaling of heavy attacks
This gives people a benefit for their actions without having a feeling of "losing" all effort because you had to stop the channel a milliseconds too early

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

zos is like u get all or u get nothing...

satanio

BohnT2 wrote: »

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

Except Molag Kena change was really good and made the set very useful for supports.

Moonsorrow

BohnT2 wrote: »

- scaling light and heavy attacks with your highest resource
There is surely someone Roleplay focused who wants to play a sword wielding sorcerer or a destro staff swinging stamina warden. Also in PvP this helps mainly magicka specs with running 1h+s (templar, DK, necromancer) and even helps bringing back meele magicka nightblade

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

I like those parts as well, but i feel often as someone else said that it is a bit of an "all or nothing" and that everything must have some "kiss-curses" on them.. even it is just not a roleplay thingy but yes, melee magblade as an example was great and would make magicka melee specs have more choices and more choices is fun.

It was just the full flip of HA and LA core mechanic that was the issue and both pve and pvp going more towards just holding 1 mouse button down for uhh.. lazy damage. That still would not had made the gap really much smaller, but would have empowered a whole new level of cheesy zergling builds for pvp.

I applauded ZOS`s decision to not go through with it.

But yeah, my melee magblade would like ha/la scaling with highest resource..

Turelus

I hope they continue with the idea but find something people like more. I would have if they just didn't bother with any changes at all in this area because of the feedback.

Lughlongarm

BohnT2 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler the decision to scratch all of the changes due to the communities feedback is really nice and makes me looking forward to further off-cycle pts patches.

However I do think some of the changes should still make it to the live servers as they make the game better without huge or any drawbacks.

- scaling light and heavy attacks with your highest resource
There is surely someone Roleplay focused who wants to play a sword wielding sorcerer or a destro staff swinging stamina warden. Also in PvP this helps mainly magicka specs with running 1h+s (templar, DK, necromancer) and even helps bringing back meele magicka nightblade

- removal of the move speed penalty of heavy attacks
That's a straight buff for everyone and helps people in both PvE and PvP, both newer and experienced ones

- Reduced channel time for destruction staff and bows
This immensely helps magicka classes and closes a gap that has been in the game for a long time without making it overbearing.

- scaling of heavy attacks
This gives people a benefit for their actions without having a feeling of "losing" all effort because you had to stop the channel a milliseconds too early

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

100% agree, I also liked the different interactions with off-balance, it made of-balance feel like a real mechanic.

BohnT2

satanio wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

Except Molag Kena change was really good and made the set very useful for supports.

I intentionally left it out because it's the only set that sees good useage right now in PvP and its new effect is only a niche buff.
For spamming support ults bloodspawn is way better and it doesn't decrease the cost of bash, sprint, block or dodge which reduces its effectiveness further

ecru

BohnT2 wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler the decision to scratch all of the changes due to the communities feedback is really nice and makes me looking forward to further off-cycle pts patches.

However I do think some of the changes should still make it to the live servers as they make the game better without huge or any drawbacks.

- scaling light and heavy attacks with your highest resource
There is surely someone Roleplay focused who wants to play a sword wielding sorcerer or a destro staff swinging stamina warden. Also in PvP this helps mainly magicka specs with running 1h+s (templar, DK, necromancer) and even helps bringing back meele magicka nightblade

- removal of the move speed penalty of heavy attacks
That's a straight buff for everyone and helps people in both PvE and PvP, both newer and experienced ones

- Reduced channel time for destruction staff and bows
This immensely helps magicka classes and closes a gap that has been in the game for a long time without making it overbearing.

- scaling of heavy attacks
This gives people a benefit for their actions without having a feeling of "losing" all effort because you had to stop the channel a milliseconds too early

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

I think most of these would be positive changes. Completely removing movement speed reduction and reducing the channel time of heavy attacks may be a bit much though, I think it should be one or the other, or a little bit of both. I'd be more in favor of reducing the channel time and possibly reducing the movement speed reduction, but not completely removing it.

satanio

BohnT2 wrote: »

satanio wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

Except Molag Kena change was really good and made the set very useful for supports.

I intentionally left it out because it's the only set that sees good useage right now in PvP and its new effect is only a niche buff.
For spamming support ults bloodspawn is way better and it doesn't decrease the cost of bash, sprint, block or dodge which reduces its effectiveness further

It's old effect is very niche too.
Bloodspawn is very dependant on the number of sources that deals damage to you per second. In vSS sunspire it would perform worse than new kena, in PvP it may perform better... And how is decreasing the cost of bash sprint, block, or dodge bad? But whatever, we will see what happens on Monday.

Skjaldbjorn

Lughlongarm wrote: »

100% agree, I also liked the different interactions with off-balance, it made of-balance feel like a real mechanic.

You might like it on a dummy or in casual content, but speaking as a Stamden main, our core class spammable being chained to such a clunky, wonky mechanic as off-balance with no real visual indicator is probably the most cancerous change my class has endured since release.

BohnT2

satanio wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

satanio wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

The set changes outside of Molag Kena are good as they touch unused sets and make them much better.

Except Molag Kena change was really good and made the set very useful for supports.

I intentionally left it out because it's the only set that sees good useage right now in PvP and its new effect is only a niche buff.
For spamming support ults bloodspawn is way better and it doesn't decrease the cost of bash, sprint, block or dodge which reduces its effectiveness further

It's old effect is very niche too.
Bloodspawn is very dependant on the number of sources that deals damage to you per second. In vSS sunspire it would perform worse than new kena, in PvP it may perform better... And how is decreasing the cost of bash sprint, block, or dodge bad? But whatever, we will see what happens on Monday.

it doesn't decrease the cost and there's a lot more than vSS in many boss fights bs will proc enough to outperform kena

Vahrokh

I am sure that if they said that:

We are only doing this:

• LA damage nerfed by 30%
• LA returns some magicka

very few would have complained about that. I wouldn't have.

OWLTHEMAD

Vahrokh wrote: »

I am sure that if they said that:

We are only doing this:

• LA damage nerfed by 30%
• LA returns some magicka

very few would have complained about that. I wouldn't have.

Agreed, though i would have taken it a step further and said lower heavy attack channel time as well. No change to heavy attack damage. That way you still keep the spirit of the idea without completely reinventing the combat. Again.

Heavy attacks would be slightly more viable, but light attacks would still be king.

At the end of the day nobody likes slow as a snail heavy attacks. They should be viable as a primary part of 'a' rotation, but not top dog performance viable.

idk

Turelus wrote: »

I hope they continue with the idea but find something people like more. I would have if they just didn't bother with any changes at all in this area because of the feedback.

I agree. Personally I liked Code's idea much better though the sustain part of it could be tweaked.

Blynjubitr

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Lughlongarm wrote: »

100% agree, I also liked the different interactions with off-balance, it made of-balance feel like a real mechanic.

You might like it on a dummy or in casual content, but speaking as a Stamden main, our core class spammable being chained to such a clunky, wonky mechanic as off-balance with no real visual indicator is probably the most cancerous change my class has endured since release.

I feel you man, i have a Stamden myself but i had to stop playing it because it literally has no meaning in end game PvE. They nerfed passive, they nerfed bird, they nerfed bear, for a moment i thought they would remove warden completely this patch. Guess not lol.

Nirntrotter

100% agree with OP. I'm very sad to see all of the QoL changes go down the gutter too, even though they had very little to do with the apocalyptic shaking-up of how LAs and HAs worked. They would've opened up and smoothed out combat nicely imho. Hope they reconsider it.

BohnT2

Happy to see that at least the Item set changes made it to the live servers.

Still hoping we'll see the rest of the things mentioned above in this pts cycle

Especially the change to Light and heavy attacks scaling with your highest resource would help future vampires in pvp a lot
@Zos_BrianWheeler