Dealing with the five stages of grief for the upcoming Light Attack nerf

orion_1981usub17_ESO

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

Vahrokh

You have no idea about how hard is to perfection LA weaving until the numbers "explode".
Just one 1/10 second slip over a minute can lower overall DPS down by 7-8K.

The only effects a 78% nerf will have are:

• Most people with LA build will stop LA weaving. Right today you can sustain without LA charge and without sustain enchants, so why bother with the pain?
• You'll now be demanded by good trial guilds to learn to bash-cancel, which can be a pain.
• With the nerf of heavy attack, new, inexperienced and disabled players - candidates to play HA builds - will have to LA weave else they go out of magicka. Exactly the opposite of what was needed!

Cage_Lizardman

Please tell ZoS to nerf bashing as well if they're doing this. Come on, no one even wants to do that crap, not even the "git gud" crowd is that crazy.

Sanguinor2

Cage_Lizardman wrote: »

Please tell ZoS to nerf bashing as well if they're doing this. Come on, no one even wants to do that crap, not even the "git gud" crowd is that crazy.

Idk, bashweaving with maarselok was kinda fun on stamcro as Long as Performance Held up.

DivineFirstYOLO

Cage_Lizardman wrote: »

Please tell ZoS to nerf bashing as well if they're doing this. Come on, no one even wants to do that crap, not even the "git gud" crowd is that crazy.

I kinda like bashing tbh. It's nice cause I see it as a mini game during a boss fight. Most boss fights are just too stupid easy...so I watch my stam bar and never let it get completely full but at the same time I try to have enough stam left for a trap (speaking of mag DD PoV right now ofc).

..it's nice to have something to press, combat would be so boring if you only had to press a button like every 2 seconds...

TheFM

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

JohnOfMarkarth

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

he seems to kno better then u do. cus what he is saying is what you are already doin... denial. lovely.

But you seem to be misinterpreting things left and right of late. Cus what he is saying (and you yet again dodged the point) is, no matter what we say... this will most likely eventually go live. And we all will have to go through the stages. And already are goin through em (whether i agree with him or not, i dont specify).

idk

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

TheFM

JohnOfMarkarth wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

he seems to kno better then u do. cus what he is saying is what you are already doin... denial. lovely.

But you seem to be misinterpreting things left and right of late. Cus what he is saying (and you yet again dodged the point) is, no matter what we say... this will most likely eventually go live. And we all will have to go through the stages. And already are goin through em (whether i agree with him or not, i dont specify).

Not true, they introduced an idea about putting cast times on shields before for mag toons, and the backlash was far less than this. And they dumped it. And yeah, he def knows better than me when he says 10 k dps loss isnt a huge thing for pvp. Ok.

Vahrokh

TheFM wrote: »

JohnOfMarkarth wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

he seems to kno better then u do. cus what he is saying is what you are already doin... denial. lovely.

But you seem to be misinterpreting things left and right of late. Cus what he is saying (and you yet again dodged the point) is, no matter what we say... this will most likely eventually go live. And we all will have to go through the stages. And already are goin through em (whether i agree with him or not, i dont specify).

Not true, they introduced an idea about putting cast times on shields before for mag toons, and the backlash was far less than this. And they dumped it. And yeah, he def knows better than me when he says 10 k dps loss isnt a huge thing for pvp. Ok.

The backlash was not far less than this.
I know this, because every time something so ugly happens, I get banned for days to weeks because I get fairly "hot" in the debate.

With cast time shields I got 2 bans, with LA nerf, so far, only one warning.

TheFM

Vahrokh wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

JohnOfMarkarth wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

he seems to kno better then u do. cus what he is saying is what you are already doin... denial. lovely.

But you seem to be misinterpreting things left and right of late. Cus what he is saying (and you yet again dodged the point) is, no matter what we say... this will most likely eventually go live. And we all will have to go through the stages. And already are goin through em (whether i agree with him or not, i dont specify).

Not true, they introduced an idea about putting cast times on shields before for mag toons, and the backlash was far less than this. And they dumped it. And yeah, he def knows better than me when he says 10 k dps loss isnt a huge thing for pvp. Ok.

The backlash was not far less than this.
I know this, because every time something so ugly happens, I get banned for days to weeks because I get fairly "hot" in the debate.

With cast time shields I got 2 bans, with LA nerf, so far, only one warning.

Ok, well im judging by the amount of comments. These ideas have , to me, caused a tsunamis worth of backlash. The shield changes had many people on board because of their hatred toward sorc players, and imo had less backlash. In all my years of playing since beta and lurking did I ever see such a massive outcry about changes. ANd I also never saw this amount of people happy about them out of spite, being unable to see the forest passed the trees.

orion_1981usub17_ESO

Thank you, all you fine folks, for joining my discussion/ therapy session. Whether you agree or not, together we can get through the healing process.

Bash Meta will be fine... Damage should be assigned using the very simple equation DPS=1+(resources*time+range). This means that LA is the base and all others are built upon that buy their cost and time cast. Bash should definitely do more damage than a light attack, it cost stamina. Heavy attacks should do more than spammables due to time cost, but they should not do more than skills that have cast/channel times. Sure there maybe some more balancing but hopefully that's what they'll work towards and what I predict.

Now as some of you folks like to talk about pvp, please don't pretend tank meta is something new, we've seen everything; bat swarm cancer, sload cancer, pet cancer, snipe desync cancer, argonian pot cancer and there are plenty near unkillable tanks today. PVP is not gonna change, pvp is about timing and burst, if everyone loses 10k dps then everyone is in the same boat. and don't worry, looking at the mack truck you can turn heavy attacks into with a few buffs and proper sets, three heavies can often melt a target before they have a chance (hell throw on knight slayer and watch those shield folks disappear because oblivion damage)

Look folks, remember Dr. Malcom in Jurassic park, nature finds away. We know changes are coming someday, we got a good idea what they'll be. I remember theory crafting before the beta even came out on tameriel forge website. For the love of the divines quit attacking like chicken littles or like tiny tim getting his walking stick taking away.

Reverb

I’m I’m the Bargaining stage. I cancelled my Greymoor pre order via Support and got a refund. If I stop helping fund this game maybe I’ll stop caring about crap performance and asinine combat changes.

orion_1981usub17_ESO

I use to play EQ... a dark elf cleric. But they wouldn't upgrade the game enough to make me stay, shows them whos boss. Then I played Lineage 2 dark elf SK but they would fix the Chinese farm bots. Then I played...…. I could go on for a very long time. Enjoy the game while you can, they simply don't last but you might get a tshirt at the end.

iCaliban

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

Agreed. Nerfing damage this substantially will make pvp even more zerg friendly and honestly push the tank meta to extreme heights

orion_1981usub17_ESO

Seriously? PVP is already zerg friendly due to zerg bomb meta, that has nothing to do with light attack dps, you cant get more zerg friendly. Just a big hulking group of yellow bomb bunnies and blue falcons flocks (I'm sure they got their choice name for EP zergs) lighting fuses and literally running up and down stairs until they get lucky and wipe the flags. That has nothing to do with a minor loss of DPS.

Current cyrodil meta is nothing more than negate bombs, chokepoint oils and siege shots and waiting tell folks lag out due to particle effects. Thats it, if you want more then go solo queue battlegrounds.

FakeFox

Uhm, okay. You seem to have completely missed the intentions, arguments and suggestions presented in the majority of critical posts related to this topic. There is really no point in discussing any of this nonsense. You attitude disgusts me.

TheFM

iCaliban wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

Hey Folks, I know everyone is in an uproar and I do want to help. I believe that even if nothing else of the pts changes go live, there will be an upcoming nerf to light attack damage. And I want to help you understand feelings that your going to be experiencing. So first, why do I believe that no matter that LA ARE going to be nerfed 78% in the future. Very simply, an empowered LA can often do as much or more damage than a skill that cost resource or a bash that cost resource. This simply will not do and its easy to see that some of these changes derive from the amount of dps gained by light attacks. So, the future holds their nerf and if you read most folks rejection this nerf is there true concern.

Of course, first most folks are gonna deny the writing on the wall. "look they say maybe they wouldn't do it... and that's highlighted!" Welcome to the first stage of grief. That's right, its not gonna happen, nobody would accept it, ZOS would never! Well the writing is on the wall or better yet observable in the PTS server.

Most folks jump swiftly into anger. "How dare they make these changes, are they stupid!" Its easy to lash out in anger at a change that hurts, its YOUR DPS! They cant take it from you! That 4-5k white damage between every skill! They cant do this! Well... they can and are and once the anger subsides you still will not be able to accept that your not in charge.

What do folks do that don't have power but want to influence those with power? The bargain, its natural and easy and many are now reaching this phase. Just buff heavy attacks they cry, or give all attacks resource regen, or even... Ill quit if you make these changes. As if your continuing support from among the multitude equals enough influence to give them pause for a nerf they greatly desire.

once you realize your not important enough to bargain with, utter sadness sets in, depression. Many gamers have not yet got there and wont until the nerf is actually implemented. ZOS was particularly clever in this regard. Throw out a change that would likely be very unpopular and let the players begin the five stages of grief early. This way once the nerf does happen in the future, the response will be more muted and the players can shift quickly from depression into

Acceptance. This is the end folks. After the pain of losing on average 10K dps to a light attack nerf, folks will pick themselves back up and carry on. In a year or two few will ever have remember their period of grief, they'll be new dungeons and new changes to go through the cycle again and again.

So please I know the PTS changes are a shock, yes the numbers need to be adjusted some (or bow gank squads are gonna dominate all of cyrodil). But for those that know and are prepared, the up coming light attack nerf is now inevitable and its time to safely express your grief.

You know how much a loss of 10 k dps hurts in pvp? Thats the difference between a good fight against a tank meta build, and a hopeless fight. Please get back to us when you actually know what you are talking about.

Agreed. Nerfing damage this substantially will make pvp even more zerg friendly and honestly push the tank meta to extreme heights

Exactly. The tanks will be getting MORE sustain, and will be even less killable. And in PvE , players that dont want to have to practice weaving, tanks and healers, and low apm players will be FORCED to learn to weave. I cannot realistically understand why this change was even introduced.

karekiz

idk wrote: »

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

IDK what you mean. ESO released in Summerset patch notes

orion_1981usub17_ESO wrote: »

I use to play EQ... a dark elf cleric. But they wouldn't upgrade the game enough to make me stay, shows them whos boss. Then I played Lineage 2 dark elf SK but they would fix the Chinese farm bots. Then I played...…. I could go on for a very long time. Enjoy the game while you can, they simply don't last but you might get a tshirt at the end.

Still releasing expansions and being active for about over 20 years? Sure showed them 0_o

nublife01

I mean nightblade is already a completely gutted class in pvp why don't we just nerf their light attacks (being the only stamina class that depends on the damage from them) as I mean we have already nerfed just about every core ability they have along with tactician and blocking (which they are more dependent upon than every other class) why not go further with it? I mean almost every nightblade has changed classes or quit the game right? Why not just nerf the last thing about them that hasn't been nerfed yet?

LittlePinkDot

idk wrote: »

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

I was wondering.... If light attacks restore more resources... If we still light attack weave does that mean we won't have to wear a sustain set or any Regen enchants/traits?

John_Falstaff

One more "calming" post from yet another dude who has no clue about what majority of the game (yes, and it's not PvP) is about. Amusing. ^^ And they can't even explain why the nerf is needed, except, of course, all people who don't want to practice secretly hopes that it's finally their chance to get to the top without working for it. Well, tough. Not happening.

Also, I should probably make a similar post, but addressed to zos and titled "Dealing with the five stages of grief for the upcoming revenue nerf"... but I'm too lazy.

MartiniDaniels

OP, I was active on all PTS in last 6-7 patches. Players were trying, really, until U25 to provide feedback. In U25 PTS was nearly dead and as you can see now even with this grounbreaking change, feedback is very limited. Players already passed your 5 stages and either stopped playing or just DGAF about what ZOS is doing and will just copy someone's else build and see what comes out.
As for me I didn't played in March a single hour and looking at this change which throws out all the days, months of training and experience to trash bin, it doesn't make me want to re-install ESO. I already kicked from all serious guilds for inactivity, I'm sure and I lost interest in hoarding motifs/gold whatever so even anniversary event leaves me absolutely inert about this game. If game doesn't have gameplay, collectibles doesn't matter.

John_Falstaff

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

idk wrote: »

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

I was wondering.... If light attacks restore more resources... If we still light attack weave does that mean we won't have to wear a sustain set or any Regen enchants/traits?

In a reasonably optimized group on live you already don't have to do any tradeoffs, people run all damage enchants, damage races, no sustain sets just fine. And if your group is not optimized, then, well, you probably have DDs that don't weave well anyway, so they'll be struggling for sustain just the same.

CleymenZero

Am I the only one who saw this?

"We’d like to emphasize the possibility of these changes never actually going into the game – we are simply testing and gathering feedback right now."

And given the current feedback, it just WON'T make it to live in its current form. Simple.

Keep giving feedback though, that helps. I have to to say that seeing you guys Romeo and Juliette over all of this is pretty entertaining.

Reverb

CleymenZero wrote: »

Am I the only one who saw this?

"We’d like to emphasize the possibility of these changes never actually going into the game – we are simply testing and gathering feedback right now."

And given the current feedback, it just WON'T make it to live in its current form. Simple.

Keep giving feedback though, that helps. I have to to say that seeing you guys Romeo and Juliette over all of this is pretty entertaining.

Our lengthy history with Zeni has taught us that once a change makes it to PTS they are committed to it. Statements to the contrary are meant to appease dissenters until people have time to get used to the idea.

mairwen85

Reverb wrote: »

CleymenZero wrote: »

Am I the only one who saw this?

"We’d like to emphasize the possibility of these changes never actually going into the game – we are simply testing and gathering feedback right now."

And given the current feedback, it just WON'T make it to live in its current form. Simple.

Keep giving feedback though, that helps. I have to to say that seeing you guys Romeo and Juliette over all of this is pretty entertaining.

Our lengthy history with Zeni has taught us that once a change makes it to PTS they are committed to it. Statements to the contrary are meant to appease dissenters until people have time to get used to the idea.

So much this. Historically if it's on PTS, it's going in the game, maybe tuned down a touch, but it's going in no matter what. Cast times on shields is the only u-turn I can recall.

Just wait, the new greymoor sets will be explicitly designed around these changes as bis gear perfectly aligned with them making it an absolute must to purchase the chapter.

LittlePinkDot

John_Falstaff wrote: »

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

idk wrote: »

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

I was wondering.... If light attacks restore more resources... If we still light attack weave does that mean we won't have to wear a sustain set or any Regen enchants/traits?

In a reasonably optimized group on live you already don't have to do any tradeoffs, people run all damage enchants, damage races, no sustain sets just fine. And if your group is not optimized, then, well, you probably have DDs that don't weave well anyway, so they'll be struggling for sustain just the same.

I love sustain sets. It makes playing more fun because I can be more carefree

John_Falstaff

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

idk wrote: »

For those of us who have played this game for a while, we somehow managed to make it, and do well, before Zos buffed LAs to where it is now. If Zos nerfs LAs and buffs Medium to HAs we will somehow be able to play this game well just like we did before.

I am not suggesting what we are testing is the best idea. I do prefer the one Code suggested over what Zos has setup for testing. I have linked it below.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517845/how-the-la-ha-changes-fail-to-fulfill-zoss-stated-goals-and-what-could-be-done-instead/p1

I was wondering.... If light attacks restore more resources... If we still light attack weave does that mean we won't have to wear a sustain set or any Regen enchants/traits?

In a reasonably optimized group on live you already don't have to do any tradeoffs, people run all damage enchants, damage races, no sustain sets just fine. And if your group is not optimized, then, well, you probably have DDs that don't weave well anyway, so they'll be struggling for sustain just the same.

I love sustain sets. It makes playing more fun because I can be more carefree

What can I say, then you're not utilizing your potential as a DD because you have an excess of sustain you're not converting into anything else. Besides having fun and being carefree of course. Following that logic, when you'll have more sustain, you'll probably keep loving sustain sets and will convert your extra sustain into extra fun and being extra carefree. Which, well, has nothing to do with how changes will affect the ceiling of performance.

And to others - of course ZOS will go through with the changes. I'm not fooled for a single moment by embellishments put around the current off-cycle PTS. It's not a step towards community. It's not a dialogue. It's not care about players. It's just ZOS finally getting the hang of how to boil the frog slowly.

peacenote

The thing about the OP's post if you support that kind of thinking... it's us basically saying that we are OK with ZOS asking for feedback and completely ignoring it. This happens, get used to it, it'll be alright.

Well, I am not OK with being treated that way. Don't ask for feedback at all, or respect us enough to acknowledge the feedback if we respond.

And btw, I am not at all grieving for LA DPS loss. That's a kind of simplistic view of the change. I am displeased with the on-demand HA sustain loss for healing (and tanking) that's occurring as what's likely, AGAIN, collateral damage to the healing role in an ongoing attempt to "balance" DPS and address DPS complaints.

ZOS_Volpe

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