Need help/direction with DK Tank PVE

dlatour_ESO

@Paramedicus Since I can craft torg I can start with that and then can farm for leeching replacements then see what works better for my style of play? Never hurts to have both sets I suppose. Torg can get me start quicker and its cheap to make with only needing 3 traits. Do you think that is a good approach?

Asardes

@Paramedicus

On DK not even in PuGs do I need healing sets to keep myself alive. So I don't need selfish sets to keep myself alive, using only group support sets.

But OK, for such absurd situations I still have the gear

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=136177

Asardes

@dlatour_ESO

Vampirism is not so bad on tank because you're already capped for spell resistance, hence elemental too (fire, lightning, ice).
Undeath is quite nice if you have a high health pool since it kicks in at a low % but you still have plenty of HP left in absolute terms. I prefer sustaining with Balance instead of stacking high resistance, since DK doesn't have recovery multipliers, but having those passives is not entirely wasted. You have to be more careful though, when you don't anticipate taking damage within the next ~5s just do Balance, wait 4s for the debuff to clear, then Green Dragon Blood + Vigor + Fragmented shield to pump yourself back to full. This is quite efficient.

Slothylicious

Paramedicus wrote: »

I think that i made my point clear: he should use crusher on staff, but he shouldn't bother using staff in dungs where he doesn't feel comfortable. He will waste magicka for wall of elements and prolly will kill himself while trying to acomplish this great goal of 2% damage boost in PUG with medicore DPS.

Using an ice staff won't decrease his survivability at all. Magicka sustain is not a problem for a tank.

Paramedicus wrote: »

It is true that leeching plate is less usefull on single target, but it s still usefull on trash and bosses with adds (which are plenty in dlc).You can also boost healing from leeching plate by investing spare CP in mighty (blue tree). My 40-70% of self healing comes from leechnig plate (and i dont use cinder or vigor because i dont have to). It is also worth noting, that as DK you get stamina from leeching plate. Comparted to that Torgus just don't give you any serious advantage. Better crusher, which translates to like 1%+ dmg in real life scenario? WOW? I have no idea why people treat this set as something default for tanks. It is so lazy advice. If OP gets good team then he can min/max with them all he wants. But for PUG? Give me a break.

Keep ignoring that Torug's Pact is by far the easiest tank set in the game to acquire, as it is craftable. The 5 piece bonus isn't very good, but the rest gives relevant stats. It's good as a starter set until he finds better.

If you have a semi competent healer, you don't need leeching plate for self healing. For most content, you can self heal with Green Dragon Blood alone.

Paramedicus

@dlatour_ESO
you have some tank sets alrdy so i dont see much point in crafting new one. I would focus on farming new ones now. Anyway you may get Torug for later, so it wont be total waste. But it just won't help you now in any way -wont fix any of your current problems.

Imo atm your priority should be fixing your sustain because you have awfuly low magicka recovery with no way to regen it (like Balance skill). It is important to have good mag sustain because CCing and self healing in DLC is really important. I like to have high mag recovery (1,1 - 2,1k), because more recovery means that I can manage almost every add from trash and CC for whole encounter. I also can spam shields and get 1k stam from it. I dont need to depend on Balance and can take something similar but better for stuff that likes to CC me instead (unstopable brute). If I go with lower mag recovery (1,1-1,5k) it is usually just for fights where i need to care more about stamina sustain (i just change food and 2 rings, so no prob). I may slot Balance in that case, to feel safe about magicka. Some ppl can live with very low mag recovery (much below 1k) and just depend on Balance, but for me it feels bit risky. Either way you go, you still need to take care of your sustain, because it will kill you. Also as others mentioned, your HP is just too low. Go for smh around 40k buffed. Later you may get it lower if you feel comfortable about it. You will just have to tweak it and check what works for you. Anyway having high health is safer because your shields and dragon blood heal scale with HP (+ vampire passive mentioned).

@Asardes
i agree that you shouldn't need leeching plate to be able to do dungs, but imho it is very solid set for new DK tanks because it lets you tank weak trash just with passive healing and also help with stamina regen. Later OP can focus on getting less selfish sets. It is always better to have bit selfish and alive tank, than fancy but dead one with cool BiS set.

BTW i like that last build. Not an overkill in any way xD

@Slothylicious
true, ice staff wont gimp his survivability like lighting one, but he will waste slot for ice wall, which could be used for other skill that actually helps. And magicka sustain is problem for tank who is new into dungs because he will waste it on over-healing or lousy CC (also look at op setup). Maybe I was too strong with criticism. I dont mean that he should throw his staff into fire. I mean that not every BiS advice is good for beginners i.e. taking staff into PUG won't make much difference.

I agree that Torug's Pact is easy set to get, but it doesnt change fact that at this point it will be useless for OP, since he has some tank sets already.

dlatour_ESO

I want to say thank you everyone for contributing. Please keep the conversation going.

Since its Friday and I want to play and accomplish some things tonight, I'm going to try and get ebon/torg/leeching pieces to start piecing a couple of set options together. My RNG with the undaunted chests suck but I'll start pushing for bloodspawn as well.

Lots of tips and comments and I really do appreciate everyone's input, though it can be overwhelming in some areas.

dlatour_ESO

Paramedicus wrote: »

@dlatour_ESO
you have some tank sets alrdy so i dont see much point in crafting new one. I would focus on farming new ones now. Anyway you may get Torug for later (trails), so it wont be a waste. But it just won't help you now in any way -wont fix any of your current problems.

Imo atm your priority should be fixing your sustain because you have awfuly low magicka recovery with no way to regen it (like Balance skill). It is important to have good mag sustain because CCing and self healing in DLC is really important. I like to have high mag recovery (1,1 - 2,1k), because more recovery means that I can manage almost every add from trash and CC for whole encounter. I also can spam shields and get 1k stam from it. I dont need to depend on Balance and can take something similar but better for stuff that likes to CC me instead (unstopable brute). If I go with lower mag recovery (1,1-1,5k) it is usually just for fights where i need to care more about stamina sustain (i just change food and 2 rings, so no prob). I may slot Balance in that case, to feel safe about magicka. Some ppl can live with very low mag recovery (much below 1k) and just depend on Balance, but for me it feels bit risky. Either way you go, you still need to take care of your sustain, because it will kill you. Also as others mentioned, your HP is just too low. Go for 40k+ buffed. Later you may get it lower if you feel comfortable about it. You will just have tweak it and check what works for you. Anyway having high health is safer because your shields and dragon blood heal scale with HP (+ vampire passive mentioned).

@Asardes
i agree that you shouldn't need leeching plate to be able to do dungs, but imho it is very solid set for new DK tanks because it lets you tank weak trash just with passive healing and also help with stamina regen. Later OP can focus on getting less selfish sets. It is always better to have bit selfish and alive tank, than fancy but dead one with cool BiS set.

BTW i like that last build. Not an overkill in any way xD

@Slothylicious
true, ice staff wont gimp his survivability like lighting one, but he will waste slot for ice wall, which could be used for other skill that actually helps. And magicka sustain is problem for tank who is new into dungs because he will waste it on over-healing or lousy CC (also look at op setup). Maybe I was too strong with criticism. I dont mean that he should trow his staff into fire. I mean that not every BiS advice is good for beginners i.e. taking staff into PUG won't make much difference.

I agree that Torug's Pact is easy set to get, but it doesnt change fact that at this point it will be useless for OP, since he has some tank sets already.

@Paramedicus What are you suggestions for fixing the sustain? I switched boon to mag recovery and that got me up to 858. If I change my stats one way it seems like I lose in another area, so I no idea how I'm going to get to 40K health and have high magic recovery and stam recovery. I'm sure its possible but I can't figure out how all you people are doing it.

Slothylicious

dlatour_ESO wrote: »

What are you suggestions for fixing the sustain? I switched boon to mag recovery and that got me up to 858. If I change my stats one way it seems like I lose in another area, so I no idea how I'm going to get to 40K health and have high magic recovery and stam recovery. I'm sure its possible but I can't figure out how all you people are doing it.

Here are things that help your magicka sustain:

- Green CP into mag recovery (obviously the more CP you have the better it will get)
- Being a vampire
- The atronach mundus boon (you already did that)
- You can look into mag recovery food + max health (it's a drink actually), but your resources pools will be lower
- Balance will help your magicka sustain
- Heavy armor passives will give you some magicka return on being hit
- Tristat potions
- Your ultimate + battle roar passive will give you a lot of resources, it's better if you have a slightly higher resource pool for that big boost
- Healer synergies, especially Luminous Shard, will give you a bit of magicka. You can get even slightly more if you have the PvP passive that gives you resources on synergy activation (any synergy)
- Staff heavy attacks

You don't need much stamina recovery, as it is negated while blocking with sword and board. Heavy attacks with a one handed weapon are very important when you don't have to block to give you some stamina back.

By the way, if you choose to use a staff on back bar (I recommend it), don't take the first passive of destruction staff, because then it would negate your magicka recovery when you block with the staff, and consume magicka on block, and you don't want that.

Paramedicus

@dlatour_ESO
get Balance from mages guild, so you wont need high recovery.

But if you want high magicka recovery stat then you may enchant jewlery with magicka recovery glyphs. Keep ones with block cost reduction tho, they may become handy for some fights (but for most, heavy attacks and shields should be enough to manage). You may mix them too. But keep in mind that with high block cost you will have to depend on heavy attacks more to get stamina.

If you feel good about your unbuffed resource pools then Orzorga's Red Frothgar drink (raw 5395 hp + 495 mag recovery) is some interesting option.

You will have to check what works for you best. Maybe you will be ok with low recovery and Balance. Maybe you will want to get it as high as possible. Or maybe more balanced aproach will be best for you.

EDIT: oh i just saw that Slothylicious wrote pretty much everything that could be written about this.

Slothylicious

Paramedicus wrote: »

But if you want high magicka recovery stat then enchant jewlery with magicka recovery glyphs.

Good one, I forgot about that. Personally I have 2 infused jewels with magicka recovery, and one infused jewel with block cost reduction.

With everything I said I achieve 1600-1700 mag recovery with tristat food and no potion buff, depending on the bar I'm on. You'll have a bit less because of less CP.

zvavi

Contradicting to recommendations of others i would still go sugar skulls, tristat food for all 3 stats is too good. But ye, atro is huge difference though, since you basically x1.5 your regen. Also, get some tri potions as "aw ***" buttons. And if you are cheap like me, then mag ones.