Can we get rid of the 200 Transmute Crystal Limit!

Agenericname · February 19

virtus753 wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

It wouldn't replace grinding gear. In many cases it's easier and faster to grind the gear anyway, weapons, jewelry and some monster sets being the exception. The weapons grind is so ridiculous in some cases a player could go to Cyrodiil and earn enough crystals to transmute 10 weapons in the same amount of time. I feel like that's being overly generous.

There should be limits, but if they're going to make "balance changes" as often and as drastic as they have been, then they should also adjust the amount we can store whether they increase the cap or make them stackable.

I worry that if they up the limit to accommodate for the drastic combat changes, they’ll feel free to make more drastic combat changes. Better to hold them to toning down the changes than giving them any sort of excuse to keep on.

Buddy_Cactus wrote: »

I think transmute crystals should be saleable but for that to work, they would need to remove the limit. It wouldn't be unlike IC keys being saleable.

Crystals are sellable, in effect. I get about a 75% recovery rate on transmuted nirn, which is not bad for something going for 25k (PC-NA). Averages out to around 17k (after expenses) per transmutation — more if you sell directly rather than through a guild store. Not OP, by any means, but not bad.

I think that ship has sailed.

Harrowstorm is not bad by comparison — excepting the Iceheart nerf, which has its own massively flawed reasoning. Still, one boat-rocking change is better than many.

Buddy_Cactus wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

It wouldn't replace grinding gear. In many cases it's easier and faster to grind the gear anyway, weapons, jewelry and some monster sets being the exception. The weapons grind is so ridiculous in some cases a player could go to Cyrodiil and earn enough crystals to transmute 10 weapons in the same amount of time. I feel like that's being overly generous.

There should be limits, but if they're going to make "balance changes" as often and as drastic as they have been, then they should also adjust the amount we can store whether they increase the cap or make them stackable.

I worry that if they up the limit to accommodate for the drastic combat changes, they’ll feel free to make more drastic combat changes. Better to hold them to toning down the changes than giving them any sort of excuse to keep on.

Buddy_Cactus wrote: »

I think transmute crystals should be saleable but for that to work, they would need to remove the limit. It wouldn't be unlike IC keys being saleable.

Crystals are sellable, in effect. I get about a 75% recovery rate on transmuted nirn, which is not bad for something going for 25k (PC-NA). Averages out to around 17k (after expenses) per transmutation — more if you sell directly rather than through a guild store. Not OP, by any means, but not bad.

I mean being able to actually sell transmute crystals to other players.

To make crystals buyable (with gold) would be more convenient, sure, but it would contradict the developers’ intentions for the system, as Varanis, Taleof2Cities, and others explained above. ZOS intends crystals to be account-bound and require grinding, which is intentionally inconvenient for us. Look at event tickets, which are far worse in terms of contrived micromanagement. I fear that if they made crystals buyable, it would be through the crown store just like tickets.

I agree, its not bad by comparison with that exception, but it's still a significant change from where we were, even if we like it.

darthgummibear_ESO · February 19

zvavi wrote: »

Not when it is one of the perks of eso+

You realize eso+ has to deal with the limit too, right?

grannas211 · February 19

VaranisArano wrote: »

Not gonna happen unless ZOS fundamentally changes their vision for transmutation.

ZOS' intent for transmutation is that it won't replace the grind for gear and weapons in the correct trait, but rather serves as assurance that eventually you can get your preferred trait. The limitation keeps players from just stacking up crystals, while the geodes loading up inventory or mail is the same as every other inventory issue in the game, I.e. make a problem, sell the ESO+/storage chest solution.

(But Jewelrycrafting! Yeah, well, ZOS deliberately made transmutation the only method to get the new jewelry traits. Likely in order to create a guaranteed sink for transmute crystals for the people who both change jewelry traits and get the most crystals: PVPers and trials groups.)

Except it doesnt work like that at all. Most people have a chit ton of the 50 geodes saved up on one or more characters. So no, theres no limit to how many items can be transmuted. Theyre just on geodes taking up space. Its jsut another idiotic feature Zos refuses to change.

Commancho · February 19

This limit is idiotic just like a number of bank slots and it needs an update. Since transmutation has been introduced we have recieved tens if not hundreds of sets. This stupid system doesn't prevent hoarding as I can hold geodes on my alt mules. It just makes everything more IRRITATING and time consuming and it doesn't make any sense.

kargen27 · February 19

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

redlink1979 wrote: »

Why don't you just use them?!

And if you don't need them, why do you keep collecting them?!

We do t use them because sometimes you are saving them for gear that you need to farm in the future.

As for why you keep collecting them after you have 200? Well it's not like its intentional. Getting transmutation geodes is a by product of every day gameplay be it pledges, trials, or pvp. These dont stack, take up inventory, and are too valuable to toss.

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed. IMO I would like to see either a transmute cost reduction (ie 25) or a base incrsase of the limit. Personally I find it frustrating that you cant transmute the traits on a full set of gear unless you reach the limit several times

And that is why there is a limit. MMO's survive in big part by players repeating content. They do not want you to be able to transmute an entire set of armor at one time. If they were to make a move on transmuting I am guessing they would go the other direction making it so you can't horde the geodes in your inventory. It wouldn't be good for the long term health of the game to raise the limit.

VaranisArano · February 19

iiYuki wrote: »

They should make geodes stack.

Interestingly enough, geodes did stack on the PTS but due to a bug ZOS had to change that.

VaranisArano · February 19

grannas211 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Not gonna happen unless ZOS fundamentally changes their vision for transmutation.

ZOS' intent for transmutation is that it won't replace the grind for gear and weapons in the correct trait, but rather serves as assurance that eventually you can get your preferred trait. The limitation keeps players from just stacking up crystals, while the geodes loading up inventory or mail is the same as every other inventory issue in the game, I.e. make a problem, sell the ESO+/storage chest solution.

(But Jewelrycrafting! Yeah, well, ZOS deliberately made transmutation the only method to get the new jewelry traits. Likely in order to create a guaranteed sink for transmute crystals for the people who both change jewelry traits and get the most crystals: PVPers and trials groups.)

Except it doesnt work like that at all. Most people have a chit ton of the 50 geodes saved up on one or more characters. So no, theres no limit to how many items can be transmuted. Theyre just on geodes taking up space. Its jsut another idiotic feature Zos refuses to change.

I've got 15+ 50-crystal geodes from the PVP campaigns sitting around on my characters, so its not like I don't know that players horde them.

However, as I already mentioned, geodes taking up space doesn't bother ZOS as much because its yet another place where hoarding leads to inventory management issues which, often enough, leads straight to either ESO+ subs (money), or spending the time or money to get in-game solutions like storage chests or just plain spending the time to inventory manage. MMOs thrive on players spending time or money on the game and ESO is no different.

Its not particularly player-friendly, but ZOS has never minded giving players inventory problems when it leads to players spending time or money on the game. ZOS is perfectly happy to make me choose between having those geodes on hand vs having those 15+ inventory slots available for other items.

Taleof2Cities · February 19

VaranisArano wrote: »

Its not particularly player-friendly, but ZOS has never minded giving players inventory problems when it leads to players spending time or money on the game. ZOS is perfectly happy to make me choose between having those geodes on hand vs having those 15+ inventory slots available for other items.

Except that a fully upgraded player account has nearly 4,000 inventory slots with bank and character inventory space, mount bag space, and furnishing storage.

No player should have a problem with that ... including gear set hoarders posting above like @Commancho.

wtlonewolf20 · February 19

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

Then why dont they cap keys, alliance points, tel var, or gold? Also why is there no cap placed on the craft bag?

If the end result is that you cap what a player can earn/store in a currency or currency equivalents with the goal being to encourage people to play more and run more content then all of these things should have a cap.

The transmute system is completely inclosed. All aspects of the transmute system are bound except gear. And then its bound after transmuted. So whether someone generates 5 transmute Crystal's or 20k crystals in a month it wont impact others.

As for decreased dungeon and trial runs? Wont happen. People still need to get that bound gear and to unlock undaunted etc.

AT the end of the day people still run the content and still do multiple runs of said content with or without the cap.

VaranisArano · February 19

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

Then why dont they cap keys, alliance points, tel var, or gold? Also why is there no cap placed on the craft bag?

If the end result is that you cap what a player can earn/store in a currency or currency equivalents with the goal being to encourage people to play more and run more content then all of these things should have a cap.

The transmute system is completely inclosed. All aspects of the transmute system are bound except gear. And then its bound after transmuted. So whether someone generates 5 transmute Crystal's or 20k crystals in a month it wont impact others.

As for decreased dungeon and trial runs? Wont happen. People still need to get that bound gear and to unlock undaunted etc.

AT the end of the day people still run the content and still do multiple runs of said content with or without the cap.

Probably because those currencies predated transmutation. You'll note that the other currency that's explicitly created to force players to continually gather as opposed to storing up extras also has a cap, though event tickets are far more restrictive than transmute crystals/geodes.

In any case, here's the Devs' reasoning from the PTS:

discussion/373097/pts-patch-notes-v3-2-1

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Transmutation
Developer Comments:
The goal of Transmutation is to provide you with a way to acquire your ideal traits in a way which is less dependent on RNG, without trivializing changing equipment traits or making it incredibly time consuming.The primary sources of Transmute Crystals are guaranteed drops from content you're likely already doing to collect your gear, such as Pledges, the group finder daily random Dungeon, Trial weekly quests, Veteran arena completions, and end of campaign PvP rewards.

And:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4505195#Comment_4505195

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

The new Transmutation system is intended as a way to assist you in obtaining the trait you desire for your gear as you play, but not be the primary way to obtain it. You'll obtain Transmutation Crystals as you play the content you're already participating in, but it isn't meant to be something you get immediately. We want you to feel like you have a way to eventually get the trait you want.

As I note in previous comments, I don't think the intent has changed much with Jewelry Crafting. As players began to hoard their geodes, ZOS introduced a transmutation sink designed to force players to spend crystals if they want the new traits on dropped gear.

Banana · February 20

Let people sell them. I will buy

xshatox · February 20

I think i destroy more transmute crystal than use it.
I mostly pvp so I have it more than i can use it.

Tsar_Gekkou · February 20

xXMeowMeowXx wrote: »

Or at least let them stack like other things....

I have 81 of the 50-crystal geodes from monthly pvp on my crafter. I keep them because i'm not a pvper so I don't rake them in like free candy, but having an extra 80 slots taken up is ridiculous.

Grianasteri · February 20

xinecallaw wrote: »

Can we please get rid of the 200 Transmute Crystal limit, I have hundreds of these things on my characters which is a huge waste of item space.

Yes, from a purely selfish perspective, I would like far more Transmute space. Even with ESO plus we do not have enough.

However, as I have commented elsewhere I think, I understand why the limit is in place. Put simply, it is to funnel people through PVP Cyrodiil and Undaunted Pledge dungeons (because both provide Transmutes as rewards). This keeps a population in Cyrodiil and in the dungeon queues. Both vital for the health of the game in general.

zaria wrote: »

Store the 50 crystal geodes on an bank alt.
Use the others, either trasmute gear you plan to use or make nirnhoned weapons for deconstruct.
Think I have around 30-40 geodes.

An excellent idea, I have tried and failed to create dedicated administrative characters purely to store items, but I just end up enjoying levelling them and creating a new build/look etc!
.

juhislihis19 · February 20

NO WE CANNOT, BECAUSE WE NEED THE ESO+ MONEY

Regards,
ZOS

Iarao · August 15

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

what about those of us with multiple playing toons? that means more crystals could be needed, especially since zos seems to think we should be changing out our gear often.

scorpius2k1 · August 15

Well, since things are being nerfed so often, how about a transmute nerf?

"Reduced the amount of transmutes required to change a trait on gear from 50 to 25"

Even corporate can still push it for sales, non eso+ subs get to transmute 4 pieces at the same time (100 cap), and eso+ subs can do 8 (200 cap). Just imagine being able to transmute an entire set of gear at the same time and making transmute crystals more viable?

Going back to the OP post with that idea, eso+ could actually lift the limitation and maybe impose a 125 limit on non eso+ subs.

Just my two cents and my bag space being full because of geodes (that don't stack for some reason) would thank you.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

CoronHR · August 15

do the thing that others suggested...transmute a weapon to nirnhoned, decon for a chance at potent nirncrux, sell the nirncrux. it's going for 18-19k

scorpius2k1 · August 15

CoronHR wrote: »

do the thing that others suggested...transmute a weapon to nirnhoned, decon for a chance at potent nirncrux, sell the nirncrux. it's going for 18-19k

It's a neat idea but If I'm going to use transmutes to decon a piece of gear it better be a guarantee, not a chance. Currently, grinding out 50 transmutes at the chance of a measly 18-19k of gold just doesn't make sense, at least to me.

Tommy_The_Gun · August 15

zvavi wrote: »

Not when it is one of the perks of eso+

At this point it is (just like craft bag) an artificial problem created by ZOS to sell you the solution (squeeze more money from players).

And tbh. it does not work. People already have found a solution for that problem. If you get a mail reward (End of campaign Cyro PvP for example), you just re-log to a mule character and receive mail with rewards there. 200 inventory slots = 10 000 Transmute crystals (200 x 50 each). People have sit tons of those...

It is just a gimmick. Nothing is stopping you from having almost unlimited supply of those. They should remove the cap tbh.

Iarao · August 15

if zos doesnt want non plus members to store up crystals, they can also not let them store them past 200 during free eso plus.

VaranisArano · August 15

Iarao wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

what about those of us with multiple playing toons? that means more crystals could be needed, especially since zos seems to think we should be changing out our gear often.

Way to raise a dead thread to ask a question months later...

Transmutation isn't intended to dramatically lessen the grind for gear, just to alleviate the whole "I ran VMA 100 times looking for a Sharpened trait Bow and all I got were these useless training bows" problem that existed before its introduction.

So if you've got multiple toons, well, yeah, you've got to grind for gear. Transmutation will help out when you've been grinding and you just can't get the gear piece/weapon you want in a specific trait, but its not going to help a whole lot with a habit of changing out full gear sets for multiple characters to follow the changing meta every update. Maybe you could swap out two, maybe three, characters via farming geodes, but the rest, you've got to grind and that's by design.

(The exception is Jewelrycrafting, which requires transmute stones to get the new traits, but ZOS knew that when they designed jewelrycrafting. The transmute crystal-sink is a feature, not a bug.)

TwinLamps · August 15

Can we have geodes to stack then.
Even mere 10 stacks per geode type would be dope af af

Dark_Lord_Kuro · August 15

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

Then why dont they cap keys, alliance points, tel var, or gold? Also why is there no cap placed on the craft bag?

If the end result is that you cap what a player can earn/store in a currency or currency equivalents with the goal being to encourage people to play more and run more content then all of these things should have a cap.

The transmute system is completely inclosed. All aspects of the transmute system are bound except gear. And then its bound after transmuted. So whether someone generates 5 transmute Crystal's or 20k crystals in a month it wont impact others.

As for decreased dungeon and trial runs? Wont happen. People still need to get that bound gear and to unlock undaunted etc.

AT the end of the day people still run the content and still do multiple runs of said content with or without the cap.

But with the limit poeple may need to run more of the cotnent to get the right gear itstead of trowing a gazilion geode at whatever is the first pieces you find

Yes you can hoard them but not everyone does it but with no limitevery one would automaticlly do so

Iarao · August 15

VaranisArano wrote: »

Iarao wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

Tbh this system needs to be looked at. Either geodes need to be stackable or the currency needs to be changed.

Tbh the current system is fine.

As @VaranisArano pointed out, Transmute is not intended to replace you running content to get the gear you need.

Transmute is intended to provide a “finish line” for running content ... so you can properly get the right trait on the gear you’ve picked up.

what about those of us with multiple playing toons? that means more crystals could be needed, especially since zos seems to think we should be changing out our gear often.

Way to raise a dead thread to ask a question months later...

Transmutation isn't intended to dramatically lessen the grind for gear, just to alleviate the whole "I ran VMA 100 times looking for a Sharpened trait Bow and all I got were these useless training bows" problem that existed before its introduction.

So if you've got multiple toons, well, yeah, you've got to grind for gear. Transmutation will help out when you've been grinding and you just can't get the gear piece/weapon you want in a specific trait, but its not going to help a whole lot with a habit of changing out full gear sets for multiple characters to follow the changing meta every update. Maybe you could swap out two, maybe three, characters via farming geodes, but the rest, you've got to grind and that's by design.

(The exception is Jewelrycrafting, which requires transmute stones to get the new traits, but ZOS knew that when they designed jewelrycrafting. The transmute crystal-sink is a feature, not a bug.)

and changing it to 500 crystals won't really make a dent in the grind on a lot of toons.