Mag classes need a buff.

talfx5

Talking mostly about magsorc, magblade.
Magden is fun but meh, magnecro getting buffed, magdk is fine.
Magplar op ofc...

The problem with magblade and magsorc is the single target damage, its fine, but stamina can hold much higher damage and much higher tankiness and with a lot of aoe. Simply unbalanced and annoying.

I tried it all, glass cannon magsorc was like the end of the rope, just wanted to kill people ffs. Im with about 20 golden sets, tried everything you can think of on a sorc or a magblade. Can abselutely work. But is it good like stam classes survivability with 50% overall mitigation 8k weapon damage 22k vigor tooltip 3k recovery, 160% speed? Its a joke.
Seriously something needs to be done.
The 2 only fun classes on eso are on the buttom for the forseeable future.

Kadoin

Want to know something?

Glass cannon any mag class sucks and its not because they are weak, its because damage output is so high you better not run a glass build unless you want to die in two hits.

Shielding is also a crappy mechanic vs. block and roll, and is exactly why not a single one of my mag chars run a shield, not even the glass ones.

Then there are the set differences, how mag needs to stack two to three resources, how mag success is almost always tied to how much healing and damage reduction your build has, double CC and triple CC problems making mag builds near impossible to operate in lag, etc.

All of the mag classes suffer from the same weaknesses, and at this point, I doubt ZOS cares.

Iskiab

This is a sarcasm thread? Mursie comes in and rages about magsorcs in 3... 2... 1....

Solaire

I do agree, Mags kinda fall behind and have been like that for a while now, i think MagSorc should be reworked completely, remove the pets and give them an actual skill line, i really can't see Sorcerers being pet masters,

make pets a world skill or make a summoning class with pets having a timer and a cooldown.
i don't touch MagSorc that much because i hate pets.

You gonna get a lot of people disagreeing with you mostly Stam users to protect their precious meta,
MagSorc used to be good, but nowadays it's below average.
but yea mostly diffidently they do need it.

Solaire

Solaire wrote: »

diffidently

*definitely

ThePedge

Mag classes are, and have been for a while, BiS for PvP.

Mudcrabjedi

Highly disagree with the magaorc needing a buff. Maybe some sort of rework, but not a buff. I run a non pet sorc build and it feels pretty good. Basically, i main a magblade and when I'm tired of dying because ZOS hates magblades, i switch to my sorc.😂

But hey, give me your thoughts on how you would change the magsorc and I'm absolutely open to ideas!

Vietfox

Magblade? Yes.
Magsorc? Definitely not.

Luede

this thread is just lol

Solaire

Mudcrabjedi wrote: »

Highly disagree with the magaorc needing a buff. Maybe some sort of rework, but not a buff. I run a non pet sorc build and it feels pretty good. Basically, i main a magblade and when I'm tired of dying because ZOS hates magblades, i switch to my sorc.😂

But hey, give me your thoughts on how you would change the magsorc and I'm absolutely open to ideas!

buff my main nerf others

katorga

Stamina classes can fill in all of their gaps usings weapon or non class skills. Take a class that struggles as magicka, swap to stamina, and everything gets hugely easier. My mag necro is forced to go Vamp for a working CC, forced to waste a slot/set/potion for major sorcery, has no access to an execute - swap to stam and all the problems go away and the class becomes an order of magnitude more effective.

That is it in a nutshell.

Iskiab

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

talfx5

Kadoin wrote: »

Want to know something?

Glass cannon any mag class sucks and its not because they are weak, its because damage output is so high you better not run a glass build unless you want to die in two hits.

Shielding is also a crappy mechanic vs. block and roll, and is exactly why not a single one of my mag chars run a shield, not even the glass ones.

Then there are the set differences, how mag needs to stack two to three resources, how mag success is almost always tied to how much healing and damage reduction your build has, double CC and triple CC problems making mag builds near impossible to operate in lag, etc.

All of the mag classes suffer from the same weaknesses, and at this point, I doubt ZOS cares.

Bruh i main a magsorc for years, tried a very tanky version all the way to a glass cannon one. No matter what it wont be as good as stamdk, stamcro,stamplar survivability and damage. Its not even a close call, cant argue with that.
In my duels my magsorc build is close to unbeatable, with 16-17k tooltip on frags. But in ow? Wont have a chance. Shields work that way now that if more than 1 person attacking you, youre stuck on your backbar trying to sustain a 8k cost shields per second with 3k recovery 60k mag. Or a tankier build with higher resistances and mitigation and 1 shield and pet, whatever, tried it all as im trying to say. Its still *** compared to anything else. I have over 20 golden sets that are viable to sorc. In this corrent meta its simply terrible compared to stam. Stam is just easy both in building and in playing.


The only 2 classes that are fun are worthless. That is a big problem, i see a lot of people just either switching to stam or leaving eso in these last few months, i know we all have seen that. Cant deny the big difference between stam and mag rn.
And next patch with molag kena? God damn..


Edit: just noticed i quoted the wrong person

blkjag

Buff magblade

Solaire

Iskiab wrote: »

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

WW are busy hunting newbies in below Lv.50 BG

Iskiab

Solaire wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

WW are busy hunting newbies in below Lv.50 BG

Yea, all they needed to do was move their cc higher up in the WW tree. They got their aoe fear, etc... earlier then other classes got cc break abilities which made them OP at low levels. The complaints about WWs at 50 was purely L2P, ZoS way overnerfed them.

Look at mid-higher MMR and how little class variety there is, and people still ask for magsorc buffs which is one of the most common classes.

If half the people who complained just switched classes they’d see how silly they’re being. I think most of it is disingenuous whining asking to be OP.

technohic

I've been playing everything lately.

The *** things about mag classes IMO is root snare immunity is only 2 seconds compared to 5 at min for stam; and NPCs spam negate everywhere you turn. And having to use staves sucks IMO for anything outside of sorc which has a full range toolkit including a kite tool. You can use 2her for melee mag but then NB seems to have an identify crisis and lacks in general as mag.

Magicka makes up for it in group utility in heals outside of stamden and maybe stamplar ER , although I find ER better for self purge while EP better for group utility in no synergy required.

Still; it gets obnoxious to be even in a group fight to have NPCs nowhere to be seen yet spamming negate; or someone spamming bombard for you to only really have 1 second GCD to do anything before being rooted again. Or destroy your stam rolling

talfx5

Iskiab wrote: »

Solaire wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

WW are busy hunting newbies in below Lv.50 BG

Yea, all they needed to do was move their cc higher up in the WW tree. They got their aoe fear, etc... earlier then other classes got cc break abilities which made them OP at low levels. The complaints about WWs at 50 was purely L2P, ZoS way overnerfed them.

Look at mid-higher MMR and how little class variety there is, and people still ask for magsorc buffs which is one of the most common classes.

If half the people who complained just switched classes they’d see how silly they’re being. I think most of it is disingenuous whining asking to be OP.

Not acknowledging magsorc and magblade have problems and they fall behind by stam classes is a lie. Are we playing the same game?

Luede

technohic wrote: »

I've been playing everything lately.

The *** things about mag classes IMO is root snare immunity is only 2 seconds compared to 5 at min for stam; and NPCs spam negate everywhere you turn. And having to use staves sucks IMO for anything outside of sorc which has a full range toolkit including a kite tool. You can use 2her for melee mag but then NB seems to have an identify crisis and lacks in general as mag.

Magicka makes up for it in group utility in heals outside of stamden and maybe stamplar ER , although I find ER better for self purge while EP better for group utility in no synergy required.

Still; it gets obnoxious to be even in a group fight to have NPCs nowhere to be seen yet spamming negate; or someone spamming bombard for you to only really have 1 second GCD to do anything before being rooted again. Or destroy your stam rolling

i agree, negate should be removed from npc spell pool

Kartalin

technohic wrote: »

Still; it gets obnoxious to be even in a group fight to have NPCs nowhere to be seen yet spamming negate; or someone spamming bombard for you to only really have 1 second GCD to do anything before being rooted again. Or destroy your stam rolling

Bombard spam is ridiculous right now, can't move 1 meter without being rooted. You need RAT/Shuffle just to do anything anymore. I thought there was supposed to be some kind of cool down that was worked on?

Iskiab

technohic wrote: »

I've been playing everything lately.

The *** things about mag classes IMO is root snare immunity is only 2 seconds compared to 5 at min for stam; and NPCs spam negate everywhere you turn. And having to use staves sucks IMO for anything outside of sorc which has a full range toolkit including a kite tool. You can use 2her for melee mag but then NB seems to have an identify crisis and lacks in general as mag.

Magicka makes up for it in group utility in heals outside of stamden and maybe stamplar ER , although I find ER better for self purge while EP better for group utility in no synergy required.

Still; it gets obnoxious to be even in a group fight to have NPCs nowhere to be seen yet spamming negate; or someone spamming bombard for you to only really have 1 second GCD to do anything before being rooted again. Or destroy your stam rolling

Charges will break immobilizations after the patch. As for now, use mist or BoL. Mist is basicly dodge roll for mag.

talfx5 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Solaire wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

WW are busy hunting newbies in below Lv.50 BG

Yea, all they needed to do was move their cc higher up in the WW tree. They got their aoe fear, etc... earlier then other classes got cc break abilities which made them OP at low levels. The complaints about WWs at 50 was purely L2P, ZoS way overnerfed them.

Look at mid-higher MMR and how little class variety there is, and people still ask for magsorc buffs which is one of the most common classes.

If half the people who complained just switched classes they’d see how silly they’re being. I think most of it is disingenuous whining asking to be OP.

Not acknowledging magsorc and magblade have problems and they fall behind by stam classes is a lie. Are we playing the same game?

Magblade yea, magsorc no. Purely a L2P issue.

Zer0_CooL

talfx5 wrote: »

Talking mostly about magsorc, magblade.
Magden is fun but meh, magnecro getting buffed, magdk is fine.
Magplar op ofc...

The problem with magblade and magsorc is the single target damage, its fine, but stamina can hold much higher damage and much higher tankiness and with a lot of aoe. Simply unbalanced and annoying.

I tried it all, glass cannon magsorc was like the end of the rope, just wanted to kill people ffs. Im with about 20 golden sets, tried everything you can think of on a sorc or a magblade. Can abselutely work. But is it good like stam classes survivability with 50% overall mitigation 8k weapon damage 22k vigor tooltip 3k recovery, 160% speed? Its a joke.
Seriously something needs to be done.
The 2 only fun classes on eso are on the buttom for the forseeable future.

I saw a Youtube video im an expert now *smh*

technohic

Kartalin wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Still; it gets obnoxious to be even in a group fight to have NPCs nowhere to be seen yet spamming negate; or someone spamming bombard for you to only really have 1 second GCD to do anything before being rooted again. Or destroy your stam rolling

Bombard spam is ridiculous right now, can't move 1 meter without being rooted. You need RAT/Shuffle just to do anything anymore. I thought there was supposed to be some kind of cool down that was worked on?

That's what I'm talking about in having 2 seconds tops as mag. RAT, wings, BOL all only give 2 seconds. Really winds up being 1 after GCD. Shuffle and rally gives like 5 base, up to 7 seconds. Theres supposed to be root immunity but seems it's only after dodge roll which does nothing for snares. Often times its root and stun in combo and that devastates magicka stam pool, and with lag delay of breaking free, it's hard to find the time to recover for round 2.

WoppaBoem

mag needs more damage for me when comparing my stamdk vs magdk and magplar vs stamplar as I have all of these. The stam version just do so much more damage its not funny.

Rahar

ThePedge wrote: »

Mag classes are, and have been for a while, BiS for PvP.

You forgot the "... in BGs".

BaiterOfZergs

Think both stam and mag are fine in general. Two things that matter the most is overall skill level, the setting and your ability to play each spec.

Some people just will never be good playing a certain spec and some will never be good at playing a certain class. Those two things can skew opinions. Like for me mag warden is trash solo but it’s good in groups.

Iskiab

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

Think both stam and mag are fine in general. Two things that matter the most is overall skill level, the setting and your ability to play each spec.

Some people just will never be good playing a certain spec and some will never be good at playing a certain class. Those two things can skew opinions. Like for me mag warden is trash solo but it’s good in groups.

I don’t really agree. Things are jacked enough right now that some classes can do all styles better then other classes.

MagWarden isn’t trash solo, just their entire burst combo isn’t enough to take out most players solo without a proc set. Same as magblade.

Most opinions aren’t wrong, just either outdated or from potatoes who don’t know better. The ‘everything needs a buff’ threads are normal around PTS time, which isn’t a coincidence. If it wasn’t PTS time you’d never see a thread like and people would get laughed off.

BaiterOfZergs

Iskiab wrote: »

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

Think both stam and mag are fine in general. Two things that matter the most is overall skill level, the setting and your ability to play each spec.

Some people just will never be good playing a certain spec and some will never be good at playing a certain class. Those two things can skew opinions. Like for me mag warden is trash solo but it’s good in groups.

I don’t really agree. Things are jacked enough right now that some classes can do all styles better then other classes.

MagWarden isn’t trash solo, just their entire burst combo isn’t enough to take out most players solo without a proc set. Same as magblade.

Most opinions aren’t wrong, just either outdated or from potatoes who don’t know better. The ‘everything needs a buff’ threads are normal around PTS time, which isn’t a coincidence. If it wasn’t PTS time you’d never see a thread like and people would get laughed off.

There has always been a class or classes that can do things better in the game, that will never change.

Mag warden is absolutely trash. I’d hop on my magblade to open world solo before magwarden. Magwarden is probably at the lowest level of potato killer , too predictable and too telegraphed. Doable doesn’t mean good, I solod on my magplar when it was considered unplayable and I solod on magblade when it was considered the worst class, didn’t stop them from being bad.

Oh and I also played magwarden during Morrowind during the period where people said they’re bad, just in bgs.

technohic

WoppaBoem wrote: »

mag needs more damage for me when comparing my stamdk vs magdk and magplar vs stamplar as I have all of these. The stam version just do so much more damage its not funny.

Magplar I think is pretty close using 2hander. The difference is made up by having a heal tied to sweeps and a burst heal.

DK can be summed up by the passive that gives a whole 6% flame damage, compared to giving 15 or 25 percent stam cost reduction? Just off the top of my head. That's huge when stam generally costs less to begin with so you have to build more sustain or rely on heavy attacks with staves which is a loss.

Speaking of staves; I am also always a bit put off in lightning=aoe and fire=Single target not really matching up with what the classes do in PVP. I suppose sorc maybe for PVE? The fire one bugs me on magdk but I suppose it buffs the DOTs maybe even though half DK use is AOE in breath and leap, while half is single target claw and whip. You kind of just default to that fire damage. Having a magicka melee 2her weapon to match the stam counter part would go a long way here IMO.

Gilvoth

if you do this buff to sorcerers and nightlbades then we need to have the oblivion damage back right along with the shield breaker set.

Solaire

Iskiab wrote: »

Solaire wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

The only thing I think that needs a buff is NBs and WWs. I almost never see WWs anymore so I forgot about them, but saw a couple in a BG this morning...poor guys. I route for them every time I see them, but they never seem to do well.

People need to L2P and stop asking for buffs to things that are already doing well. I like seeing a variety of capable opponents and it’s wrecking the game.

WW are busy hunting newbies in below Lv.50 BG

Yea, all they needed to do was move their cc higher up in the WW tree. They got their aoe fear, etc... earlier then other classes got cc break abilities which made them OP at low levels. The complaints about WWs at 50 was purely L2P, ZoS way overnerfed them.

Look at mid-higher MMR and how little class variety there is, and people still ask for magsorc buffs which is one of the most common classes.

If half the people who complained just switched classes they’d see how silly they’re being. I think most of it is disingenuous whining asking to be OP.

Mostly all MagSorc switched to MagPlar which i understand, they got over nerfed, ZOS has a very bad way of nerfing classes, they either don't do it or if they do, get ready to get reked for an ongoing 20 patches of nerfs,

Stamina and Mag are not balanced right now, Stams are way ahead of Mags, which is bad for class identity which ZOS is trying to toss aside, MagSorc recently got nerfed Yet there is another nerf on ZOS's radar for MagSorc, so i see why people would react like that,

Imagine a class you play the most get nerfed almost every patch, ongoing while you know it's not Over performing,
same goes for buffs, some builds or classes do not need buffs they are already good the way they are but ZOS always misses up everything cause they listen to the wrong people or just don't play their game enough,

StamNB and MagSorc are two most complained about classes in the game since release, they both got pretty reked by nerfs, they got some buffs but it never helped them to get up and match others, while StamNBs have wide range of options to go through thanks to many stamina based weapons and skills to fill that nerf gap with, MagSorc could not do that, they have only 1 weapon choice and different elemental DMG, which they got nerfed also, so it made things even worse for them,

I think both NB and Sorc need a total rework, just completely rework them, too many complains coming in and out everyday
while the real over performing builds hide in the shadows.