Nobody Ever Dies: Welcome to the Ticklefight Meta

Sergykid

who cares about CP pvp. It always had and will always have unbalanced stuff.

in no CP i play all kinds of builds, including tanks and light armor brawlers, and i can tell you even with brp resto and hots up i can't survive an execute spam. With a troll build you might survive forever against one player, but two decent players come in and you can't sustain enough to survive.

i would like for every player to not play CP anymore so they might eventually adjust it.

ThePhantomThorn

Sergykid wrote: »

who cares about CP pvp. It always had and will always have unbalanced stuff.

in no CP i play all kinds of builds, including tanks and light armor brawlers, and i can tell you even with brp resto and hots up i can't survive an execute spam. With a troll build you might survive forever against one player, but two decent players come in and you can't sustain enough to survive.

i would like for every player to not play CP anymore so they might eventually adjust it.

i wish. but off balance stun is basicly required for stamblade to land a incap

martinhpb16_ESO

I have to say Cyro in a big fight just feels weird

Super fast, everyone zooming, popping skills, it feels like uncontrolled trash play.

martinhpb16_ESO

Sergykid wrote: »

who cares about CP pvp.

Really?

MajBludd

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

Raudgrani

Oh, get jumped by some 5-6 enemies and it will do it. All the time. Especially like stam builds spamming Dizzy Swing, but wait... It will lose it's knockback now. So... Yes. No dying. Death is a horrible thing...

Iskiab

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

Rahar

Iskiab wrote: »

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

Yikes. I guess you haven't fought a stamden this patch in CP, right?

Anyway, CP has always had fights that never end, even before Scalebreaker. It's easy to dismiss these as tank builds, but they really aren't. Most of them are wearing at least one damage set and don't build in to blocking or healing or anything.

Jimmy_The_Fixer

Iskiab wrote: »

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

You’re exactly backwards here, burst combos have increased in importance this patch since sustained pressure is now a less viable offensive win condition.

Nobody wants a meta where the only way to kill someone is to OHKO them from 100% health, and that’s the problem with the dragonhold patch.

FearlessOne_2014

Sarousse wrote: »

God, I miss softcaps so hard.

METOO!

Qbiken

Iskiab wrote: »

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

Tells people to L2P, plays a healbot in a zerg.......ironic xD

Iskiab

Qbiken wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

Tells people to L2P, plays a healbot in a zerg.......ironic xD

Don’t be jealous! Yea, healing is cheating in pvp, there’s no skill at all. If you think things like that then L2PvP couldn’t be more accurate.

ketsparrowhawk

My medium armor stamplar with 4k wep damage killed plenty of people in CP Cyro this weekend. Including some "tanks". Had a handful of duels that ended in a draw. There were also plenty that didn't.

Thing about tanks is their sustain sucks. If you spec even a little into mobility, you move too fast for them to land any heavies which totally shuts them down. Drag the fight on for 15+ seconds and they run out of gas and you can whittle them down at your leisure. If they're just permablocking? They are not a threat.. just move along.

Way I think of it.. I gotta get through their stamina bar before I can work their health bar. My strategy this patch has been to out-sustain my opponents and that has been working well for me.

As a strictly medium/light armor player, I welcome tanky enemies to the battlefield. Once you abandon the strategy of just bursting them down ASAP it's pretty easy to shut them down.

Qbiken

Iskiab wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

MajBludd wrote: »

I always see people in CP pvp die. I dont get where this whole unkillable thing comes from.

I've run across tanks that you can't kill, but isn't that their whole schtick, being a tank? I also dont get why players get upset because somebody else can play a build or setup effectively.

Sounds like haters to me.

I agree, I assume it’s mostly dizzy spammers, magsorcs and Magtemplars who can’t adapt. Glassy builds who rely on being able to burst someone in 3 or so GCDs.

Take away their burst combo not being able to always take someone down and they realize they never learned how to pvp and don’t have anything else.

Tells people to L2P, plays a healbot in a zerg.......ironic xD

Don’t be jealous! Yea, healing is cheating in pvp, there’s no skill at all. If you think things like that then L2PvP couldn’t be more accurate.

I´ve done my fair share of organized raids in PvP, capped at 12 people (anything over 12 is a zerg tbh) and not 24+ like Homocide zergs. Heck I´m not even on your server and I know about it......that´s should say something tbh.....

And where did I say healing is cheating??? I´m calling you out because you complain about people who you think don´t want to adapt, when you play a playstyle that literally doesn´t force you to adapt at all. You can play whatever way you want for all that I care, but don´t be a hypocrite at least.

Jimmy_The_Fixer

ketsparrowhawk wrote: »

My medium armor stamplar with 4k wep damage killed plenty of people in CP Cyro this weekend. Including some "tanks". Had a handful of duels that ended in a draw. There were also plenty that didn't.

Of course killing bad players is just as easy as ever, the issue is that stalemates and 10+ minute fights are increasingly common between players of comparable skill, even when both players are built offensively.

Crom_CCCXVI

PERFECT POST--

this is wussiest the game has been. The average player is now pushing 35K Resistance, half the damage skills are worthless
and everyone has Immobilization, off balance, and stun immunity 90% of the time..

Heck I play a Mag DK, we don't even have a ranged stun anymore..... people just run away and we have no chance, lol.


ORGANIZED GROUPS? this is a joke, you need a full 50 man zerg to kill people now, you can have the most organized group in ESO history, there isn't enough damage in the damn game compared to healing and defense.. this is stupid

MCBIZZLE300

I actually preferred scalebreaker, cant belive im saying that!

Ramber

Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »

Mostly the title, self-healing, especially periodic healing has become too powerful in comparison to offensive options, turning CP pvp into extended periods of jumping around at full HP because sustained offensive pressure can’t break through the HoTs as they currently exist.

Even in light/medium armor with no defensive sets while fighting another person in light/medium.

Intensive Mender, Cauterize, and Living Dark are the notable offenders, but the list of overtuned HoTs is pretty long.

It’s not an issue of class balance, since every class can effortlessly live forever unless they get 100-to-0’d in one burst. It’s just tedious and unrewarding gameplay.

PS: The problem is a lot less prominent in no-CP PvP. Also I don’t know how this patch is affecting large group fights.

Dont healing builds lose by virtue of the fact they cant kill anyone?

ThePhantomThorn

MCBIZZLE300 wrote: »

I actually preferred scalebreaker, cant belive im saying that!

ikr. dotts are less than elsweyr by my tooltip, and the healing is still super high?
at least we could kill people.

you prune a bush regularly. you dont take a chainsaw and go to town on it every three months.

zos needs to do a little patch every month rather than a overhaul every 3 months.

also they dont listen to the community. imean... cast times. come on.

even new moon and spriggans this patch is not enough damage to cleave through the stamdks max resists and insaine heals.
the game is getting worse patch by patch. just bring wrobel back.

KurtAngle2

CP PvP is just an unbalanced mess that will never ever get fixed.
There's nothing like an unkillable tank in No CP, just go there and enjoy the game (unless you're ORC because your passives do not work there)

MizoreReyes

Yep they just need to reintroduce Major Defile to every class again. A lot of back and forth nerfing and buffing, they really need to play all classes in CP and No-CP BGs.

JumpmanLane

Add some damage and pen to your builds. Period. Only troll tanks can’t be killed. Anybody that really came just to PvP can be dropped.

Abyssmol

Iskiab wrote: »

Infectious1X wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

IF they do nerf healing they should do it through battlespirit. Maybe have battlespirit reduce damage by 2/3 and healing by 1-4.

It won’t do much to help solo players. They’ll still get rocked by organized groups. With the way the game is setup even if 1 person can stay alive easily against one person, they’ll die quickly when against two.

Not that this is targeted at you, but why do people think a solo person or smaller group should be able to do much against a larger group in the first place? This is the only game I’ve ever played where people feel as though a 1vX or outnumbered situation should be consistently winnable and I don’t understand that mentality.

Being outnumbered means you should generally lose. Simple as that. Obviously there are many variables that need to be taken into account to determine outcomes, such as player skill, organized vs unorganized, etc. but as a general rule, if you’re outnumbered, you’re losing that fight.

I agree with you, but having enough defense to survive against two people for a limited amount of time should be a minimum I think.

In other pvp games I’ve played I’ve taken on multiple people, multiple times, and the key was the burst damage was far lower. In ESO the burst damage and healing are at least double of other games, one stun and you’re dead just isn’t fun to me.

As for this thread, I’m not seeing it. I used hardly any dots last patch and see next to no difference in tankiness.

Is this a thread for people who got used to dots and dizzy and are having problems adapting? I don’t get it. Yea there are a lot of tanky players in cyrodiil now, like before, but it’s not like they can kill anyone unless multiple of them focus you.

I played this morning on my alt, and besides one magsorc who lit me up it was mostly tanky players who were ineffective.

I don't see much of a difference from before the patch and now. I see the same amount of tanks as before, and they don't do damage. I just love messing with them when I find one by themself. I follow them everywhere, place snares on them, and don't let them mount. They have to crawl to where they need to go. Beautiful 😁

Iskiab

Abyssmol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Infectious1X wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

IF they do nerf healing they should do it through battlespirit. Maybe have battlespirit reduce damage by 2/3 and healing by 1-4.

It won’t do much to help solo players. They’ll still get rocked by organized groups. With the way the game is setup even if 1 person can stay alive easily against one person, they’ll die quickly when against two.

Not that this is targeted at you, but why do people think a solo person or smaller group should be able to do much against a larger group in the first place? This is the only game I’ve ever played where people feel as though a 1vX or outnumbered situation should be consistently winnable and I don’t understand that mentality.

Being outnumbered means you should generally lose. Simple as that. Obviously there are many variables that need to be taken into account to determine outcomes, such as player skill, organized vs unorganized, etc. but as a general rule, if you’re outnumbered, you’re losing that fight.

I agree with you, but having enough defense to survive against two people for a limited amount of time should be a minimum I think.

In other pvp games I’ve played I’ve taken on multiple people, multiple times, and the key was the burst damage was far lower. In ESO the burst damage and healing are at least double of other games, one stun and you’re dead just isn’t fun to me.

As for this thread, I’m not seeing it. I used hardly any dots last patch and see next to no difference in tankiness.

Is this a thread for people who got used to dots and dizzy and are having problems adapting? I don’t get it. Yea there are a lot of tanky players in cyrodiil now, like before, but it’s not like they can kill anyone unless multiple of them focus you.

I played this morning on my alt, and besides one magsorc who lit me up it was mostly tanky players who were ineffective.

I don't see much of a difference from before the patch and now. I see the same amount of tanks as before, and they don't do damage. I just love messing with them when I find one by themself. I follow them everywhere, place snares on them, and don't let them mount. They have to crawl to where they need to go. Beautiful 😁

Me neither. Seems like it’s becoming more like how pvp should be; tanks can’t kill anyone, people need to focus on damage to do damage, etc...

15 second plus encounters should be the norm.

Healing is high, but so’s burst damage. If someone’s idea of pvp is everyone should die from one burst combo of course people are going to build to stop it, because if you can survive it those people are in one trick pony specs.

If you’re upset about that being a ‘tank meta’ you’re missing the point, it’s the logical way to build, especially on a class that’s missing burst.

Plus the whole argument is disingenuous. Touch things like wings or shields and people scream their heads off, what people don’t like is ‘their’ burst not being able to kill people while building for tankiness themselves. I rarely if ever see solo glassy builds.

leepalmer95

Iskiab wrote: »

Abyssmol wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Infectious1X wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

IF they do nerf healing they should do it through battlespirit. Maybe have battlespirit reduce damage by 2/3 and healing by 1-4.

It won’t do much to help solo players. They’ll still get rocked by organized groups. With the way the game is setup even if 1 person can stay alive easily against one person, they’ll die quickly when against two.

Not that this is targeted at you, but why do people think a solo person or smaller group should be able to do much against a larger group in the first place? This is the only game I’ve ever played where people feel as though a 1vX or outnumbered situation should be consistently winnable and I don’t understand that mentality.

Being outnumbered means you should generally lose. Simple as that. Obviously there are many variables that need to be taken into account to determine outcomes, such as player skill, organized vs unorganized, etc. but as a general rule, if you’re outnumbered, you’re losing that fight.

I agree with you, but having enough defense to survive against two people for a limited amount of time should be a minimum I think.

In other pvp games I’ve played I’ve taken on multiple people, multiple times, and the key was the burst damage was far lower. In ESO the burst damage and healing are at least double of other games, one stun and you’re dead just isn’t fun to me.

As for this thread, I’m not seeing it. I used hardly any dots last patch and see next to no difference in tankiness.

Is this a thread for people who got used to dots and dizzy and are having problems adapting? I don’t get it. Yea there are a lot of tanky players in cyrodiil now, like before, but it’s not like they can kill anyone unless multiple of them focus you.

I played this morning on my alt, and besides one magsorc who lit me up it was mostly tanky players who were ineffective.

I don't see much of a difference from before the patch and now. I see the same amount of tanks as before, and they don't do damage. I just love messing with them when I find one by themself. I follow them everywhere, place snares on them, and don't let them mount. They have to crawl to where they need to go. Beautiful 😁

Me neither. Seems like it’s becoming more like how pvp should be; tanks can’t kill anyone, people need to focus on damage to do damage, etc...

15 second plus encounters should be the norm.

Healing is high, but so’s burst damage. If someone’s idea of pvp is everyone should die from one burst combo of course people are going to build to stop it, because if you can survive it those people are in one trick pony specs.

If you’re upset about that being a ‘tank meta’ you’re missing the point, it’s the logical way to build, especially on a class that’s missing burst.

Plus the whole argument is disingenuous. Touch things like wings or shields and people scream their heads off, what people don’t like is ‘their’ burst not being able to kill people while building for tankiness themselves. I rarely if ever see solo glassy builds.

But im running around with 30k armour and 5.5k wpn dmg and if i come across someone not a potato we can't kill eachother.

The pvp's messed up. You may not notice because your healing a 24 man who steam pug groups but in proper pvp you can notice.

Legendzerox

More like welcome to the CC bug meta, where you will get cc stunned for eternity.

Fawn4287

I find most problems come from off healing and not self healing. 1V1 there isn’t really any build that puts out insane damage and has ridiculous healing, however CP allows players to stack huge resistances, high health, either be blocking or in mistform and still output solid healing. Really in PvP capping health at like ~30k, significantly reducing healing to other targets by around 50% and put a 10 second cooldown when res is interrupted. There is nothing worse than seeing a group of 3+ templars stacking healing circles, each doing 2-3k HOT.

OrderoftheDarkness

So many Wardens appeared in Non-CP BG. They didn't seem to feel nerf dizzy or dots. I hope the blow to healing will be strong and merciless.
I wouldn't say that Non-CP is OK. Who has more Wardens, those won. If templar full DD, he not such culprit as Wardens, although for Templar healing this element.

Kadoin

OrderoftheDarkness wrote: »

So many Wardens appeared in Non-CP BG. They didn't seem to feel nerf dizzy or dots. I hope the blow to healing will be strong and merciless.
I wouldn't say that Non-CP is OK. Who has more Wardens, those won. If templar full DD, he not such culprit as Wardens, although for Templar healing this element.

Well when you can mix hp% heals AND strong HoTs, that's where the game's balance really shines. Don't worry though, ZOS will never nerf HP% heals and make people actually have to invest something to heal...

Now excuse me while I go get some proc sets to add to the equation.

OrderoftheDarkness

1

Kadoin wrote: »

OrderoftheDarkness wrote: »

So many Wardens appeared in Non-CP BG. They didn't seem to feel nerf dizzy or dots. I hope the blow to healing will be strong and merciless.
I wouldn't say that Non-CP is OK. Who has more Wardens, those won. If templar full DD, he not such culprit as Wardens, although for Templar healing this element.

Well when you can mix hp% heals AND strong HoTs, that's where the game's balance really shines. Don't worry though, ZOS will never nerf HP% heals and make people actually have to invest something to heal...

Now excuse me while I go get some proc sets to add to the equation.

Gl with proc. Someone else says that hybrids are so-so, neither yours nor ours. They have more damage than a full DD and more healing than a full healer and all this in one doll. Again look at this until the next patch. Although can for devs this normally.
I saw no change in the AoE warden damage. Dolls 22k - 30k health should not inflict millions of damage and half a million or more healing in Non CP