Great Job, ZOS, now we're back to PvP Tank Meta /facepalm

Commancho

Like I've said multiple times before patch - these are endless nerfs and next one in the order is healing

xylena_lazarow

PvP Battle Spirit needs to significantly reduce healing done to other players, reduce block mitigation, and increase block cost. The Efficient Purge morph should not be functioning as a spammable group cleanse. AoE healing ultimates should probably cost the same 200-250 that AoE damage ultimates do, so long as this wouldn't disrupt PvE.

There's little to no tradeoff between powerful group healing and personal survivability as things currently stand in PvP. Healing and tanking should be distinct roles that you specifically build for, like in PvE, not a package deal you get for free by running a generic Heavy Armor SnB/Resto build.

Delete the tanky healbots, and players will be far less reliant on zerging in Cyro, there will be far fewer stalemates in BGs, and successful group play will be more about your coordination and individual skill, less about how much heal spam you stack.

Daedric_NB_187

Lol. This is comedy gold. They had a cure for your ails with the last update. Now that it's gone, it's back to crying about unkillable tanks/heals? Lol. I can't anymore. First it's crying that people die too much. Now you're back to complaining that people don't die enough. I love pvp. It is my primary game mode. But some of y'all truly make me smh.

CaffeinatedMayhem

Nyladreas wrote: »

Tanks should've been nerfed in pvp from the beginning. Healers never should've been touched as hard as they have been. IMHO.

You must be new here... PvE tanks have been nerfed to the point we carry desto staves, all because of PvP. What do you mean PvP tanks need more nerfs? PvE tanks have nothing left! What goes next, my shield?

Edit: When stam regen while blocking was done away with there was a whole chorus of "tie this change to Battle Spirit!"... and ZOS did not. Every tank nerf afterwards was suggested to tie to Battle Spirit, because only PvE tanks were suffering. Now you can't nerf PvP tanks anymore because the PvE tanks will all quit... if they haven't already. So will ZOS finally tie tank nerfs to Battle Spirit? My guess is "no."

xeNNNNN

Nyladreas wrote: »

Now don't get me wrong... The DOT meta sucked hard, but at least people kept dying. What we have now though? Holy ***....

High MMR BGs are just full of players running 40k-50k+ health blocking and watching each other until their ults charge then atttempt to kill each other.

Can we please have an increase of block costs and decrease of block mitigation on battlespirit, with one hand and shield equipped? Hell, why don't you add a forced defense cap too This is actually ridiculous and boring as hell

that suggestion would have to be restricted to battlegrounds only. Overland PvP needs block mitigation because you know....zergs are a thing. Only ways to survive are roll dodging, blocking and self heal spam and most of the time you have to do all 3 to survive the ball groups remotely. So yeah if people do want this then BGs only. But be warned, it will be nothing but 2h and bow builds if you push for this change. Enjoy your dizzy spam I guess? lol

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

to me the probs is skills do to much damage if that was lowered peeps would not go tank meta

BattleAxe

alainjbrennanb16_ESO wrote: »

to me the probs is skills do to much damage if that was lowered peeps would not go tank meta

Half of wut they do in pve u think tht is too much damage

itscompton

Daedric_NB_187 wrote: »

Lol. This is comedy gold. They had a cure for your ails with the last update. Now that it's gone, it's back to crying about unkillable tanks/heals? Lol. I can't anymore. First it's crying that people die too much. Now you're back to complaining that people don't die enough. I love pvp. It is my primary game mode. But some of y'all truly make me smh.

It's not clear, are you addressing the OP, everyone who's posted or the forums in general? Because I personally think the Dot Meta has been incredibly fun and was all for it from day one. I'm on PS4 so I've still got two weeks to enjoy it. Not looking forward to Cyrodiil being nothing but tanks or super mobile builds that kite away the second they start losing a fight.

WuffyCerulei

But wasn’t it always like that? Not sure where you’re getting at.

amir412

Tanks exists before this patch.
See @Bubosh vids

LiquidPony

I'm definitely sure that no one on PTS has been predicting an unkillable tank PvP meta for the past 5 weeks.

Definitely not. This outcome is really totally surprising and I can see how ZOS didn't see it coming. Very surprising indeed.

I mean, they only massively nerfed damage on about 47 different skills without adjusting healing while also buffing PvP tanking tools.

FierceSam

PvP players find way not to be killed in PvP shocker

I would have thought that’s the whole point. No one comes into PvP going “oh I’m super happy to be killed all the time ‘cos I’ve got a kick ass Kill Me build”. And whining that players can heal themselves??. Cos clearly you don’t? That’s just inane.

PvP demands that you are as tanky as you can get away with, that you can heal as fast as possible so you can stay alive and, eventually, kill your opponent.

Evenly matched PvP will produce relatively few kills, either through low ability (no one has the skills to kill) or high ability (everyone has the skills to survive). High death count is an indication of bad match ups.

Clearly players will have to decide what an ‘epic’ fight is - is it a short one sided battle where I kill everyone instantly again and again with my overpowered button press, or a longer battle where I probe out my opponent’s weakness and finally outplay them? I know which one sounds more epic to me.

The_Lex

Elseweyr was fun but they really missed the mark with Scalebreaker and Dragonhold.

OtarTheMad

It's always the same cycle, has been since launch. Players are too tanky, they give us a counter and then players complain about the counter and zos nerfs it and then we are back at square one.

Drdeath20

I appreciated DoT META. Atleast every1 died, alot, when playing BG's. I guess its strictly PVE until a better META comes around.

BRogueNZ

You all focus healers and just want them to melt and ignore common sense by trying to prolong their life. get real.

holden_caulfield

This is a brilliant idea.
Just DD with self healing. Not too much ofc specifically when they are against you.
From ESO to EDDO, elder DD only.
You really really want a game just made for you and your needs

WillhelmBlack

How the hell could you increase the cost of block any more than what it is now? It costs 4x more than original cost and you can't regenerate stamina whilst doing so.

What you're seeing are the new potions vs your old, out of date build. If you want to kill people that are stacking all these resists, you're gonna need a lot of spell or weapon damage, penetration and burst. DoTs do nothing.

olsborg

Its always been to easy to turtle up and heal in this game. Snb just makes it stupidly easy

WillhelmBlack

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Oh yes, the answer to tank meta is nerfing sword and board YET AGAIN.

Some people shouldn't be allowed to post on forums. We need a personality and knowledge test set up to qualify.

Although this would take some of my Saturday reading enjoyment away, so maybe not. Saturday morning is the best time for snowflakes spitting their dummies out.

EmEm_Oh

casparian wrote: »

ZOS has been attempting to introduce effective counters to the heal/tank meta for years. Proc sets, oblivion damage, easy access to Defile, DOTs....they've tried their darnedest to figure this out, but every solution they've introduced has been extremely unpopular with players.

I'm not at all optimistic about whatever it is they attempt to do next.

Yep.

The problem is the players. ZOS needs to IGNORE the nerfers. By not doing so, they are just chasing their mmo tails in circles.

Why?

Nerfers will NEVER be satisfied. ZOS should only update skills when a new DLC is out, meaning 3 months at the least...not every 3 weeks.

WillhelmBlack

olsborg wrote: »

Its always been to easy to turtle up and heal in this game. Snb just makes it stupidly easy

Blocking is free in most other games and is encouraged as part of skillful gameplay.

In most other games though, you cannot spam OP heals like Breath of Life whilst doing so.

Weesacs

If block reduction cost is increased then the cost of other forms of defense needs to be increased as well to stay inline with what u are asking for e.g. dodge roll, shields etc.

Ragnarock41

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Oh yes, the answer to tank meta is nerfing sword and board YET AGAIN.

Some people shouldn't be allowed to post on forums. We need a personality and knowledge test set up to qualify.

Although this would take some of my Saturday reading enjoyment away, so maybe not. Saturday morning is the best time for snowflakes spitting their dummies out.

Well ZOS takes your weekend fun rather seriously , unfortunately these threats are often taken very seriously, speaking from painful experience.

So yes, somebody should come up and say ''Wait, you're talking non-sense'' So ZOS also reads it and say ''Maybe OP is just biased and misinformed''. If nobody comes up with counter points, the complainers win and they ruin things. If you want proof look at wings. An iconic , class defining ability, now ruined forever.

Nyladreas

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Oh yes, the answer to tank meta is nerfing sword and board YET AGAIN.

Wrong, I asked them to change Battlespirit, the skill line would be to remain untouched. Read the posts properly before panicking with conclusions.

Sahidom

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Oh yes, the answer to tank meta is nerfing sword and board YET AGAIN.

I agree, don't do this.

There are ways to force someone to drop block; plus, heavy hits eats up stamina when blocking. Multiple hits eats up stamina e.g. Force Shock triple hit forces three separate stamina costs to block one.

IF their running 40-50k resistances (presuming the 20% is coming from Pariah) than resource poison the F out of them, including upping their Ultimate cost. Burn their resources out, they probably don't have more than 2k recovery.

Try and test methods to circumvent their resistances, and force them to be low on resources to minimize their offense potential; BUT don't mess up S/B because changes to that will deeply impact PVE tanking.

Nyladreas

thatlaurachick wrote: »

Nyladreas wrote: »

Tanks should've been nerfed in pvp from the beginning. Healers never should've been touched as hard as they have been. IMHO.

You must be new here... PvE tanks have been nerfed to the point we carry desto staves, all because of PvP. What do you mean PvP tanks need more nerfs? PvE tanks have nothing left! What goes next, my shield?

Edit: When stam regen while blocking was done away with there was a whole chorus of "tie this change to Battle Spirit!"... and ZOS did not. Every tank nerf afterwards was suggested to tie to Battle Spirit, because only PvE tanks were suffering. Now you can't nerf PvP tanks anymore because the PvE tanks will all quit... if they haven't already. So will ZOS finally tie tank nerfs to Battle Spirit? My guess is "no."

I've never said i wanted tanks nerfed, I said i wanted their behavior nerfed via an enforced PVP buff. Once again you're another person overreacting to a post you haven't read properly, yet then you mention battlespirit yourself. I'm confused

Dusk_Coven

The answer to meta is to stop chasing meta so hard. All the hard-core meta people need to be segregated into their own PvP league and let the power fantasy play-your-pay people have fun in another league.

Ragnarock41

Nyladreas wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Oh yes, the answer to tank meta is nerfing sword and board YET AGAIN.

Wrong, I asked them to change Battlespirit, the skill line would be to remain untouched. Read the posts properly before panicking with conclusions.

As if that changes anything, you're still asking for a nerf to SnB weapon, stop acting innocent about it. SnB is already worthless as a front bar weapon. I don't accept another nerf to it because magplars can blockcast their heals with it.

RouDeR

Sure if we nerf the stupid OP Fury set and Onslaught damage as well : )