DPS is through the roof right now. Why are so many people still terribad at it?

kylewwefan

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.

Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

rotaugen454

Don’t worry, the dot thing goes away soon.

Dalsinthus

I wouldn't call 25 to 30k through the roof, but I hear you. I pug tanked Elden 1 yesterday for the style drop and I had a group that did less than 10k combined dps. A sword and board / bow DK that was spamming lethal arrow as well as a 2 handed and Resto staff templar (magplar?) that did either jabs or heavy attacks. We finished it, but my teeth had been ground down a few mm by the end. I think the healer and I did most of the damage. The two "dps" were so happy when we finished that this must have been one of their first vet dungeons.

Light attack weaving is not the easiest thing to do well on console, but we were way beyond those sorts of issues with this group. The game also does not do a great job training you to play and the relative ease of overland does not select for knowing how to build a damage dealing rotation.

VaranisArano

Probably because ESO tells players about light attack weaving in a Level Up Tip and a loading screen and that's it. And aside from the Skills Advisor, it doesnt hint about the existence of rotations at all. Oh, and the game is also terrible about explaining how magicka/stamina scaling works.

Its sad that using outside sources is practically a must.

rotaugen454

How is it possible to do a combined less than 10k damage? I can do nothing but heavy attacks and monster set occasionally firing off and do 7k (tested because I was curious).

jadarock

It's been over a year since I spent time doing dummy parses. Max I ever achieved was 15.9k 😬
Problem is i cant get light heavies or skills to fire reliably yet I have guildies that hit 50k+ on all their chars and melt all content like its pretty trivial /shrug
Dummy rotations dont do jack for me anyway as I'm strictly a pvper xbox na

Nestor

I watch players of all ranks have long protracted fights with overland and trash mobs. Some people simply do not care how long it takes to kill something.

Numerikuu

rotaugen454 wrote: »

How is it possible to do a combined less than 10k damage? I can do nothing but heavy attacks and monster set occasionally firing off and do 7k (tested because I was curious).

As someone who once did a whopping total of roughly 3k dps before realising the game did a *** poor job of telling you how stats/scaling works and so on, a combined less of 10k is very, very possible lol

Nestor wrote: »

I watch players of all ranks have long protracted fights with overland and trash mobs. Some people simply do not care how long it takes to kill something.

Not necessarily true. Back in the early days I was one of those people that took forever killing a trash mob, but that was because I literally had zero idea of how the game worked. It was only when a CP9000 person ran up and 1hko'd the thing I was killing that I realised something was very, very wrong lol.
As Varanis said above, the game does an utterly awful job at teaching you how it works, if at all.

Dalsinthus

rotaugen454 wrote: »

How is it possible to do a combined less than 10k damage? I can do nothing but heavy attacks and monster set occasionally firing off and do 7k (tested because I was curious).

I mean I was wondering the same thing. But these dps characters were a mess - a templar with Resto and a great sword using jabs and occasional heavy attacks. Sometimes the DK would just stop and stair at the fight for 5-10 seconds before going back to lethal arrow spam. The builds were bad, the players had no idea what they were doing, and they were not really even trying.

Casul

Likely due to bar rotation and being reluctant to light attack weave. I have seen hybrids that can hit for 30-35k so no excuses.

rotaugen454

True. I was grinding zombies to raise some skills up, and I saw two players struggling to take on more than three. I invited them to group, told them to just toss in some AOE after I bunched the zombies up, and we melted everything very quickly. They asked how I could do that, and I tried my best to explain various aspects, including difference between mob and single target. If players don’t hear it from someone else, it’s hard to pick up without a lot of trial and error.

Cpt_Teemo

Who cares who does the most dps when you got....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOMj7WttkOA

on your team

Huyen

VaranisArano wrote: »

Probably because ESO tells players about light attack weaving in a Level Up Tip and a loading screen and that's it. And aside from the Skills Advisor, it doesnt hint about the existence of rotations at all. Oh, and the game is also terrible about explaining how magicka/stamina scaling works.

Its sad that using outside sources is practically a must.

The skilladvisor hasnt changed. Meanwhile alot of skills have. Like the spectral bow skill a nightblade has. Its now a tank skill, but its in the advisor still for dps. On top of that the whole play as you want thing is ruining things too.

zaria

kylewwefan wrote: »

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.
Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

I want details of your build.
I can do 27K with requiem and briarheart on dummy with max cp stamsorc with master bow if headwind then focusing hard. Animation cancel is obvious. Your rotation point to weave anyway and yes I miss some.
And yes if you play on pc you can go to pts and test gear and setup.

And this is my main critic against the combat changes. It mostly hurt the mid tire players. The ones progressing trough vet dungeons or vMA using an 6 month old guide.
Yes they are also the idiots saying you can not be an nord magsorc, then you did 50% of dps, obviously as an healer on an non death run even then all roll dodge into stupid.

Jaimeh

kylewwefan wrote: »

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.

Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

That's a bit of a narrow way to look at this, and there are valid reasons, which are not excuses, but just a result of the many ways the game can be enjoyed. To name a few: because people don't really understand how to effectively do damage, and/or play defensively (because they are not comfortable with mechanics), and/or do not care, since dps only becomes important in certain aspects of the game. I think most veterans forget how befuddling the game can be for beginners, or players that haven't played similar games, or those that have levelled entirely solo, doing overland stuff, that don't really require a big damage output. I remember when I did my first normal dungeon (at CP300+), and someone from the group asked me why I was using a resto staff on my back-bar as a dps, and I had no clue what 'dps' meant, and the idea of not having my resto healing seemed preposterous I didn't even know what a rotation was when I first went into vMA. I just instictively knew I had to throw a bunch of skills periodically, and that's how I got by most content, three years into my ESO life. Eventually, because I discovered I liked trials, I started reading guides about builds, which eventually led to finding out about rotations, weaving, animation cancelling, and so on. And even if someone has done all that research, they still need to practice said rotations, and spend countless hours on the dummy, or in live content, in order to improve (thus, there's an element of free time as well). In addition, a level of individual swiftness also comes into it. Even if power creep nowdays can inflate damage, it still requires a rudimentary rotation and understanding of how to perform the DD role, and that's nowhere mentioned in the game, it's something that people have to learn by themselves, like for all the roles. But most people will not bother because simply put, for the majority of the game content, high damage is not needed at all; even vMA can be completed easily nowdays with a one-bar, heavy attack rotation. Therefore, if someone only does normal dungeons, or overland content, and for WBs, dragons, and dolmens they can usually be in the company of others, they won't bother with dps, because it's actually not needed for their activities and enjoyment of the game. I don't see people with terribad dps, like you said, in veteran dungeons, maybe it can be low, but it's obviously players who are working on it, and trying to improve. It's mostly in normal dungeons that this can happen, and that's to be expected since new or more casual players will run dungeons in that mode.

Heyodude

rotaugen454 wrote: »

Don’t worry, the dot thing goes away soon.

Thank jeebuz I can get back to engaging gameplay.

Jeremy

kylewwefan wrote: »

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.

Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

Yeah it's still out of control. But it has gotten a little better at least - and with the new incoming changes should continue to move in the right direction. Once all the turmoil settles and the melodrama fades - I think a better Elder Scrolls Online will emerge from the destruction. I just hope the current development team has the balls to see their vision to the end and not get cold feet in the face of all this exaggerated criticism because the long term health of their game depends on it.

But anyway, and to your point - I don't understand how people struggle with DPS on this game either, especially on the easier content like the landscape where players continuously tell me they struggle. Even my tank - who has literally no offensive stats - can still easily dispatch nearly everything I encounter with a single rotation. I hate to sound brash - but this game should not be balanced around new players who walk around nude and punch things. It needs to be balanced around players who at least show some commitment to the game and wear decent gear and devise logical builds for themselves. Because I don't understand how anyone who meets those basic qualifications could be struggling on this game's landscape content.

Starlock

The "why" is that these so-called guarantees are nothing of the sort. Players won't actually hit those numbers by doing what is outlined in the OP. But I wouldn't expect someone who has a giant list of video game achievements in their signature to understand that anyway, no offense.

IndianaJames7

Many people like to learn at their own pace or don’t have others to learn from so end up doing many things dps ideally shouldn’t. When I started playing MagSorc way back when as my first dps I had no idea what I was doing and was only hitting like 15k on a 3mil until I looked into some Alcast builds/ videos and found things to improve.

I assume that many others likely made the same mistakes I did, so I will list some of them.

- Ineffective build: instead of maximizing damage, too much focus is put onto stats that dps shouldn’t be focusing on like: 30k health, boosting resists, health Regen, increasing non primary resource.
- Incomplete builds: bad traits on gear, mix and match sets that don’t give you the proper 5 piece bonus.
- No back bar: I was close to cp300 by the time I discovered what a back bar is.
- Zero light attack weaving: Base game should do a better job teaching people how to do this.
- Terrible sustain: results in having to continually heavy attack instead of using abilities.
- Wrong abilities: mag dps using abilities that scale on weapon damage/stamina, abilities morphed wrong, not enough dots.
- No rotation to speak of: only using spammable on boss, spamming the same aoe on adds etc.

It should be no surprise that people making these mistakes are pulling terrible dps. In many cases people simply don’t know better and treat combat like it’s a sequel to Skyrim, rather than like an mmo that requires dynamic use of many abilities and specialized builds.

Nestor

Does any game really teach you how to play it? Sure some games teach what buttons to press to do something and some games are better at that than others.

But to teach you how to excel at the game? I have not seen that since Daggerfall and its 150 page user manual.

rotaugen454

Nestor wrote: »

Does any game really teach you how to play it? Sure some games teach what buttons to press to do something and some games are better at that than others.

But to teach you how to excel at the game? I have not seen that since Daggerfall and its 150 page user manual.

If I didn’t have all the internet sites to reference, I’d be WAY behind where I am. That’s why I try to help people out. I got help from all the website people and understand it well enough to test out builds/rotations myself now.

Odovacar

Poor DPS makes for bad experiences in PuG's for sure, but many I think just cannot or will not put in the time to learn rotations properly. Mainly the reason the end game (even simpler DLC vet content) is cleared by a very small percentage, at least on consoles that is.

Jhalin

High ping or server lag (both of which is plentiful in ESO) can cause problems with weaving, meaning anywhere between a 5-10k dps loss that cannot be made up for by skill.

Other sources of dps loss comes from a lack of sustain, usually caused by spamming abilities or a healer providing insufficient resource assistance.

But honestly, most of the difference between sub 15k dps and 25k+ is how much people care about the people they’re going to be in a group with. Unfortunately nothing in the game tells people that their S&B resto sorc isn’t even close to pass for a dps until they jump into group content, at which point any criticism is consider “elitism”

xeha_arwen11

kylewwefan wrote: »

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.

Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

And here's an example of said toxicity and elitism I've been talking about. Just because you find something easy doesn't mean you should mock other people for having difficulty with it. They are not "terribad". Stop with the rudeness. How about helping people out while being nice? Typical ESO elitist poisoning the game.

I've pugged dungeons and trials a long time. I've seen many people struggle to get 15k dps. It's hard for a lot of people. There's a lot to it. Calling people names doesn't increase their dps. People react badly to venomous criticism. They would be far more likely to take advice and increase dps from someone who is decent acting.

Davor

kylewwefan wrote: »

For real my people. All you have to do is lay out every dot you can think of in no particular order. Start on back bar, work your way to and through the front bar. Then start over. Ult dump whenever you feel like it. I guarantee you’re gonna hit 25 to 30k DPS without even trying hard.

No excuses. No sweaty rotation nonsense. No animation cancel. This Maelstrom Staff ain’t gonna make you all of a sudden good.

Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Light attack, skill. Swap bar. Light attack, skill. Etc. etc. etc. start over.

Why do I constantly get in either group of terribaddy’s or godlike Monster DPS.

Uhm, not all of us are cyber jocks. Some of us play for fun.

Curious, how come you are a cyber jock? Couldn't hack it in real life? Now you belittle in the cyber world now? How very jocky of you.

azjuwelz

Some guildmates of mine wanted to complete vdsa (for the weapons), and since I was only at CP300 and another guildie was at 580, they took the higher CP, thinking he could do more damage . . . and then after wiping repeatedly on Round 8, they came to learn that this "dps" wore heavy armor, had attributes scattered between health, magicka, and stam, did not have a single complete 5 set, and used skills better suited to a tank.

No one had ever told him about builds, or rotations.

Now perhaps at max CP you can fire a bunch of DOTs and hit 30k, but I personally can't. And yes, I'm still working on weaving, which on console without combat metrics is sort of a guessing game to know if you're hitting the timing right.

SidraWillowsky

rotaugen454 wrote: »

How is it possible to do a combined less than 10k damage? I can do nothing but heavy attacks and monster set occasionally firing off and do 7k (tested because I was curious).

I was doing 2.5k DPS at CP 220ish because the game makes it profoundly unclear on what you need to do to get high DPS.

Turns out that that does != spamming Ambush and Acid Spray on your stamblade.

Also, I came from Skyrim. Never played an MMO before. I didn't expect Skyrim 2.0 per se, but in Skyrim, things get a LOT easier as you level up, to the point where after a while I could kill stuff just by hitting it enough with my mace- no skill required. ESO's a different beast entirely, and I imagine that a lot of other people are here for this being a TES game first and the MMO part second.

Had I not had help from guildies, I wouldn't have even known what to search if I wanted to look up how to get better. Rotation? Light attack weaving? Alcast? Foreign terms. I guess I'd have figured it out eventually but I didn't even realize I was doing anything wrong until people showed me why it was wrong and how to get better.

Hashtag_

Demra

The best dps doesn't not nessasily result in the best looking fantasy fight. I like 1person camera playing like in skyrim with single target attacks and jumping around all dramatic.

I get it, i am selfish.I just want to have fun. What can you do.

El_Borracho

rotaugen454 wrote: »

How is it possible to do a combined less than 10k damage? I can do nothing but heavy attacks and monster set occasionally firing off and do 7k (tested because I was curious).

Well, when I started, I thought this was going to more like Skyrim. So me and my heavy-armor wearing Nord DK hybrid with a mishmash of CP and skills wasn't exactly crushing it. It was fine, as I was roaming the world and doing the solo overland content.

Once I started doing group content, I looked up online what to do, how to build a character, rotations, etc. Now, it seems silly that I was dishing such low damage. But others are right, if you never looked up sites like alcast or xynode or even this site, you would have no idea that what you are doing is wrong. Especially with the CP system.

Orjix

I have been trying for so long on my magblade to get over the 20k mark, and no matter what i seem to do it just doesnt work. i can copy other peoples builds who hit way higher that the 20k mark and try my best to light attack weave and keep my dots up, but i just CANT hit 20k+. At this point ive given up, i have heard "oh its easy, let me help you!" so many times and even after having them there and do what they tell me to do, i can never seem to pull it off. /ohwell