Concern: Dev feedback this PTS cycle

Moloch1514

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

Insco851

Feedback? The only thing they listen to are noobs asking for nerfs.

Dear ZOS, I Died to Dizzy Swing today.... what’s block? Please nerf!

Mayrael

I'm pretty convinced that this patch will be the same as others. People will find some game breaking bugs, so ZOS won't fix it before going live, but they will nerf everyone just in case.

juhislihis19

Mayrael wrote: »

I'm pretty convinced that this patch will be the same as others. People will find some game breaking bugs, so ZOS won't fix it before going live, but they will nerf everyone just in case.

That's exactly how it will go. They couldn't fix Leap when it was buggy and 'missed' targets so instead they increased the radius (?!)

Some of the over-the-top nerfs/buffs and broken mechanics will go through Live, and ZOS might be fixing them - in the next few months or so.

Astrid_Ironfang92

Moloch1514 wrote: »

... perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

This is mine and my partner's sentiment exactly.

Elwendryll

Reduced all damage over time by 60% and your favorite "spammable" ability by 15%.

Dev comment:

Some guilds have been able to complete the Godslayer of Sunspire achievement which was not intended, so we reduced the overall dps

Finedaible

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

I was really hoping they'd go over and explain why all the nerfs and the drastic increase in ability costs during the stream, but they skipped entirely over the nerfs and only announced the slight changes and buffs. They only took like 3 'questions' after they were done too, which didn't even address the main issues.

Major_Lag

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle?

No. Same as on every other PTS cycle thus far (with 1 notable exception - cast times on shields).

mikemacon

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously a very vocal but hardly representative sector of the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

Fixed it for you.

Mettaricana

So much for their atte pt to be more trnasparent 20 patches later still no transparency or goal..

Azyle1

mikemacon wrote: »

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously a very vocal but hardly representative sector of the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

Fixed it for you.

I am not so sure you silly edit holds true.

They never nerfed a large % of dps before as far as I know. Most people except the bottom of the barrel DPS are upset.

Callie-Brie

So far, only crickets from ZOS. I'm sure there will be some adjustments in Week 2 PTS, but the lack of Dev interaction so far speaks volumes. More of the same ZOS.

SirLeeMinion

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

Back and forth? No. No we won't. #killingit

Vapirko

SirLeeMinion wrote: »

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Will we actually have any meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team this PTS cycle? Obviously the community is not happy with such drastic nerfs with damge reduced AND costs doubled, so perhaps @ZOS_Gilliam or @ZOS_BrianWheeler could spend time justifying what looks like attempts to nerf Hodor, leaving us mortals behind to deal with our DPS going from 30k to 20k.

@ZOS_GinaBruno will there be more dev feedback this time?

Back and forth? No. No we won't. #killingit

If by back and forth you mean way over buffing and then way over nerfing then yes, yes they will. #killingit

Olupajmibanan

juhislihis19 wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

I'm pretty convinced that this patch will be the same as others. People will find some game breaking bugs, so ZOS won't fix it before going live, but they will nerf everyone just in case.

That's exactly how it will go. They couldn't fix Leap when it was buggy and 'missed' targets so instead they increased the radius (?!)

Some of the over-the-top nerfs/buffs and broken mechanics will go through Live, and ZOS might be fixing them - in the next few months or so.

Not fixing Bastion CP would be pretty funny :-D Iceheart on magicka and infused off hand weapon with glyph of hardening on stamina would suddenly become bis of the bis

Moloch1514

I guess we will have NO dev feedback this PTS. Typical for this regime; was hoping they'd want to improve something for once.

Canned_Apples

They have been pretty transparent with regards to their vision but their actions/decisions have had the opposite effect.

How exactly do you create class identity when you're stripping away everything that makes a class' skills unique and buffing generic dots to do the same damage?

Shantu

"meaningful back-and-forth with the combat team"? Since when has that ever happened? It's pretty obvious, and has been for a long time, this company holds its player base in the lowest of regards.

chrightt

I think the real issue is while they are trying to do good and make balanced and productive patch notes they more often than not fail miserably. Good intentions with beyond garbage outcomes until they can “sort of feel” they really really *** up. No point of getting dev feedbacks if they can’t produce actual, useful *** results.

SFDB

chrightt wrote: »

I think the real issue is while they are trying to do good and make balanced and productive patch notes they more often than not fail miserably. Good intentions with beyond garbage outcomes until they can “sort of feel” they really really *** up. No point of getting dev feedbacks if they can’t produce actual, useful *** results.

The idea behind it all isn't unique, lots of games undergo a big transformation years in to sort out long-standing build issues. This version is problematic because we're getting the interim steps, rather than the largely completed work. Consequently, nothing interesting, just like there's nothing particularly exciting about your new kitchen remodel if you spend six months with a camp heater for cooking and a garden hose for water. Your dream kitchen may be on the other side of that six months, but it's a lousy six months, which isn't convincing you that there's going to be a dream kitchen on the other side.

The biggest problem is that they aren't do anything exciting for the majority of players while taking something away from almost all players. Thinking that one new stamina morph for each of three classes is going to make up for following up a nerf patch with another nerf patch is myopic.

DreadDaedroth

They've found the time to nerf Sentinel set. Nuff said.

idk

While I think Zos has not thought through how to best implement their new "vision" for combat in the game they have clearly explained that is what they are in the middle of doing. So not sure what OP wants Zos to say other than to repeat what they have already repeated.

BTW, Do not expect much better. Matt Firor was at the helm when this game experienced the worst launch for a major MMORPG title in the history of gaming. He was also at the helm when they decided that us being able to obtain the full 3600 CP in less than 2 years and be able to use it was a great idea (yes, that is how CP was launched). I still expect the same mediocrity with this major change.

Also, like how somehow this is all due to Hodor. lol

Wayshuba

chrightt wrote: »

I think the real issue is while they are trying to do good and make balanced and productive patch notes they more often than not fail miserably. Good intentions with beyond garbage outcomes until they can “sort of feel” they really really *** up. No point of getting dev feedbacks if they can’t produce actual, useful *** results.

I have gone back and watched the streams on combat changes over the last year, especially from the U24 initial launch and NOWHERE do they say they are trying to balance things. What they do say, is how they think a DK (an in your face melee class) having an expensive ranged spammable would be so cool.... and this can be said for many of the skills.

Listen to the combat team in the U24 launch. It is not about balance. It is about what they think would be cool. Heck, even when they talk about their reasoning for changes it doesn't make an sense whatsoever. This is why they were asked if "they play the game", because most players could see the reasoning was utterly senseless.

There is no good intentions at all. There is some self-aggrandizing love fest with themselves which continues to go forward against player wishes regardless of the damage it is causing in player retention.

Sahidom

The developers should consider "returning to the basics," and regain their integrity of the game for designing a quality game. [snip] Also. The vocal player base are not the "innocent" party when they've systematically contributed to the string of changes. Sometimes, it's harsh dealing with narcissistic, self-centered players in game development when so many forum petitions often revolve around their "wants" then the majority of the communities. The developers shot themselves in the foot for listening, and saying all this, I understand that others will disagree with me avidly. But, the painting is all over the wall.

[Edited to remove Bashing]

Araneae6537

Elwendryll wrote: »

Reduced all damage over time by 60% and your favorite "spammable" ability by 15%.

Dev comment:

Some guilds have been able to complete the Godslayer of Sunspire achievement which was not intended, so we reduced the overall dps

What is this? Surely it is taken out of context I hope??? Things aren’t being nerfed because the most extreme hardcore beat an achievement that was what, supposed to be impossible??? Maybe what I am saying makes no sense but this comment, by itself, makes no sense to me.

Girl_Number8

Insco851 wrote: »

Feedback? The only thing they listen to are noobs asking for nerfs.

Dear ZOS, I Died to Dizzy Swing today.... what’s block? Please nerf!

So true ^

pdblake

I've never even been on the PTS but, to those who have, if you think they don't listen, why do you even bother?

Personally, as a paying customer, they can test it themselves.

I have to test my work, I wouldn't dream of letting a customer loose on it until I think it's ready, and then I fix anything that happened to be missed ASAP.

Moloch1514

Hehe...same deal, different patch cycle. Every patch is addressing feedback given the LAST PTS cycle.