SAVE MAG SORC FROM THE NERFING?

ezio45

Yes but nerf the pets they are a plague!!!

IronWooshu wrote: »

I feel no pity... death to shield stacking.

You know, there is a very large portion of the sorc community that infact wanted a major minor system with nerfmire to prevent shield stacking. Instead what we got actually forced players that didnt want to shield stack into doing it.....

Amdar_Godkiller

Sorc wasn't nerfed as bad as WW, so I'm actually hoping for more nerfs once its realized that sorc is still going to be best in PVP.

ezio45

Yes but nerf the pets they are a plague!!!

Pet sorc was over preforming. Unfortunately these changes make non pet pretty much dead, definitely unplayable and with no reason to be used.

Hope they will do something to help nonpet out but given zos's track record and this communities hatred for sorcs, i doubt it.

Mayrael

Lol. Save sorcs? I guess magblades don't need to be saved because they had already extinct.

Maxx7410

Yes they are the best class!!!!

I think some dont understand, MAGICKA SORCERER CANT BE NERFED they MUST be the best class they have MAGIC they dont need to follow the physical limitations from other classes. For RPG purposes it MUST be this way!!!

SidraWillowsky

Yes but nerf the pets they are a plague!!!

They need to nerf pet sorc in PVP ONLY. Some PvE-ers just want to quest without dying too much and I think that the pet sorc build is perfect for them... and anyone else who cares to use it. I don't care if it's ez mode in PvE, just please stop it in PvP.

Katahdin

I'm also a non sorc main that stood up for sorcs when zos put a cast time on shields.
Since other non sorc classes got so much "love" and "reciprocaton" for nerfs, to the point sorcs were cheering for the nerfs, I wont support them again for a while even though I do have a sorc I do play sometimes.
Sorcs can die to the nerfs like everyone else

Palidon

Oh it's ok to nerf every other class but golly leave the poor Sorc's alone. Awe, do I really care? Nope.

roksolana_sowa

Not everyone here know but every patch zos making just to nerf the most purr class in game with no dps, selfheal and survivability T-T

Chadak

I love how people start parroting the language the developers hand to them with absolutely no basis for comprehension for it.

"It was overperforming"

Over performing?

Over performing in comparison to what, precisely? Some non-existent standard? Some moving goalpost that skids around like a panicked dog trying to run on wet ice?

The devs use fifty cent words and professional-sounding phraseology in patch notes. And yet, 'overperforming' still means bupkus if performance objectives neither exist nor have any definitions.

Overperforming as based on what data? We only assume there is data and that it's being utilized and interpreted in an intelligent manner, and that's an unfit assumption to make considering how many times they keep ramrodding extreme changes back and forth on certain powers and abilities.

It's like watching the shadows of two lunatics duking out it. Can't actually see the fistfight, but looking at the patch notes across the past year (let alone two years) has been like seeing the results of an ongoing battle for dominance between Larry, Moe, Curly and Forrest Gump.

And the joke's on us, because it's our time they continue to waste with their nothingburgers topped with the finest of fifty cent verbiage.

'Overperforming' doesn't mean diddly squat when the entire basis for deciding something is 'overperforming' is failing to do basic math, implementing something and then panicking when the math you didn't test, examine or apparently even meaningfully think about goes places you obviously didn't anticipate.

My car's speedometer goes from 0 MPH to 180 MPH. Because I'm not a complete potato, I consistently manage to drive it at speeds commonly ranging from 30 MPH to 75 MPH, concurrent with the local speed limits of whatever road I'm on.

ZOS keeps slamming on the gas, then slamming on the brakes. There is no middle ground. It's 'bark the tires and spin out sideways', then 'panic profusely and slam on the brakes'.

Back and forth the pendulum goes. All the while, they pretend everything is fine and try to sound super casual when nerfing something by 50% or buffing something by 160% and so on.

It's tantamount to them saying "Yeah, so, we stomped on the gas and then the car was overperforming, so we stomped on the brakes, and then the car was underperforming."

These turnips need an adult and a time-out, not directive powers over a game they're clearly so incompetent at balancing that they've wasted the time of literally millions of people by over-correcting in every imaginable way without end and without fail.

Ragged_Claw

Yes nobody will think of the poor sorcerers!!!

Chadak wrote: »

I love how people start parroting the language the developers hand to them with absolutely no basis for comprehension for it.

"It was overperforming"

Over performing?

Over performing in comparison to what, precisely? Some non-existent standard? Some moving goalpost that skids around like a panicked dog trying to run on wet ice?

The devs use fifty cent words and professional-sounding phraseology in patch notes. And yet, 'overperforming' still means bupkus if performance objectives neither exist nor have any definitions.

Overperforming as based on what data? We only assume there is data and that it's being utilized and interpreted in an intelligent manner, and that's an unfit assumption to make considering how many times they keep ramrodding extreme changes back and forth on certain powers and abilities.

It's like watching the shadows of two lunatics duking out it. Can't actually see the fistfight, but looking at the patch notes across the past year (let alone two years) has been like seeing the results of an ongoing battle for dominance between Larry, Moe, Curly and Forrest Gump.

And the joke's on us, because it's our time they continue to waste with their nothingburgers topped with the finest of fifty cent verbiage.

'Overperforming' doesn't mean diddly squat when the entire basis for deciding something is 'overperforming' is failing to do basic math, implementing something and then panicking when the math you didn't test, examine or apparently even meaningfully think about goes places you obviously didn't anticipate.

My car's speedometer goes from 0 MPH to 180 MPH. Because I'm not a complete potato, I consistently manage to drive it at speeds commonly ranging from 30 MPH to 75 MPH, concurrent with the local speed limits of whatever road I'm on.

ZOS keeps slamming on the gas, then slamming on the brakes. There is no middle ground. It's 'bark the tires and spin out sideways', then 'panic profusely and slam on the brakes'.

Back and forth the pendulum goes. All the while, they pretend everything is fine and try to sound super casual when nerfing something by 50% or buffing something by 160% and so on.

It's tantamount to them saying "Yeah, so, we stomped on the gas and then the car was overperforming, so we stomped on the brakes, and then the car was underperforming."

These turnips need an adult and a time-out, not directive powers over a game they're clearly so incompetent at balancing that they've wasted the time of literally millions of people by over-correcting in every imaginable way without end and without fail.

Fair points, well made.

You win the forums I reckon.

p00tx

Saril_Durzam wrote: »

Aedaryl wrote: »

IronWooshu wrote: »

I feel no pity... death to shield stacking.

Maybe nerf shield stack and not individual shields so?

Just dont let shields stack. Plain and simple. Wont affect much Sorcs (zero in Pve. Maybe a bit in PvP but not much).

That would affect PvE tanks negatively. If they could put it into Battle Spirit, I'd support it 100% though.

p00tx

Chadak wrote: »

I love how people start parroting the language the developers hand to them with absolutely no basis for comprehension for it.

"It was overperforming"

Over performing?

Over performing in comparison to what, precisely? Some non-existent standard? Some moving goalpost that skids around like a panicked dog trying to run on wet ice?

The devs use fifty cent words and professional-sounding phraseology in patch notes. And yet, 'overperforming' still means bupkus if performance objectives neither exist nor have any definitions.

Overperforming as based on what data? We only assume there is data and that it's being utilized and interpreted in an intelligent manner, and that's an unfit assumption to make considering how many times they keep ramrodding extreme changes back and forth on certain powers and abilities.

It's like watching the shadows of two lunatics duking out it. Can't actually see the fistfight, but looking at the patch notes across the past year (let alone two years) has been like seeing the results of an ongoing battle for dominance between Larry, Moe, Curly and Forrest Gump.

And the joke's on us, because it's our time they continue to waste with their nothingburgers topped with the finest of fifty cent verbiage.

'Overperforming' doesn't mean diddly squat when the entire basis for deciding something is 'overperforming' is failing to do basic math, implementing something and then panicking when the math you didn't test, examine or apparently even meaningfully think about goes places you obviously didn't anticipate.

My car's speedometer goes from 0 MPH to 180 MPH. Because I'm not a complete potato, I consistently manage to drive it at speeds commonly ranging from 30 MPH to 75 MPH, concurrent with the local speed limits of whatever road I'm on.

ZOS keeps slamming on the gas, then slamming on the brakes. There is no middle ground. It's 'bark the tires and spin out sideways', then 'panic profusely and slam on the brakes'.

Back and forth the pendulum goes. All the while, they pretend everything is fine and try to sound super casual when nerfing something by 50% or buffing something by 160% and so on.

It's tantamount to them saying "Yeah, so, we stomped on the gas and then the car was overperforming, so we stomped on the brakes, and then the car was underperforming."

These turnips need an adult and a time-out, not directive powers over a game they're clearly so incompetent at balancing that they've wasted the time of literally millions of people by over-correcting in every imaginable way without end and without fail.

That's actually a brilliantly apt description for how "balancing" has felt in this game over the last 4 years. It feels like a constant game of "Pin the nerf on the Donkey" where they just keep blindly pinning, figuring something will get stuck in the right place eventually so they can say "See! Told you I'm great at this!".

On the flip side of that, Pet Sorcs were a bit silly. They were consistently hitting the highest out of the Mag DPS in in PvE by a pretty notable margin (60k+ at the top end on the non raid dummy, while most other Mag classes topped around 55k). My evidence for PvP is 100% anecdotal, but after being slammed in the face by countless 14-15k+ Crystal Frags (often one right after the other from the same player somehow) with 6K+ tics from their Matriarch (the healing morph for Pete's sake), I'm willing to put a little money on the side of "overperforming", even though I don't have any real metrics to back that up. No, I don't think they need to be nerfed into the ground, but maybe tuned down just a bit.

peacenote

Yes nobody will think of the poor sorcerers!!!

Alright, I'll play. (Although you should have a pro pet sorc specific choice and a no, to be fair.)

My main is not a sorc however my main DPS character is now a pet sorc.

I am most concerned with the healing changes so I haven't delved into the sorc changes as much (I have a job and stuff) BUT I have cubital tunnel syndrome and received an excellent and absolutely true recommendation on this forum that pet sorcs, because of a viable heavy attack rotation, are a good class to play if you have injuries.

As a result, besides my three healers and tank, out of the seven DPS characters I have the petsorc by far sees the most play, with my stam WW NB getting the least play because OMG IT HURTS!! Being a werewolf looks cool but it is not worth the pain.

Therefore I do get concerned when I hear about pet sorc nerfs. Yes, the pets are annoying for people, and if you want to reduce their sizes or make them transparent in cities or whatever that's fine, but let's not eliminate the whole playstyle. I can't speak to whether the proposed changes, even in my opinion, will actually be extremely detrimental to pet sorcs, BUT I will advocate for the sorcs if there are expert sorc players out there who believe that the changes will be problematic!

xeNNNNN

Death to 3vs1
Death to Shield of incredible size and durability
Death to sorcs


RAAWRRSDaksdklahdfjhasjkldfasbdfjaksbdfkjasbdlf


Seriously though,

No. Take your nerf and embrace it. Now you shall feel the pain DKs have felt for a very long time and by that I mean the constant string of nerfs that never stop and only seem like they're averted when something gets buffed.

bardx86

Yes but nerf the pets they are a plague!!!

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Death to 3vs1
Death to Shield of incredible size and durability
Death to sorcs


RAAWRRSDaksdklahdfjhasjkldfasbdfjaksbdfkjasbdlf


Seriously though,

No. Take your nerf and embrace it. Now you shall feel the pain DKs have felt for a very long time and by that I mean the constant string of nerfs that never stop and only seem like they're averted when something gets buffed.

Sorcs have been nerfed for 2 and 1/2 years and DKs just got buffed ass.

Agenericname

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Death to 3vs1
Death to Shield of incredible size and durability
Death to sorcs


RAAWRRSDaksdklahdfjhasjkldfasbdfjaksbdfkjasbdlf


Seriously though,

No. Take your nerf and embrace it. Now you shall feel the pain DKs have felt for a very long time and by that I mean the constant string of nerfs that never stop and only seem like they're averted when something gets buffed.

Or you could play both and wish that neither of your characters weren't getting nerfed. The us vs them makes it easier to nerf everyone though, there's always that.

Chadak

p00tx wrote: »

Chadak wrote: »

I love how people start parroting the language the developers hand to them with absolutely no basis for comprehension for it.

"It was overperforming"

Over performing?

Over performing in comparison to what, precisely? Some non-existent standard? Some moving goalpost that skids around like a panicked dog trying to run on wet ice?

The devs use fifty cent words and professional-sounding phraseology in patch notes. And yet, 'overperforming' still means bupkus if performance objectives neither exist nor have any definitions.

Overperforming as based on what data? We only assume there is data and that it's being utilized and interpreted in an intelligent manner, and that's an unfit assumption to make considering how many times they keep ramrodding extreme changes back and forth on certain powers and abilities.

It's like watching the shadows of two lunatics duking out it. Can't actually see the fistfight, but looking at the patch notes across the past year (let alone two years) has been like seeing the results of an ongoing battle for dominance between Larry, Moe, Curly and Forrest Gump.

And the joke's on us, because it's our time they continue to waste with their nothingburgers topped with the finest of fifty cent verbiage.

'Overperforming' doesn't mean diddly squat when the entire basis for deciding something is 'overperforming' is failing to do basic math, implementing something and then panicking when the math you didn't test, examine or apparently even meaningfully think about goes places you obviously didn't anticipate.

My car's speedometer goes from 0 MPH to 180 MPH. Because I'm not a complete potato, I consistently manage to drive it at speeds commonly ranging from 30 MPH to 75 MPH, concurrent with the local speed limits of whatever road I'm on.

ZOS keeps slamming on the gas, then slamming on the brakes. There is no middle ground. It's 'bark the tires and spin out sideways', then 'panic profusely and slam on the brakes'.

Back and forth the pendulum goes. All the while, they pretend everything is fine and try to sound super casual when nerfing something by 50% or buffing something by 160% and so on.

It's tantamount to them saying "Yeah, so, we stomped on the gas and then the car was overperforming, so we stomped on the brakes, and then the car was underperforming."

These turnips need an adult and a time-out, not directive powers over a game they're clearly so incompetent at balancing that they've wasted the time of literally millions of people by over-correcting in every imaginable way without end and without fail.

That's actually a brilliantly apt description for how "balancing" has felt in this game over the last 4 years. It feels like a constant game of "Pin the nerf on the Donkey" where they just keep blindly pinning, figuring something will get stuck in the right place eventually so they can say "See! Told you I'm great at this!".

On the flip side of that, Pet Sorcs were a bit silly. They were consistently hitting the highest out of the Mag DPS in in PvE by a pretty notable margin (60k+ at the top end on the non raid dummy, while most other Mag classes topped around 55k). My evidence for PvP is 100% anecdotal, but after being slammed in the face by countless 14-15k+ Crystal Frags (often one right after the other from the same player somehow) with 6K+ tics from their Matriarch (the healing morph for Pete's sake), I'm willing to put a little money on the side of "overperforming", even though I don't have any real metrics to back that up. No, I don't think they need to be nerfed into the ground, but maybe tuned down just a bit.

You're not wrong. Petsorc's felt like the pets were hitting a little too hard, and nobody'd have heard a peep out of me if they'd gotten nerfed. I'm not even mad at the specific numbers of the nerf to them.

Nothing about this patch in the vacuum of its own isolated existence is why I'm so livid. It's the fact that this patch is yet another blind swing of the axe at things the devs clearly don't understand, and that they keep trying to 'fix' by panicking and flailing blindly at.

I'm sick to absolute death of feeling like I'm an idiot for expecting consistency from month to month in any playstyle or build I make on any class. Any of them; all of them. They all get chainsawed by lunatics, and this usually creates the problems that then get over-corrected upon in a 'fix' soon after.

Overcorrection after overcorrection, and I'm just so freaking done with it that it defies common description.

I've been stunned and infuriated by perpetuated incompetence in MMO's before, but this wins an award, and the only way incompetence like this gets cured is by dragging it into the sunlight and burn the stupidity out of it.

f047ys3v3n

Yes but nerf the pets they are a plague!!!

The Restoring Twilight is hela over tuned in the dps department. A skill that you don't even have to activate should not be a top 3 dps ability even if it does take two bar slots. Though, the volatile familiar dps was actually a little under-tuned considering the extra bar slot required. It under performs most DOT's.

As for the rest, it is an undeserved nerf. No mag dps is keeping up with any stam dps load out these days and nerfing the ground DOT's that are mags primary dps source is therefore pretty stupid. Sorc gets hit hard with this with the mega nerf to lightning plus the general mag nerf to wall.

Lastly, you guys are actually un-nerfing the severity of the cost stacking on streak? I take it your devs wern't around a few years ago. Maybe you were still in high school? I'll clue you in. It was bad. People just endlessly streaked across the map. They were as unkillable as nightblades who have macroed the bunny hop exploit and do it the second they cloak (you should probably work on fixing that btw) You should really reconsider this un-nerf. People still streak away just fine. They don't need to be able to do it 3 times as long.

BTW, I main a mag sorc. Or will until this patch goes live. Mag was already on the weak side, guess I will need to hunker down and totally re-learn how to play, on a stam toon. To be honest, I doubt I will. I drifted away for some while after your Morrowind drunken bender and even after coming back later, the game has never been near as good. It was best around homestead BTW. Pretty much every patch since has been downhill. Quite the unbroken record of failure, ineptitude, idiocy at this point.

Jeremy

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Pet Sorcs with Engine Guardian is quite possibly the most annoying thing I’ve seen in this game.

Yeah, they're pretty annoying.

They need to do something about pets in PvP generally. They're just too effective as obstructions to the targeting system and people are purposely trying to get as many pets out at once for that very reason. I doubt that was intended.