[Rage] Age old problem that has me at a crossroads.

Elric_Ashborn

For the last week I've been hardcore dungeon running. Rounding down I have run into time and time again (1 in 3) or in some cases more then twice per dungeon a tank or a healer queuing up without any ability to do such at all. The last THREE healers had no healing moves at all. Running with tanks with 11k health running light armor. It is so overwhelmingly systemic its sad. Just to cut ahead of the line.

My personal crossroad, I want to build a pure DPS. But to put it mildly, I have never been able to do such in ESO. But, I do get some complaints sometimes that my DPS could be higher, I WANT it to be higher. But every single day, sometimes more then once a dungeon I need to heal for the group. All with the same story I'm not kidding you "sorry bro just wanted my daily" I have heard that FOUR times just today. I'm honestly pretty laid back, I'll carry you if I can, but a great deal of these folks are not even aware of the mechanics. Watching a bow stamina build run Breath of life. What is very strange is most/all of these folks have high CP...

Should I...
A) Play as my Hybrid this will never be solved.
Build a pure DPS and deal with the... special users.
C) Go to FF14 where they properly train roles, and make then go through the routine, before doing dungeons.

yodased

Join a dungeon guild and leave the pugs

redspecter23

Play as a pure dps if you choose to. If your healer doesn't bring heals, vote to kick. If your tank doesn't bring a taunt, vote to kick. Don't diminish your build because of queue skippers.

Elric_Ashborn

Just running with a guild that I trust seems viable... more viable then default.

MartiniDaniels

ESO dps formula severely punishes for any step out of glass cannon build (which doesn't prevent you from being tanky dps on some builds). Probably you may try healer role, healer is probably closest to support/dps position in dungeons.

KappaKid83

Elric_Ashborn wrote: »

For the last week I've been hardcore dungeon running. Rounding down I have run into time and time again (1 in 3) or in some cases more then twice per dungeon a tank or a healer queuing up without any ability to do such at all. The last THREE healers had no healing moves at all. Running with tanks with 11k health running light armor. It is so overwhelmingly systemic its sad. Just to cut ahead of the line.

My personal crossroad, I want to build a pure DPS. But to put it mildly, I have never been able to do such in ESO. But, I do get some complaints sometimes that my DPS could be higher, I WANT it to be higher. But every single day, sometimes more then once a dungeon I need to heal for the group. All with the same story I'm not kidding you "sorry bro just wanted my daily" I have heard that FOUR times just today. I'm honestly pretty laid back, I'll carry you if I can, but a great deal of these folks are not even aware of the mechanics. Watching a bow stamina build run Breath of life. What is very strange is most/all of these folks have high CP...

Should I...
A) Play as my Hybrid this will never be solved.
Build a pure DPS and deal with the... special users.
C) Go to FF14 where they properly train roles, and make then go through the routine, before doing dungeons.

IMO try FF14, its' leveling and combat systems are really clean and a lot of fun. Also being able to level every class on one single toon is pretty nice.

Elric_Ashborn

You know what? That's true, I get comments all the time I make a better healer then the one we got. Maybe contributing DPS where I can is the answer. I'll solve the problem! I WILL BE THE HEALER... heh

Grandma

1) join a guild
2) make a tank / healer so you don't have to deal with fakes as much and don't have to worry about dps performance

Raisin

Kick them. You're there to have fun, not carry greedy buttwipes at your expense.

yodased

PC NA there is a dude named yodased who runs a guild named dungeon dwellers.

Leader is badass, check them out

SirAndy

Whenever i pug a dungeon (random or otherwise) i fully expect to solo that dungeon.

Anything better than that is just added gravy ...

SirAndy

yodased wrote: »

PC NA there is a dude named yodased who runs a guild named dungeon dwellers.
Leader is badass, check them out

Tried contacting them but the answering machine said they're currently all busy dwelling in some random dungeon ...

Dark_Lord_Kuro

Just so you know those are healing bow with medicinal arrows!

Haquor

Build pure dps and throw a self/burst heal on your backbar. Vigor, Surge/matriach, spores, dragon blood, sap essence...cant remember the necro skill 5 living death.

You will kill everything faster and survive in normals. And with some of the above heal your group anyway while being 95% dps.

Osteos

yodased wrote: »

PC NA there is a dude named yodased who runs a guild named dungeon dwellers.

Leader is badass, check them out

Why is that name so familiar..

IneedaDollar

DDs flagging as healers is not a bad thing actually since 3 DDs is way better than running with a healer for 95 percent of the dungeons anyway but yeah fake tanks are a big problem.

Mr_Walker

You could always... play as a tank or healer yourself?

barney2525

Elric_Ashborn wrote: »

For the last week I've been hardcore dungeon running. Rounding down I have run into time and time again (1 in 3) or in some cases more then twice per dungeon a tank or a healer queuing up without any ability to do such at all. The last THREE healers had no healing moves at all. Running with tanks with 11k health running light armor. It is so overwhelmingly systemic its sad. Just to cut ahead of the line.

My personal crossroad, I want to build a pure DPS. But to put it mildly, I have never been able to do such in ESO. But, I do get some complaints sometimes that my DPS could be higher, I WANT it to be higher. But every single day, sometimes more then once a dungeon I need to heal for the group. All with the same story I'm not kidding you "sorry bro just wanted my daily" I have heard that FOUR times just today. I'm honestly pretty laid back, I'll carry you if I can, but a great deal of these folks are not even aware of the mechanics. Watching a bow stamina build run Breath of life. What is very strange is most/all of these folks have high CP...

Should I...
A) Play as my Hybrid this will never be solved.
Build a pure DPS and deal with the... special users.
C) Go to FF14 where they properly train roles, and make then go through the routine, before doing dungeons.

You gotta look out for number One and make sure You are having a fun time. What ever the answer is, THAT is what the answer should be based on. Do not play what others 'need'. Play what you will have fun with.

Quite frankly, it's not your responsibility to get daily rewards for other players. And it is Very selfish of others to Lie about their character type so they can get into a dungeon fast and then Con everyone into carrying them through it. It's completely disrespectful to everyone else and people should Not, IMHO, bail them out.

Austinseph1

Honestly the group finder sees very low expectations from me. If I use it I do so expecting to solo while carrying a few extra people on my back, if you get a player that actually did their homework it’s a nice bonus. It sounds negative but I’ve had far more bad experiences with the group finder than I have good ones. If I que as dps and wait 40 mins just to play with somebody who would rather cut in line I vote kick. If that doesn’t work then I report and leave it to the next poor soul in line. It’s not even about wait times, it’s just plain disrespectful to the players and the game.

aaisoaho

I personally try to adapt my build for pugs when pugging. Instead of going full on DPS, I use TFS (I don't count on having the pen buffs from group when pugging) and VO (it adds sustain, which might not be available from group when pugging). On my stam sorc, I'll also use skills like vigor and crit surge to heal myself - also because there's no way of knowing if the healer in PuGs is gonna have enough healing.

I also expect newer players to inform the rest of the group if they are new. I sometimes ask my group if somebody is new, so we can explain the mechanics beforehand and wait for them to finish the quest. Being new is never a reason to votekick for me!

LeagueTroll

Mr_Walker wrote: »

You could always... play as a tank or healer yourself?

My thoughts exactly. For these stupid dungeon, I rather play my healer or tank, enjoy the fast que, and kick the bad dd if i get them.

Mathius_Mordred

Join a large active guild and say goodbye to pug runs. Even in the guild, we don't often have a tank or a healer but as there is at least one person on the run who can clear the dungeon solo it's almost never required. Of course vet is a totally different story as are trials. For trials we prefer people to be on Discord for normal and that's mandatory for Vet trials, with quite a lot of requirements. But that's going from the easiest to the hardest content, a good guild will help you achieve everything you want including higher DPS.

FrancisCrawford

Elric_Ashborn wrote: »

You know what? That's true, I get comments all the time I make a better healer then the one we got. Maybe contributing DPS where I can is the answer. I'll solve the problem! I WILL BE THE HEALER... heh

Healers can and should spend most of their time in dungeons DPSing. Yes, your numbers are limited by your other job, but it still feels a lot like a DD role.

Hotdog_23

Always have a self heal available period unless you go in a organized planned group. Even then it is still a good idea to have a self heal and not go full glass canon.

Personally I can tell when I pug a group as either a tank/healer or dps who has the ability to self sustain and heal when needed. The runs go so much smoother if the dps can self heal and the healer can spend most of their time doing dps.

Some of my favorite times in a dungeon as a healer is when a dps gets hit hard and starts running away from the group and I have to stop dps/support and chase them down to heal them.

Ashtaris

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

Always have a self heal available period unless you go in a organized planned group. Even then it is still a good idea to have a self heal and not go full glass canon.

Personally I can tell when I pug a group as either a tank/healer or dps who has the ability to self sustain and heal when needed. The runs go so much smoother if the dps can self heal and the healer can spend most of their time doing dps.

Some of my favorite times in a dungeon as a healer is when a dps gets hit hard and starts running away from the group and I have to stop dps/support and chase them down to heal them.

All this shows to me is that the current system is terribly flawed if you don’t need a tank or a healer for end-game content.

redlink1979

PUG has its risks.
You really need to run dungeons with friends/guild mates for better experiences.

Coatmagic

(Already stated but) +1 to join a dungeon guild and drop pug life
or
do what my friends and I have done and embrace the snowflake xD
(The above obviously requires you to have regular online buds.)

Noldornir

yodased wrote: »

Join a dungeon guild and leave the pugs

This is the dog running 'round it's own tail in order to bite it.

Yoda's right in his statement, it's just the truth that's behind it that is not "fair".

Imagine this:

You make a Tank, pure tank---> start to play alone, go in pugs find many ppl with crappy DPS/doing stupid things. Take ages to do even simple dungeon.
BTW tanking is boring AF in an easy dungeon with low DPS so you wont do it anymore.

---

PPL in pugs will not find you (nor many other tanks) anymore in finders so they'll start to "lie to the AF" and declare themselves as tanks (while they are plain DD not even DD with a little more HP or a taunt skill)

---

For each person that do the above 3 ppl are going to have (90%) a bad time.

10% you'll get one so good that can tank/DD if it's a base game dungeon


Pretty much the same is for healers.

Tanks and healers in this games are designed as buffers/debuffers other than their main role.
Buffs/Debuffs works good only if some good number is already there to begin with.

TLDR=

Real Tanks/Heals are (almost) going with guilds/premades only. They are rare (compared to DDs) and do prefer not to get the shortest straw for a (let's say) pledge. Many DDs are probably asking em to go already (unless these tanks/heals sucks) from guilds so why they should?

Result= fake tanks, fake heals

I think ZOS should address this problem ASAP 'cause it's a REAL bad experience for new players finding themselves in dungeons with setups that are NOT supposed to be and learning things the WRONG way.

Girl_Number8

Make three friends or join a guild problem solved. Good luck

Remember smarter not harder, so it is fun and hopefully remains so.

yodased

Just to comment on the above.. I pug every day on all and I actively recruit to my guild through that so I am literally even worse than presented.

Im actively removing good players from the he'll that is PUG and wrapping them in the warm blanket that is my guild.

OrphanHelgen

I rage quit or vote to kick when I see *** like that. Did veteran frostvault with someone spamming hardcast frags only and did like 3k dps. It's my choice not to play with that ***. I dont expect world best players when I group tool, but just have a brain thats all I'm asking. So either vote to kick and if that doesn't go through, just quit and try again.