Magsorc - ULT of Choice?

HalvarIronfist

I prefer NO CP PVP.

What do you think is the best PVP sorc ult that I should use?


(Assume Resto staff backbar ult)

ItsNotLiving

Shooting star

Betty_Booms

Depends on your style and game type. In no cp you have a wider choice. Others may think its trash but i get some good mileage out of overload.

For flag games I run atro.
If I see enough nightblades in a bg ill run soul assault.
Ill also give db a run every so often if im running a tankier build with mines and blockade.

Meteor is highly telegraphed and easly blocked.

If you are facing a group strong with heals consider negate.

They all serve a purpose and i would choose one that caters to your situation.

gepe87

Atronach/Dawnbreaker+Life Giver with pet sorc destro resto
Dawnbreaker/Shooting Star if small scale or ice comet->solo+Life giver n) No pet sorc

Temporal guard if you have s&b backbar (only pet sorc)

Negate if supporting (absortion field on ball groups)

Blinkin8r

If you're a zergling Atro for sure. More pets = less chances you get killed.

darkblue5

LoS-iNg iN yOuR aTroNaCh iS sKilLeD pLaY aNd sHoUlD bE rEwArDeD.
(Run Atro anyways as it is the most pressure and a stun... Overload builds exist but aren't meta.)

ChunkyCat

Now I want to make a pet sorc PvP build.

Metemsycosis

For bgs soul assault, meteor, atro, eots.

I rated them in order of my preference.

oxygen_thief

dawn breaker or soul assault.

HalvarIronfist

In the past, I ran shooting star and I mainly used it for pressure.Hit a group with it, plant a curse, and then mage-wrath them down.

I feel like attro is terrible because it could be killed(?), but the stun and pressure is nice.

Dawnbreaker is an option, but i'd need to be in melee range. Which is not how I prefer to play a magsorc.


Soul assault is something I havent thought of. Could be worth a try.

Iskiab

ChunkyCat wrote: »

Now I want to make a pet sorc PvP build.

Agreed. Nothing can create so much salt unless it’s really good.

Emma_Overload

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

Thogard

A good rule of thumb to determine the best ult to slot on your mag sorc is that it’s whichever one you don’t currently have slotted.

Datolite

Shooting Star by far. I sometimes run a Vicious Death build in BGs and have wiped entire teams with a well placed Fury/Meteor/Frags.

Noobslayer3255

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

Emma_Overload

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

I don't judge the class by the hundred worthless potatoes I cut through like butter every day. I judge it by what happens when I run into a fully leveled, competent player of one of the other classes. THOSE are the memorable fights to me. And what has always been true is that Mag Sorc has some serious flaws that need to be addressed before the class can truly shine.

Sure, Mag Sorc has various strengths, too, but there are other specs that are even stronger. Stamina builds in general, and Stamblades in particular, simply do more damage. Until Mag Sorc has all the tools necessary to make our combo stick, there is going to be plenty to complain about.

Illuvatarr

Energy overload is the best sustain tool (comparable to wearing an additional sustain set) available to sorcs and the damage is incredible when weaved. In my opinion, it is the most underrated ultimate in the game. The arguments for bright throat over lich simply don’t stack. One infused sustain glyph on jewelry gives more sustain than the entire bright throat set.

Urvoth

You really can't go wrong with DB. Even on mag it's one of the best ults in the game.

Illuvatarr

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

The same could be said for your posts man. I don't think you understand how strong of a counter stamina is in general to mag sorcs (the entire stat, from the classes that use it to the defensive mechanics they can utilize to essentially negate mag sorc damage).

I think you have a mag sorc due to the knowledge you have on your other posts which leads me to conclude you haven't played it much recently or are not seeing just how strong the counters in place are to the class.

oxygen_thief

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Energy overload is the best sustain tool (comparable to wearing an additional sustain set) available to sorcs and the damage is incredible when weaved. In my opinion, it is the most underrated ultimate in the game. The arguments for bright throat over lich simply don’t stack. One infused sustain glyph on jewelry gives more sustain than the entire bright throat set.

it has always been a clunky ult. it stucks in heavy attack mode so often that its almost useless

Noobslayer3255

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

The same could be said for your posts man. I don't think you understand how strong of a counter stamina is in general to mag sorcs (the entire stat, from the classes that use it to the defensive mechanics they can utilize to essentially negate mag sorc damage).

I think you have a mag sorc due to the knowledge you have on your other posts which leads me to conclude you haven't played it much recently or are not seeing just how strong the counters in place are to the class.

I've commented in substance on one magsorc thread, my comment on this thread doesn't even talk about the class.

Yes I have a magsorc, I have every class mag and stam besides mag necro.

I don't play my magsorc as often as my stam classes because I like stamina a lot more, and yes I do feel in general stamina is stronger than magicka for pvp because of the things you allude to - break free, roll dodge, sprint etc. But mag sorcs have great stamina sustain and can take advantage of dodge roll if you build in a bit of stamina sustain and use dark deal. Also, mag sorcs often mitigate 100% of my single target stamina damage because they can dance around 2 pets that are up 100% of the time, a third with shadowrend, a 4th with atro.... Nothing like wasting my incap or onslaught on a *** twilight. If they changed the targeting or actually made tab targeting work, it would go a looong way in reducing my perception that magsorcs are very, very, perhaps too, strong. Especially the healing twilight. It shouldn't be targetable, and one morph should heal while the other morph should deal damage. The pet offers way too much as is. They would still have a great pvp kit and passives if they tuned down the pets and changed the targeting, but they wouldn't be so mind numbingly frustrating just to even freakin target with single target abilities.

Zer0_CooL

Frontbar:
Atro because of the stun and it either keeps the enemy at distance or deals a decent amount of damage.
Backbar:
The resto ulti for solo, or the negate when in group.

In my opinion, the shooting star has a too long delay and deals not that much dmg. It should be changed, so that the DoT is on the target instead of an AoE.

Illuvatarr

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

The same could be said for your posts man. I don't think you understand how strong of a counter stamina is in general to mag sorcs (the entire stat, from the classes that use it to the defensive mechanics they can utilize to essentially negate mag sorc damage).

I think you have a mag sorc due to the knowledge you have on your other posts which leads me to conclude you haven't played it much recently or are not seeing just how strong the counters in place are to the class.

I've commented in substance on one magsorc thread, my comment on this thread doesn't even talk about the class.

Yes I have a magsorc, I have every class mag and stam besides mag necro.

I don't play my magsorc as often as my stam classes because I like stamina a lot more, and yes I do feel in general stamina is stronger than magicka for pvp because of the things you allude to - break free, roll dodge, sprint etc. But mag sorcs have great stamina sustain and can take advantage of dodge roll if you build in a bit of stamina sustain and use dark deal. Also, mag sorcs often mitigate 100% of my single target stamina damage because they can dance around 2 pets that are up 100% of the time, a third with shadowrend, a 4th with atro.... Nothing like wasting my incap or onslaught on a *** twilight. If they changed the targeting or actually made tab targeting work, it would go a looong way in reducing my perception that magsorcs are very, very, perhaps too, strong. Especially the healing twilight. It shouldn't be targetable, and one morph should heal while the other morph should deal damage. The pet offers way too much as is. They would still have a great pvp kit and passives if they tuned down the pets and changed the targeting, but they wouldn't be so mind numbingly frustrating just to even freakin target with single target abilities.

Cloak and dodge roll are better defenses than pets. Much better. It is 100 percent damage mitigation and it can be combined. Stamina is much better than magicka in terms of melee range burst( magicka has no equivalent to speak of), ranged burst with bow(this patch the burst that can be achieved with ballista is comical), survivability, ease of play, pvp movement speed, higher armor ratings, item set selection, lack of a stamina negate, ability choices, cost reduction for abilities being higher and more prevalent, cc immunity on the best and one of most used dps lines in the game, heals.... ad infinitum (the only time magicka is better is with group aoe being fully supported by healers).

After a couple of years of near complete stamina dominance, a magicka class can burst and do sustained dps almost to stam levels and of course stam players are now here complaining because the new reality of something closing in on parity is here and it is uncomfortable.

I don’t see how your posts have any merit when it comes to this discussion other than conveying you are not liking that a mag toon can do to you what stam toons have been doing to mag toons for over two years now.

It’s even more noted that you main a nightblade.....the class specifically designed to kill mag sorcs.

Emmagoldman

I dont think nightblades are specifically designed as the counter to magsorcs, streak is awesome to pull them out of stealth. Generally I feel magdk are harder to fight against with the ability to chain and root

I love magsorc but I get why people hate when their attack gets used on a pet. I dont feel that magsorc needs to be narrowed into a pet build either.

Id like to see if a pet is killed that the player takes oblivion dmg

Aedaryl

There is no good and universal offensive ultimate for magsorc.

We have :

Negate : useless if you don't run in an organise bombsquad

Meteor : extremely bad vs anyone with a brain. You can kill pve boys full divine the first time they go in cyrodil.

Soul assault : Good vs Stamblade and noobs, bad versus everyone else (bad vs shields and tanky players)

Eyes of the storm : only good if you are in a bombsquad

Overload : it's kinda good but the no ultimate regen + reflect+ weirdo and hard weaving + useless GCD spend when activated make it mediocre

Atronach : very good ultimate combining good offense and defense if the ennemies are dumb enough to stay in range.

Dawnbreaker : it's a stam ultimate and you lose too much damage from penetration + physical damage cp


Go atronach, it's the best magsorc choice

LordTareq

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

Atro is great, but you should see it as an area of denial tool & damage shield not an ultimate that wrecks people by itself. You can use it to physically shield you from attacks which works very well.

ll_Rev

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

Stop trolling.

TheFamousMockingbird

Overload is a really powerful ultimate. Now that you can more effectively (not perfectly) weave the light attacks with other skills you can take down even roll dodgers reliably. The worst thing about overload is the ease with which it gets stuck in a heavy attack animation when you are in laggy situations. I once ran around Cyro stuck in Overload heavy attack animation for 30 min. Character Death wouldn’t clear it and I didn’t want to go through 98 person queue. So I was a big out of control sparkler.

I am also a fan of the psijic ultimate on my shield bar for the minor protection.

Sorcs don’t have 1 ultimate Ultimate that does it all like a dawn breaker or permafrost. That have to load out with much more consideration of their opponents and battle situation.

Insco851

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

^^^^^

BECAUSE YOU DONT NEED AN ULT TO ROLFSTOMP

FOH

I always see sorcs spamming these survive forever ults.

Noobslayer3255

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Noobslayer3255 wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Undo on front bar (the morph with 8% damage reduction) and Resto ult on backbar. Seriously!

THAT's how bad the offensive ults for Sorcs are. Sure, the Atro will help you killl bad players, but good players will deal with it or just move away. Overload is fun to use, especially the heavy attack, but it is very situational. Negate is meh unless you are in an organized zerg or something. Meteor sucks ever since Rune Cage got gutted. Soul Assault is another Xv1 ult that leaves much to be desired against good players.

What we really need is a Magicka Dawnbreaker.

You're on every single mag sorc thread talking about how bad it is and it's hilarious.

The same could be said for your posts man. I don't think you understand how strong of a counter stamina is in general to mag sorcs (the entire stat, from the classes that use it to the defensive mechanics they can utilize to essentially negate mag sorc damage).

I think you have a mag sorc due to the knowledge you have on your other posts which leads me to conclude you haven't played it much recently or are not seeing just how strong the counters in place are to the class.

I've commented in substance on one magsorc thread, my comment on this thread doesn't even talk about the class.

Yes I have a magsorc, I have every class mag and stam besides mag necro.

I don't play my magsorc as often as my stam classes because I like stamina a lot more, and yes I do feel in general stamina is stronger than magicka for pvp because of the things you allude to - break free, roll dodge, sprint etc. But mag sorcs have great stamina sustain and can take advantage of dodge roll if you build in a bit of stamina sustain and use dark deal. Also, mag sorcs often mitigate 100% of my single target stamina damage because they can dance around 2 pets that are up 100% of the time, a third with shadowrend, a 4th with atro.... Nothing like wasting my incap or onslaught on a *** twilight. If they changed the targeting or actually made tab targeting work, it would go a looong way in reducing my perception that magsorcs are very, very, perhaps too, strong. Especially the healing twilight. It shouldn't be targetable, and one morph should heal while the other morph should deal damage. The pet offers way too much as is. They would still have a great pvp kit and passives if they tuned down the pets and changed the targeting, but they wouldn't be so mind numbingly frustrating just to even freakin target with single target abilities.

Cloak and dodge roll are better defenses than pets. Much better. It is 100 percent damage mitigation and it can be combined. Stamina is much better than magicka in terms of melee range burst( magicka has no equivalent to speak of), ranged burst with bow(this patch the burst that can be achieved with ballista is comical), survivability, ease of play, pvp movement speed, higher armor ratings, item set selection, lack of a stamina negate, ability choices, cost reduction for abilities being higher and more prevalent, cc immunity on the best and one of most used dps lines in the game, heals.... ad infinitum (the only time magicka is better is with group aoe being fully supported by healers).

After a couple of years of near complete stamina dominance, a magicka class can burst and do sustained dps almost to stam levels and of course stam players are now here complaining because the new reality of something closing in on parity is here and it is uncomfortable.

I don’t see how your posts have any merit when it comes to this discussion other than conveying you are not liking that a mag toon can do to you what stam toons have been doing to mag toons for over two years now.

It’s even more noted that you main a nightblade.....the class specifically designed to kill mag sorcs.

I don't main anything, but the class I play the most is stam sorc.

Breaking line of sight is the best defense in the game and nothing is even close. Sorcs get los that follows them around, heals them, and does damage. Cloak gets broken with a sneeze, any aoe, and you can't roll dodge aoes. And it's easy for a sorc to have enough stamina sustain for the occasional roll dodge anyway. And then you can stack shields to double your effective health.

Anyway, your post is just entirely shifting the goalposts and making a point I already agreed upon: yes in general stamina is superior to magicka for pvp. The exception however being magicka sorcerer, what we were actually talking about, not some generic stam vs mag debate. And Sorc dominance is nothing new, as I said before they've been the top or at the top of the pvp tier list since this game came out. Before IC release battle spirit didn't even halve shields and you could easily cast a 20k+ hardened ward that lasted like 20 seconds and couldn't be crit.

Comparing the range "burst" of an ultimate to basic abilities is foolish. And while it leaves you exposed to attacks by other players, soul assault is a hard counter to any roly poly build and can reach insane tool tip numbers. Plus, ballista doesn't compare to the actual burst of a properly timed sorc combo that all goes off at once, that's burst. A hard hitting channel isn't burst.

Anyway, you are entitled to your opinion, and free to disregard my opinions if you think they have "no merit" but that's being laughably disingenuous.

InvictusApollo

For magsorc definitely the best ultimate is the atronach unless you are facing a ballgroup. Then it is your duty to slot Negate.