How do you deal with incapable people in vet dungeons and trials?

FierceSam

It's clearly a sliding scale and there's no one size fits all answer and most of it applies just as much to guild groups as it does to PUGs, but broadly

Analyse situation - what's going wrong? (group coordination, understanding of mechanics, individual issues, my abilities)

Propose/agree solution - how can we beat this? what shall we try? can we implement our plan - sometimes creating and implementing a plan is some of the most satisfying parts of the entire game.

If we still can't progress, again discuss why. If the problem is solvable (and you'll have a pretty good idea if that's true) try again. In the rare event that it isn't (eg failure to understand the pinning mechanic in FG2, which will eventually wipe a group that's uncoordinated, or DPS failure in BC2, which results in Daedroth overkill) I'll say I don't think it can be done, have one more try and then leave. I've only had to do that 3 times.

The only proviso is that the rest of the group are able to discuss issues (with EU server there can be language barriers as I stupidly only speak 1 language fluently) and that there is no rudeness.

Bottom line, I'm here to have fun

Atallanta

czar wrote: »

Depends. If they are nice and try their best, I stick with them. If we don't progress, they usually realize they're not ready for the content and give up long before I do. If they have a bad attitude, are horrible at their role and refuse to leave, I will vote to kick them.

This

MLGProPlayer

Other

Carry the group.

You can solo every non-DLC vet dungeon with your eyes closed if you are a DD. If the other 3 players are garbage, just ignore them and keep moving (use them as meat shields whenever it is advantageous).

leeux

Stick with them

I always stick to the end no matter how many times it needs, and only give up when the group dissolves. OTOH, if I'm the weak link in the chain, I offer to leave as soon as I realize that.

But OTOH, I don't PUG much/at all, so when that happened to me it was always with guildies and never had a bad situation come out of that, luckily.

N00BxV1

Other

I don't care what they do in base game veteran dungeons as long as they're trying and not being a ***. In DLC veteran dungeons I'll give it a few tries but if failure is imminent then abandon ship. And I haven't done veteran trials because I lack the commitment for it.

Ashtaris

Stick with them

Most of the time I will stick with the group. There has only been a couple of times I’ve left the group, usually as a healer because some knucklehead forges ahead pulling all the agro with me trying to save their sorry ass, usually dying in the process because I’m getting most of the agro instead.

FangOfTheTwoMoons

Stick with them

Teach them as much as I can. Unless it's a Vet DLC we usually get it done. The only time I kick is if someone joins as a fake tank or someone's being rude.

Arunei

Other

It generally depends on the situation.

If I'm in a group and we wipe on a boss, I'll ask if everyone knows the mechanics. I'll do food/drink checks, stuff like that. Might ask what sort of setup a person is running in terms of skills and offer suggestions to try other things if it's applicable. I don't mind if a group wipes several times on a boss because sometimes you need to see how something actually works in practice before you get it down. I especially don't mind if we're making overall progress; eventually we'll get it (hopefully). In the case that we don't get it though, I'll usually explain that we probably won't be able to get through the content and offer to give it one more novel try before heading out of the group.

Now all that assumes everyone in the group is actively trying and are responding when asked if everyone knows mechanics and all that stuff. If there's a person who isn't saying anything in group chat, even if directly spoken to, and they're very obviously not following explained mechanics or are hiding during combat or something, I'll usually give those people a few chances. I'll try talking to them a few times, maybe even try whispering them in case they don't have their chat set to see group messages for whatever reason, basically make an effort to get some kind of reply out of them. If after all that there's no change, I'll vote to kick. I have absolutely no problem with helping people who are willing to learn and try, and I don't get mad if I find myself in a group that can't clear any given content. But if someone is just looking for a carry or clearly has no interest in following mechanics to such a point that it's hindering the group's progress overall, I'm not down for that.

SteveCampsOut

Other

Tiresome repetitive polls are tiresome.

Silver_Strider

Other

I'm a very fickle person to a point that I'd swear I was Bi-polar. I'll offer advice periodically but having been called an elitist several times in the past has left me very jaded about actually giving advice nicely often so I'll either give it with mild contempt but fairly clearly or I'll state them in a condescending tone as though this is the easiest thing in the world for anyone with common senses (and to be fair, most mechanics in ESO are like that). Sure, I'll do the common pleasantries but after dying to the same mechanic over and over again, despite both explaining and demonstrating the mechanics for them to still not get it, I get a bit mouthy; I'll praise any person that is at least making an effort to understand mechanics but those that continously fail them without any sign of improvement at all will just receive vague remarks about how we aren't going to clear where I don't openly name players that are clearly the weak link in the group but behave in a passive aggressive manner towards them, such as running in circles around them after we wipe for the Xth time and are in ghost form or waiting for the next pull attempt. They either get snippy with me, despite me not openly accusing them of fault, which results in the group naming them as the toxic one that needs to be removed, they quietly leave or group disbands from fatigue. Regardless of the outcome, I'm just glad to be out of that situation.

I'm such a b**** and I have no shame to admit it.

heng14rwb17_ESO

NO 50K DEEPS NO TALK !

tspecherb14_ESO

Other

I stick with them as long as reasonably possible. I will make some recommendations but at some point I'll move to more drastic measures if need be.

Tonturri

Kick them

I had a pair of DPS in vet BC I a couple days ago. They did a grand total of 8k DPS. Nor each, together. I'm not entirely sure how.

They also died very easily, so I can only assume they had no spells slotted and were spamming light attacks the entire time.

I do not believe it is my job to teach people that their hotbar can have skills on it and that they should press them, often in certain sequence. Anyway, they eventually left.

Sibenice

Other

It depends. If the dungeon is a really easy one I'm fine with just pushing through. But if they're slowing things significantly or wiping us then I will remove them.

Hyperion616

Stick with them

Gordon906 wrote: »

Fake/incompetent/under geared/low cp tanks, healer, and/or dps.

Have a little patience, stick it out and see if you can teach them how to improve on their game some.

WldKarde

Leave

Usually I'll only leave group if it's absolutely hopeless for the current group to complete the content.

That said...

I will also do my best to help others learn the mechanics until all hope is lost.

I've been in the "I'm new to this one" camp many times before...

So I try to pay it forward as much as I can

Runefang

Leave

Teaching mechanics, fine I can do that.

But the rest of the stuff? I learnt it from other people and from practice on my own time, not when wasting other people's time in actual content.

xF1REFL1x

Ive gotta say... I'm new to trials and my guild has taken me through normal and vet dungeons so far the past few weeks. They have been patient and taught me along the way. Wish I would have started doing this earlier but it could not have worked out better. Great bunch of players!

Tasear

Other

heng14rwb17_ESO wrote: »

NO 50K DEEPS NO TALK !

Pshh 50k was last season...60k or go home 🤓😜

xmaveri

Kick them

No I'm sorry but I'm sick in tired of waiting 20 min to que into vet dlc dungeons just to be grouped with 3 100-400 CP players. Everytime I give them a chance they either can't understand the mechanics, don't have the DPS, can't tank or can't heal... I was just in vFG2 with a 100cp and 300cp and 400cp and none of them knew the mechanics or even had the capabilities of completing the dungeon and it's becoming a bigger problem. The game should have stricter level requirements, I have no idea why Everytime I que into a vet dlc dungeon I get grouped with low cp players, EVERY TIME! you would think they would get a clue and stick with they know. Either that or the one time they qued in with 3 810cp and was carried they now think they can play all end game... It's not like there's plenty of mid game level content...

navystylz_ESO

Stick with them

I find a lot of people are willing to learn and feel accomplished sticking it out. Some people don't find it fun to pre-watch dungeon runs but willing to take instruction. Sometimes I'm being help as a newer tank.

Jeremy

Other

Gordon906 wrote: »

Fake/incompetent/under geared/low cp tanks, healer, and/or dps.

In my experience when people realize they are holding back the team they will leave on their own accord. Extremely rarely have I ever encountered a situation where it was necessary to kick someone who was genuinely under performing to such a degree it was preventing our progress. So I usually tough it out until that happens.

The exception to this are those who fake their roles. Those I will opt to kick just on principle alone - though I would prefer there was a different system in place to deal with those specific types of players. But that's really a separate issue so I won't get into that.

Androconium

Heelie wrote: »

If I come to the conclussion that I have to spend more than 30 minutes in a dungeon, or that I might have to teach the group the mechanics. I leave, I am not in the business of free carry runs.

• I have to spend more than 30 minutes in a dungeon
• I might have to teach the group the mechanics
• I am not in the business of free carry runs.

Leave then. The group would probably have a better time.

Elusiin

Stick with them

If possible, why not stick with them and educate them? If not possible to clear the dungeon/trial, politely tell them why. It's not that hard to be kind and respectful.

siddique

Stick with them

I've seen this preconceived notion that if you are low cp you automatically suck. This is such nonsense.

I got kicked from March of Sacrifices even before I moved because I was cp 580. Three 810s we're stuck on the first boss. I told them Einsteins I've done this on vet before. Anyway I queue again and I get back in the same group! This time they beg me to stay, I said ha! No game, later noobs!

And the other day we pugged vetbloodroot with a 300 or so cp healer and a 300 cp dps who left at final boss suddenly but we would've done it with him too.

Weesacs

Stick with them

Myself and a mate (tank) recently did vet Moon Hunter Keep with a pug DD and healer. The other DD was low CP and only did light attacks with a bow. I know I have good damage so we just continued on. Yes it was painful however the guy picked up the mechanics easily enough and I didn't realise you can get that amount of symbols on the second last boss (it was even more funnier when he activated HM on the last boss which we quickly explained wasn't going to happen). Nevertheless we completed the dungeon anyway.

On the other hand, if this was a full pug group and I only had limited time I would have left, which I do occasionally as my time is limited at times due to family commitments and having young kids who require your time. However I never criticise anyone when I do.

I only ever kick people if they are immature, petulant or rude.

I like to teach people anyway and it's how I've meet some nice friends in game.

Lastly I don't tend to keep elitist friends in game as well - they don't hang around me for long because a spades a spade and I can be blunt and tend to tell them what I think of them not long after meeting this type of player which they don't like ... but you cant get on with everyone eh? ☺

SoLooney

Other

I dont pug vet dungeons or trials, and that saved me

Tigerseye

Other

Despite the fact I raided a bit in WoW, I have no idea what I am doing in vets and trials here (as I don't bother with them), but when I am asked, I seem to end up with people who know even less than I do (and especially since the recent influx from WoW, are also pretty rude and trollish), so I have decided to just say no to all of it, from now on.

Saves me having to say things they might regret.

Schemering

Other

czar wrote: »

Depends. If they are nice and try their best, I stick with them. If we don't progress, they usually realize they're not ready for the content and give up long before I do. If they have a bad attitude, are horrible at their role and refuse to leave, I will vote to kick them.

this... if they communicate and do their best ill try... and if theres a structural problem that prevents the group from progressing at all there has to be a point to say goodbye

Coatmagic

Stick with them

I don't pug what I can't solo so if this scenario comes up it's a non-issue xD