Pvp Heavy armour meta suggestion

r34lian

As we know the heavy armour meta stuff going on with resist stacking how about in battle spirit we cap max resist to 18k perhaps and rather than nerf buff light armour or medium armour recovery and cost reduction bonus like increase mag recovery from 2 to 3% and 4 to 5% at max for light armour same for medium what you guys think of it?

Sergykid

without heavy armor u can get 20k resists in noCP with a simple defensive ability that gives major ward and major resolve. Not high resists makes people so defensive.

Liww

the problem with heavy isnt its tankiness, its the recovery it still retains. combined with alot of damage orientated heavy sets.

which wont change as its necessary for pve by design.

mag sustain isnt bad, with susceptebility and harnass its actually insanely strong. medium could use some penetration passives imo. (the sneak passives are beyond useless)

Iskiab

It’s fine. You’ll notice heavy armour damage proc’s are on damage taken not damage done.

If you’re going to get hit a lot heavy armour should be better. If you buff medium or light you’re going to have snipers and ranged be buffed when they shouldn’t be.

Facefister

Just change bleeding so that its damage depends on the armor the target has.

Deathlord92

Just give medium armor a passive that buffs physical resistance like light buffs spell and heavy buffs both then I will be happy 🙂

mcagatayg

Liww wrote: »

the problem with heavy isnt its tankiness, its the recovery it still retains. combined with alot of damage orientated heavy sets.

which wont change as its necessary for pve by design.

mag sustain isnt bad, with susceptebility and harnass its actually insanely strong. medium could use some penetration passives imo. (the sneak passives are beyond useless)

i agree with pen passive, it could change pvp and pve to a good way. More ppl would play medium if we could actuall do damage to some perma blockers. Or sorcs with heavy armor...

r34lian

Iskiab wrote: »

It’s fine. You’ll notice heavy armour damage proc’s are on damage taken not damage done.

If you’re going to get hit a lot heavy armour should be better. If you buff medium or light you’re going to have snipers and ranged be buffed when they shouldn’t be.

I'm saying more from defensive or resources buff point of view

Vapirko

18k is way too low. Any build without shields or that isn’t a gankblade will get plastered with those resists.

technohic

Vapirko wrote: »

18k is way too low. Any build without shields or that isn’t a gankblade will get plastered with those resists.

Yeah this seems very 1 sided. Really no need to comment as its pretty obvious even for ZOS to not do.

Vapirko

technohic wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

18k is way too low. Any build without shields or that isn’t a gankblade will get plastered with those resists.

Yeah this seems very 1 sided. Really no need to comment as its pretty obvious even for ZOS to not do.

Probably. Sometimes I worry though...

Deathlord92

mcagatayg wrote: »

Liww wrote: »

the problem with heavy isnt its tankiness, its the recovery it still retains. combined with alot of damage orientated heavy sets.

which wont change as its necessary for pve by design.

mag sustain isnt bad, with susceptebility and harnass its actually insanely strong. medium could use some penetration passives imo. (the sneak passives are beyond useless)

i agree with pen passive, it could change pvp and pve to a good way. More ppl would play medium if we could actuall do damage to some perma blockers. Or sorcs with heavy armor...

Agree 👍

JumpmanLane

Jesus resists are fine, up your damage and pen geeze. Run Sloads or something. Or add bleeds.

BrownChicken

Agree with OP.

Wing

looking past the OP blatant favoritism of damage considering 18k is nothing and easily bypassed. some pvp tanks stack upwards of 50k of each resistance in anticipation of a lot of it being bypassed.

when heavy armor was at its PEAK, that is absolute best, when it had a passive that granted it weapon and spell damage, and when there were a few heavy armor sets that were even better then we have now. . .

it was on par with the other armor weights as far as use (ZOS linked a graph showing as much) but they still nerfed it because NB and Sorc were having trouble one shot'ing people.

being tanky requires a lot more then just "put on heavy armor" in pvp, and even more so if you want to be tanky but relevant.



the tank meta we have been shifting into is a direct result of people sick of getting bursted or ganked by any glass cannon that wanders along. turns out pvp is more fun when your alive to experience it. people built damage to one shot, people built armor to resist it. people became reliant on bleeds, people built health to resist it.

if you build DPS because you just want to go around and one shot people don't get mad when they build tanky so you cannot one shot then cry to the devs to nerf them. that's the most childish thing I have EVER heard.



that and this does not even address or bring up that the most difficult to deal with class in pvp is pet sorcs who hide behind pets, shield stack, and still keep al their damage, all while not bothering with heavy armor at all.

but yeah, lets end up with everyone doing that, im sure it will be fun -_-


EDIT: here is the hard data from ZOS at the peak of heavy armor when there were claims all over that it was OP and its what everyone used. this was also before the light armor buffs

posted by rich lambert himself

Current armor bias of ALL players on NA PC:


Current armor bias of ONLY PVP players on NA PC:


.. and now just for fun, here's the bias of all PVP players on NA PC with 501+ CP:




there, ZOS's data trumps your thoughts and feelings.

ryzen_gamer_gal

Rattle cage

Firstmep

Play no cp, ppl die fast without dedicated healers

SippingPotions

Light armor is already very strong in PVP with the penetration passive and protective jewelry trait. I also think the sustain from medium armor is fine. But let me ask you all: when was the last time you heard someone say “I think I’ll slot 5 medium so I can use Shuffle!”?

I think that some extra damage or pen might be in order for the 5pc medium armor passives but the real problem lies in the worthless active. Maybe add a unique damage, penetration, or crit buff while evasion and morphs are active?

I don’t like the resistance nerf to 18k because I have a build that runs 18.3k spell pen and 5.5k spell damage and that build would literally two shot anyone(three if you count the proc). I think CP power creep, and the sustain it provides to heavy while still being able to have the same weapon damage as medium is the real culprit. I think the heavy armor meta will stay until they re-rework the CP system all together.

Girl_Number8

Nah, learn to theory craft a well rounded build, things are fine. And the meta for what ?? There is a meta for a lot of classes that use light, medium, and heavy....Depends on what class you play and if you are playing solo, small scale, or a nerfiling.

Sounds like a thread asking for something just to suit your short comings.

Vapirko

Wing wrote: »

looking past the OP blatant favoritism of damage considering 18k is nothing and easily bypassed. some pvp tanks stack upwards of 50k of each resistance in anticipation of a lot of it being bypassed.

when heavy armor was at its PEAK, that is absolute best, when it had a passive that granted it weapon and spell damage, and when there were a few heavy armor sets that were even better then we have now. . .

it was on par with the other armor weights as far as use (ZOS linked a graph showing as much) but they still nerfed it because NB and Sorc were having trouble one shot'ing people.

being tanky requires a lot more then just "put on heavy armor" in pvp, and even more so if you want to be tanky but relevant.



the tank meta we have been shifting into is a direct result of people sick of getting bursted or ganked by any glass cannon that wanders along. turns out pvp is more fun when your alive to experience it. people built damage to one shot, people built armor to resist it. people became reliant on bleeds, people built health to resist it.

if you build DPS because you just want to go around and one shot people don't get mad when they build tanky so you cannot one shot then cry to the devs to nerf them. that's the most childish thing I have EVER heard.



that and this does not even address or bring up that the most difficult to deal with class in pvp is pet sorcs who hide behind pets, shield stack, and still keep al their damage, all while not bothering with heavy armor at all.

but yeah, lets end up with everyone doing that, im sure it will be fun -_-


EDIT: here is the hard data from ZOS at the peak of heavy armor when there were claims all over that it was OP and its what everyone used. this was also before the light armor buffs

posted by rich lambert himself

Current armor bias of ALL players on NA PC:


Current armor bias of ONLY PVP players on NA PC:


.. and now just for fun, here's the bias of all PVP players on NA PC with 501+ CP:




there, ZOS's data trumps your thoughts and feelings.

Lol. People who complain that heavy armor is OP don’t want data proof. They just want to complain because they couldn’t kill someone and got rekt and assumed they were wearing heavy armor with fury and 7th legion.

kypranb14_ESO

If medium armor gets a pen passive, light armor better get a +15% spell damage passive.

Your's truly, a light armor user.

Crixus8000

Wing wrote: »

the tank meta we have been shifting into is a direct result of people sick of getting bursted or ganked by any glass cannon that wanders along. turns out pvp is more fun when your alive to experience it. people built damage to one shot, people built armor to resist it. people became reliant on bleeds, people built health to resist it.

if you build DPS because you just want to go around and one shot people don't get mad when they build tanky so you cannot one shot then cry to the devs to nerf them. that's the most childish thing I have EVER heard.

This so much.

I find it so confusing when people complain about healing and tankiness in pvp. Have people seen how hard some builds can actually hit ? I currently run a very tanky setup in no cp, and still can be 2 shot easily. Damage is huge right now, I get hit 10k+ snipes all the time.

There is no way I will ever play with low resists or healing because the game has too much dmg, some skills have little counterplay and hit way too hard, then you have proc sets like zaan hitting around 20k and ignoring los and block, it's a damn proc set that hits harder than any ult, and on top of that you have bleeds and oblivion that ignore all resists.

Also lag is just a part of the game now, it will never be fixed and I never really have a time when im not lagging so why rely on lower resists when I might get cc'd be unable to break free and die because of it.

david_m_18b16_ESO

So many stam dps want to see medium armor beeing the only viable *** out there.

LeagueTroll

Heavy is meta? wraith passive is gone for a long time already.

TriangularChicken

Wing wrote: »

looking past the OP blatant favoritism of damage considering 18k is nothing and easily bypassed. some pvp tanks stack upwards of 50k of each resistance in anticipation of a lot of it being bypassed.

when heavy armor was at its PEAK, that is absolute best, when it had a passive that granted it weapon and spell damage, and when there were a few heavy armor sets that were even better then we have now. . .

it was on par with the other armor weights as far as use (ZOS linked a graph showing as much) but they still nerfed it because NB and Sorc were having trouble one shot'ing people.

being tanky requires a lot more then just "put on heavy armor" in pvp, and even more so if you want to be tanky but relevant.



the tank meta we have been shifting into is a direct result of people sick of getting bursted or ganked by any glass cannon that wanders along. turns out pvp is more fun when your alive to experience it. people built damage to one shot, people built armor to resist it. people became reliant on bleeds, people built health to resist it.

if you build DPS because you just want to go around and one shot people don't get mad when they build tanky so you cannot one shot then cry to the devs to nerf them. that's the most childish thing I have EVER heard.



that and this does not even address or bring up that the most difficult to deal with class in pvp is pet sorcs who hide behind pets, shield stack, and still keep al their damage, all while not bothering with heavy armor at all.

but yeah, lets end up with everyone doing that, im sure it will be fun -_-


EDIT: here is the hard data from ZOS at the peak of heavy armor when there were claims all over that it was OP and its what everyone used. this was also before the light armor buffs

posted by rich lambert himself

Current armor bias of ALL players on NA PC:


Current armor bias of ONLY PVP players on NA PC:


.. and now just for fun, here's the bias of all PVP players on NA PC with 501+ CP:




there, ZOS's data trumps your thoughts and feelings.

@Wing
Thanks a lot for the data, can you link the source? Or can I find it in the Dev Tracker when I go through his posts? I love to see such data.. I wish they would show us more..super nice!

Wing

TriangularChicken wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

looking past the OP blatant favoritism of damage considering 18k is nothing and easily bypassed. some pvp tanks stack upwards of 50k of each resistance in anticipation of a lot of it being bypassed.

when heavy armor was at its PEAK, that is absolute best, when it had a passive that granted it weapon and spell damage, and when there were a few heavy armor sets that were even better then we have now. . .

it was on par with the other armor weights as far as use (ZOS linked a graph showing as much) but they still nerfed it because NB and Sorc were having trouble one shot'ing people.

being tanky requires a lot more then just "put on heavy armor" in pvp, and even more so if you want to be tanky but relevant.



the tank meta we have been shifting into is a direct result of people sick of getting bursted or ganked by any glass cannon that wanders along. turns out pvp is more fun when your alive to experience it. people built damage to one shot, people built armor to resist it. people became reliant on bleeds, people built health to resist it.

if you build DPS because you just want to go around and one shot people don't get mad when they build tanky so you cannot one shot then cry to the devs to nerf them. that's the most childish thing I have EVER heard.



that and this does not even address or bring up that the most difficult to deal with class in pvp is pet sorcs who hide behind pets, shield stack, and still keep al their damage, all while not bothering with heavy armor at all.

but yeah, lets end up with everyone doing that, im sure it will be fun -_-


EDIT: here is the hard data from ZOS at the peak of heavy armor when there were claims all over that it was OP and its what everyone used. this was also before the light armor buffs

posted by rich lambert himself

Current armor bias of ALL players on NA PC:


Current armor bias of ONLY PVP players on NA PC:


.. and now just for fun, here's the bias of all PVP players on NA PC with 501+ CP:




there, ZOS's data trumps your thoughts and feelings.

@Wing
Thanks a lot for the data, can you link the source? Or can I find it in the Dev Tracker when I go through his posts? I love to see such data.. I wish they would show us more..super nice!

@TriangularChicken it was from a thread I had to dig through:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/291607/zos-claims-to-use-hard-data-for-balancing/p1

but yeah rich posted that in it to kind of smack down some people claiming there anecdotal musings as game wide fact. they have never posted that kind of data again sadly.

I wish they would post this type of thing more often though, as its fun to look through. though im sure people would find ways to misuse it to twist and prove a point of view.

pod88kk

Two words mate..... Fortified Brass

ChunkyCat

The meta is now light armor with protective jewelry.

>,>