Should Vampire & Werewolf skills be illegal in line with Necromancy?

LapisLazuli99

With the arrival of Necromancers and the introduction of the "Lore friendly" mechanic of Necromancy being illegal to practice openly, I was wondering if people thought Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal in the same way?

kathandira

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

If you are caught using a vampirism ability, then yes. If you are caught in werewolf form, then yes. If you are caught using necromancy, then yes.

LapisLazuli99

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

kathandira wrote: »

If you are caught using a vampirism ability, then yes. If you are caught in werewolf form, then yes. If you are caught using necromancy, then yes.

That's about what I thought. I can see a lot of people not liking the mechanic, but since its an old mechanic they might as well add it in its full capacity as it works in the mainline ES games?

Danikat

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Vampires feeding on people is already a crime (and some times I've gotten a higher bounty from that than simply killing them with the Blade of Woe) and I thought being seen turning into a werewolf would give you a bounty too, like in previous TES games. But I don't have a werewolf myself so I'm not sure.

It could be like necromancy of course where some abilities are ok and others are not, for example maybe vampires could use Mist Form but not Drain Essence, since Mist Form doesn't actually involve attacking anyone.

1mirg

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Vampires and Werewolves are already frowned upon and even outright hunted in Tamriel. Its so bad that If you even look or behave like a vampire or werewolf people will seek to kill you. So, yes. They most definitely should be illegal, especially Vamp Stage 4. It's already strange enough being a vampire while being hired to fight vampires while you are acting like you've never heard of them.

StormeReigns

No, Vampire and Werewolf should not be illegal.

Sure. Ill change my vote. Only if repeat thieves and murderers get a reputation system put in and get a bounty instantly soon as they walk into town after being recognized by green and yellow npcs without using the sewers. No matter if they ever got caught or not.

LapisLazuli99

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Danikat wrote: »

Vampires feeding on people is already a crime (and some times I've gotten a higher bounty from that than simply killing them with the Blade of Woe) and I thought being seen turning into a werewolf would give you a bounty too, like in previous TES games. But I don't have a werewolf myself so I'm not sure.

It could be like necromancy of course where some abilities are ok and others are not, for example maybe vampires could use Mist Form but not Drain Essence, since Mist Form doesn't actually involve attacking anyone.

Guards ignore Werewolves as is. And I think Drain Essence gets a bounty because you're hurting someone rather than being tied to the actual vampirism?

Tommy_The_Gun

No, Vampire and Werewolf should not be illegal.

I told you this will happen.... I told you we will have discussions like this...

WuffyCerulei

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Yeah, it makes sense. I honestly think summoning your heckin sorc pets should be in there too. Cuz, y’know, they’re summoning Daedra.

LapisLazuli99

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

SkerKro wrote: »

Sure. Ill change my vote. Only if repeat thieves and murderers get a reputation system put in and get a bounty instantly soon as they walk into town after being recognized by green and yellow npcs without using the sewers. No matter if they ever got caught or not.

I can't tell how serious you re but that could actually be fun XD Crime pays well in ESO and it would put an incentive to actually be good at it.

StormeReigns

No, Vampire and Werewolf should not be illegal.

LapisLazuli99 wrote: »

SkerKro wrote: »

Sure. Ill change my vote. Only if repeat thieves and murderers get a reputation system put in and get a bounty instantly soon as they walk into town after being recognized by green and yellow npcs without using the sewers. No matter if they ever got caught or not.

I can't tell how serious you re but that could actually be fun XD Crime pays well in ESO and it would put an incentive to actually be good at it.

Very much so lol. Plus if it isn't nailed down im picking it it up, and out of pockets and corpses to get it fenced. I am beyond a kleptomaniac in the game. So far there hasnt been a home i havent trespassed nor a pocket or basket i picked clean. I get a bargin even on lint. But the rare occasions i get caught. It is meh. No thrill any more.

Arunei

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

Yeah, it makes sense. I honestly think summoning your heckin sorc pets should be in there too. Cuz, y’know, they’re summoning Daedra.

Except summoning Daedra in and of itself isn't illegal. People might not like it, but it's not unlawful in the way necromancy is, and isn't as heavily prejudiced against as being a Were/Vamp. Conjuration and Summoning are accepted Schools of magick, even tho in ESO's time period they aren't exactly established yet.

Siohwenoeht

Well using vampire skills, and getting caught feeding will get you a bounty already. Only one out of line is werewolf transformation.

Jaraal

One of the best parts about EverQuest was (is) the faction system. Classes and races had natural affinity or hatred for those with opposing values. Necromancers were welcome in Troll or Ogre cities, but kill on sight in "good" cities. Clerics and Paladins were hated by Necros, and vice versa.... and some cities had righteous and evil sections, where if you went to the wrong part of town you got jumped, etc. And most quests, including the repeatables, would raise your faction standing with certain groups, and lower it with others, to the point where an evil character could be tolerated in good areas, and so forth.

In other words, you had a lot of control over how accepted or hated your character was. Of course, most ESO players would balk at such a complicated faction system, but it's a fantastic feature for role players

Thevampirenight

I think they should do it how they did it in Dawnguard for SKyrim. I don't think many people think of vampires as much of a threat as say a fully transformed werewolf or vampire lord. So any Powerful Transformation ability like vampire lord or werewolf or necromancers illusion transformation ability would be something that would scare the people. People might not like vampires but they know they can be defeated and one vampire can't just end an entire village by attacking. One werewolf can end an entire village because its that powerful compared to a vampire who is typically stuck in just a humaniod form they are born with. Vampires can be dangerous yes and are hated, but werewolves are so dangerous and I think people would find them a bigger threat. For that very reason I think people in the cities might prefer having vampires nearby then a clan of werewolves. What I think they should do is give vampires a gargoyle transformation. Make that a crime, make transforming into a werewolf a crime too along with being a bone colosisis. I don't think they should make stage four vampirism a crime per say as well that could easily be covered up by a skin. Or helmet and it would break immersion if you were fully covered from head to two with no one knowing your a vampire or not. But yeah powerful transformation abilties should be a crime .

kargen27

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Well using vampire skills, and getting caught feeding will get you a bounty already. Only one out of line is werewolf transformation.

Use a werewolf skill on an NPC and you will get a bounty. Just walking around like a werewolf same as vampire nobody cares. I'm assuming the town folk think it is some kind of illusion and if you set out a hat they will give you coins.

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

I would LOVE to see an update do this.

I would also like to see Vampires getting the same kind of love Werewolves did with the "Wolfhunter" DLC.

max_only

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

As people have said already, the SKILLS yes, just being a vamp, no.
I don’t have any vamp characters only werewolf and I agree that using a ww skill (including the transformation) should incur a bounty when used in front of/on justice NPCs.

ArchangelIsraphel

No, Vampire and Werewolf should not be illegal.

The illegal skill lines are annoying enough with Necromancers as it is. There's no reason to add further inconvenience to the game for the sake of "immersion" that will get old the day the changes are made.

Give Bosmer back it's stealth passives as per lore, then you can have "lore friendly" bounties for vampires and werewolves >_>

pknecron

This mechinic is stupid and Necromancer skills shouldn't be illegal to begin with.

If they were to make WW illegal, then the ultimate needs to go and the skill needs to become a toggle. It already needs to be a toggle, but this kind of change would make it mandatory.

barney2525

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

As recently been told, the Lore says they are Daedric creatures/converted mortals. The setting is Fantasy dictatorships (kings/Queens) and lots of supernatural stuff is considered to be evil at it's core.

The people of this setting would obviously not want these creatures in their towns.

TheShadowScout

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Saying it for years...

...bloodsucking fiends and part-time furry beasts ought to be as illegal as corpsef... lovers. Meaning if they show their monstrous nature off under the eyes of the guard... they get "kill on sight" level heat.

Meaning any werewolf who transforms in town should get the guard after them with silver and steel.

Meaning any vampire who gets found out should get the guard after them with stake and torch.

For werewolves the mechanic is easy - seen transformed should give the bounty. Stay in human form, and no sweat.

For vampires... well, they -do- look a little sickly even if well fed, and at later stages... like walking corpses. So I say, they ought to have a "detection chance" for anyone, 20% at stage 1, 40% at stagge 2, 80% at stage 3 and automatic at stage four... and anyone who spots their nature, will yell for the guard and give them the bounty.
And then... they need a "masquerade" skill as toggle to balance, that allows them to lower their vampirism visual effects and detection chance by one stage (meaning at stage 1 they would lower it to stage 0, and look completely mortal with no detection chance whatsoever - JUST like count ravenwatch did when we first met him, remember?)

And that is what I think about those and the justice system.

Thevampirenight

Okay here is how I see this. Maybe all classes could get a skill that would be illegal to use. Vampires as they are not nearly as dangerous as werewolves well they are dangeorus just not to an entire city full of people maybe some of them. Given if they can control it or cover it up. They shouldn't be given a bounty for stage four. Now bat swarm is not normal. Mist form I think most would mistake that for say some mage power. drain essense could be mistaken for some mage ability. Anything that can be dangerous and cause harm to nearby people should be a crime. Templars Sun ultimate just one example.
So what could be made crimes are the following.
Storm Attronach
Bat Swarm
Werewolf Transformation
Nova
Shadow Cloak
Aspect of Terror
Soul Shred
Daedric Mines
Frozen Gate
Sleet Storm
Swarm
Ash Cloud
Inferno
Bear While seen by bankers or seen by Crafting npcs in crafting areas.
Twilight while seen by bankers or Crafting Area Npcs
Scamp While seen by bankers or crafting area npcs.
This is because of how annoying they can be. But also limiting it to being seen by these npcs so players don't have to worry about despawning them everytime they go to a wayshrine or city. But When in certain areas where there are crafting stations they would be reminded they have to put their pets away.
Basically anything that could be dangerous. Not effecting you but other people that causes damage or puts peoples lives in great risk. Shadow Cloak not because its dangerous but because of how it could be used for crime. Daedric Mines because if they go off they could kil someone. Swarm because bugs summoned might stick around and cause problems. Ash Cloud because maybe it can choke and burn nearby innocents. Sleet Storm because the area of effect could cause harm to people. Bat swarm because that isn't natural and well because of the area of effect and the bats could attack nearby civilions. Werewolf transformation because just one werewolf could tear apart entire villeges and kill many of the people within them. Soul Shred because it is a form of necromancy and your directly messing with souls, Aspect of Terror because its also a form of necromancy. Nova because of the harm it could do. Inferno because you could potentially burn down a building.

bearbelly

Thevampirenight wrote: »

Okay here is how I see this. Maybe all classes could get a skill that would be illegal to use. Vampires as they are not nearly as dangerous as werewolves well they are dangeorus just not to an entire city full of people maybe some of them. Given if they can control it or cover it up. They shouldn't be given a bounty for stage four.

That logic is inconsistent.
If a vampire shouldn't be given a bounty for Stage 4, then a werewolf shouldn't be given a bounty just for transforming.
Nobody gets hurt in the process of a transformation.

Just like a vampire simply standing around being at Stage 4 isn't causing anyone any harm, a werewolf doesn't cause harm simply by transforming. So if you don't believe a vampire should earn a bounty for being at Stage 4, then a werewolf shouldn't be given a bounty just for the act of transforming.

Both already receive bounties if they feed on or attack innocents.


I do agree, in order to be consistent across the board, that if a necromancer is going to be penalized for raising the dead within town limits, then both vampires and werewolves should get a bounty for either entering town at Stage 4 or transforming in town.

Otherwise, nobody should get a bounty if they aren't actually harming innocent folk.

Van_Winkle

This mechinic is stupid and Necromancer skills shouldn't be illegal to begin with.

Oh God, again this nonsense... Justice system must help players, not suppress them!

rpa

Sure, give bounty from rising the dead, devouring corpses, sucking blood from people, bringing summoned daedra and beasts to city, dueling, casting dangerous spells, having drawn out weapons, public nudity and using foul language in chat.

TheShadowScout

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Van_Winkle wrote: »

Oh God, again this nonsense... Justice system must help players, not suppress them!

Wrong.
Justice system must help make the game more interesting!
Not "help the player", that would be add-ons.

For crime gameplay, justice system -must- suppress those who get caught, otherwise there would not be a sense of danger for getting caught doing crime (not that its much of one, but... that is why I always want... better justice, more justice... Great Justice! )

And many believe it -would- be more interesting if vampires or werewolves had more of a "monster in disguise" feel Like The Classic Stories; instead of "just a player with an extra skill line" feel like they are now. If they too had to take care, just like necromancers will have to, not to show their "bad side" around town...

Others disagree because they just want to play without any drawbacks (and I remember them whining when the justice system was refitted, demanding they get to opt out of it so they can still steal everything and crying how the whole economy would collapse if they could no longer steal all those provisioning ingredients and so on...).

Matthew_Galvanus

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

bearbelly wrote: »

Thevampirenight wrote: »

Okay here is how I see this. Maybe all classes could get a skill that would be illegal to use. Vampires as they are not nearly as dangerous as werewolves well they are dangeorus just not to an entire city full of people maybe some of them. Given if they can control it or cover it up. They shouldn't be given a bounty for stage four.

That logic is inconsistent.
If a vampire shouldn't be given a bounty for Stage 4, then a werewolf shouldn't be given a bounty just for transforming.
Nobody gets hurt in the process of a transformation.

Just like a vampire simply standing around being at Stage 4 isn't causing anyone any harm, a werewolf doesn't cause harm simply by transforming. So if you don't believe a vampire should earn a bounty for being at Stage 4, then a werewolf shouldn't be given a bounty just for the act of transforming.

Both already receive bounties if they feed on or attack innocents.


I do agree, in order to be consistent across the board, that if a necromancer is going to be penalized for raising the dead within town limits, then both vampires and werewolves should get a bounty for either entering town at Stage 4 or transforming in town.

Otherwise, nobody should get a bounty if they aren't actually harming innocent folk.

As you well know, in previous elder scrolls games, you would receive a bounty if you transformed in front of non-enemy npcs as lycanthropy was considered evil.

vampirism was much the same until Dawnguard where they changed that to you getting attacked for going vampire lord in front of friendly npcs.

it really should be something that comes back

ArchMikem

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

Theyre curses, and the common folk of Tamriel dont take kindly to those.

Aztrias

Yes, Vampire and Werewolf skills should be illegal.

mann9753b16_ESO

No, Vampire and Werewolf should not be illegal.

As a Werewolf player, I disagree.

Werewolf as it is now should NOT be a criminal act.

Dont get me wrong, I like the basic idea, but as long as werewolf form is as limited as it is and costs 300 ultimate to cast, players shouldnt be forced out of it when they run past guards or cities.

Reduce the Cost to like 150 and I am fine with having to abort my werewolf form to walk through cities, but as expensive as it is right now? No.