A few big issues with the removal of NB Minor Berserk - Camo Hunter mechanics

TumlinTheJolly

The Minor Berserk provided by Camo Hunter APPLIES THE BUFF TO THE HIT THAT PROCS IT. Let's talk about what this means.

1. Stamblade ganking isn't really getting nerfed as hard as some had first thought... Magblade ganking is though.

2. More ganking. Camo Hunter gives 8 seconds of Minor Berserk, as opposed to Relentess' 20 seconds. This means that Stamblades will be incentivised to be in combat for an even shorter period of time - i.e. more ganking, less lengthy dueling.

3. More bow builds. Every crouch hit from range is a guaranteed crit. Only melee crouch hits from BEHIND the target are guaranteed to crit. Even when cloaked, moving in front of your target will technically break crouch, therefore NOT providing Minor Berserk from Camo Hunter. This forces Stamblade into opening with ranged attacks - i.e. more bow builds and less melee burst builds (which require more skill and awareness to play, and should therefore be encouraged imo).

I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of others regarding other potential ramifications.

In terms of a solution to this... I genuinely think that the best option might actually be to leave the skill as it is on live. The live version helps promote more skilled and prolonged melee combat and still helps Magblade out in PvP. Unless NB is parsing considerably higher than all the other classes in PVE???

DoonerSeraph

Bow gankers are basically dead with the Snipe nerf anyway.

techprince

Use slimecraw...

darkblue5

It's a PVE based change mostly IMO.

Checkmath

darkblue5 wrote: »

It's a PVE based change mostly IMO.

I thought it is a PvP change, since in PvE healers are responsible for minor berserk for the group, when not only nighblades are stacked

TumlinTheJolly

techprince wrote: »

Use slimecraw...

Missing out on 1 piece Kena, 1 piece Kra'gh is a pretty big deal.

TumlinTheJolly

Checkmath wrote: »

darkblue5 wrote: »

It's a PVE based change mostly IMO.

I thought it is a PvP change, since in PvE healers are responsible for minor berserk for the group, when not only nighblades are stacked

Interesting. Yeah I thought it was a PvP change too, to try and reduce 1shotting. The problem is that it doesn't actually lessen stamina 1shotting, because of how Camo Hunter works. I'd absolutely just leave the skill as is, as the live version promotes 'healthier' game play (lengthened/skilled combat). The nerfs to channeled abilities will be pretty significant nerfs to 1shotting anyway.

Varana

Not all stamblades are bow gankers. Yes, they might be able to compensate a bit with Camouflaged Hunter (though it's hardly an adequate replacement), but the nerf still goes through for all the other occasions in which a stamblade might find themselves not starting a fight critting from sneak. Which is, like, 90% of the time.

TumlinTheJolly

Varana wrote: »

Not all stamblades are bow gankers. Yes, they might be able to compensate a bit with Camouflaged Hunter (though it's hardly an adequate replacement), but the nerf still goes through for all the other occasions in which a stamblade might find themselves not starting a fight critting from sneak. Which is, like, 90% of the time.

Exactly. Which is why the change shouldn't go through. We want less people hiding away in crouch, and more people closer to the combat area... right?

Iskiab

DoonerSeraph wrote: »

Bow gankers are basically dead with the Snipe nerf anyway.

Look at the big picture. I expect them to be stronger.

Prutton

TumlinTheJolly wrote: »

Unless NB is parsing considerably higher than all the other classes in PVE???

They are.

TumlinTheJolly

Prutton wrote: »

TumlinTheJolly wrote: »

Unless NB is parsing considerably higher than all the other classes in PVE???

They are.

8% higher? And can the healer not provide Minor Berserk anyway?

Kidgangster101

But for pvp the nbs always tell non nbs to slot camo Hunter to detect them...... But now nbs need to slot camo Hunter for a buff and they don't want to? The karma here..... Lol

Raudgrani

Remove current requirement for Minor Berserk from Camouflaged Hunter (if it brakes stealth - which I think it does, remove this too), get buff from activating the skill (5, 6 or 8 seconds or whatever, increase the cost if need be - and you'll still allow current playstyle).. Remove breaking stealth from using Combat Prayer. Both stam- and magblades get a nerf, but you don't CHANGE the whole identity of these classes.

I can see the need to change certain classes and skills, but I DON'T agree with the tendency to completely change the way people play the game. You can force people into adjusting their playstyle, but it's really really bad to force them into CHANGING playstyle. It's really bad for build diversity at the very least, and you are very likely to make people leave the game.

Same thing with Snipe really. Don't change the skill, FIX it. What you die from if you know how to play, is when it's bugged and you suffer a desync kind of Snipe death. Snipe is not the problem, really. It's slow, and can easily be heard and avoided.