A poll for people who pug tank daily pledges, in regards to crowd control.

RavenSworn · February 2019

Yes, I use Chains/Silver Leash/Talons/Time Stop/Frost Wall or other skills to help speed up things, it's my choice.

It's a choice. Always. I don't need to go full on metal gear on a normal fg1 run.

I do however, on my sorc healer, run cc since it's technically easier to do it with a healer than a tank imo, even a DK tank.

Even in a trial I don't really use much healing spells, just mutagen, Orbs, combat prayer. Sometimes I swap my dps abilities with wards or circle.

All I need from the tank, is to be tanky and take the hits from the main fellas, rather than trying to run around like a headless chicken.

Ertosi · February 2019

Tanks don't need to offer crowd control, not their job.

A tank's job is to keep aggro and be tanky (ie not die). Full stop.

All other expectations fall under player "dogma" rather than real game or role requirements.

I consider this especially true when pugging, as more often than not I know I'll not be able to rely on anyone else to bring solid DPS or give me a heal if needed, so I know I need to be completely self-reliant to make it through.

MartiniDaniels · February 2019

Yes, I use Chains/Silver Leash/Talons/Time Stop/Frost Wall or other skills to help speed up things, it's my choice.

I won't play as tank if there wasn't this fun of catching and gathering mobs together. On the other hand it's clearly that poll results do not represent real situation in PUG, where tanks use chains very rare. Though even low level tanks usually try to taunt everything and keep aggro, so PUG tanks are overall ok, much better then average PUG dps.

Alpheu5 · February 2019

Yes, it is part of my job as tank to provide this utility.

Ertosi wrote: »

A tank's job is to keep aggro and be tanky (ie not die). Full stop.

All other expectations fall under player "dogma" rather than real game or role requirements.

I consider this especially true when pugging, as more often than not I know I'll not be able to rely on anyone else to bring solid DPS or give me a heal if needed, so I know I need to be completely self-reliant to make it through.

If a DPS is considered ineffective for using a single ability to deal damage and technically fulfill their role's job, then a tank has to be held to the same standard. All roles use a combination of abilities to compliment their primary function and benefit the team. When everybody builds with the anticipation that nobody in the group is going to give support, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

IwakuraLain42 · February 2019

No, I'm a class without crowd control and I don't mess with it. The dps will get the mobs down eventually.

For my Nightblade tank I usually don't both with CCing as I don't have any class tools available to do so (I don't have P2W skills like TimeStop available). I taunt big targets and help the helper with Funnel Health casts.

max_only · February 2019

Yes, it is part of my job as tank to provide this utility.

IwakuraLain42 wrote: »

For my Nightblade tank I usually don't both with CCing as I don't have any class tools available to do so (I don't have P2W skills like TimeStop available). I taunt big targets and help the helper with Funnel Health casts.

As a former saptank who campaigned for Silver Leash.... might I suggest you use it? Also you have a class ultimate that is crowd control, Soul Tether, only 150 ult.

IwakuraLain42 · February 2019

No, I'm a class without crowd control and I don't mess with it. The dps will get the mobs down eventually.

max_only wrote: »

IwakuraLain42 wrote: »

For my Nightblade tank I usually don't both with CCing as I don't have any class tools available to do so (I don't have P2W skills like TimeStop available). I taunt big targets and help the helper with Funnel Health casts.

As a former saptank who campaigned for Silver Leash.... might I suggest you use it? Also you have a class ultimate that is crowd control, Soul Tether, only 150 ult.

I'm using Soul Tether, but I don't use Silver Least (yet). Might do later, I'm still trying to get this tank working again after a long hiatus ...

Ertosi · February 2019

Tanks don't need to offer crowd control, not their job.

Alpheu5 wrote: »

Ertosi wrote: »

A tank's job is to keep aggro and be tanky (ie not die). Full stop.

All other expectations fall under player "dogma" rather than real game or role requirements.

I consider this especially true when pugging, as more often than not I know I'll not be able to rely on anyone else to bring solid DPS or give me a heal if needed, so I know I need to be completely self-reliant to make it through.

If a DPS is considered ineffective for using a single ability to deal damage and technically fulfill their role's job, then a tank has to be held to the same standard. All roles use a combination of abilities to compliment their primary function and benefit the team. When everybody builds with the anticipation that nobody in the group is going to give support, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I hear you, and even agree (clicked the "agree" button and everything), but you're talking about an ideal situation while this thread is specifically concerning pugs which are rarely ideal. If I get a group where everyone built with the anticipation that nobody in the group is going to give support, so they just focus on their primary tasks, I'm still over the moon cause it means the group is already more advanced than the average pugs. More often than not, though, you get stuck with pugs who didn't anticipate for anything, and who neither provide support or their primary role.

So again, main thread is concerning pug groups, which more often than not experienced players will be having to carry, no matter their role.

As an example, how much support was I getting from this pug group in Volenfell? How well would you estimate these pugs were assisting the group by filling even their basic roles?

inb4 why not rez? Cause they would just run back down the hallway and try to range it again, so why bother risking it when the boss would be taken out moments later?

Starlock · February 2019

Yes, I use Chains/Silver Leash/Talons/Time Stop/Frost Wall or other skills to help speed up things, it's my choice.

It's situational, really. Considering half the time some damage dealer is running ahead of everyone like the world is about to end, much of the time I don't bother.

Honestly, I don't understand the mentality of "it's the tank's job to CC." Back when I still ran as a damage dealer - who was my lightning mage - I would do the CC myself. That felt logical to me. After all, I was the one who was laying down all these AoEs and I wanted stuff to stay put in them. It was MY job to make sure they stayed in my AoEs and I positioned my AoEs correctly, not someone else's. Aside from it just being logical, maybe it's that I come from tabletop RPG backgrounds where yes, the mage is the one doing crowd control... not the tank.