is Redguard Necromancer the most lorebreaking thing ZOS has ever introduced?

Sylvermynx

Gadamlub14_ESO wrote: »

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Gadamlub14_ESO wrote: »

Has anyone mentioned Falion yet? the master level necromancer redguard in Skyrim?

Oh.... hmm. I thought he was Dunmer?

nope, he's a Redguard.
http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Falion_(Skyrim)

Ah, I never really looked him up. Interesting. Very. Thanks for the info!

First there's the stupid hood. Then there's the dark skin. And the name isn't exactly Redguard.... And I only got into that whole thing once over the years. Yeah, I LOVE Morthal (to the point where I wrote hundreds of thousands of words of fanfic about a girl and her relations (beginning with Idgrod and going on from there).... Morthal is my favorite place in all of Skyrim....

Anyway, thanks again. I'll have to revisit the whole thing eventually - after I update everything.... assuming I have the bandwidth. NOT a given *sigh*. Sucks to pay so much for such stringent limits....

Morgul667

I making a redguard necromancer

Zelos

No necromancy was banned by hannibal traven in oblivion. It's technically not banned in this time period by the mages guild but its frowned upon as being "wicked mysticism" redguards can also do anything they want. Not all respect their ancient ways.

Sibenice

Elsterchen wrote: »

Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »

For every rule, there are exceptions.

Well, said but the way its going to show in game is: there are going to be a lot more redguard necromancers then redguard good guys (i.e. non werewolf, non vampire, no members of thieve guild or /and dark brotherhood) and that is NOT lore.

But you have to remember that lorewise there's only one vestige, one hero helping through these stories. If that one person happens to be a Reguard Necro then so be it. He also doesn't have to tell his friends that he's a necromancer. I certainly didn't while running around Skyrim with about 10 skeletons following me. They didn't need to know.

rexagamemnon

You don’t have to play as a redgaurd if you make a character as a necromancer. You also dont have to play as the new class either.

psychotrip

As much as I'd love to bash this game's treatment of the lore:

Oblivion had a redguard necromancer. Think he was in Belda? Whichever ayleid ruin is right next to the sewer exit. Redguard necromancers exist. They're just incredibly rare.

Granted, this necromancer's existence was justified by the story. Which leads to the real question: how will the game's narrative respond to you being a necromancer? So many quests will make little sense without acknowledging the hideous corpse following you.

Tigerseye

Maybe they just shouldn't make MMOs out of established, single player series?

MMOs require balance and parity above all things.

MMOs cannot afford to put lore above that balance and parity.

Much as I appreciate that the lore afficionados want every ESO game to continue along that lore-respecting path, it is impossible to do so, without making a really, really dysfunctional MMO.

LukosCreyden

The fact that people cannot accept that necromancy is becoming playable us silly...

Have any of you played any of the other Elder Scrolls games??

OrdoHermetica

psychotrip wrote: »

As much as I'd love to bash this game's treatment of the lore:

Oblivion had a redguard necromancer. Think he was in Belda? Whichever ayleid ruin is right next to the sewer exit. Redguard necromancers exist. They're just incredibly rare.

Granted, this necromancer's existence was justified by the story. Which leads to the real question: how will the game's narrative respond to you being a necromancer? So many quests will make little sense without acknowledging the hideous corpse following you.

Well, they have confirmed that the Justice System will react to overt necromancy, so there's that. Quest-wise, I kinda doubt it, simply because they'd have to redo/add dialogue for pretty much the entire game OR only have it in new content, which would be a weird split.

Elsterchen

Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »

For every rule, there are exceptions.

Well, said but the way its going to show in game is: there are going to be a lot more redguard necromancers then redguard good guys (i.e. non werewolf, non vampire, no members of thieve guild or /and dark brotherhood) and that is NOT lore.

Well, atm in game you see numerous people riding luminescent mounts. Makes no sense lorewise. So I just think that number of redguard necros will be one of the least lore breaking things in eso

Well, luminescent mounts are of less concern lore-wise. They are not beautiful, i agree, but they may or may not be a part of tamriel at all times (i.e. just too "normal" to be noted somewhere). Stereotypes for races however are what other races note as beeing very frequently present in the race at question... (i.e. dunmer have red eyes, most bosmer refrain from eating greens, nords have a habit of drinking, khajit have a sneaky way, redguards generally despise and mistrust magic, altmer are arogant... etc etc etc). There is no reason ALL members of a race have to fullfill the stereotype, but we wouldn't call it stereotype if only a small minority of said race shows the habits/features.

This is whats getting watered down with every update and just because it has been done over and over again doesn't justify more of this stuff, nor does it make the simple fact that eso is neglegting lore, any better.

I remember the discussions around vampires, werewolves, thieves guild and dark brotherhood and the way zos could have implemented them in a lore conform fashion beeing neglegted or regarded too hard to implement. I expect nothing less in regards of necromancers: Promises that are going to be broken bc they are to lazy to do it right.

To see this is very discouraging for me and spoils the fun in playing a suposedly elder scrolls themed game.


edit:

Sibenice wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »

For every rule, there are exceptions.

Well, said but the way its going to show in game is: there are going to be a lot more redguard necromancers then redguard good guys (i.e. non werewolf, non vampire, no members of thieve guild or /and dark brotherhood) and that is NOT lore.

But you have to remember that lorewise there's only one vestige, one hero helping through these stories. If that one person happens to be a Reguard Necro then so be it. He also doesn't have to tell his friends that he's a necromancer. I certainly didn't while running around Skyrim with about 10 skeletons following me. They didn't need to know.

True, but you do play an MMO... and probably you don#t solo as much as I do. So while the vestige can as well perfectly well be a redguard necro... those other 2 Million necros running around with you will spoil lore, right?
Fun aside, a redguard necro should be so niche most inhabitans of tamriel won#t ever hear about one, let alone see one... and not a sight perfectly normal when strolling through town to do your shopping.

Michaelkeir

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

I know some people just want their magic powers and zombies and such... but I think that an MMO needs to remain true to the lore of the setting. Necromancy is not tolerated in many of the cultures of the game, and using necromantic powers within sight of civilians or guards should incur a penalty.

Now, I'm also of the opinion that if you are using an ability that incurs a penalty, it should be commensurately more powerful.

Is it lore breaking that there might be Dunmer or Redguard necromancers? Not at all. I'm sure there are many of them. Are they tolerated? Not at all. Guards and civilians should respond to them as they would any other criminal.

Not sure if you know this but with the introduction of Necromancers, the game's justice system has been overhauled. If you perform any necromantic powers in towns or around npc/guards you'll receive a bounty. They discussed this in the live stream on Tuesday.

RedTalon

I will be making a redguard called Tim The-Necromancer

Sibenice

Elsterchen wrote: »

Sibenice wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »

For every rule, there are exceptions.

Well, said but the way its going to show in game is: there are going to be a lot more redguard necromancers then redguard good guys (i.e. non werewolf, non vampire, no members of thieve guild or /and dark brotherhood) and that is NOT lore.

But you have to remember that lorewise there's only one vestige, one hero helping through these stories. If that one person happens to be a Reguard Necro then so be it. He also doesn't have to tell his friends that he's a necromancer. I certainly didn't while running around Skyrim with about 10 skeletons following me. They didn't need to know.

True, but you do play an MMO... and probably you don#t solo as much as I do. So while the vestige can as well perfectly well be a redguard necro... those other 2 Million necros running around with you will spoil lore, right?
Fun aside, a redguard necro should be so niche most inhabitans of tamriel won#t ever hear about one, let alone see one... and not a sight perfectly normal when strolling through town to do your shopping.

Nope. That was my point. As far as lore goes they don't exist. It's a game play vs lore thing. You see them in the game but they don't actually exist in the story.

Dark_Lord_Kuro

IronWooshu wrote: »

Sercisil wrote: »

you already have seen link with a necromancer from skyrim, so...

a redguard necromancer from oblivion: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Jalbert


a redguard necromancer from redguard (yep!):https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Redguard:Iszara (at least, she tried to ressurect that prince during the main plot of the game)

so it's not SO uncommon actually, redguard necromancers were almost in all tes games since 1998...

I get it but no hero of Tamriel has ever been a Necromancer and especially not a Redguard.

Exept you could totally be one in skyrim if you wanted