Improve dynamics in Vivec (Cryodiil), make scrolls worth only 5 points...force people to play map

Cavedog

There have been some changes in Cyrodiil scoring lately that have resulted in a dynamic that is very frustrating for many players.

With scrolls being worth 10 points, a color can grab two scrolls, hold two keeps, and get nearly as many points as the other two teams. Meanwhile, the team missing their scrolls can hold all their home keeps plus some of the opponent color keeps, and still not be competitive when it comes to evaluation scoring.

It seems like cutting the point value for scrolls in half would go a long way to forcing factions to play the map a little more.

What do other players who main in Vivec think?

I think this would also help the lag a little bit, as players would be balled up on the map less often...even if it didn't help anything else.

courier

Heck yeah, it'd def help spread the map out some.

dem0n1k

In a game called Elder Scrolls Online... the Elder Scrolls might be important! Whoda thunkdit. XD


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oXI_Viper_IXo

Hate to break it to you, but most people will not care about playing the map no matter what they do.

Reverb

People who care about the map are already playing the map. People who don't care about it aren't going to change over scroll points. The scrolls were worthless for too long, and this change made them desirable finally.

Heimpai

dem0n1k wrote: »

In a game called Elder Scrolls Online... the Elder Scrolls might be important! Whoda thunkdit. XD


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You’d think there’d be a reward for capping one, guess they’re not too important

NBrookus

An entire faction turtling two keeps to hold two enemy scrolls is not playing the map, it's playing the score. It's also blobbing people up and causing lag. Score rules can change, and should, to promote better play dynamics.

5 points per scroll sounds like a good thing to try. Still good points, but not so many it's more important than your home keeps.

Taleof2Cities

Reverb wrote: »

People who care about the map are already playing the map. People who don't care about it aren't going to change over scroll points. The scrolls were worthless for too long, and this change made them desirable finally.

^Pretty much this.^

Scrolls were totally ignored until the scoring changed.

If you don’t want to run the scroll on your Magplar with 11k Stam ... that’s a topic for another thread.

Taleof2Cities

Heimpai wrote: »

dem0n1k wrote: »

In a game called Elder Scrolls Online... the Elder Scrolls might be important! Whoda thunkdit. XD


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You’d think there’d be a reward for capping one, guess they’re not too important

I agree with this, though.

Scroll runners should get some sort of reward ... even if it’s a minuscule amount of AP.

courier

I disagree, people don't play a game to lose it. I for one beat the Bears head against the two scroll keeps for two days, constantly outnumbered, with an instant response from the other faction, I watched guys I run with daily drop the group and rage quit. These are guys I've never seen even show any sign of annoyance at the game.

The scoring should change, all of your home keeps should always be priority, I do think that scrolls should be worth points, but not enough to put another team in the lead by leaps and bounds if they decide to defend them like the last emp keep and lose the rest of the map, maybe do something like a boost if you have all home keeps and enemy scroll.

Cavedog

Thanks for the replies guys....especially those from the players I know to be regulars in Vivec.

The scrolls were most certainly worth too few points before they were worth 10pts, but 10 turns out to be just too high as it creates a dynamic where people play the score, instead of the map and enjoying the game. The blobbing up of people around two keeps for hours is a guaranteed lag fest for everyone, even the team on the winning end of the score tally.

It really seems to me that scrolls being worth 5 points might be the Goldilocks zone for a scrolls score value.

Thanks again for the constructive replies guys.

Cavedog

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

People who care about the map are already playing the map. People who don't care about it aren't going to change over scroll points. The scrolls were worthless for too long, and this change made them desirable finally.

^Pretty much this.^

Scrolls were totally ignored until the scoring changed.

If you don’t want to run the scroll on your Magplar with 11k Stam ... that’s a topic for another thread.

Not sure where you are going with your comment, but if you need advice for a max speed, max resistance scroll runner build.....people ask me about my runner build all the time, and you can't do any better or be any faster due to caps. Let me know if you want to know the build.

Derra

You can never force people to play in a way they don´t like.
If you try to do that they leave.

gplumblingnrb18_ESO

Whats more important and annoying is the damn fps drop in cyrodiil.. Once this is fixed people will play a lot more. Atm because of *** lag and fps drop.. I prefer to stay away from cyrodiil and just play bg.

TequilaFire

OP you are supposed to go and capture your scrolls back, not just sit in a keep.
Besides the score is all rigged by the few groups that control emp cycling through the alliances.

rootimus

Everyone knows that for AD, it's all about holding the Alessia bridge while our keeps burn to the ground. Until ZOS put a capture point on the bridge, that is, at which point most of the faction will go camp a tree.

Nutshotz

Idk. I like the idea of reducing the point value for the scrolls but they really need to figure out something to spread the damn zergs out ranging from EP- Crow and their 3-4 full 24 man grps rolling together as well as , *** AD/DC/EP to many darn guilds to name.

Whether it be any group over 12-16 after the 12 or 16 those other players get a BIG FAT ZERO AP from players that are killed. Keeps and outpost are different. Just maybe that'll get it thru some of these zerglings to spread out. Yes it might be more calculations on the server but what could be worse. 72-100 players running down a group of 12 coordinated players that play together on a daily basis and all Tbagging you or the deminishing AP for grps?

kmarie

Derra wrote: »

You can never force people to play in a way they don´t like.
If you try to do that they leave.

Yes, but you can promote exploitative practices with bad policy. It seems to me that ZOS just quickly responds to complaints without considering unintended consequences of the changes they make.

Kagukan

I think the scrolls should be valuable. Go defend if the enemy is after them. Maybe have some kind of defense boost at the scrolls if a team is greatly out numbered.

TequilaFire

Exactly, if you let them take your scrolls it is on your alliance.

RebornV3x

5 is too much maybe 3 would be just right

NBrookus

TequilaFire wrote: »

Exactly, if you let them take your scrolls it is on your alliance.

That might be true if you could get out of combat to port and/or ride there, didn't disconnect upon getting anywhere near the 3+ stack raids swarming an underpopulated faction, and assuming you are lucky enough to be in game and in the right place, have your skills function with less than a 3 second delay.

courier

TequilaFire wrote: »

Exactly, if you let them take your scrolls it is on your alliance.

I 100% agree, it is on your faction to get off their behinds and go get their points back, but if the other faction will give up every keep just to defend those scrolls ( and let's be honest EP defend like pros) I think that's where the change needs to happen.

Cavedog

TequilaFire wrote: »

OP you are supposed to go and capture your scrolls back, not just sit in a keep.
Besides the score is all rigged by the few groups that control emp cycling through the alliances.

I primarily play EP, and it's EP that has been the primary beneficiary of the dynamic. And no, it's not just a few groups that control what happens in cyrodiil. It's a community effort.

TequilaFire

Cavedog wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

OP you are supposed to go and capture your scrolls back, not just sit in a keep.
Besides the score is all rigged by the few groups that control emp cycling through the alliances.

I primarily play EP, and it's EP that has been the primary beneficiary of the dynamic. And no, it's not just a few groups that control what happens in cyrodiil. It's a community effort.

On PS4 NA Vivec the same groups definitely control the campaign, case in point they are on DC now giving them the lead.
Last month they were on EP and EP won.
In the past they were on AD and won the campaign.
These groups manage to get the last of the good players together that still play and roll the map and are on 24/7.
Fact of life is this game is more about politics and lemmings.

TequilaFire

NBrookus wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Exactly, if you let them take your scrolls it is on your alliance.

That might be true if you could get out of combat to port and/or ride there, didn't disconnect upon getting anywhere near the 3+ stack raids swarming an underpopulated faction, and assuming you are lucky enough to be in game and in the right place, have your skills function with less than a 3 second delay.

They managed to take your scrolls under the same conditions.
Granted there is a problem with alliance hopping allowing for keep take over without siege and stealing scrolls.

Cavedog

TequilaFire wrote: »

Cavedog wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

OP you are supposed to go and capture your scrolls back, not just sit in a keep.
Besides the score is all rigged by the few groups that control emp cycling through the alliances.

I primarily play EP, and it's EP that has been the primary beneficiary of the dynamic. And no, it's not just a few groups that control what happens in cyrodiil. It's a community effort.

On PS4 NA Vivec the same groups definitely control the campaign, case in point they are on DC now giving them the lead.
Last month they were on EP and EP won.
In the past they were on AD and won the campaign.
These groups manage to get the last of the good players together that still play and roll the map and are on 24/7.
Fact of life is this game is more about politics and lemmings.

The players in this game are all on PC. The people you are replying to are mostly playing on PC. Maybe you should try playing on the platform the game was designed to be played on. ...and leave the politics and lemmings on the game boxes where they belong.

TequilaFire

Cavedog wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Cavedog wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

OP you are supposed to go and capture your scrolls back, not just sit in a keep.
Besides the score is all rigged by the few groups that control emp cycling through the alliances.

I primarily play EP, and it's EP that has been the primary beneficiary of the dynamic. And no, it's not just a few groups that control what happens in cyrodiil. It's a community effort.

On PS4 NA Vivec the same groups definitely control the campaign, case in point they are on DC now giving them the lead.
Last month they were on EP and EP won.
In the past they were on AD and won the campaign.
These groups manage to get the last of the good players together that still play and roll the map and are on 24/7.
Fact of life is this game is more about politics and lemmings.

The players in this game are all on PC. The people you are replying to are mostly playing on PC. Maybe you should try playing on the platform the game was designed to be played on. ...and leave the politics and lemmings on the game boxes where they belong.

I have played on PC since beta and PS4, the PvP player base on PS4 has always been more active when I compare them.
The same crap goes on in the PC campaigns.
And no all of the players in this game are not on PC.

ArchMikem

Why specifically that campaign?

courier

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