Can we only let the content patch go live and keep the combat changes on pts? - review of pts change

Zer0oo

Can we only let the content patch go live and keep the combat changes on pts?

Most of the combat changes are just not though through and will create way more problems than they are intended to solve.

• shield changes: who the hell know what they will do since they are for most of the pts time bugged. - Shields on tanks got buffed? - Shields on high risk pvp builds go nerfed?(If you are brave enough to run a real damage setup that will get you killed by 1 mistake it should be rewarding - cc in the wrong time on a low hp sorc = dead) - Shatter cp, oblivion damage and bastion cp are they now balanced, useless or even op? - argonian mag sorc will have the highest shields (WTF as if argonian was not already the best race for almost all mag classes), sorc pets die fast in solo content, are all trial mechanics adjusted to not kill those low shield squishy mag dds (looking at vHR execute),..
  Most mag classes do not have a good class heal so they relay on the shields so their hots or the healer can heal them up. This is also a problem with taking away the small heal on healing ward. (It will leave most classes without a good heal since healing ward will only heal you after 6 sec)
  
• speed changes: snares just became more powerful again and it is not like half(mag players) of the pvp community did QQ about snares for ages. It also makes solo play on stam way harder since you need to kite if you are outnumbered
• mag sorc lost even more of their class identity with the removal of the third bar while they still have not enough overloaded skills(skills that do more things at once) for a working 5+5 skill setup and still have a lot of toggles / skills that do nothing but have to be on the bar for damage boost - at least with no dying pets they will be ok as healers
• mag nb also lost their flavor of being the healing damage dealer with good sustain that will also reward good gameplay (if you weave good your sustain will be good because Ass will is a free cast)
• Major Evasion change: a nice change but it will also create a lot of problems. Almost all ultis are AOE, a few classes will have it harder to deal with it since their class skills are also aoe (templer, warden), Also mag chars are screwed since they have a lot harder time to get this extrem powerful buff that reduces almost all ulti damage and has a long uptime while mag chars only have an active defense that lasts a ~5sec when cast, (mag nb are the only class with easy access to it and it will make raid bomber even stronger)
• templer got some nice buffs but also will feel the Major Evasion changes in pvp - Repentance heal is now extrem strong in a grp of templers

And these are just problems i could have think of within a few min.

There are also quite a lot of problems that did not any attention.

• proc in no-cp
• grp-finder not working (especial evening EU)
• sustain difference on classes/races
• bug fixes for extrem old bugs like: stuck in combat, randomly getting in combat on a warden, delay on ground targeted skills even on auto cast(especial bad with the tree ulti from wardens), not reliable working doors in pvp (you are inside the keep and now you are outside again), chain and ambush through keep doors,...
• snares+roots against mag chars especial in no cp
• ultis no going off but costing ulti
• fps will not go up after intense fights unless you port(restart game)

I really like the game but at some point it is just frustrating to see the same old bugs in the game over and over again while the new balance updates will just create way more problems than i can possible solve. In a 3 month period we have to wait for gamebreaking op things to get fixed while the problems have been known since the pts release.
Also for the love of GOD please fix the bg-tool since pvp is unplayable during prime-time and give us a no-cp pvp balance patch since bgs are now forced no cp.

code65536

Tank shields were not buffed. They gained resistances. But then they nerfed the strength of health-based shields (Igneous, for example, lost a quarter of its strength), so they are about the same as before. Except now in PvP, tank shields are now crittable.

del9

This. There is nothing wrong with trying and failing. This is why we have the PTS. We understand that ZOS has spent time, energy, and paid for many person-hours to come up with these changes. We can see a lot of effort when into this.

But when both mag and stam players of all classes are freaking out, they need to reconsider what they’ve done. When people are upset about the fun factor over their build’s strength, they need to reconsider. When both PVE and PVP are dreading the combat changes, IT IS TIME TO RECONSIDER.

Time to put aside your pride ZoS, and admit this may be a mistake. The community would applaud you.

jcm2606

At the least, the mobility changes need to stay on the PTS. They should not have been added in the second last week of the PTS, as that is simply not enough time to properly test the changes and come to a consensus as to which direction they should go. Even if Zenimax incrementally changed mobility, as they should.

susmitds

Major Evasion was never supposed to be a magicka buff in the first place. It is good that bombblades will be stronger. Raids and ball groups need to be deleted from the game.

Zer0oo

susmitds wrote: »

Major Evasion was never supposed to be a magicka buff in the first place. It is good that bombblades will be stronger. Raids and ball groups need to be deleted from the game.

You know that i was talking about the ball grp bomber nb? A solo bomber can never kill any good ball grp and goes in against a pug grp that does not pay attention (e.g on a resource flag, door repair etc.). And probably does not need this buff since he will go in with the intention to die anyways.

susmitds

del9 wrote: »

This. There is nothing wrong with trying and failing. This is why we have the PTS. We understand that ZOS has spent time, energy, and paid for many person-hours to come up with these changes. We can see a lot of effort when into this.

But when both mag and stam players of all classes are freaking out, they need to reconsider what they’ve done. When people are upset about the fun factor over their build’s strength, they need to reconsider. When both PVE and PVP are dreading the combat changes, IT IS TIME TO RECONSIDER.

Time to put aside your pride ZoS, and admit this may be a mistake. The community would applaud you.

@del9 As a StamNB main, I am certainly not freaking out. I guess the dodge changes will kill my rollypolly build but I will just build a bit tankier.

Solariken

Sorry but I don't agree, I'm looking forward to this patch overall.

Will this patch shatter the current meta? YES.

Will it truly break any playstyles or classes? NO

While I don't like all the changes, I'm so super pumped for the Major Evasion change, lower speeds in combat, slightly toned down dodge roll, and finally having shields not be immune to things they shouldn't be.

aeowulf

Actually good shout, and whilst we're at it can we revoke all class & combat based changes to how they were before Morrowind.

This patch has not done anything to help NB tanks, in fact all changes have made no difference or hurt them in some way. Decreased sustain, loss of dodge/tava tank, loss of minor vitality etc.

SodanTok

Most of what you listed just screams "things cant be tested without going live and seeing the impact on larger playerbase"

and so they will be. Pointless thread.

Zer0oo

SodanTok wrote: »

Most of what you listed just screams "things cant be tested without going live and seeing the impact on larger playerbase"

and so they will be. Pointless thread.

I would not have a problem with it if the next balance change would not take at least 3-6 month to fix what they break. So keep the broken or not well tested changes on pts or allow shorter balance update periods.

Bitmun

I agree, right now, on live, the game looks much more interesting to play. The next patch adds a bunch of new problems, not solving the old, moreover, making them a lot more distinct, if not destroys eso. :P

SodanTok

Zer0oo wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

Most of what you listed just screams "things cant be tested without going live and seeing the impact on larger playerbase"

and so they will be. Pointless thread.

I would not have a problem with it if the next balance change would not take at least 3-6 month to fix what they break. So keep the broken or not well tested changes on pts or allow shorter balance update periods.

You know well thats not gonna happen so what is the point of this. They wont stop doing changes and they wont do them faster either.

Nicalas

.

mikemacon

YES PLEASE.

The “balancing” changes are still very, very half baked.

Kanar

The combat and class changes are fine and should go live. PvP speed fotm was stupid as *** given the games lag and slow server response time. Nerf couldn't have come soon enough. AoEs are the no-skill option in PvP because you don't need to target them, therefore it's good that they will be less effective.

BalticBlues

Solariken wrote: »

Will this patch shatter the current meta? YES.
Will it truly break any playstyles or classes? NO

Sorry, but you obviously have not played all classes and playstyles to judge this.

Example: This patch truly breaks Sorcs with two pets, because without the 3rd bar and only 6 slots left (besides of the two pets blocking 4 slots) there is no meaningful gameplay possible anymore that deserves this name.
Example: This patch (IMHO) breaks light armor because the former advantage of light armor (more dps) is gone when people now constantly have to recast the now gutted shield. It seems much smarter to go for heavy armor now. Isn't this the opposite result of what this patch once was about?

Therefore, I strongly AGREE WITH THE OP. ZOS, please give people the fine content but leave the questionable combat changes out. Red Dead Redemption 2 will release on Oct, 26. This landmark game will cost us players. Please alleviate the expected losses with fine content - instead of aggravating the losses with questionable combat changes most of the playerbase already fear.