Elder Slow Online

Caligamy_ESO

Who asked for this?

Patch Notes:
Developer Comment: A number of changes listed below are targeted at reducing the overall movement speed of players.
The Swift Jewelry Trait now increases movement speed by 6% at max quality, previously 10%.
Boundless Storm: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 7.5. So now you can't shield and you can't get away.
Fiery Grip: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds.
Falcon’s Swiftness: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 10 seconds.
Hasty Retreat: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 5 seconds.
Quick Cloak: This ability now grants Major Expedition for a maximum of 4 seconds instead of 5 seconds.

Also... what?
Bone Shield: Reduced the effectiveness of the Bone Wall and Spinal Surge Synergy granted by this ability and its morphs to 50% from 100%.
Developer Comment:
With the changes to shields now accounting for your armor, we wanted to ensure these shields could remain just as potent as before, but you would need to allocate more resources in doing so.

I'm almost convinced nerfs and buffs are just a big wall in the office covered in darts at this point.

Enslaved

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

Maryal

I am paraphrasing, but in essence, our class reps 'represented to the devs' that the community wanted a nerf to speed because in pvp enemy players were to mobile for their ... errr... 'our' melee attacks to connect.

Unfortunately, the views of that part of the community not in agreement with their viewpoint didn't appear to be addressed.

Caligamy_ESO

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

lol.. I didn't catch that one but yeah crap like that. This doesn't exactly scream planning or forethought in balance changes.

Nicko_Lps

So all magica shields got a nerf, you wanted the stamina shield to remain the same?


Elder Stamina Online.

Caligamy_ESO

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

So all magica shields got a nerf, you wanted the stamina shield to remain the same?

Elder Stamina Online.

Who was using it was the point, I think I saw it like 3 years ago once.. and it was terrible.

GlorphNoldorin

Maryal wrote: »

I am paraphrasing, but in essence, our class reps 'represented to the devs' that the 'majority' of us wanted a nerf to speed because enemy players were to mobile for their ... errr... 'our' melee attacks to connect.

So now the whole game has a speed nerf. Cant fault the class reps....but the devs however. Speed in pvp............. that's the point but what is the cause and what is a solution?

Devs
Is it swift jewelry?
Is it forward momentum?
Is it major expedition?
Devs
We dont know so we will put everything to the hammer.

Why not just make a movement speed cap in cyrodil....case closed.

Kadoin

To be fair, speed could be used to bug damage in PvE as well. Though the speed nerf doesn't mean that targeting problem will be gone. I think I've said it before on the forums before Summerset that there was something fundamentally wrong with ZOS' positioning system and code. I can achieve the same targeting bug at base movement speed, 30% movement (major expedition), etc. It's simply more difficult to do at lower speed, but it still exists and is just as "potent" for anyone that is lame enough to abuse bugs. ZOS should look into that bug. If I remember correctly, I noticed it more after the Morrowind patch...

Maryal

GlorphNoldorin wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

I am paraphrasing, but in essence, our class reps 'represented to the devs' that the 'majority' of us wanted a nerf to speed because enemy players were to mobile for their ... errr... 'our' melee attacks to connect.

So now the whole game has a speed nerf. Cant fault the class reps....but the devs however. Speed in pvp............. that's the point but what is the cause and what is a solution?

Devs
Is it swift jewelry?
Is it forward momentum?
Is it major expedition?
Devs
We dont know so we will put everything to the hammer.

Why not just make a movement speed cap in cyrodil....case closed.

Yes I can fault the class reps ... (partially) they were the ones that told the devs speed buffs were a community pain point ... they are the ones who pointed the finger saying because of speed buffs the community is suffering (in essence). Was there any counter community viewpoint presented in the class rep notes? I sure didn't see any - no dialog as to any other reason for 'the problem' (and there are many), no dialog pointing out the benefits of speed buffs, no dialog pointing out how speed buffs help alleviate numerous pain points that otherwise exist in the game. While not entirely their fault, they still bear some responsibility for this round of over-nerfs.

RD065

We need new class reps and how do you become a class rep?

MaxJrFTW

I like the changes. You see, i prefer a balanced game. Not a broken one...

ResTandRespeC

RD065 wrote: »

We need new class reps and how do you become a class rep?

Get recognized for spending the vast majority of your time both helping the community and learning about the game. The players who are class reps have spent 1000's of hours learning and teaching the game and in most cases with proof in the form of youtube videos and forum posts.

Vapirko

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

Yeah this is WTF

ResTandRespeC

Maryal wrote: »

GlorphNoldorin wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

I am paraphrasing, but in essence, our class reps 'represented to the devs' that the 'majority' of us wanted a nerf to speed because enemy players were to mobile for their ... errr... 'our' melee attacks to connect.

So now the whole game has a speed nerf. Cant fault the class reps....but the devs however. Speed in pvp............. that's the point but what is the cause and what is a solution?

Devs
Is it swift jewelry?
Is it forward momentum?
Is it major expedition?
Devs
We dont know so we will put everything to the hammer.

Why not just make a movement speed cap in cyrodil....case closed.

Yes I can fault the class reps ... (partially) they were the ones that told the devs speed buffs were a community pain point ... they are the ones who pointed the finger saying because of speed buffs the community is suffering (in essence). Was there any counter community viewpoint presented in the class rep notes? I sure didn't see any - no dialog as to any other reason for 'the problem' (and there are many), no dialog pointing out the benefits of speed buffs, no dialog pointing out how speed buffs help alleviate numerous pain points that otherwise exist in the game. While not entirely their fault, they still bear some responsibility for this round of over-nerfs.

I mean you can read these however you want i suppose...
"ZOS told us they are aware players are moving too fast and are too difficult to target with melee and short ranged abilities. They want to slow us down. Swift Jewelry was something that was specifically mentioned. The Major Expedition buff being too strong was hinted at. The reps agreed that players are too fast and that Swift Jewelry is a primary offender, especially when it was additive to other speed boosts and Forward Momentum. The reps did not agree that the Major Expedition was too strong. It was mentioned that diminishing returns may be a better way to address the issue than flat out nerfs as it is the stacking of speed that is the primary issue."
To me all i got was that the class reps thought swift was to strong (which is a concern constantly brought up on the various discords and the forums). The did provide the a counter point that they didn't think major expedition was overpowered. They likewise provided other ways then a flat out nerf to deal with speed stacking (obviously wasn't used). On top of all that it looks like, at least the way i'm reading it, that zos was already planning to go down this road.

Beardimus

Guys swift was over performing. The reps called it right.

Over reaction by ZOS? Yes.

Blaming the reps for that? NO. These are volenteers committed to helping us don't blame ZOS interpretation on them.

StamWhipCultist

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

So all magica shields got a nerf, you wanted the stamina shield to remain the same?


Elder Stamina Online.

Well, since they want all shields to be of same strength, maybe igneous should be 40% of max HP as well.

Undefwun

RD065 wrote: »

We need new class reps and how do you become a class rep?

Do you understand how the class rep system works, before you decide to a) make those claims and b) I hope that wasn't you putting your hand up.

There was alot of chatter about swift and the issues it was causing. I personally liked being fast. I have 2 toons that use swift. The vast majority of players don't encounter those issues, because of how and what they play.

The issue with swift was a pvp issue, the game itself during fighting couldn't cope with the pure speed at times making players un-target-able. My stam sorc was at 83% of the speed cap without sprinting. Considering they just screwed that class over I am not too happy about losing my speed either.

BigBragg

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

I loved how they tried to compare a skill with a 7m range to one that has a 28m range.

Kram8ion

One toon two sets I wear are VO and DKS with one swift
Oh my

Bam_Bam

Glad of the change. As if bunny-hopping wasn't completely stupid already - now they bounce at Mach 2. B'llends!!!

At least so-called "unkillable" tanks will be able to be kept up with so that people can actually, ya know, try.

DivineFirstYOLO

As I posted in another thread:
who was using bone shield in PvE? Guilds that are doing score runs don't have a place for the skill, noob guilds probably don't even know that the skill exists.

PvP - solo players obviously don't use a skill that requires allies to hit the synergy.. only a few groups used bone shield ..and now they got punished for playing as a team.
(maybe a 50% shield with your characters resistance is as strong as it used to be, but i highly doubt it - have not tested tho)

Changes in last few patches were decent..but some nerfs lately are ridiculous...and people who are crying for nerfs are even worse.

Septimus_Magna

At least you have a chance to land Uppercuts in Nerfmire, with the current movement speed thats almost impossible.

weedgenius

Caligamy_ESO wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

lol.. I didn't catch that one but yeah crap like that. This doesn't exactly scream planning or forethought in balance changes.

Sorta like how they buffed netch by 60% only to reduce it to 40% the very next week “to account for the free cast.” As if they forgot it was free to cast when they pulled 60% out of thin air in the first place.

weedgenius

Maryal wrote: »

GlorphNoldorin wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

I am paraphrasing, but in essence, our class reps 'represented to the devs' that the 'majority' of us wanted a nerf to speed because enemy players were to mobile for their ... errr... 'our' melee attacks to connect.

So now the whole game has a speed nerf. Cant fault the class reps....but the devs however. Speed in pvp............. that's the point but what is the cause and what is a solution?

Devs
Is it swift jewelry?
Is it forward momentum?
Is it major expedition?
Devs
We dont know so we will put everything to the hammer.

Why not just make a movement speed cap in cyrodil....case closed.

Yes I can fault the class reps ... (partially) they were the ones that told the devs speed buffs were a community pain point ... they are the ones who pointed the finger saying because of speed buffs the community is suffering (in essence). Was there any counter community viewpoint presented in the class rep notes? I sure didn't see any - no dialog as to any other reason for 'the problem' (and there are many), no dialog pointing out the benefits of speed buffs, no dialog pointing out how speed buffs help alleviate numerous pain points that otherwise exist in the game. While not entirely their fault, they still bear some responsibility for this round of over-nerfs.

Class reps literally told ZOS swift + forward is the problem and major expedition was not an issue. If you read the class rep notes you will see that ZOS came in saying they thought major expedition skills needed to be fixed, class reps told them but actually no they don’t, and yet here we are. Pretty crummy to blame class reps IMO.

Tan9oSuccka

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

I like the changes. You see, i prefer a balanced game. Not a broken one...

Brace yourself. The forum people will be coming after you with pitchforks and torches.

Balance is a mystery to a majority on the forum.

Swift + stall your crap connection + below average server performance seems to be the new plague.

Mannix1958

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

But they added travel time to a fairly slow telegraphed spell. If I had a choice between it and whip in my toolkit...I'd take whip after these changes.

StamWhipCultist

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

I like the changes. You see, i prefer a balanced game. Not a broken one...

try pokemon go

Mannix1958

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

I like the changes. You see, i prefer a balanced game. Not a broken one...

Funny...cause this does not feel like balance at all. I keep testing it on the PTS and certain classes are paying a much higher price.

leepalmer95

weedgenius wrote: »

Caligamy_ESO wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

I love how they nerfed whip week or two ago "to be in line with frags" and now they buffed frags lolz

lol.. I didn't catch that one but yeah crap like that. This doesn't exactly scream planning or forethought in balance changes.

Sorta like how they buffed netch by 60% only to reduce it to 40% the very next week “to account for the free cast.” As if they forgot it was free to cast when they pulled 60% out of thin air in the first place.

Or they originally nerf frag because it was doing too much dmg and reduced it to 10% only to then buff it again to 20%...

Or the same with the jesus beam nerf, nerfed to 330% from 400% because it was doing too much dmg, then buffed it to 400% again ...

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

Nicko_Lps wrote: »

So all magica shields got a nerf, you wanted the stamina shield to remain the same?


Elder Stamina Online.

Well, since they want all shields to be of same strength, maybe igneous should be 40% of max HP as well.

Considering you can put igneous on 6 people at once, that is like having a 40% shield.

frostz417

Speed nerf was honestly the silliest thing ever, no more 1vX’ing fellas. I guess we’ll just have to deal with zergs always chasing us with cc/root spam sadly. Elder Zergs Online