The Nerf to Speed Pots is a horrible idea; Here's why.

templesus

Everyone knows nerfing speed pots is directed at stamina players, as there are no Magicka speed pots. This is common knowledge, as even following todays notes multiple players made multiple forum posts saying "Speed pots need nerfed too!" and other things similar, and it was then confirmed by @ZOS_GinaBruno that they would be nerfed next patch. Disclaimer: Saying slot Magicka abilities for speed is not an answer nor a resolution; I would not tell a Magicka player to run well fitted because they cannot dodge sloads enough. Please if you are shortsighted enough to tell me to spend Magicka every 3 seconds for Race against time then just please do not comment at all.

Currently Magicka players have the following magicka costing abilities as a means of Major Expedition:
Dragonknight: Chains
Templar: Zip Zilch Zada
Nightblade: Cripple, Path
Warden: Bird of Prey
Sorcerer: Boundless Storm
Vampire: Mist Form
Psijic: Race against time

Keep in mind we are not speaking subjectively as to how well some of these abilities are or how much they're used, these are simply the SOURCES of major expeditions that cost Magicka.

Now, Stamina currently have:
Dual Wield: Quick Cloak
Assault Tree: Rapids

Stamina also has a passive in the Bow Skill line that grants major expedition after dodge rolling.

We can clearly see the discrepancy here. Mainly, Stamina classes will be pigeonholed into running either a bow or quick cloak, with no other viable options for expedition. Rapids gets removed as soon as any ability is used, so we'll assume that it does not truly function in combat here. Most Stam builds are already forced into running a 2h due to the necessity of rally/forward momentum, so this change is not even remotely healthy for the game.

This change objectively only really hurts 1vX players and tanks in PvE who need the movement speed to complete certain mechanics (ie vCR). Nobody in ball groups, zergs, etc is getting hurt by this change. It is literally nerfing 1vX players, people who actively try to play against outnumbered odds, which has a VERY high ceiling ~ and such players should not be punished like this. Simply put, if ZOS wants to nerf speed pots they should nerf them to the point to where they only grant 2 bonus effects in total, ie Stam + Speed or Immovable + Speed, but at the same time for the sake of balance make it possible to get Magicka + Speed as well.

Kikke

Gap closers, by Zeni's standards mags are supposed to kite stams, not the other way around.

zParallaxz

If they make Magicka speed pots I’m all for it, however we are past the that stage with Zos already. Sooooo, in terms of nerfs you shouldn’t be able to combine speed and immovable if they want to nerf it in a logical manner.

templesus

kikkehs wrote: »

Gap closers, by Zeni's standards mags are supposed to kite stams, not the other way around.

Just lol.

Crixus8000

Very well said.

As a solo player I hate this so much. When doing 1vx without speed you just die, stand your ground isn't a thing with the amount of damage in pvp right now with things like bleeds and proc sets. If it's a duration nerf ( and it's probably going to be) then it's just pointless to run speed pots because the second that speed falls off your useless.

I tried running without speed pots and it was just terrible. I couldn't escape anything and couldn't hardly land any dizzy swings.

But zos seems to hate solo/small scale play. Zergs get buffed while we suffer.

Andferne

The duration of speed pots needs to be reduced and should have been long ago.

Gilvoth

allready feels like we crawl in mud, especially when sneaking.
please do not nerf speed.

Gilvoth

.

crazy_catman21

Andferne wrote: »

The duration of speed pots needs to be reduced and should have been long ago.

Why though? Major expedition is not what’s game breaking speed wise. Swift is over performing & deserved a minor adjustment, but this nerf to expedition is another episode of zos taking a mile balance wise instead of an inch.

Andferne

crazy_catman21 wrote: »

Why though? Major expedition is not what’s game breaking speed wise. Swift is over performing & deserved a minor adjustment.

Never said that major expedition was game breaking. The duration that the potions gave was the problem. They exceeded any duration that an actual buff could give someone.

Crixus8000

Andferne wrote: »

The duration of speed pots needs to be reduced and should have been long ago.

If the duration is nerfed then they are useless. moving like a snail for half the fight won't work. The second that speed falls off your basically dead because you can't use los to escape the endless proc sets, snipe spam and everything else the large group of players is throwing at you.

idk

Reducing the up time of momentum from a speed pot makes sense being that everything OP mentioned that grants the buff does not grant it for very long whereas a speed potion grants the buff for a full 45 seconds. I believe there is nothing that comes near that uptime for the buff.

Many of those skills OP mentioned only grant momentum for a few seconds.

Further, some of those the skills can be used by stam even though they cost magicka.

NB Double take is great for a stam NB. Does not cost preciouis stam, will grant AoE damage reduction plus momentum.

Available to all is the Psijic order skill OP mentioned. Burn some of that magicka.

Granted, I am not calling for a nerf to anything, but agree it does make sense to reduce the uptime per potion.

GlorphNoldorin

This change objectively only really hurts 1vX players and tanks in PvE who need the movement speed to complete certain mechanics (ie vCR). Nobody in ball groups, zergs, etc is getting hurt by this change. It is literally nerfing 1vX players, people who actively try to play against outnumbered odds, which has a VERY high ceiling ~ and such players should not be punished like this. Simply put, if ZOS wants to nerf speed pots they should nerf them to the point to where they only grant 2 bonus effects in total, ie Stam + Speed or Immovable + Speed, but at the same time for the sake of balance make it possible to get Magicka + Speed as well. [/quote]

Very well said....but I fear you are wasting your time and that we will still get the hammer.

NobleX35

Completely agree that nerfing speed pots is a horrible decision and will only have negative effects on gameplay.

kikkehs wrote: »

Gap closers, by Zeni's standards mags are supposed to kite stams, not the other way around.

Movement speed is not only for closing gaps, it's also for getting out of an engagement.

Koensol

I bet you all my gold it will be a duration nerf. This will be the patch that officially kills 1vx and any form of solo pvp. And of course, snares will remain without cooldown and roots will keep their nearly spammable status. It will be great fun next patch!

Derra

Personally i think the nerf to speed pots is just a major nerf to magica.

Stamina can optionally just equip cowards gear on one bar and yolo sprint with major protection into the sunset - still leaves room to fight with master DW + fury + trollking.

Getting speed for magica at a reasonable investment will be much harder.

Emma_Overload

Yep, Stamina builds should have 45 seconds of Major Expedition while Magicka builds get 4 seconds... That sounds fair! 🙄

StamWhipCultist

zParallaxz wrote: »

If they make Magicka speed pots I’m all for it, however we are past the that stage with Zos already. Sooooo, in terms of nerfs you shouldn’t be able to combine speed and immovable if they want to nerf it in a logical manner.

wut

You can consume speed pots no matter what resource you use.
Meta speed pot do not even have stam return on it but lingering health.

Crixus8000

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Yep, Stamina builds should have 45 seconds of Major Expedition while Magicka builds get 4 seconds... That sounds fair! 🙄

sooo give magicka a speed pot option instead of destroying solo play for stam builds.

Koensol

Derra wrote: »

Personally i think the nerf to speed pots is just a major nerf to magica.

Stamina can optionally just equip cowards gear on one bar and yolo sprint with major protection into the sunset - still leaves room to fight with master DW + fury + trollking.

Getting speed for magica at a reasonable investment will be much harder.

Cowards will be nerfed as well, just watch. ZOS will make sure to root out mobility completely. It is just hilarious, the lack of vision from ZOS. In one patch they add swift. In the next they nerf snares, and now they nerf speed and mobility and empower snare and root spamming zergs once more. I wish ZOS would just officially state that they do not want solo pvp in their game. At least they would show some balls.

StamWhipCultist

Stamina can equip cowards gear?
Do it yourself, derra.

Beardimus

swift needed a Nerf. The rest didn't.

ZOS seem to overcompensate alot recently. They change A which breaks B then instead of fix A they create C which makes problems D,E & F.

Unless A is rune cage in which case they do back track and delete the skill.

Chilly-McFreeze

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Yep, Stamina builds should have 45 seconds of Major Expedition while Magicka builds get 4 seconds... That sounds fair! 🙄

If my stam chars can run speed + lingering health pots (see, no stam effect here), so can your mag builds

Septimus_Magna

templesus wrote: »

Everyone knows nerfing speed pots is directed at stamina players, as there are no Magicka speed pots. This is common knowledge, as even following todays notes multiple players made multiple forum posts saying "Speed pots need nerfed too!" and other things similar, and it was then confirmed by @ZOS_GinaBruno that they would be nerfed next patch. Disclaimer: Saying slot Magicka abilities for speed is not an answer nor a resolution; I would not tell a Magicka player to run well fitted because they cannot dodge sloads enough. Please if you are shortsighted enough to tell me to spend Magicka every 3 seconds for Race against time then just please do not comment at all.

Currently Magicka players have the following magicka costing abilities as a means of Major Expedition:
Dragonknight: Chains
Templar: Zip Zilch Zada
Nightblade: Cripple, Path
Warden: Bird of Prey
Sorcerer: Boundless Storm
Vampire: Mist Form
Psijic: Race against time

Keep in mind we are not speaking subjectively as to how well some of these abilities are or how much they're used, these are simply the SOURCES of major expeditions that cost Magicka.

Now, Stamina currently have:
Dual Wield: Quick Cloak
Assault Tree: Rapids

Stamina also has a passive in the Bow Skill line that grants major expedition after dodge rolling.

We can clearly see the discrepancy here. Mainly, Stamina classes will be pigeonholed into running either a bow or quick cloak, with no other viable options for expedition. Rapids gets removed as soon as any ability is used, so we'll assume that it does not truly function in combat here. Most Stam builds are already forced into running a 2h due to the necessity of rally/forward momentum, so this change is not even remotely healthy for the game.

This change objectively only really hurts 1vX players and tanks in PvE who need the movement speed to complete certain mechanics (ie vCR). Nobody in ball groups, zergs, etc is getting hurt by this change. It is literally nerfing 1vX players, people who actively try to play against outnumbered odds, which has a VERY high ceiling ~ and such players should not be punished like this. Simply put, if ZOS wants to nerf speed pots they should nerf them to the point to where they only grant 2 bonus effects in total, ie Stam + Speed or Immovable + Speed, but at the same time for the sake of balance make it possible to get Magicka + Speed as well.

Ranged magicka builds are still unable to kite anyone due to sprint and gap closers.

Quick Cloak for AOE dmg reduction and major evasion isnt bad, I will probably run it on my Stamden when Nerfmire goes live.

Lutallo

Sounds to me like OP is panicking after he went and made 500 immovable speed pots for his cheese-stamden build.

Nicalas

I give up.

Haashhtaag

It’s typical ZOS instead of slowly making changes they try to rush out changes such as these. No grey area with them either they will destroy everything or nothing all for the sake of forum heroes and getting the patch out due to arbitrary schedule of content release.

Maryal

It is so weird to see people refer to speed pots as 'stamina speed pots' when they can (and often are) made with no restorative benefit to stamina whatsoever.

Solariken

Andferne wrote: »

The duration of speed pots needs to be reduced and should have been long ago.

^

Emma_Overload

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Yep, Stamina builds should have 45 seconds of Major Expedition while Magicka builds get 4 seconds... That sounds fair! 🙄

If my stam chars can run speed + lingering health pots (see, no stam effect here), so can your mag builds

I've done it. Giving up Major Intellect is too high a price to pay for Mag Sorcs... our sustain is already so dodgy.

zParallaxz

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

zParallaxz wrote: »

If they make Magicka speed pots I’m all for it, however we are past the that stage with Zos already. Sooooo, in terms of nerfs you shouldn’t be able to combine speed and immovable if they want to nerf it in a logical manner.

wut

You can consume speed pots no matter what resource you use.
Meta speed pot do not even have stam return on it but lingering health.

Bro why do u think a majority of people refer to them as STAM speed spots. Also no the meta speed pot to use is a immovable, speed, return stam pot.