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What defines a "TANK" in the Group Finder? (+personal story)

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Shraar
Shraar
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Hello, intermediate player here and I'd like your opinion on something.

My understanding of tank is someone who should be the most durable party member, the one who leads the charge, engages and hold aggros so his squishier teammates can focus on healing/damaging. He controls the pace of each fight.

But in ESO, I see tanks who run past everything. Who aren't shieldmaidens and who let aggression fly everywhere. Is this allowed? This seems to be against the rules of the game, exploited by DPS who want a queue that is 20 seconds instead of 20 minutes. To me, that doesn't seem fair or right or expected but I don't know this community yet and I would like to be humble and understand exactly what's going on here. The way I see it now, this kind of behaviour shouldn't be enabled/encouraged, otherwise what is the point of "roles"?

My personal story:
Just recently, I saw a Bow+DW "Tank" who was bullying a member of our party in Elden Hollow I for doing little DPS. I think he had a mod that tracked group members I have seen similar things in WoW? I could tell she wasn't very good because she only heavy attacked and used abilities but she was probably very new because she didn't respond at all, maybe she didn't know how to type?

I decided to stand up and point out that he shouldn't blame DPS for not doing their job when he wasn't tanking anything and was blazing through the instance.
You see, I have the transcript of the conversation here, but names have been replaced so I don't break the Tenets:

Meanie: REALLY HORRIBLE DPS
Meanie: "Other DPS Name" is dealing 3.7k DPS...
Meanie: how is that even possible
Meanie: heavy 2h attack is garbage dude
Me: says the dw/bow tank?
Meanie: I can tank with shield but dps is terrible
Me: You obviously want to rush through this, stop typing.
Meanie: this is my 5 min pledge
Me: This is everyone's dungeon run
Meanie: solo dungeon
Meanie: [FTC] Chokethorn (+1) - 1:03 - 810,302 Damage (32,863 DPS)
Meanie: bow light attack and 2H heavy attack u are a garbage

(it was at this point that he insulted me personally for bow light attacks on a bunch of minions that I decided to vote kick him. I didn't feel like explaining I wanted to get killing blows on non-boss enemies with bow to level the skill line as I was taught to do because I'm below level 50 in skill-line and level. Hail of Arrows and Caltrops were already down! ...The vote kick was successful.)

Me: good people
Meanie (now in /say due to being kicked): u guys wanted a caary
Meanie (now in /say due to being kicked): trashes
Healer: blow me
Me: Lol

Then in the middle of the final bossfight he whispered me: "Garbages play with garbages I guess go play Mine craft trash builds"
Our healer said something along the lines of "hey on our second last boss" so I assume he whispered the other group members too and our healer accidentally responded in group chat??
I simply muted him. I didn't report him (even though I'll admit my spite made me want to...) because he only whispered me once and that's not harassment. I have never encountered toxicity like that in game before.

I am watching a Netflix series right now that features characters who stand up for people in need. I saw what I perceived to be a new player struggling to keep up, and this harsh criticism in Elden Hollow 1, casual and easy, was no place for such high standards and insulting judgments so I stood up against the bully as eloquently as I could. I chose not to be a bystander. Then we, the three of us, stood up to a bully and kicked him out. Hopefully that teaches him that the tortoise beats the hare. I just had to write it all out to get it off my level 40 Hunding's Rage heavy chest armor if you don't think it's relevant I understand that's why I hid it away. Hopefully that teaches him not to rush and be mean.
"This seems to be against the rules of the game, exploited by DPS who want a queue that is 20 seconds instead of 20 minutes."
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  • Artim_X
    Artim_X
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    In my opinion for the most part a tank at minimum should consistently hold aggro of the boss and any hard hitting enemies that can one shot. They should somehow contribute to the overall group damage either by significantly debuffing enemies (especially in trials) or in easier 4 man content (normal dungeons and vanilla vet dungeons) they sacrifice some of their tankiness for more personal damage, which can be quite the boon when the actual damage dealers are a bit inexperienced. However, at the end of the day as long as a tank is able to survive the content that they chose to play while holding aggro one could say that they are playing the role of a tank, but this would essentially be a tank that is just starting out and for normal dungeons that is perfectly fine.

    It's unfortunate that your group had such a bad experience, but it's good that your group ended up kicking the player. In the future if it's clear that someone is being toxic during a run just initiate a vote kick right away. Chances are if you felt that a person was being toxic the others will agree as well.
    (AD) Artim X |PC/NA| Primary Guild: Storm Guides NA Casual staff wielding vampire sorcerer.

    My Easygoing Builds
    Electric-Stun
    https://media.giphy.com/media/hokMyu1PAKfJK/giphy.gif
    Proc free DPS build for when a tank isn't holding bosses in place and for times where one is not getting buffed by a healer.
    Gear: 5 Netch's Touch (All apparel Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 2 Slimecraw (All Divines. 1 med/1 heavy. Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Lightning Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame enchant).
    Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath, Hardened Ward (Twilight Tormentor if one can somewhat trust both the heals and tank to keep you alive), Lightning Flood, and Power Overload.
    Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Streak, Shock Reach, Dampen Magic (Twilight Tormentor if one can somewhat trust both the healer and tank to keep you alive), Unstable Wall of Storms, and Thunderous Rage.

    Electric-Burn
    [url="https://media.giphy.com/media/6CovzgyTig7M4/giphy.gif[/url]
    DPS build for more organized groups.
    Gear: 5 Burning Spellweave (All apparel Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 2 Grothdarr (All Divines. 1 med/1 heavy. Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Inferno Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame enchant).
    Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath, Hardened Ward (Twilight Tormentor if one can somewhat trust both the heals and tank to keep you alive), Lightning Flood, and Power Overload.
    Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Streak, Flame Reach, Dampen Magic (Twilight Tormentor if one can somewhat trust both the healer and tank to keep you alive), Unstable Wall of Fire, and Fiery Rage.

    Electric-Cool
    [url="https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif[/url]
    Utility focused DPS build that is capable of tanking normal dungeons and vet non dlc dungeons, but it does not provide enough tank based buffs/debuffs to warrant it's use in trials/vet dlc dungeons and due to the limits of damage shields it would be too much of a liability due to the sheer number of potential one-shot mechanics that a pure tank would have an easier time dealing with.
    Gear: 5 Icy Conjuror (All apparel Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 2 Iceheart (All Divines. 1 med/1 heavy. Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Ice Staff (infused/ice enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused/flame enchant).
    Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Boundless Storm, Mages' Wrath (Elemental Drain in vet content if healer isn't using it), Hardened Ward, Lightning Flood, and Power Overload (Replenishing Barrier when healer isn't keeping others alive).
    Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Streak (Inner Rage when dealing with multiple bosses), Frost Reach (Restraining Prison when I want to lock enemies down), Dampen Magic, Unstable Wall of Frost, and Icy Rage (Aggressive Horn when DPS is decent).

    Electric-Heal
    https://media.giphy.com/media/5ibGIHneWS6ek/giphy.gif
    My healer build that I for the most part only use in normal dungeons/trials or in Vet premades, since playing with randoms tend to result in me being in a group that lacks DPS, has a fake tank, or both.
    Gear: 5 Spell Power Cure (All apparel Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 2 spell critical monster set pieces when I don't feel like using spell crit pots, Grothdarr when I want to do more damage, Bogdan when I want more HoTs, Symphony of Blades to provide more emergency resources, or Earthgore when I feel like it would make a significant difference (All Divines. 1 med/1 heavy. Max Mag Enchants), Maelstrom's Lightning Staff (infused/shock enchant), and Infallible Aether jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/restoration staff (infused with weapon damage enchant).
    Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge (Power Surge for more heals), Boundless Storm, Combat Prayer, Ward Ally (Twilight Matriarch for another burst heal and damage), Energy Orb, and Replenishing Barrier.
    Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Overflowing Altar, Elemental Drain, Hardened Ward (Twilight Matriarch for another burst heal and damage), Unstable Wall of Storms, and Aggressive Horn.

    Electric-Vamp
    https://media.giphy.com/media/ukDQiYZzRAxMZKcK86/giphy.gif
    Tanky utility focused PvP healer that can take down very inexperienced players, but is primarily focused on working alongside others in an organized group, PUGs, or zergs.
    Gear: 5 Torug's Pact (3 heavy body pieces, light waist, and medium hands. All Impenetrable. Max Mag Enchants), 2 heavy Mighty Chudan (All Impenetrable. Max Mag Enchants), and Knight Slayer jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/lightning staff (infused with oblivion enchant)/restoration staff (infused with oblivion enchant. Same enchant as lightning in order to maintain consistent pressure regardless of which staff you're heavy attacking with). [When more focused on damage will change Chudan pieces to medium and light. Also all my Torug body pieces to light except the chest that stays heavy].
    Ability-Bar 1: Structured Entropy, Consuming Trap, Haunting Curse, Ward Ally, Rapid Regeneration, and Life Giver (or Soul Assault).
    Ability-Bar 2: Dark Deal, Elusive Mist, Rune Cage, Hardened Ward, Efficient Purge, and Shooting Star.

    Electric-Ward
    https://media.giphy.com/media/Wa0TGmtDvwW3e/giphy.gif
    Damage shield tank designed to help my guildmates clear vet dungeons when a typical tank isn't available.
    Gear: 5 Brands of the Imperium (All Divines with Max Mag Enchants), 2 Mother Ciannait (All Divines. 1 med/1 light. Max Mag Enchants). Combat Physician jewelry (arcane with spell damage enchant)/Ice Staff (infused/crusher). Blackrose Restoration Staff (doesn't have to be the perfect version. infused/hardening enchant).
    Ability-Bar 1: Critical Surge, Bound Aegis, Inner Rage, Boundless Storm, Ward Ally, and Replenishing Barrier.
    Ability-Bar 2: Deep Thoughts, Bound Aegis, Restraining Prison (Elemental Drain in vet content if healer isn't using it), Unstable Wall of Frost, Hardened Ward, and Temporal Guard.

    PvE Starter Gear
    https://media.giphy.com/media/6CovzgyTig7M4/giphy.gif
    Gear: 5 Law of Julianos (heavy chest, gloves/belt light, and the rest can be light or 1 medium piece if you're not wearing medium anywhere else on your body. All in training if grinding for XP or divines), Armor of the Seducer or Magnus' Gift head, shoulder, and staves (light with 1 medium piece if you are not already wearing 1 medium Julianos piece. All in training or divines. The staves should be training or infused), and 3 purple Willpower Jewelry with Arcane trait (can be bought from trading guilds for relatively cheap. Check tamrieltradecentre.com for the best deals if you're not using a price checking addon).

    Race
    https://media.giphy.com/media/sdEkeWpiaGz0A/giphy.gif
    High elf, since you will not have issues with sustain, but other mag based races are also fine so this is more of a personal choice.

    Mundus Stones
    https://media.giphy.com/media/cT3wMhLGQWdKU/giphy.gif
    PvP: The Atronach.
    PvE: I will almost always use the Atronach in this content as well (especially if I'm healing in PvE or playing it safe while solo). However, in a strong group other Mundus Stones can be effective (Thief is what I would use in a serious group as a healer. As DPS I would use Shadow or Lover depending on group), since a heavy attack rotation will ensure that you're always restoring magicka at a decent rate. When using electric-ward in vet content I will always use the Lady to reach 25k+ physical/spell resistances.

    Current Champion Points
    [url="https://media.giphy.com/media/y2RgvEEy1R5rW/giphy.gif[/url]
    Mag Sorc: More focused on damage, since changing CP isn't free. Mage: Elfborn (56), Spell Erosion (22), Elemental Expert (64), Staff Expert (44), Master-at-Arms (9), and Thaumaturge (75). Warrior: Ironclad (34), Resistant (8), Light Armor Focus (12), Hardy (32), Elemental Defender (32), Thick Skinned (31), Expert Defender (33), Bastion (56), and Quick Recovery (32). Thief: Warlord (31), Sprinter (6), Bashing Focus (6), Arcanist (75), Tenacity (75), Shade (25), Tumbling (26), and Shadow Ward (26).

    Rotations
    [url="https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif[/url]
    Mag Sorc: (In your gameplay settings turn on quick cast ground abilities) Buff up with Boundless and Surge, weapon swap immediately after casting the previous skill, drop Rage if it's active (only drop it on significant bosses or in situations with lots of enemies where you know you'll have the ult filled up by the next boss), Reach, Unstable, quickly weapon swap, Liquid Flood, two heavy attacks, activate either Surge or Boundless, cancel the animation of the buff used with a weapon swap, and repeat. If you have an excessive amount of ult and you're dealing with trash mobs activate overload before performing the rotation, but don't heavy attack for too long. If you have enough ult for Rage while you're fighting a serious boss and you're in the middle of the rotation just focus on activating the ultimate, afterwards either continue the rotation or start from scratch. During the execute phase (around 20% health) replace the second heavy attack with about 4 Mages' Wrath, but if boss is melting quickly just keep spamming Wrath (hold heavy attack while spamming Wrath). When using Twilight Tormentor only use the active ability before a fight and at times where you aren't actively engaging the boss.

    When frost staff tanking a single boss buff up with Boundless and Surge, weapon swap immediately after casting the previous skill, heavy attack with the ice staff, drop Rage if it's active, Reach/Restraining (at times can be replaced with an additional lightning staff heavy for sustain), Unstable, quickly weapon swap, Lightning Flood, one heavy attack (two if Reach isn't used), activate either Surge or Boundless, cancel the animation of the buff used with a weapon swap, one heavy attack, and repeat. If frost staff tanking multiple bosses buff up with Boundless and Surge, weapon swap immediately after casting the previous skill, heavy attack with the ice staff each enemy, drop Rage if it's active, Unstable, quickly weapon swap, Lightning Flood, heavy attack priority boss in order to proc IA (pink smoke), activate either Surge or Boundless, cancel the animation of the buff used with a weapon swap, heavy attack all the bosses, and repeat. Can also slot in Inner Rage and forego heavy attacking with the ice staff. If using inner rage after getting aggro perform the DPS oriented rotation and retake aggro after 1 rotation. Most challenging bosses to keep aggroed will be the Pact in the Blessed Crucible and the knights in the White-Gold Tower, since you need to keep 3 enemies taunted, but they can also be locked down with Restraining. During the execute phase on a single target (around 20% health) replace the second heavy attack with a partial heavy attack in order to proc IA and around 4 Mages' Wrath, but if boss is melting quickly just keep spamming Wrath (hold block while spamming Wrath).

    When healing in PvE just keep all support skills and Unstable up. Heavy attack primarily with a restoration staff whenever you can. Be reactive with your heals (when someone is scratched use ward ally and top them off with some Prayers). When taking a lot of continuous damage make sure to have all buffs/debuffs up while keeping Energy Orb active in the group. At the boss use the horn ult, but only when the group has decent survivability and damage. If too many players lack survivability then use the barrier ult to make life easier (longer fight, but less risk of death). Can use barrier when dealing with trash mobs (gives back ult).

    In PvP you'll rarely be in a scenario where you can perform a PvE esque rotation with AOE unless you're performing a single target burst. For the most part just stun peeps whenever possible, apply dots, and heavy attack them a few times. Rinse and repeat till they die and use ults as needed, but make sure to keep your health and shields up whenever you take significant damage (might have to keep one's distance if a dk is using a skill like draw essence). When in a high pressure situation stay on the lightning staff bar and keep hardened ward up while stunning and heavy attacking hostiles make sure to keep primary buffs up, heal up, purge, and shield stack as needed. When dealing with a large amount of enemy players alongside your faction keep your distance from friendlies (avoid bombs). If you get debuffs on you be careful not to overuse efficient purge, which is still quite costly. If not grouped up do not bother using purge on a debuffed friendly, since it will not affect them at all.

    In PvE and PvP make sure to utilize tab target to keep track of priority enemies. Use streak in PvE for mag based movement that also allows you to stun a group of enemies. Use elusive mist for mag based movement, snare removal, and damage mitigation in PvP (can also be used in stealth, but will pop you out of a hidden state for a brief moment).

    In PvP when solo taking a resource ride your mount towards the tower, aggro the two guards at the front of the entrance, then head on inside the tower, buff up, purge, head up the stairs, kill everyone that follows especially the mage guard, kill everyone on the flag, and flip.

    Favorite Foods and Potions
    https://media.giphy.com/media/3otPoTggaYFNd1FdAI/giphy.gif
    Gold Food for PvE:
    (DPS) Corrupting Bloody Mara (increases Max Magicka by 4620, Max Health by 5051, and Health Recovery by 505 for 2 hours). If a vampire use font of loss furnishing to decrease vampirism to stage 1 to benefit from health recovery.

    Gold Food for PvP and PvE:
    (PvP healer/PvE serious tank) Clockwork Citrus Filet (increases Max Health by 3326, Health Recovery by 406 [useful if stage 1 vampire], Max Magicka by 3080, and Magicka Recovery by 338 for 2 hours).

    Trash Potions when feeling cheap:
    Regular CP150 Essence of Magicka pots that I obtain frequently from playing the game or Crown Tri-Restoration Potion obtained from dailies.

    Crafted Potions:
    Essence of Spell Critical (Bugloss, Lady's Smock, and Water Hyacinth). Without magelight this is my primary means of obtaining Major Prophecy, which increases my Spell Critical Rating. This also heals and restores magicka. Essence of Immovability (Columbine, Corn Flower, and Wormwood). I use this in PvP, since this gives me stealth detection, knockback immunity, and restores magicka (better to use it when competent allies are nearby, since it might reveal that you are surrounded by multiple players in stealth and you will not have an emergency pot available after use). Essence of Invisibility with only 2 ingredients (Blue Entoloma, Namira's Rot, Nirnroot, or Spider Egg). I use this in PvE content that requires stealth and if I need more speed I'll use Rapid Maneuver before using the potion. Essence of Invisibility with 3 ingredients (Blessed Thistle, Blue Entoloma, and Namira's Rot). Very useful in PvP alongside the vampire Dark Stalker passive, since you'll be invisible, ignore movement speed penalty while in Crouch, and you'll have a 30% movement speed boost from Major Expedition (I always have this slotted when riding from point A to B in PvP land, since gankers are always lurking).
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  • harlam
    harlam
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    I feel your pain. I was trying to do Moon Hunter Keep last night, and providing the tank can survive the larger hits from the and keep things like the larger werewolves faced away from the DPS the mechanics outside of that are fairly straight forward.

    4 "tanks" it took running in and getting 1 shot, or not knowing (and no being willing to listen to and understand) the mechanics of certain bosses before we finally got someone who was properly capable of holding agro and even though unaware of boss mechanics, was willing to ask and listen to learn and succeed.

    I'd much rather fail a few times helping someone learn what to do and improve their knowledge, than burn through both repair kits and my time with ungrateful and egocentric players who ruin the experience for the 3 other members of the group

    It's a shame as this part of the game is one of the bits I enjoy. New dungeons, learning tactics/mechanics and working with others, but players like the ones mentioned here ruin it. I have genuinely considered a re-spec on my main to tank even though I prefer DPS on that class just to be able to actually enjoy the newer content
    Harlam Nightbane - Nightblade Tank <Keepers of Nirn> - Xbox EU
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  • Salvas_Aren
    Salvas_Aren
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    General opinion on tanks: Hold aggro, buff and/or debuff, survive while doing this.

    I'm fine with: Hold aggro, rez if all DDs are dead, survive while doing this.


    As long as you pug, you will meet a lot of people who complain about everything and the dead skeever next to it. One of the cutest stories I know is about a guy/girl who would hateswhisp our tank for 10 mins after kicking. We remember of this incident as the *How dare you* story.
    It just works, it just works, little lies, stunning shows,
    people buy, money flows, it just works.
    It just works, it just works, overpriced open worlds,
    earnings rise, take my word: IT JUST WORKS!

    I nerfed my wallet in Jan 2017. I altered my wallet status to closed in May 2019.
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  • DeadlyRecluse
    DeadlyRecluse
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    Shraar wrote: »
    hold aggro

    If i'm pugging, this is literally the entirety of my expectation.
    Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub
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  • remilafo
    remilafo
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    This is a never ending discussion. And it's not the players fault, it's the game design

    ESO --> play the way you want
    simultaneous
    ESO --> we have dungeons that are designed around the tank/healer/dps motif..

    Personally my tolerance for people doing their roles really depends on what the content is..
    Normal dungeon/trial -- play the way you want, seriously.. go nuts and have fun.

    When it comes to vet difficultly the reality is that we do need people to perform and be good at what they do, the severity of that requirement increases or decreases depending on what the exactly dungeon or trial it is.

    I will NEVER judge or vote kick anyone on a normal dungeon.
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  • AcadianPaladin
    AcadianPaladin
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    Intermediate level main tank: Grab the boss, turn the boss away from group, hold the boss in a fairly fixed location so the dps' AoE's are effective, don't die.

    An intermediate tank should have all this down and be working on knowing more detail on dungeon mechanics and refining skill at pulling and holding priority foes (beyond the boss) into the tank so the bigger threats are held in a tight killing zone for the dps.

    Since area/multiple target taunts do not exist and abilities that lock foes in position are very short duration, it is not reasonable to expect a tank to pull in and hold all trash - as much as the tank would like to.

    Sorry that you encountered what appears to be a toxic player who was not focused on the tank role.
    PC NA (PvE)
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  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    All I ask is that you hold boss aggro, hold the boss more or less still, and don't die.

    Now, a good tank does all that, crowd controls adds, taunts priority adds, block bashes, interrupts, follows mechanics, buffs the group and debuffs the boss.
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  • AhPook_Is_Here
    AhPook_Is_Here
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    The core definition of a tank is the player who taunts mobs from most dangerous to least and can then take their hits and survive, ideally with their own resources.

    The expanded definition also includes group utility boost to dps, defense and correcting DPS judgement errors with soul-stones.

    If you want to tank start with the core definition and go from there.
    “Whatever.”
    -Unknown American
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  • raj72616a
    raj72616a
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    there is no aoe taunts, mobs do go everywhere if the group doesnt stack together. follow the tank to pull all those trash mobs into one spot for efficient slaughter. it can only be achieved by coordinated movement of the whole group, if you insist to stay behind and fight mobs in small group of five or so, no tank can do anything abt it, we don't have enough stamina to taunt all of them one by one.
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  • Narvuntien
    Narvuntien
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    Taunt.
    Hold the boss still.
    Don't die.
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  • kathandira
    kathandira
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    My own personal story about a DPS who queued up as a Tank.

    Last night I did Moon Hunter Keep for the first time on my Healer. I didn't know the mechanics going in, and neither did the 2 DPS I was with. The DPS were from my guild, so we were on the Mic discussing the encounters and sharing what we learned with each wipe. We went through 7 tanks....2 of them actually gave it a fair shot before leaving. 4 of them were added to the group, then after a minute or so of waiting for them to run to us, they up and left.

    The last tank we got was a Sorc Tank. We ran the Werewolf boss with him about 2 times before he joined us on the Mic. He was totally down with discussing what we learned so far as it was his first time as well. He admitted that he was a DPS who queued as a Tank, but is using Inner Fire to taunt, and is doing his best at filling the role. He was a really nice dude, and didn't feel the need to point the blame at anyone's abilities or lack there of. We gave it a few more tries before me and 1 other member had to split for a Guild Event. After a hour or so in there, everyone felt that was fair since we all gave it our best.

    We didn't succeed, but it was a nice run all the same. Everyone was chill, and understanding, and cool. I know Faux Tanks can be a pain in the butt, but sometimes you get one who isn't trying to hide the fact that they aren't a true tank, and are actually really nice people.
    Edited by kathandira on September 5, 2018 3:01PM
    PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc
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  • snegurd
    snegurd
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    Tanks really have 2 jobs imo. 1) reduce the damage your group takes and 2) increase the damage your group does.

    1) is achieved by holding aggro on the boss and important adds/trash, debuffing the boss's damage (maim, etc), interrupting, following mechanics, and healing/shielding the group.

    2) is achieved by grouping adds/trash together, holding the boss in place, debuffing the boss's resistance (crusher, Alkosh, etc), and buffing the group's DPS.


    There are a few other issues at hand here.

    First of all, the issue of "fake tanks" (DDs queuing as tanks to avoid a long queue) is certainly prevalent. I would say half the time I queue as a DD the tank has less than 25k health and is clearly a DD build. For some dungeons this isn't really an issue but once you get to the vet II dungeons and the DLC ones it can ruin runs. I think issues with the Dungeon Finder are well documented and are the root cause of this.

    Second, the aggression from that fake tank in your personal story is sad to see. We all play ESO as a means of having fun and interacting with a fantastic community. It's really disappointing when some players try and ruin that. Good on you for handling it maturely.
    PC | NA
    Guildmaster of Noob Nation

    Snegurd Limp-Spear: Nord DK tank
    Milamber of Midkemia: Breton Sorc dps

    Flawless Conqueror | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Assistant Alienist | Shadow Breaker | Blackrose Executioner
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  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    I always queue as a tank with my magsorc. All I do is slot inner fire and I'm good to go. With 14k health btw, and I also always do vet HM.
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  • John_Falstaff
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    @raj72616a , if part of the group is behind and fights mobs, it means one thing - that the tank have ran forward instead of doing the tank stuff.

    Stick with the group, smack the mobs with an AOE to get them on you for a moment, chain in ranged ones, taunt heavy hitters, pack all tight and CC for damage dealers to handle. "They insisted on staying behind" is just another way to say that you insisted on running ahead.
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  • DuskMarine
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    tanks have high health sword and board or sword and board with ice staff back bar.
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  • raj72616a
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    there is *no* aoe taunt in the game.
    caltrops, endless hail, nothing's gonna get all the mobs on me, i aggro them, they go for you squishy dps. there is no threat no hate mechanics in the game, it's just taunted or not taunted. and we only have single target taunt.
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  • DuskMarine
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    raj72616a wrote: »
    there is *no* aoe taunt in the game.
    caltrops, endless hail, nothing's gonna get all the mobs on me, i aggro them, they go for you squishy dps. there is no threat no hate mechanics in the game, it's just taunted or not taunted. and we only have single target taunt.

    well you as the tank should only be tanking the heavy hitting enemies like bosses or elites. if the dps and healer cant handle the rest you need to drop the scrubs and grab some new people
    Edited by DuskMarine on September 5, 2018 3:12PM
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  • John_Falstaff
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    @raj72616a, you have crowd control - talons, time stop, whatever works - and chains or silver leash to pack up the ranged ones. And if you're not running ahead of the group and past the mobs, you'll keep them on you. Move with the group's pace, that will be enough of a guarantee that nobody is "staying behind".
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  • DuskMarine
    DuskMarine
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    John_Falstaff wrote: »
    @raj72616a, you have crowd control - talons, time stop, whatever works - and chains or silver leash to pack up the ranged ones. And if you're not running ahead of the group and past the mobs, you'll keep them on you. Move with the group's pace, that will be enough of a guarantee that nobody is "staying behind".

    that only works in a premade group in a group of pugs tank either moves or their is no movement most times.
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  • John_Falstaff
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    @DuskMarine , you move, they move, they fell behind, stop and let them catch up, that's how it works. Keep in mind some of them might be doing quest, or just being thorough exploring.
    Edited by John_Falstaff on September 5, 2018 3:22PM
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  • Tryxus
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    Here's my pug story from a few days ago:

    - vFG1: "Tank" was using DW+Bow... in Heavy Armor. "No, that just makes you an even worse liar."
    - Vet Selene's Web: Tank seemed fine, he did use S&B + 2H and his HP was just below 30k but it didn't matter if he could taunt and hold aggro at least. Tank proceeded to turn into a Werewolf... "Where's the Taunt skill on WW? Oh wait..."
    - Normal Fang Lair: Couldn't find a group in guild, decided to pug this on normal cuz I def didn't want a fake tank on vet. "Tank" that I got grouped with... was a Snipe spamming NB... "Well, you got my aggro at least!"
    "In the Storyteller's name, I stand upon the bones of the world. I drink in the promise and power of nature's law, and breathe out my thanks."
    Tryxus - Magicka Warden - PC/EU/DC
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  • raj72616a
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    do you kill every trash mob in ICP? in FG? never skip a mob? even with a low dps group?
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  • keevil111
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    Some may view it differently and that's OK. I believe tank = leader. Taunt, root, buff, protect, yada yada yada. Most important is leadership.

    A good leader does everything in his/her power to HELP THE GROUP! A good leader also listens to the group for ideas and advice when offered. Being a jerk about everything is stupid.

    How many times have I patiently wiped while my low level group tries to figure out mechanics on some boss in some dungeon? I explain, we try again. I have left groups but I always say good try or hey maybe next time.

    I f*****g hate sh***y little twerps who treat people like garbage! Little morons who think that their video game guy is better than everyone else's video game guy! SERIOUSLY, DUDE? WHO CARES?! Little a**hole mother f****rs! There, I said it.

    Sorry, got a little off topic... What was the question?
    PS4 NA
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  • max_only
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    Another post about fake tanks.

    Seems to be an epidemic.

    Which is weird because I’ve seen at least 5 other people wearing Ebon Armory at any one time when I’m in Wayrest or Elden Root.

    They must only tank for friends then.

    I dunno maybe if the old dungeons could actually use a tank we’d see more of them instead of this pervasive attitude of “4 dds is better yuk yuk yuk”
    #FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
    #OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
    || CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
    ""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom
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  • NyassaV
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    If you can clear the dungeon then don't complain. It doesn't matter what role you queue as so long as you can clear. Basically as long as you get through it, shut up please.

    I tank as a DPS all the time. Sometimes I only have agro 80% of the time since I don't have a taunt slotted but I can put shade on my flex spot which applies the debuff that tanks are needed for so it's not like anyone is suffering hard here.

    https://clips.twitch.tv/SarcasticGeniusWerewolfBIRB

    But that guy sounds ruuuude
    Flawless Conqueror ~ Alliance Warlord
    She/Her ~ PC/NA
    ESOFam Community Discord: https://discord.gg/gMntMb8
    I record things for fun and for info
    https://youtube.com/channel/UC0WuLVnsW177WKkKcvNuuYA
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