whelp, sick of Balorgh already

Neoauspex

ak_pvp wrote: »

Front bar maelstrom dw if it still works. Flurry then nuke.

Shhhhhhhhhhhh

Rianai

Balorgh with 500 ult would only add like 15% dmg to a build which stacks high spell dmg, so a 100k SA tooltip becomes 115k. Zaan going off at the same time as SA would add much more dmg and could be done much more frequently.

Lexxypwns

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

Wing

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

or use a different source of berserk and rock both, win win.

Thunderknuckles

Hutch679 wrote: »

Balorg with clever alchemist and bone pirate on a medium stam warden is insanity...... permafrost, clever alchemist proc, bird of prey, deadly cloak, sub assault, steel tornado is just.... unreal... I'm literally wiping entire groups with it in Bgs. 2 quad kills with one ultimate..... it basically will give you 6,000 weapon power with 5,000 spell power for the duration of your permafrost. So not only are you hitting everyone with undodgable hard hitting aoe damage, you also have major protection lol

Man, yer makin' me slobber. ha ha I wanna try this set up now.

Kadoin

I wish I had the set so I can use it on my defensive builds...

Kadoin

Wing wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

or use a different source of berserk and rock both, win win.

Guess what? There is a reliable source of minor berserk. Camo hunter bugged right now and if you get crit healed in stealth it will apply minor berserk for 8 sec (and reset it every time you get crit healed). Looks like we have a problem...

Stratforge

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

Is this true? I was thinking about this on and off at work today and I wonder if my previous post being mad about Balorgh may have been misguided. I have always been somewhat unclear on exactly how Max Stam interacts with Wep Damage. Like, I assume there is just a formula but I don't know what it is aside from 1.1k stam roughly equals 100 WD in terms of actual damage output (and I'm not sure if I'm even remembering that properly). On a high damage build, 8% overall damage buff seems like it could surpass a 1k wep/spell damage buff but I'm not sure at what point that would happen. If slimecraw is straight-up better, what makes balorgh attractive?

IZZEFlameLash

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

Are we talking about the uptimes and stuff included when we say that?

Derra

Waffennacht wrote: »

You guys do realize a ZoS solution will be to lower total ult possible right?

So this is now a Nerf sorc thread lol

To be honest - it´s time to revamp overload and then they might aswell reduce max ult to the currently highest cost.

Biro123

Hmm.. useful for hybrids, I guess.

clever alch, shackle, argonian pot-cooldown

Feanor

Hutch679 wrote: »

Balorg with clever alchemist and bone pirate on a medium stam warden is insanity...... permafrost, clever alchemist proc, bird of prey, deadly cloak, sub assault, steel tornado is just.... unreal... I'm literally wiping entire groups with it in Bgs. 2 quad kills with one ultimate..... it basically will give you 6,000 weapon power with 5,000 spell power for the duration of your permafrost. So not only are you hitting everyone with undodgable hard hitting aoe damage, you also have major protection lol

That's what yesterday's Sotha Sil EP emp was playing, or some twist of it. It's really absurd.

Hutch679

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Just so we’re clear, Slimecraw gives more damage than Balorgh...

No it doesn't. Stamina warden already gets access to the 8% buff. And for everyone else, 8% damage buff is not greater than 1,129 spell and weapon damage

Pijng

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

leepalmer95

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Pijng

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

Wing

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

Pijng

Wing wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

By dpm I meant not spamming people with skills, but quantity of your burst combos.

Basically you'll have enough burst to kill people even without that balorgh proc.
I just cant see the point. So people are not complaining about my incap + bow, but suddenly: "hey that guy can run around getting 500 ult and do the same stuff like he could... do without it"

Even in raid groups - you are already pushing with A LOT of aoes ults so that balorgh is a drop in a sea.
Its only really game changing if you put it on yr bomblade - then even 300 SD from tether is pretty noticeable.

But I got you. Still cant understand the reasons, but got you.

For me its better to burst as soon as I can or when I see a decent window for it, than kiting for minutes, and then bursting people in the same way.

Waffennacht

Pijng wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

By dpm I meant not spamming people with skills, but quantity of your burst combos.

Basically you'll have enough burst to kill people even without that balorgh proc.
I just cant see the point. So people are not complaining about my incap + bow, but suddenly: "hey that guy can run around getting 500 ult and do the same stuff like he could... do without it"

Even in raid groups - you are already pushing with A LOT of aoes ults so that balorgh is a drop in a sea.
Its only really game changing if you put it on yr bomblade - then even 300 SD from tether is pretty noticeable.

But I got you. Still cant understand the reasons, but got you.

For me its better to burst as soon as I can or when I see a decent window for it, than kiting for minutes, and then bursting people in the same way.

You're an NB; you're automatically immune to Nerf threads and balancing patches.

That's why you don't see the complaints; they exist, you just surpress/dodge them all

With a little help from ZoS

SpiderCultist

Hutch679 wrote: »

Balorg with clever alchemist and bone pirate on a medium stam warden is insanity...... permafrost, clever alchemist proc, bird of prey, deadly cloak, sub assault, steel tornado is just.... unreal... I'm literally wiping entire groups with it in Bgs. 2 quad kills with one ultimate..... it basically will give you 6,000 weapon power with 5,000 spell power for the duration of your permafrost. So not only are you hitting everyone with undodgable hard hitting aoe damage, you also have major protection lol

Maybe it is my playstyle but I've just tested this and I have to say it is not what I expected. Back to BP/7th/BS after 3 BG matches... actually I don't see this set anything "OP" outside bombing.

Pijng

Waffennacht wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

By dpm I meant not spamming people with skills, but quantity of your burst combos.

Basically you'll have enough burst to kill people even without that balorgh proc.
I just cant see the point. So people are not complaining about my incap + bow, but suddenly: "hey that guy can run around getting 500 ult and do the same stuff like he could... do without it"

Even in raid groups - you are already pushing with A LOT of aoes ults so that balorgh is a drop in a sea.
Its only really game changing if you put it on yr bomblade - then even 300 SD from tether is pretty noticeable.

But I got you. Still cant understand the reasons, but got you.

For me its better to burst as soon as I can or when I see a decent window for it, than kiting for minutes, and then bursting people in the same way.

You're an NB; you're automatically immune to Nerf threads and balancing patches.

That's why you don't see the complaints; they exist, you just surpress/dodge them all

With a little help from ZoS

Thx zos
(Still looking for some nb nerfs)

SugaComa

So balrogh vicious death and a bomber build it is then ... Wish I was good enough to build a bomber

leepalmer95

Pijng wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

By dpm I meant not spamming people with skills, but quantity of your burst combos.

Basically you'll have enough burst to kill people even without that balorgh proc.
I just cant see the point. So people are not complaining about my incap + bow, but suddenly: "hey that guy can run around getting 500 ult and do the same stuff like he could... do without it"

Even in raid groups - you are already pushing with A LOT of aoes ults so that balorgh is a drop in a sea.
Its only really game changing if you put it on yr bomblade - then even 300 SD from tether is pretty noticeable.

But I got you. Still cant understand the reasons, but got you.

For me its better to burst as soon as I can or when I see a decent window for it, than kiting for minutes, and then bursting people in the same way.

You're an NB; you're automatically immune to Nerf threads and balancing patches.

That's why you don't see the complaints; they exist, you just surpress/dodge them all

With a little help from ZoS

Thx zos
(Still looking for some nb nerfs)

Put steel tornado on, nb's ez.

Pijng

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

It's not hard.

3 ult a second is base for everyone for either light attacking or taking dmg.
Everyone also has some passive ult gen in one of there 3 skill lines for using that type of skill.

You get 20 ult per kill in pvp
Nbs get 20 ult a pot.

Wardens flat out just get major heroism which is 3 ult every 1.5s

Moglijuana wrote: »

Pijng wrote: »

How the hell you guys collecting that 500 ulty? You dont use ults until you have 500 or what?

I was running around with lich + bloodspawn last night and high enough max to stack shields on my MDK...getting to 500 ult was quicker than expected just kiting around lol.

Yup, I know. I just didn't meant how but more like... how and why, lol?
Maybe its just me with my incap so i spend ult whenever my merciles is ready.
The only times I can go up to 500 if playing with raid when we're charging all ulties for strong push.

UPD: But, again – if people are not spending their ults with balorgh until they got 500 – then it's not that OP, right?
Cause more time you spend to get that juicy ultimate pool = less damage you have in terms of DPM. So you put yourself at disadvantage – honestly you're playing without monster set all that time and without ult.

pvp is not about dpm, its about burst, you cannot dpm people to death in pvp, and if your focusing on stacking ultimate and only that its very easy to focus on kiting and healing alone as you don't have to focus on pressure or trying to kill.

then when your finally ready to fight you do so with overwhelming statistical advantage over your opponent as well as the knowledge and benefit of knowing exactly when your going to fight.

this is the problem

people are not fighting for a long period of time, and have no interest in fighting, they just kite, heal, and los, its boring.

THEN

they turn on you without warning and destroy you within seconds with overwhelming advantage.

then they repeat, going back to showing no interest in fighting and just kiting, healing, and los for the next couple minutes. its not fun to play against and with the pvp meta the advantage is clearly to the one dancing around.

By dpm I meant not spamming people with skills, but quantity of your burst combos.

Basically you'll have enough burst to kill people even without that balorgh proc.
I just cant see the point. So people are not complaining about my incap + bow, but suddenly: "hey that guy can run around getting 500 ult and do the same stuff like he could... do without it"

Even in raid groups - you are already pushing with A LOT of aoes ults so that balorgh is a drop in a sea.
Its only really game changing if you put it on yr bomblade - then even 300 SD from tether is pretty noticeable.

But I got you. Still cant understand the reasons, but got you.

For me its better to burst as soon as I can or when I see a decent window for it, than kiting for minutes, and then bursting people in the same way.

You're an NB; you're automatically immune to Nerf threads and balancing patches.

That's why you don't see the complaints; they exist, you just surpress/dodge them all

With a little help from ZoS

Thx zos
(Still looking for some nb nerfs)

Put steel tornado on, nb's ez.

Nerf steel tornado op skill pls

Kartalin

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Put steel tornado on, nb's ez.

Balorgh is much stronger in non-cp even if you just build up to your ulti cost (200 or 250) since percent gains (minor berserk) have less of an impact when base damage is lower. NBs (bombblades) of course can use both.

Rianai

Minor Berserk is additive with the dmg boni from CP, which makes it weaker in comparison to noCP, while non proc burst tends to be higher with CP, so building for raw stats is better there.
(Dmg being lower with CP is a misconception. It is pretty much the same if not higher than noCP. But survivablity is much better with CP, that's why at least halfway decent players feel so tanky there).