Master DW Axe Bleed + Master Bow + 2 DoTs + Pressure = Sorc still happily bunnyhops in shields.

Nyladreas
Nyladreas
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Are you MF-ing serious ZOS?

This is on build with over 4.5k weapon damage too mind you.

This was in NO CP battlegrounds too. Unfortunately i do NOT have video, I cannot record on my current computer.
Edited by Nyladreas on June 23, 2018 3:33AM
S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
"Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
"The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
"One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
"Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

"Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • JobooAGS
    JobooAGS
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    Video?
  • Nyladreas
    Nyladreas
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    JobooAGS wrote: »
    Video?

    I can't record sadly, otherwise I happily would.
    S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
    "Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
    "The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
    "One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
    "Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

    "Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • WaltherCarraway
    WaltherCarraway
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    With 60k magicka I can address everything else as L2P issue.

    Yes!

    Edit:

    imho with all these legendary weapons OP you should do some more practices in order to utilize them better. I mean they are still pretty amazing this patch.
    Edited by WaltherCarraway on June 23, 2018 8:31PM
    any class, main DK. EP Hit Squad. I have Striped Senche Tiger mount. All veteran content checked
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  • idk
    idk
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sounds like the wrong kind of pressure. That is being serious. Pressure need to require them to burn their mag, stam or both.

    It reminds me of pvp in a different game where I mostly went in as a healer. DDs would be silly and try to kill me. Hit their rotations hard yet always, or at least mostly, for got the most important thing. They did not interrupt my big heals or any heal at that.

    Cut them at the knees and they fall.
    Really, idk
  • Asmael
    Asmael
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    ✭✭
    Vapirko wrote: »
    [...] Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. [...]

    Erhm. Bleeds are arguably performing at their worst against magicka sorc, since they get no benefit whatsoever compared to other DoTs while shields are up, and get to ignore rather low physical penetration once you break those.

    It's not really realistic to kill proper mag sorcs running a sustain build those days 1 on 1, altho I won't complain about it since 1 on 1 encounters are probably one of the least balanced things around here.

    I've been on both sides of the fence: sitting there only refreshing shields as magsorc and tanking builds similar to OP's, as well as standing on the same spot, refreshing only defensive buffs, Vigor and blocking a few attacks with Troll King on top with a mag sorc hammering on me (could even sit in their Meteor for the whole duration). It's just a number game - a pretty broken one as well.

    I kinda miss the old Surge, since it rewarded being extremely aggressive and taking risks, current mag sorc is just too boring and 2 dimensional to play.
    PC EU - Zahraji of the Void, aka "Kitty"
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  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    ✭✭✭
    Asmael wrote: »
    Vapirko wrote: »
    [...] Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. [...]

    Erhm. Bleeds are arguably performing at their worst against magicka sorc, since they get no benefit whatsoever compared to other DoTs while shields are up, and get to ignore rather low physical penetration once you break those.

    It's not really realistic to kill proper mag sorcs running a sustain build those days 1 on 1, altho I won't complain about it since 1 on 1 encounters are probably one of the least balanced things around here.

    I've been on both sides of the fence: sitting there only refreshing shields as magsorc and tanking builds similar to OP's, as well as standing on the same spot, refreshing only defensive buffs, Vigor and blocking a few attacks with Troll King on top with a mag sorc hammering on me (could even sit in their Meteor for the whole duration). It's just a number game - a pretty broken one as well.

    I kinda miss the old Surge, since it rewarded being extremely aggressive and taking risks, current mag sorc is just too boring and 2 dimensional to play.

    Yes, If you’re trying to wear down shields with bleeds well, lol. But if you set up bleed and go for the burst then they really hurt after being stunned and stack with DBoS tick. I usually back bar dw on my Stam Warden, go with rending slashes, bar swap into the sub assault, dizzy swing, DBoS which gets rid of their shields and then watch their health dribble away, and then it’s just keep up pressure. Although I’ve been hit with 9k bleeds from master dw in heavy armor not counting another 11k from axe and heavy weapons
    bleed, which is easily the strength of a couple of shields in BGs so just from the bleed alone you can really put pressure on a mag sorc.
  • Kadoin
    Kadoin
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    I'd still bunny hop with that on me on any class...No CP "god" builds actually seem to work better than CP ones IMO. Can't be two shot, other person has to manage resources or else, etc. makes life quite easy in no-CP for me!
  • Gprime31
    Gprime31
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    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Are you MF-ing serious ZOS?

    This is on build with over 4.5k weapon damage too mind you.

    This was in NO CP battlegrounds too. Unfortunately i do NOT have video, I cannot record on my current computer.

    The really good sorcs take forever to kill....magdks too.... need constant pressure....just keep practicing
  • Nyladreas
    Nyladreas
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    Vapirko wrote: »
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Vapirko wrote: »
    Lol if you can’t pressure a sorc with all that fancy gear then it’s definitely a L2P issue. Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. Also I hate when people list their weapon damage as some kind of ultimate answer to any other question you could ask about their build or skill level. 4.5k wpn damage = I should be able to beat anyone. I used to complain about mag sorcs constantly, I leveled one some time before Summerset and now I don’t feel the need to complain about them as much even though I’d say I’m only on it about 30% of the time and on stamina the rest. Playing one just helps you separate the perception of “god mode” from skill and you know when someone has been carried by mag sorc skills a little or when they’re just a better player than you. So, I invite you to level a mag sorc and play one for a while, leveling goes pretty fast these days, BiS mag sorc gear is easy to get.

    I mean honestly how you can be sure the person just wasn’t a lot better than you? Gear and stats doesn’t mean a thing. You complain that this person was carried by their class and then say that you should have been able to beat them because of have certain gear. Isn’t that pretty ironic?

    So your definition of skill is bunny hopping and spamming shields? That's a lot of damn skill man. I wish I could do that. That's literally my only complaint as I didn't lose the fight. It's just very, if not extremely annoying to see someone just bunny hop for an entire minute and a half hoping to be saved by their buddies. He can still dish out a ton of damage if not focused and that's the problem. Any other class in the game can do just 1 of those things at the same time, not both. EDIT: And even if they can, they can only do it for a short time, not for an ENTIRE MINUTE AND A HALF.

    MagSorc is my first main and I think you make absolutely no sense. You should run a different class too perhaps? I can switch over to my Sorc and easily kill anything that doesn't wear Shieldbreaker. Stop defending a broken class just because it suits you please.

    And yes it's my fault for not wearing Sloads. He did die eventually but It took wayyyyy too long for someone who can still eat low HP targets inbetween shield stacks.

    So you won the fight and you’re complaining because they used their defensive tactic to hold you off? I play mag sorc, and I’ve tried every stamina class over the years as well as magblade and magplar. And currently I don’t see mag sorcs as more of an issue than most other classes. I fought a whole team of mag sorcs in BGs yesterday in deathmatch and they won by only a small margin due to the fact that two of our players only got like 2 or 3 kills each. No one was making a peep about mag sorcs being OP prior to Summerset. Shields haven’t changed one bit, now suddenly shields are god mode again? I don’t buy it, I think we just have an influx of new players.

    Honestly from the sound of your post it seems like you were just up against a mediocre player who had built for max shields and was spamming to prolong the inevitable. That’s jsut the nature of shields, you can’t change it without restructuring how mag sorcs and shields work from the ground up and that’s unlikely to happen.

    Still doesn't make that design right. I find it stupid, lazy, braindead, unfair, "imbalanced", effortless, unskilled, ridiculous <insert a ton of other negative adjectives> yada yada...

    Also stop turning the entire topic against me and only me like I'm some sort of egomaniac. My problem isn't that I can't easily eat these builds like tiny AP snacks, but that I don't find the whole idea fair at all towards classes like DK/Templar/Warden. Hell even Stamblades have a harder time escaping most of the time. Especially vs Sorcs and their BS. I admit i chose the title and OP wording poorly.

    A High Burst, DPS Class SHOULD NOT EVER BE ABLE TO WITHSTAND INSANE PRESSURE FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME OR MULTIPLE PEOPLE (if we talk new players) WHILE BEING ABLE TO DEAL FULL DAMAGE FROM THE BACK LINE. PERIOD. It's just as bad as proc sets and zergs. There is a limited counter play but it severely hurts PVP. And new players, completely unfamiliar with this endgame aspect of the game will just get tired after a couple games and leave.

    Look how many threads there are about sorcs and listen to players who played since 2014... Everyone will tell you: "yeah sorc ain't what it used to be, but it's still the top class".

    Any content in the game is EZ PZ with a sorc compared to ANY class and that's another thing entirely, that i don't want to get into (pve).
    Edited by Nyladreas on June 23, 2018 11:35AM
    S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
    "Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
    "The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
    "One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
    "Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

    "Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • Nyladreas
    Nyladreas
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    Gprime31 wrote: »
    A good tank can withstand 10+ people hitting it
    Hence “tank”

    Yes but he can't deal full damage back from the backline while being safe and pampered over there. Then run into the crowd and bunnyhop unharmed all the same time. A tank gets maybe 1 chance with an ult, not an entire set of skills and burst combos.
    Edited by Nyladreas on June 23, 2018 11:31AM
    S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
    "Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
    "The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
    "One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
    "Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

    "Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • Gprime31
    Gprime31
    ✭✭✭✭
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Gprime31 wrote: »
    A good tank can withstand 10+ people hitting it
    Hence “tank”

    Yes but he can't deal full damage back, from the backline while being safe and pampered over there.

    Depends how you build the tank
  • Aisle9
    Aisle9
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Vapirko wrote: »
    Lol if you can’t pressure a sorc with all that fancy gear then it’s definitely a L2P issue. Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. Also I hate when people list their weapon damage as some kind of ultimate answer to any other question you could ask about their build or skill level. 4.5k wpn damage = I should be able to beat anyone. I used to complain about mag sorcs constantly, I leveled one some time before Summerset and now I don’t feel the need to complain about them as much even though I’d say I’m only on it about 30% of the time and on stamina the rest. Playing one just helps you separate the perception of “god mode” from skill and you know when someone has been carried by mag sorc skills a little or when they’re just a better player than you. So, I invite you to level a mag sorc and play one for a while, leveling goes pretty fast these days, BiS mag sorc gear is easy to get.

    I mean honestly how you can be sure the person just wasn’t a lot better than you? Gear and stats doesn’t mean a thing. You complain that this person was carried by their class and then say that you should have been able to beat them because of have certain gear. Isn’t that pretty ironic?

    So your definition of skill is bunny hopping and spamming shields? That's a lot of damn skill man. I wish I could do that. That's literally my only complaint as I didn't lose the fight. It's just very, if not extremely annoying to see someone just bunny hop for an entire minute and a half hoping to be saved by their buddies. He can still dish out a ton of damage if not focused and that's the problem. Any other class in the game can do just 1 of those things at the same time, not both. EDIT: And even if they can, they can only do it for a short time, not for an ENTIRE MINUTE AND A HALF.

    MagSorc is my first main and I think you make absolutely no sense. You should run a different class too perhaps? I can switch over to my Sorc and easily kill anything that doesn't wear Shieldbreaker. Stop defending a broken class just because it suits you please.

    And yes it's my fault for not wearing Sloads. He did die eventually but It took wayyyyy too long for someone who can still eat low HP targets inbetween shield stacks.

    DKs can do both...

    Magblades can do both...

    Stamwardens can do both...

    So...

    Yeah...

    GGWP

    I wish I still had that video with 11 people pounding on me for an entire minute and half (on a magblade) before giving up...

    Also, incidentally, I can kill a magsorc with careful application of CC and burst damage, without having to use Sload, Shieldbreaker, etc, so...

    Yeah..

    GGWP

    Edited by Aisle9 on June 23, 2018 11:35AM
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  • Nyladreas
    Nyladreas
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Aisle9 wrote: »
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Vapirko wrote: »
    Lol if you can’t pressure a sorc with all that fancy gear then it’s definitely a L2P issue. Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. Also I hate when people list their weapon damage as some kind of ultimate answer to any other question you could ask about their build or skill level. 4.5k wpn damage = I should be able to beat anyone. I used to complain about mag sorcs constantly, I leveled one some time before Summerset and now I don’t feel the need to complain about them as much even though I’d say I’m only on it about 30% of the time and on stamina the rest. Playing one just helps you separate the perception of “god mode” from skill and you know when someone has been carried by mag sorc skills a little or when they’re just a better player than you. So, I invite you to level a mag sorc and play one for a while, leveling goes pretty fast these days, BiS mag sorc gear is easy to get.

    I mean honestly how you can be sure the person just wasn’t a lot better than you? Gear and stats doesn’t mean a thing. You complain that this person was carried by their class and then say that you should have been able to beat them because of have certain gear. Isn’t that pretty ironic?

    So your definition of skill is bunny hopping and spamming shields? That's a lot of damn skill man. I wish I could do that. That's literally my only complaint as I didn't lose the fight. It's just very, if not extremely annoying to see someone just bunny hop for an entire minute and a half hoping to be saved by their buddies. He can still dish out a ton of damage if not focused and that's the problem. Any other class in the game can do just 1 of those things at the same time, not both. EDIT: And even if they can, they can only do it for a short time, not for an ENTIRE MINUTE AND A HALF.

    MagSorc is my first main and I think you make absolutely no sense. You should run a different class too perhaps? I can switch over to my Sorc and easily kill anything that doesn't wear Shieldbreaker. Stop defending a broken class just because it suits you please.

    And yes it's my fault for not wearing Sloads. He did die eventually but It took wayyyyy too long for someone who can still eat low HP targets inbetween shield stacks.

    DKs can do both...

    Magblades can do both...

    Stamwardens can do both...

    So...

    Yeah...

    GGWP

    In CP perhaps. This is a NOCP discussion. They cannot. Unless the oponent is braindead.
    S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
    "Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
    "The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
    "One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
    "Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

    "Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • Aisle9
    Aisle9
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Aisle9 wrote: »
    Nyladreas wrote: »
    Vapirko wrote: »
    Lol if you can’t pressure a sorc with all that fancy gear then it’s definitely a L2P issue. Bleeds are super deadly to a sorc. Also I hate when people list their weapon damage as some kind of ultimate answer to any other question you could ask about their build or skill level. 4.5k wpn damage = I should be able to beat anyone. I used to complain about mag sorcs constantly, I leveled one some time before Summerset and now I don’t feel the need to complain about them as much even though I’d say I’m only on it about 30% of the time and on stamina the rest. Playing one just helps you separate the perception of “god mode” from skill and you know when someone has been carried by mag sorc skills a little or when they’re just a better player than you. So, I invite you to level a mag sorc and play one for a while, leveling goes pretty fast these days, BiS mag sorc gear is easy to get.

    I mean honestly how you can be sure the person just wasn’t a lot better than you? Gear and stats doesn’t mean a thing. You complain that this person was carried by their class and then say that you should have been able to beat them because of have certain gear. Isn’t that pretty ironic?

    So your definition of skill is bunny hopping and spamming shields? That's a lot of damn skill man. I wish I could do that. That's literally my only complaint as I didn't lose the fight. It's just very, if not extremely annoying to see someone just bunny hop for an entire minute and a half hoping to be saved by their buddies. He can still dish out a ton of damage if not focused and that's the problem. Any other class in the game can do just 1 of those things at the same time, not both. EDIT: And even if they can, they can only do it for a short time, not for an ENTIRE MINUTE AND A HALF.

    MagSorc is my first main and I think you make absolutely no sense. You should run a different class too perhaps? I can switch over to my Sorc and easily kill anything that doesn't wear Shieldbreaker. Stop defending a broken class just because it suits you please.

    And yes it's my fault for not wearing Sloads. He did die eventually but It took wayyyyy too long for someone who can still eat low HP targets inbetween shield stacks.

    DKs can do both...

    Magblades can do both...

    Stamwardens can do both...

    So...

    Yeah...

    GGWP

    In CP perhaps. This is a NOCP discussion. They cannot. Unless the oponent is braindead.

    I only play BGs or Sotha, I don't go in CP campaigns, ever unless I'm farming telvar.

    If I give you an opinion is based on my experienced, therefore...

    Yeah..

    GGWP.

    Edited by Aisle9 on June 23, 2018 11:40AM
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  • Morgul667
    Morgul667
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    ✭✭
    When it comes to magsorc, i usually find it is much easier to just let the haters hate

    For some reason they get all the attention
  • Chilly-McFreeze
    Chilly-McFreeze
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    Nyladreas wrote: »

    A High Burst, DPS Class SHOULD NOT EVER BE ABLE TO WITHSTAND INSANE PRESSURE FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME OR MULTIPLE PEOPLE (if we talk new players) WHILE BEING ABLE TO DEAL FULL DAMAGE FROM THE BACK LINE. PERIOD.
    [/b]

    You know that we are in an era that doesn't has "DPS classes", tank classes or heal classes anymore, right?

    And can you describe your "insane pressure" a bit more, please? I take you have PI and Rending on them, probably Twin Blade and Blunt bleed as well. Which else DoTs did you use on him? Which spam? Did he LoS a lot? Did you pressure his stamina?

    Which class are you on btw? I play a dot stam sorc with rending, carve, 2 passives bleeds, hurricane, (double) dot poison, skoria and rapids, I've never had issues with shields (especially in no cp), even without arena weapons. But I can see how 2 dots and a spam alone wouldn't take down shields easily.
  • Chilly-McFreeze
    Chilly-McFreeze
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    When it comes to magsorc, i usually find it is much easier to just let the haters hate

    For some reason they get all the attention

    Yep, but when they gut sorcerers, chances might be good that stam sorcs get a collateral hit as well.
  • Morgul667
    Morgul667
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    ✭✭
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    When it comes to magsorc, i usually find it is much easier to just let the haters hate

    For some reason they get all the attention

    Yep, but when they gut sorcerers, chances might be good that stam sorcs get a collateral hit as well.

    Sadly true

    Hope stamsorc do not get hit
  • Nyladreas
    Nyladreas
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    When it comes to magsorc, i usually find it is much easier to just let the haters hate

    For some reason they get all the attention

    Yep, but when they gut sorcerers, chances might be good that stam sorcs get a collateral hit as well.

    Sadly true

    Hope stamsorc do not get hit

    I'm with you guys on that. Stam sorcs do not need any of that.
    S'Dahrra of Pellitine [PC] <-> [NA] Blood for the Pact
    "Where is it written that all our dreams must be small..."
    "The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past..."
    "One who dreams of becoming a king, should first become a man..."
    "Happiness is a choice, but because of greed, many are too blind to choose..."

    "Always be as fast as the wind, as quiet as the forest, as daring as fire, and as immovable as the mountain..."
  • TequilaFire
    TequilaFire
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭
    Bunny hopping should cost stamina.
    My Imgakin beta monkey got lost in a load screen.
    Lupis Mortis EP Magplar
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  • Aisle9
    Aisle9
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bunny hopping should cost stamina.

    Agreed, but should also increase Acrobatics
    Artemis Absinthe - DC magicka nightblade (PC - EU)
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    Hold-Many-Bags - Mule Promoted to main tank
    Olaf Proudstache - Mule - No longer with us Now a Stamwarden healer
    Aglieglie Brazorf - AD magicka sorcerer (PC - EU)
    Rodolfo Lavandino - DC stamina, greatsword wielding, Jesus beam spamming, Redguard hybrid templar just a stamplar again (PC - EU)

    LUI user - I can see you when you fap loot.

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