Add Group Arenas and Normal Trials to Group Finder

Phage
Phage
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With the announcement of a new Arena for Murkmire, I figured it was a good time to bring this up again.

ZOS, please add Group Arenas and Normal Trials to Group Finder.

This is content that is on par, difficulty-wise, with the hardest DLC dungeons in Group Finder. In some cases, it can even be easier than DLCs. Difficulty isn't a good reason to not have them included. Most people who do this content are competent enough to at least clear it on normal mode with manually-created PUGs. All you'd be doing is creating a framework for that to happen faster and easier, so that more people could participate in the content.

It wouldn't be that hard to include them in Group Finder. Arenas fill out and perform in the same way as Dungeons. Trials would fill out more roles, but the performance is still the same as Dungeons.

Honestly, adding things like this to Group Finder would increase quality of life for many players, and would also give them access to groups for content they might not do otherwise. I've heard from many players that they would do Trials if they only had easy access to group up for them whenever they wanted.

This is good for Guilds too: no longer would they have to manually look for players to fill those missing slots - they could queue right in with however many Guildmates they have, and the Group Finder would fill out their roster for them.

Before people come with the overused "join a Guild" retort, consider the following:

Not everyone has access to Guilds for this, or is willing to be in Guilds. A large portion of the playerbase plays solo, and their only real access to group content comes from participating in Group Finder. This is true even of some players who are in Guilds, but choose to still play solo. Also consider that even the best Trials Guilds don't run 24/7.

Adding Arenas and Trials to Group Finder would make it so that anyone could find a group for them, at any time. Adding this content, on-demand, would increase accessibility to endgame for many people.

Really, the positives far outweigh any negatives. I can't think of any good reason not do to this.

Please, ZOS, consider adding this content to Group Finder.
Edited by Phage on June 13, 2018 8:36PM
PC-NA Goat

Add Group Arenas and Normal Trials to Group Finder 114 votes

Yes!
77%
SaladinwayfarerxWatchYourSixxDarcyMardinOsteosTonnopesceYakidafiOkiirecseHortator Indoril Nerevarramasurinenpreub18_ESOsrfrogg23pinkempyrealGTech_1AhPook_Is_HereTommy83tsuaa53GuppetKeahizuEdziu 88 votes
No (Tell us why in a comment below)
18%
Mojmirlelink88TheDarkShadowDextailVaohZagnut123Zagnut123blkjagLadislaojoaaocaamposrG_KubBigBadVolkFakeFoxBbsample197CiliPadiLyss1991phontom78kissMittimzTrokSamarcand32arishok33 21 votes
Other (Specify below)
4%
zariaXuhoraLiquidPonyAesliefThorstienn 5 votes
  • Diminish
    Diminish
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    This will never happen. For one, what criteria would they use for roles? How do they know if a group should have 1 tank, 2 tanks, same for healers/etc. I'm all for making grouping more accessible to everyone, but the group finder is not the way. They need some sort of in-game LFG tool.
  • TelvanniWizard
    TelvanniWizard
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    Yes!
    Yes please! So much needed feature!
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  • MythrialDrow
    MythrialDrow
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    Yes!
    Needed I have been playing since pc beta I am a solo wolf,I love to play in the groups.... but.... even is it’s crap I’d love to have the chance as I’m quite shy when it’s voice/chat/text ...... just stick me in. They can kick me it will be a learning curve
  • gnarlyvandal
    gnarlyvandal
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    Yes!
    Diminish wrote: »
    This will never happen. For one, what criteria would they use for roles? How do they know if a group should have 1 tank, 2 tanks, same for healers/etc. I'm all for making grouping more accessible to everyone, but the group finder is not the way. They need some sort of in-game LFG tool.

    Good point! They could add an option to choose how many tanks and healers one would prefer? Just a 1-2 toggle
  • Pimpkachu
    Pimpkachu
    Soul Shriven
    No (Tell us why in a comment below)
    If you are looking for normal trials groups, you can stand with Large Damage on the wall in Belkarth for a little bit and listen to the zone chat of Craglorn. Granted this is not 24/7, but actually you will be suprised to see people advertising that they are looking for x role for x nTrial quite often. If you don’t see anyone advertising there in zone chat, then you can start your own group! When you make your own group you can choose how many tanks, healers, and dps that you want to take. I personally have farmed all of my trials gear in pug groups. Most of which I started myself as no one was going to the trials I needed.

    For vDSA, it is much rarer to see someone asking for people to fill roles. But the same applies above where you can start your own group!

    As to a Group Finder, I think it is a great idea to have something more convenient and more efficient. I’m all for getting more people into end game group content, I even run a new trials guild on PC-NA which is aimed at people who haven’t touched a trial yet (Shout out to my Red Sabres :P). Zone chat is what we have for now and is efficient enough so that you can get to where you want to be.
  • redspecter23
    redspecter23
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    Yes!
    Meh, go ahead and add them I suppose. I can see the reasoning for not adding them. There would be no "leader". Sure, not every normal trial run needs someone to lead, but it can be confusing if nobody takes any leadership role at all. It can lead to frustration as people might run around doing different things. Roles can vary a bit. Some trials are better with 2 tanks (or at least an off tank), some may only need one. Who decides how many tanks are automatically allocated to the trial? If it uses a system similar to what we have for dungeons, ZOS decides. You also have the potential for "fake tanks" just completely ruining a run. Yes, vets can blast through normal trials with ease, probably with no tank at all. I can guarantee that normal MOL with an inexperienced pug and 2 fake tanks will be a nightmare.

    At any rate, it will probably do more good than bad so it wouldn't bother me if they add this. I personally would never use it and to those that do use it and complain about the quality of the pug group for any reason, I'd just go back to telling them to find friends/guild/etc. Don't ever have any expectations from group finder groups. It only leads to disappointment when you expect more than the system is intended to provide.
    Edited by redspecter23 on June 13, 2018 9:58PM
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  • Vaoh
    Vaoh
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    No (Tell us why in a comment below)
    Ideally it would be awesome if this could work. However, I don’t believe it would.

    Have you heard how many horror stories there are in group dungeons? Especially in terms of DPS? The point is, normal trials are no joke if people aren’t performing their role. Group dungeons are *significantly* more lenient. There would be a massive amount of toxicity via people doing terrible jobs at their roles and Vote to Kick being spammed.

    Case in point, Normal Trials would rarely ever complete.

    If you want to run a normal trial you can join a guild that runs them a lot (many guilds) or ask in Craglorn to join a run. It has always worked well to do this and immediately filters out the vast majority of useless/terrible/PvP Build players, since you would need to put more effort into getting in a group than simply pressing the Group Finder button. Also when you are in Group Finder you are immediately put in Group - getting invited means people will see you and know if you are being a troll early on (aka the DPS queued as tank), also resulting in a kick from said guild that hurts your opportunities and reputation. In other words, there is far more accountability for one’s role than in a Group Finder pug which is a big deal in a trial with 12ppl.


    Arenas are different. By this you mean DSA. This arena is significantly longer than any Group Dungeon. The amount of time it would take to complete with typical noobie players.... that sounds like an utter nightmare. No way lol.
    However, just as you can run Normal Trials by joining guilds, you can run Normal DSA easily by joining guilds as well. The process of joining a guild filters out nearly all trolls, total noobies, and generally players that would need a full carry or else cause the run to not complete.

    These are the reasons why they are currently not in the Group Finder. I’d prefer it to stay this way tbh. Ofc it’d be all nice and dandy if Normal Trials, Vet Trials, DSA, vDSA, etc were in Group Finder, but the reality is there are reasons why they are not and it’s going to stay that way. If you want to run that content I can’t recommend enough to simply join a casual guild that does that stuff all day.
    Edited by Vaoh on June 13, 2018 10:16PM
  • zaria
    zaria
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    Other (Specify below)
    Normal trials is not normal, the craglorn ones are easy as in normal dungeon with typical group, nmol is harder, nhof is far more, nAS tend to be wipe feasts then I lay down dots then rez and repeat :) Not done the summerset trial yet.
    And yes just hang around the zone and you get requests, once had an level 30 in nAA in an late night run, we just needed an body to stand on an plate.

    And no fake roles does not work in trials, simply don't even try. less an issue as in more DD in group, even more as some runs can be done with one healer and one tank, you can state yourself as off healer or tank for one of the paths in nHrC but leave the last part to the real ones.
    Grinding just make you go in circles.
    Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.
  • idk
    idk
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    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.
    Really, idk
  • BigBadVolk
    BigBadVolk
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    No (Tell us why in a comment below)
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on
    "The ass is similar to the opinion: Everyone has it, but no one cares about the others!"
    I'm 118 years old
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    There's nothing to stop people from grouping into your manual PUGS like this already. At least with Group Finder you could vote to kick.
    PC-NA Goat
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    Diminish wrote: »
    This will never happen. For one, what criteria would they use for roles? How do they know if a group should have 1 tank, 2 tanks, same for healers/etc. I'm all for making grouping more accessible to everyone, but the group finder is not the way. They need some sort of in-game LFG tool.

    Never say never. LFG, Group Finder, something in between, doesn't matter.

    The game needs a way to form groups for this content.
    PC-NA Goat
  • BigBadVolk
    BigBadVolk
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    No (Tell us why in a comment below)
    Phage wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    There's nothing to stop people from grouping into your manual PUGS like this already. At least with Group Finder you could vote to kick.

    true, I admit it would help a bit, but it would be just as much a mess as the dungeon group finder, maybe even worse with waiting for 12 people at least for trials
    "The ass is similar to the opinion: Everyone has it, but no one cares about the others!"
    I'm 118 years old
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    Phage wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    There's nothing to stop people from grouping into your manual PUGS like this already. At least with Group Finder you could vote to kick.

    true, I admit it would help a bit, but it would be just as much a mess as the dungeon group finder, maybe even worse with waiting for 12 people at least for trials

    For most trials groups you'd be only waiting for 3-4 people right out the gate. DDs are a dime a dozen and would queue in droves if this was a thing. It could be a mess, but I think if it was done right it would be a big improvement to the game.

    Imagine for a minute if we didn't have Dungeon Finder. Even in its buggy state, it's better than not having it at all.
    PC-NA Goat
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.
    PC-NA Goat
  • idk
    idk
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    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.
    Really, idk
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    idk wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.
    idk wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.

    I seriously doubt this. If there was a tool available to make grouping easier for raids/arenas, people would use it. Dungeon Finder isn't nearly as bad as the people on this forum make it out to be. An equivalent tool for other content would make grouping for normal trials and arenas easier. It's no different than if you're pulling PUGs from zone chat, just much easier, and you have the option to vote to kick.
    PC-NA Goat
  • AzraelKrieg
    AzraelKrieg
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    Been a while, let's see who is around.

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  • MLGProPlayer
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    Yes!
    DSA, at the very least, needs to be there. It uses the same amount of players as dungeons.
  • MLGProPlayer
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    Yes!
    idk wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.

    No.

    You don't join a raid guild to do normal trials. A ton of guilds run those. All of my trade guilds run weekly normal (and even vet) trials. But if I can't log in when they run the trial I need, I'm SOL until next week.

    Most people run normal raids to farm gear, which group finder is perfect for.

    I play this game sporadically due to my unpredictable IRL schedule. I can't commit to a set raiding schedule. Being able to log in and queue up for a farm run is ideal.
    Edited by MLGProPlayer on June 13, 2018 11:59PM
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    Been a while, let's see who is around.

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  • idk
    idk
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    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.
    idk wrote: »
    BigBadVolk wrote: »
    inb4 12 fake tanks or 12 fake healers or 6 fake tanks and 6 fake healers and so on

    The issue would be the 12 fake dps
    Phage wrote: »
    idk wrote: »
    I have no issues with adding the normal versions to the GF, but it will be a train wreck.

    Think about the complaint threads about GF groups we already get with much easier content. Those same people will blame everyone else for a group being challenged to clear nHoF and maybe nAA will be a challenge for some random groups.

    If they offer a decent reward for doing a random GF trial we will see decent groups form up on their own before entering the GF just like they do for dungeons.

    And that's part of the plan too. You offer Group Finder for those that want it. That increases interest in the content, as well as gives people increased exposure and practice in doing the content. Those who want to make their own groups will then have far more people willing and able to run if there's a daily random reward.

    You miss my point. It will be a train wreck.

    Most that really want to are in guilds that raid, maybe even a couple of them. That leaves pretty much inexperienced and whatever for queuing up.

    I seriously doubt this. If there was a tool available to make grouping easier for raids/arenas, people would use it. Dungeon Finder isn't nearly as bad as the people on this forum make it out to be. An equivalent tool for other content would make grouping for normal trials and arenas easier. It's no different than if you're pulling PUGs from zone chat, just much easier, and you have the option to vote to kick.

    Again, I could care less if they added it. I am not objecting.

    I will not destroy the fantasy that it will be a perfect world with normal trials in GF. If you think kicking a player is the answer, and of course getting 5 more to agree and vote with you, then great. Of course GF groups are perfect as it is now for mere 4 man content.
    Really, idk
  • Thorstienn
    Thorstienn
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    Other (Specify below)
    Everything should be GF optional at the same time. My favorite thing in any MMO is to be able to Q up for anything I feel like while I run around.
    In ESO; BGs OR dungeons. And you better not be in Cyrodil.
  • Diminish
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    Phage wrote: »
    Diminish wrote: »
    This will never happen. For one, what criteria would they use for roles? How do they know if a group should have 1 tank, 2 tanks, same for healers/etc. I'm all for making grouping more accessible to everyone, but the group finder is not the way. They need some sort of in-game LFG tool.

    Never say never. LFG, Group Finder, something in between, doesn't matter.

    The game needs a way to form groups for this content.

    I'm fairly certain I said this exact same thing with the exception being that I also stated trials will NEVER be added to the group finder currently in game. Which is the way it should be.
  • WaltherCarraway
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    Yes!
    As we've seen many post saying PvE content is too easy. I think now is the time to add an easier access to some end-game contents.
    any class, main DK. EP Hit Squad. I have Striped Senche Tiger mount. All veteran content checked
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  • Bbsample197
    Bbsample197
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    No (Tell us why in a comment below)
    I have my fill with 3 players queueing in all roles, the last thing that i need is 11 players queueing in all roles just to get past
    at least asking in zone chat doesnt need a vote kick you could just kick the person immediately, vote kicking with 11 players will result to a failure there will always be someone who wouldnt vote
    Edited by Bbsample197 on June 14, 2018 1:30AM
  • Phage
    Phage
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    Yes!
    Diminish wrote: »
    Phage wrote: »
    Diminish wrote: »
    This will never happen. For one, what criteria would they use for roles? How do they know if a group should have 1 tank, 2 tanks, same for healers/etc. I'm all for making grouping more accessible to everyone, but the group finder is not the way. They need some sort of in-game LFG tool.

    Never say never. LFG, Group Finder, something in between, doesn't matter.

    The game needs a way to form groups for this content.

    I'm fairly certain I said this exact same thing with the exception being that I also stated trials will NEVER be added to the group finder currently in game. Which is the way it should be.

    I didn't said in my OP that they had to put it into Group Finder exactly the way it is.

    Again, never say never. :)
    PC-NA Goat
  • akl77
    akl77
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    Yes!
    Queue finder for those would save us so much time asking out in zone and guilds when I just wanna pug them.

    Edited by akl77 on June 14, 2018 4:59AM
    PS4 pro NA
  • Xuhora
    Xuhora
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    Other (Specify below)
    care to elaborate deeper?

    - at what LVL/CP does the GF for nTrials start?
    - who decides how many tanks/healers/dds are going for which trial?
    - how many players need to press F for yes to votekick?
    - is it possible to select more than 1 role?
    - does the GF offer daily rewards such as for normal randoms?
    - If so, what do they contain?

    Simply saying, GF for ntrials would be awesome is easy. thinking about what comes with it is a little more tricky.

    In my opinion, yeah, do it, but i will never use it since im sure it will frustrate me more than i benefit from it. furthermore i say its bad for the firsttimers and gals who need to learn the mechanics.
    With a GF-Group running a trial chances are, that there are 5 guys who know what to do and 7 who dont. Now it will be no different to the procedure of a PUG Dungeon. The 5 guys who know what to do will rush forward, pull things, and start fights, leaving the 7 other in an awefull disparity not knowing what to do. That either leads to them dying left and right to mobs and mechanics, or dulling them down, eventually succeeding nontheless and rewarding that habit. Both of these possibilities are equally bad for the community.

    I got nothing against player saying they are lonewolves, i just dont understand playing a mMorpg and staying alone... And while i respect your decision to do so, i also ask you to understand that there is content in a mMorpg that demmands coordination. So by saying GF will help us lonewolves getting content done, well, see the 2 possibilities above.
    And if you actually manage to find a guy, knowing what to do and willing to endlessly type mechanics before boss, capslocking mechanics during boss and trying his best to get stuff done, at the very least, say thanks mate, dont take it for granted
  • Tommy_The_Gun
    Tommy_The_Gun
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes!
    Being forced to join a guild or spam chat with "LFG" just to have acces to content you paid for feels like a bad game design...
    Seriously, is there any good reason why arenas & trials are not supported by a group finder ?
    When ZOS added battlegrounds somehow those are supported...
    It just feels wrong that end - game pve content is "locked" that way...

    Yeah ! Because you know - spamming zone chat with "LFG" for 2h is FUN ! :(
    Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on June 14, 2018 9:41AM
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