Question about infused jewelry

ezio45

I read on one of the jewelry feedback posts that arcane gives more damage than infused with a spell damage glyph.

The way ive always understood it is, spell damage works better for abilities because of the like 1 spell damage is worth like 10.2? max mag and that max mag applys to shields and possibly has something to do with crit damage. Not an expert so i wanted this broken down for me.

WrathOfInnos

Sure. A spell damage enchant on jewelry gives 174 spell damage. Infused trait increases this by 60% or 104. This can be multiplied by 1.25 if you have Major and Minor Sorcery buffs, so 130 spell damage total from the infused trait.

Arcane gives 870 Max Magicka. This gets multiplied by 1.2 if you have at least 100 blue champion points assigned, so 870x1.2 = 1044. Then you also get various other % bonuses. For example on my Sorcerer I get Altmer 10%, Bound Aegis 8%, Inner Light 7%, Undaunted Passive 6% (5-1-1 armor weight), Warhorn 10% for a total of 41% more Max Magicka. This means that each piece of arcane jewelry gives 1044x1.41 = 1472 max magicka. Using the ratio 10.5:1 this is equivalent to 140 spell damage.

Now if you had less bonuses to Magicka, like if you were not a Magicka race, or were in a group that did not have Warhorn, or did not have Bound Aegis (or the nightblade passive for 8% max Magicka) then that would shift the formula so that Arcane would not be as good. There are definitely cases where Infused can outperform Arcane, but in the optimized build Arcane is slightly better.

SammyFable

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Sure. A spell damage enchant on jewelry gives 174 spell damage. Infused trait increases this by 60% or 104. This can be multiplied by 1.25 if you have Major and Minor Sorcery buffs, so 130 spell damage total from the infused trait.

Arcane gives 870 Max Magicka. This gets multiplied by 1.2 if you have at least 100 blue champion points assigned, so 870x1.2 = 1044. Then you also get various other % bonuses. For example on my Sorcerer I get Altmer 10%, Bound Aegis 8%, Inner Light 7%, Undaunted Passive 6% (5-1-1 armor weight), Warhorn 10% for a total of 41% more Max Magicka. This means that each piece of arcane jewelry gives 1044x1.41 = 1472 max magicka. Using the ratio 10.5:1 this is equivalent to 140 spell damage.

Now if you had less bonuses to Magicka, like if you were not a Magicka race, or were in a group that did not have Warhorn, or did not have Bound Aegis (or the nightblade passive for 8% max Magicka) then that would shift the formula so that Arcane would not be as good. There are definitely cases where Infused can outperform Arcane, but in the optimized build Arcane is slightly better.

I would like to add, that certain classes also have % modifiers for spell damage, Sorcs get 2% for each class ability slotted. Usually a mag Sorc will have 3 class abilities slotted, so 6% additional spell damage. This would increase the value from infused to 104*1.31=136. Still a tiny amount less than what you'd get from arcane.

WrathOfInnos

SammyFable wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Sure. A spell damage enchant on jewelry gives 174 spell damage. Infused trait increases this by 60% or 104. This can be multiplied by 1.25 if you have Major and Minor Sorcery buffs, so 130 spell damage total from the infused trait.

Arcane gives 870 Max Magicka. This gets multiplied by 1.2 if you have at least 100 blue champion points assigned, so 870x1.2 = 1044. Then you also get various other % bonuses. For example on my Sorcerer I get Altmer 10%, Bound Aegis 8%, Inner Light 7%, Undaunted Passive 6% (5-1-1 armor weight), Warhorn 10% for a total of 41% more Max Magicka. This means that each piece of arcane jewelry gives 1044x1.41 = 1472 max magicka. Using the ratio 10.5:1 this is equivalent to 140 spell damage.

Now if you had less bonuses to Magicka, like if you were not a Magicka race, or were in a group that did not have Warhorn, or did not have Bound Aegis (or the nightblade passive for 8% max Magicka) then that would shift the formula so that Arcane would not be as good. There are definitely cases where Infused can outperform Arcane, but in the optimized build Arcane is slightly better.

I would like to add, that certain classes also have % modifiers for spell damage, Sorcs get 2% for each class ability slotted. Usually a mag Sorc will have 3 class abilities slotted, so 6% additional spell damage. This would increase the value from infused to 104*1.31=136. Still a tiny amount less than what you'd get from arcane.

Edit: Ignore everything below, passive has been fixed.

True in theory, but last I checked this Sorc passive was not applying to most sources of spell damage. It was giving 2% of the 1335 from a staff, but not adding 2% to any spell damage from set bonuses or jewelry enchants.

SammyFable

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

SammyFable wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Sure. A spell damage enchant on jewelry gives 174 spell damage. Infused trait increases this by 60% or 104. This can be multiplied by 1.25 if you have Major and Minor Sorcery buffs, so 130 spell damage total from the infused trait.

Arcane gives 870 Max Magicka. This gets multiplied by 1.2 if you have at least 100 blue champion points assigned, so 870x1.2 = 1044. Then you also get various other % bonuses. For example on my Sorcerer I get Altmer 10%, Bound Aegis 8%, Inner Light 7%, Undaunted Passive 6% (5-1-1 armor weight), Warhorn 10% for a total of 41% more Max Magicka. This means that each piece of arcane jewelry gives 1044x1.41 = 1472 max magicka. Using the ratio 10.5:1 this is equivalent to 140 spell damage.

Now if you had less bonuses to Magicka, like if you were not a Magicka race, or were in a group that did not have Warhorn, or did not have Bound Aegis (or the nightblade passive for 8% max Magicka) then that would shift the formula so that Arcane would not be as good. There are definitely cases where Infused can outperform Arcane, but in the optimized build Arcane is slightly better.

I would like to add, that certain classes also have % modifiers for spell damage, Sorcs get 2% for each class ability slotted. Usually a mag Sorc will have 3 class abilities slotted, so 6% additional spell damage. This would increase the value from infused to 104*1.31=136. Still a tiny amount less than what you'd get from arcane.

True in theory, but last I checked this Sorc passive was not applying to most sources of spell damage. It was giving 2% of the 1335 from a staff, but not adding 2% to any spell damage from set bonuses or jewelry enchants.

I just checked on the PTS, my unbuffed spelldamage went up from 2385 to 2495 with an infused neklace while having 3 sorc class abilities slotted. Thats an additional 110 SD. 104*1.06=110.24. So the passive does increase jewelry enchants. At least for the tooltip.
With a potion it got from 2835 to 2966, so 131 more SD. 104*1.26= 131.04. So the math works out.
If this was different in the past, ZOS has definitely changed that. So atleast with Summerset the passive works just as expected.

ezio45

so assuming I have all the relevant skills and passives, as a highelf sorc. I should stick with arcane rather than transmute my existing jewelry to infused?

Currently i have 44k max mag, 3700 spell damage fully buffed

SammyFable

Yeah, stick with arcane.

ezio45

kk ty

Bladerunner1

Spell damage scales very heavily with light and heavy attacks on live, but with the planned attack scaling changes it would have a slightly reduced influence on overall DPS after Summerset.

It was already mentioned, but magic users tend to have more magicka multipliers. Magicka also scales with their shields. The way things are headed with jewelry crafting, really the only thing I'm planning is stamina based transmutation.

WrathOfInnos

SammyFable wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

SammyFable wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Sure. A spell damage enchant on jewelry gives 174 spell damage. Infused trait increases this by 60% or 104. This can be multiplied by 1.25 if you have Major and Minor Sorcery buffs, so 130 spell damage total from the infused trait.

Arcane gives 870 Max Magicka. This gets multiplied by 1.2 if you have at least 100 blue champion points assigned, so 870x1.2 = 1044. Then you also get various other % bonuses. For example on my Sorcerer I get Altmer 10%, Bound Aegis 8%, Inner Light 7%, Undaunted Passive 6% (5-1-1 armor weight), Warhorn 10% for a total of 41% more Max Magicka. This means that each piece of arcane jewelry gives 1044x1.41 = 1472 max magicka. Using the ratio 10.5:1 this is equivalent to 140 spell damage.

Now if you had less bonuses to Magicka, like if you were not a Magicka race, or were in a group that did not have Warhorn, or did not have Bound Aegis (or the nightblade passive for 8% max Magicka) then that would shift the formula so that Arcane would not be as good. There are definitely cases where Infused can outperform Arcane, but in the optimized build Arcane is slightly better.

I would like to add, that certain classes also have % modifiers for spell damage, Sorcs get 2% for each class ability slotted. Usually a mag Sorc will have 3 class abilities slotted, so 6% additional spell damage. This would increase the value from infused to 104*1.31=136. Still a tiny amount less than what you'd get from arcane.

True in theory, but last I checked this Sorc passive was not applying to most sources of spell damage. It was giving 2% of the 1335 from a staff, but not adding 2% to any spell damage from set bonuses or jewelry enchants.

I just checked on the PTS, my unbuffed spelldamage went up from 2385 to 2495 with an infused neklace while having 3 sorc class abilities slotted. Thats an additional 110 SD. 104*1.06=110.24. So the passive does increase jewelry enchants. At least for the tooltip.
With a potion it got from 2835 to 2966, so 131 more SD. 104*1.26= 131.04. So the math works out.
If this was different in the past, ZOS has definitely changed that. So atleast with Summerset the passive works just as expected.

Awesome, thanks for checking. Hadn't see this fix in the patch notes, but glad it works again.