Question about character race and the high elves

LindsC

How do they treat all of the races in Tamriel? Are they friendly to High Elves? What about the rest of the Dominion?

Smaxx

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

Iselin

High elves tolerate all lesser races equally.

Mystrius_Archaion

From an immersion perspective, I'm also curious if the high elves in Summerset will recognize a high elf player character and be less racist to them?
I hope they're not overtly racist though since we had enough of that with Vvardenfell and those dunmer, even though there were enough of them friendly. Here's hoping it's not all snobby racists.

By the way, I was thinking about this the other day and really all races are racist for the most part. They all distrust other races and often greet them poorly. Certain races are treated worse and to varying degrees by other races, but, in general, every race is racist to a point.
It's pretty believable like the real world.

Iselin

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

From an immersion perspective, I'm also curious if the high elves in Summerset will recognize a high elf player character and be less racist to them?

I already had a negative reception from a character who shall remain nameless who made a snide remark that even though my character is Altmer, I was not born in Summerset.

Shortly after that, I killed him.

Mystrius_Archaion

Iselin wrote: »

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

From an immersion perspective, I'm also curious if the high elves in Summerset will recognize a high elf player character and be less racist to them?

I already had a negative reception from a character who shall remain nameless who made a snide remark that even though my character is Altmer, I was not born in Summerset.

Shortly after that, I killed him.

So it's TES3 Morrowind all over again where we're an outlander/N'wah and all put on the defensive to make us all hold hands and sing Kumbaya before we save the racists sorry behinds.

Ok. I'm on board the messiah train.

VaranisArano

Even in the first quest, its clear that like the Dunmer, the Altmer of Summerset know an outlander when they see one.

There is no option for being an Altmer born and raised on Summerset that I can see.

LindsC

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

I haven't been able to download it. You're not helpful

usmguy1234

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

usmguy1234

LindsC wrote: »

How do they treat all of the races in Tamriel? Are they friendly to High Elves? What about the rest of the Dominion?

They refer to themselves as the oldest and most cultured race in Tamriel. Don't get me wrong, I love elves in all lore, especially Tolkien's, however these much like the others exhibit the stereotypical elvish aloof- snobishness. Kind of like a cat without the fur. That being said, they can make strong allies if you can find yourself in their good graces.

heaven13

usmguy1234 wrote: »

LindsC wrote: »

How do they treat all of the races in Tamriel? Are they friendly to High Elves? What about the rest of the Dominion?

They refer to themselves as the oldest and most cultured race in Tamriel. Don't get me wrong, I love elves in all lore, especially Tolkien's, however these much like the others exhibit the stereotypical elvish aloof- snobishness. Kind of like a cat without the fur. That being said, they can make strong allies if you can find yourself in their good graces.

I knew they reminded me of something! Look at that judgement!

adriant1978

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

So it's TES3 Morrowind all over again where we're an outlander/N'wah and all put on the defensive to make us all hold hands and sing Kumbaya before we save the racists sorry behinds.

I was afraid of this. There goes my new character idea of (shock! horror!) a Summerset Altmer beginning their adventures in Summerset.

DirkRavenclaw

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

From an immersion perspective, I'm also curious if the high elves in Summerset will recognize a high elf player character and be less racist to them?
I hope they're not overtly racist though since we had enough of that with Vvardenfell and those dunmer, even though there were enough of them friendly. Here's hoping it's not all snobby racists.

By the way, I was thinking about this the other day and really all races are racist for the most part. They all distrust other races and often greet them poorly. Certain races are treated worse and to varying degrees by other races, but, in general, every race is racist to a point.
It's pretty believable like the real world.

Well, without Spoilers, there is, in Alinor a chat with a Lady to get the Dailies started, I played a High Elf, got spoken to: A a Fellow High Elf

usmguy1234

Mystrius_Archaion wrote: »

From an immersion perspective, I'm also curious if the high elves in Summerset will recognize a high elf player character and be less racist to them?
I hope they're not overtly racist though since we had enough of that with Vvardenfell and those dunmer, even though there were enough of them friendly. Here's hoping it's not all snobby racists.

By the way, I was thinking about this the other day and really all races are racist for the most part. They all distrust other races and often greet them poorly. Certain races are treated worse and to varying degrees by other races, but, in general, every race is racist to a point.
It's pretty believable like the real world.

One small hitch. The altmer are just the people who worship the high elves... Summerset is literally what is left of that ancient culture. The psijic order was established to preserve the old ways because the hearts of the aldmer people were being swayed towards worshipping false gods. Interestingly enough, the psijics are the birthplace of chim and necromancy.

jedtb16_ESO

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

adriant1978

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

Dwemer = deep elf (although they are also lost)

usmguy1234

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

VaranisArano

usmguy1234 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

That's...not remotely how the term "high elf" is used in the other games. In Skyrim, you can make a "High Elf" aka an Altmer. So while perhaps technically correct, the TES games don't really back up that level of technical hairsplitting.

Aebaradath

Iselin wrote: »

High elves tolerate all lesser races equally.

More like, despise them all equally.

Xvorg

usmguy1234 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

Nopes... Aldmer are the first mer. Altmer are the high mer

http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aldmer

usmguy1234

VaranisArano wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

That's...not remotely how the term "high elf" is used in the other games. In Skyrim, you can make a "High Elf" aka an Altmer. So while perhaps technically correct, the TES games don't really back up that level of technical hairsplitting.

This is how it is in the official lore: Aedra-> Mer-> Aldmer-> Altmer. The Aedra/Mer are basically gods/demigods.

usmguy1234

Xvorg wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

Nopes... Aldmer are the first mer. Altmer are the high mer

http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aldmer

The modern Altmer are believed to resemble the original Aldmer. The Altmer today hold their ancestors in great reverence and constantly strive to emulate their ways; it has even been alleged that they selectively breed for Aldmer-like features.

From that exact article. Like I said, the altmer worship the aldmer. They are a lesser form of the aldmer.

MLGProPlayer

Iselin wrote: »

High elves tolerate all lesser races equally.

Whether you're a slimy argonian or a dirty dark elf, the high elves see no difference. You're all inferior scum.

Dracane

The Altmer are not unlike the Aldmer. The Aldmer were the ones, who lived on old Aldmeris and came to Tamriel, with Summerset being where they arrived at first. Altmer is simply the term for those, who decided to stay on Summerset, rather than leaving Summerset. Just because something has gotten a slightly different name, doesn't mean it's something different.

The Altmer are just like Aldmer that originally came to Summerset. Of course, the Altmer want to preserve the past, aka the memory of the Aldmer. But change is inevitable, now matter how hard you try. But basically, the Altmer are Aldmeri genetically.

Xvorg

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

Play the game. Learn it. It's not like there aren't any High Elves in the existing game.

... but the altmer aren't exactly high elves.

bosmer....wood elf

dunmer.... dark elf

maormer ... sea elf

dwemer... lost elf (could be wrong on this one)

altmer... high elf

Aldmer are the true high elves. Altmer just worship them.

Nopes... Aldmer are the first mer. Altmer are the high mer

http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Aldmer

The modern Altmer are believed to resemble the original Aldmer. The Altmer today hold their ancestors in great reverence and constantly strive to emulate their ways; it has even been alleged that they selectively breed for Aldmer-like features.

From that exact article. Like I said, the altmer worship the aldmer. They are a lesser form of the aldmer.

Nopes (again)

Aldmer were the original elven race that came to Tamriel from Aldmeris, then the race split into several other races. It is not that Altmer worship the Aldmer, it's just they believe they are keeping the old way.

Consider that other mer races also believe they are keeping their old ways

nouagea

LindsC wrote: »

How do they treat all of the races in Tamriel? Are they friendly to High Elves? What about the rest of the Dominion?

I'm going to answer OP's above question to the best of my ability while also addressing the other comments in the thread with regards to the Altmer, or High Elves and their disposition towards the other races of Tamriel. First and foremost, I'm going to offer a brief understanding of the Altmer from my understanding of the lore as established prior to Summerset's in-game expansion. It's worth noting that this is my understanding of the lore and anyone's free to add points to what's being said here or disagree entirely. I'll include links from where I draw my information so that you can read and discern for yourselves if you wish.

Altmer is the Aldmeris word for High Elf (Alt being an adjective meaning high, and mer the noun for Elf).
Aldmer is Aldmeris for First Elf, but it can also mean old, ancient, or Proto (Ald meaning First, and mer meaning elf).

It's reasonable to say that how friendly an Altmer is to newcomers or other races depends entirely on the mer in question. Yes, a more than sizable amount of them will harbor a signature haughtiness about them, but some can demonstrate themselves to be approachable, even if it's by Altmeri standards. To understand this variation, we have to look at the Altmer's cultural past and how it's shaped the foundation of their disposition as a race.

The Doom of Aldmeris

The Aldmer are believed to have arrived to Summerset from the alleged lost city continent of Aldmeris in the Middle Merethic Era. For perspective, this would also be right around the time when the Direnni Clan rediscovers and captures the Adamantine Tower (source). From what can be understood, the Aldmer came to Summerset with humble beginnings which included a kind of egalitarian society where mer were treated as equals among themselves - something also reflective of their practice of ancestor veneration:

"Early Aldmer society was agricultural and politically egalitarian. A system of ancestor worship had been exported whole from Aldmeris, and it brought with it a communal spirit that served the early settlers of Summerset well. When the Aldmer came together as a people to create the Crystal Tower, it was not a monument to any king or god, but rather to the spirit of the elven people, living and dead. Within the glittering walls of the Tower are housed the graves of the early Aldmeri settlers, preserved forever as a lasting symbol of the power of the people for that brief moment in history, fully unified. (Pocket Guide to the Empire, 3rd Edition)"

How did a society of politically egalitarian mer evolve into a rigid, albeit haughty caste-based structure we see with Altmer today?

As Aldmeri society grew so too did social stratification. A hierarchy of classes would eventually sprout, separating mer into strictly enforced roles within their growing society. The tendrils of the Aldmer's social stratification also creeps into their practices of ancestral veneration and the results are important to note:

"The religion of the people also changed because of this change in society: no longer did the Aldmer worship their own ancestors, but the ancestors of their "betters." Auriel, Trinimac, Syrabane, and Phynaster are among the many ancestor spirits who became Gods. A group of elders rebelled against this trend, calling themselves the Psijics, the keepers of the Old Ways of Aldmeris. With their mystical powers, they were able to settle in Artaeum, away from what they considered the corruption of their society. They continued to return to the land to act as advisors, but never again would they call Summerset home." - (Pocket Guide to the Empire, 3rd Edition)

This is important to keep in mind because we can surmise that the reason the Psijics left Summerset was to preserve the "Old Ways of Aldmeris". However, the Psijic's weren't the only ones to leave Summerset during this social stratification period. The Great Velothi Dissident movement took place somewhere between the Middle and Late Middle Merethic Era when Veloth the Prophet led his followers out of Summerset to the land of Resdayn (now known as Morrowind) where they can be free from "those who were blind to the corruption and spiritual bankruptcy at the heart of their society" (Exodus from Summerset).

What of the Aldmer who remained on the Isle?

The Culture of Stasis

While it's not exactly clear how and why yet, the traditions of Summerset state that those Aldmer remaining on Summerset would become Altmer. Unlike the Psijics who left to preserve the Old Ways, or Veloth who left to lead his followers to a new promised land, the remaining mer persisted in upholding the veneration practices of a changed society (mainly worshiping elevated ancestor spirits as gods along with their chief ancestor, Auri-El). It can be argued that the disposition of Altmer today, whether we're talking Altmer in the 2nd Era ESO, or the 4th Era Altmer in Skyrim's timeline, can be explained by how Altmer are taught to regard themselves in relation to the other races. An in-game lorebook that provides some insight on the schism in the Human/Aldmeri worldview is the Monomyth: (The Monomyth - A theological book containing the common creation myths).

In a sloppy nutshell, the Altmer believe that Auri-El, their God King ancestor from who they all descended from, was tricked by Lorkhan (Spririt of Nirn and God of all Mortals) into creating Mundus which shed them of their former divinity. To make up for the error of falling for Lorkhan's trickery, Auri-El was believed to have "led the original Aldmer against the armies of Lorkhan in mythic times, vanquishing that tyrant and establishing the first kingdoms of the Altmer, Altmora and Old Ehlnofey" (Brother Mikhael Karkuxor). Upon doing so, he eventually ascends to Aetherius to watch over his followers so that they may learn what's needed to escape their mortal prison and return to divinity.

Auri-El, an ancestor spirit among the Aldmer of the upper caste, eventually becomes adopted by other Aldmer so that they may emulate their social betters. Altmer today, given this context, are keen to look down on the other races, but the same can be said of Altmer looking down on other Altmer. Summerset's rigid class structure is ripe with mer bent on preserving what they believe is essential order and preservation. By the Ancestors, if it's been this way for hundreds of years then it's going to stay that way hundreds more! Surely, how can the lesser races truly comprehend the pillars of our cherished lore? The other races are but children holding a candle to the greatness of the Altmer's lasting legacy.

Conclusion?

Yet, do all Altmer think the same?

Simply said, of course not. While they can seem similar, no two Altmer are the same. Like the Aldmer that preceded them, there are Altmer who probably still adhere to the traditions of their ancestors (egalitarian traditions before the social stratification) while others are adamant on the importance of Auri-El worship and all that it entails. One can argue that the social changes that took place between the Middle and Late Middle Merethic Eras are still the source of social unrest as mer engage in socio-political or theological disagreements well into the 3rd and 4th Era. The Altmer are indeed a long-lived bunch and it's easy to see grudges being held for a longer period of time. With that said, how any particular Altmer views the outside races or even other Altmer can vary on a multitude of social and cultural factors sculpting their perception of the world and themselves.