Magicka supremacy returns with summerset

Kanar

Summerset is putting magicka back on top, where the game designers have always wanted it.

2h changes: no benefit for 2handers or bow, but clear benefit for staff users.
Sunder/nmg: clear nerf to organized stamina.
Psijic: magicka now gets minor force

My prediction: stamina will be far behind magicka when summerset arrives. Would love to be proven wrong.

Edit: also light/heavy attacks scaling better with max attribute: bigger buff for magicka than Stam.

getemshauna

Welcome to homestead again

Elijah_Crow

2H and Bow can now have 5-5-2. That's can be a huge benefit.

In testing they were getting some parses for 2H/Bow which were close to DW/Bow. Not quite there but it was closing the gap and that is with limited time for testing.

Kanar

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

2H and Bow can now have 5-5-2. That's can be a huge benefit.

In testing they were getting some parses for 2H/Bow which were close to DW/Bow.

No, because 2h/bow uses asylum 2hander and vMA bow, so there's no benefit. I already get close to dw/bow on live with 2h/bow...

Aliyavana

Mag gets survivability plus damage, and stam survivability (blade cloak) gets a damage nerf

Cadbury

Plus, add in the fact that Sorc and NB are possibly getting nerfs. I suspect SSI will make alot of players happy

Apache_Kid

All of this on top of the fact that most Mag Builds can DPS from range allowing them to be more safe from range with shields and they get to apply DPS during certain mechanics that stamina characters have to have their DPS drastically reduced during.

The fact that NMG and sunderflame are being reduced to basically solo sets is the most confusing and troubling change though. What is the reason for this?

xbobx

aliyavana wrote: »

Mag gets survivability plus damage, and stam survivability (blade cloak) gets a damage nerf

and a nerf to the cost of their spammable

JD2013

Dracane

Needed buffs to bring magicka, which is greatly behind in pvp at the moment, more in line with stamina and stamina also profits ALOT from these changes, as bows and 2handed melee weapons profit from it.

My prediction is, that little to nothing will change, as stamina profits alot from these changes.

Feanor

@Kanar

Magicka always had Minor Force, and even on a ranged skill if you chose to, it just made no sense that the buff is attached to a stamina skill (Trap).

You also have to consider vMA weapons probably are worth less due to the changes, and vMA staves were the primary reason to run a 5-3-2-1 build.

I don't see the magicka supremacy just yet, and for PvP stamina still retains the far superior mobility.

JobooAGS

Kanar wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

2H and Bow can now have 5-5-2. That's can be a huge benefit.

In testing they were getting some parses for 2H/Bow which were close to DW/Bow.

No, because 2h/bow uses asylum 2hander and vMA bow, so there's no benefit. I already get close to dw/bow on live with 2h/bow...

Is 301 weapon damage better than 129 weapon damage and a monster set? Because with these changes that is what Im looking at for my bow/bow build

Cadbury

I wonder if now 2 hander will finally topple DW's supremacy.

rhapsodious

Apache_Kid wrote: »

The fact that NMG and sunderflame are being reduced to basically solo sets is the most confusing and troubling change though. What is the reason for this?

My guess is that they want to further streamline things into the Major/Minor system, instead of having to micromanage all the unique (de-)buffs going out. While this specific change does end up hurting organized melee players, I think it makes sense from their point of view to make the system less confusing/complicated.

Only wish they had done the same thing with snares, but at least it's on their radar.

Apache_Kid

rhapsodious wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

The fact that NMG and sunderflame are being reduced to basically solo sets is the most confusing and troubling change though. What is the reason for this?

My guess is that they want to further streamline things into the Major/Minor system, instead of having to micromanage all the unique (de-)buffs going out. While this specific change does end up hurting organized melee players, I think it makes sense from their point of view to make the system less confusing/complicated.

Only wish they had done the same thing with snares, but at least it's on their radar.

If that is their reasoning then they need to introduce more stamina sets that can provide group buffs and support that are worth using in end-game raids. To just completely take these sets away from the pool of available gear and not replace them is a giant nerf to stamina players in end-game group play. If they do not introduce replacement stamina support sets then it would seem their reasoning is to nerf stamina in PvE group-play.

Kanar

JobooAGS wrote: »

Kanar wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

2H and Bow can now have 5-5-2. That's can be a huge benefit.

In testing they were getting some parses for 2H/Bow which were close to DW/Bow.

No, because 2h/bow uses asylum 2hander and vMA bow, so there's no benefit. I already get close to dw/bow on live with 2h/bow...

Is 301 weapon damage better than 129 weapon damage and a monster set? Because with these changes that is what Im looking at for my bow/bow build

On my bow/bow I already run a monster set. I would be looking at dropping master's bow + agility and replacing that with a 5pc set.

For 2hander I could replace asylum weapon with a VO 2hander + monster set. That would likely be a target dummy dps increase but I don't think it would be as useful in actual dungeon or trial scenarios. We'll see.

getemshauna

Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight. Liofa was aplying ele drain because selfbuffed test is better sustain (because ele drain is an instant so 1 more free action).
No worm, no orbs. Just dry ele drain. However, it requires to reach the target frequently, because trap is melee and stamina cost, what saves our magicka aswell, and soul harvest melee aswell + it is cheap ult - so again free action what means magicka is saved. So I guess it's gonna be good to get Zaan next patch and just go melee. We don't really wanna use Acceleration because it's magicka cost.
Anyway even with force pulse we will be able to sustain rotations - all we need is to improve our siphoning attacks uptime. Here is the video from a test:
https://youtu.be/sKTSwoePK2Y
It's fully raid setup with 20 points in spell erosion.

Kanar

rhapsodious wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

The fact that NMG and sunderflame are being reduced to basically solo sets is the most confusing and troubling change though. What is the reason for this?

My guess is that they want to further streamline things into the Major/Minor system, instead of having to micromanage all the unique (de-)buffs going out. While this specific change does end up hurting organized melee players, I think it makes sense from their point of view to make the system less confusing/complicated.

Only wish they had done the same thing with snares, but at least it's on their radar.

At least I can stop trying for 1h sunder weapons now.

Geroken777

Stamina keeps getting slapped in the face, counting the upcoming spell crafting as well. Stamina chars need love, ZOS.

Valkysas154

going to get 1.4k more mana with that 2 hander change about time 2 handers had at lest 1 benefit when
even 1 handers had the same dmg

Zeni0s

Yay!

DocFrost72

JD2013 wrote: »

^

It's not even out on pts and some are calling ZOS evil henchmen of the global anti stam movement. You know, that one that totally exists

Cadbury

DocFrost72 wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

^

It's not even out on pts and some are calling ZOS evil henchmen of the global anti stam movement. You know, that one that totally exists

Not enough "ZOS killed my stam build, want refund" posts yet.

But give it time.

IV_Deity

Kanar wrote: »

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

2H and Bow can now have 5-5-2. That's can be a huge benefit.

In testing they were getting some parses for 2H/Bow which were close to DW/Bow.

No, because 2h/bow uses asylum 2hander and vMA bow, so there's no benefit. I already get close to dw/bow on live with 2h/bow...

Not all people who use 2H weapons, use vMA or Asylum weapons....this does benefit 2H users actually.

ecru

gethemshauna wrote: »

Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight. Liofa was aplying ele drain because selfbuffed test is better sustain (because ele drain is an instant so 1 more free action).
No worm, no orbs. Just dry ele drain. However, it requires to reach the target frequently, because trap is melee and stamina cost, what saves our magicka aswell, and soul harvest melee aswell + it is cheap ult - so again free action what means magicka is saved. So I guess it's gonna be good to get Zaan next patch and just go melee. We don't really wanna use Acceleration because it's magicka cost.
Anyway even with force pulse we will be able to sustain rotations - all we need is to improve our siphoning attacks uptime. Here is the video from a test:
https://youtu.be/sKTSwoePK2Y
It's fully raid setup with 20 points in spell erosion.

This has always been the case, but when you're actually in a trial and target swapping frequently, you're going to be using a lot more magicka. There's no way around heavy attacking for magblade's in trials after this change IMO.

themaddaedra

This. An instant thread which complains about others' problems being solved instead of wanting themselves something good.

If you said that both Sunder and NMG being nerfed is an overkill, i would agree and i still think that devs will take one of them back to original before launch.

However, for one time in forum history, don't complain for other builds' or other class' problems being solved. Nothing wrong with 2h weapons being 2 set pieces now. That's what (most) people always wanted. For one time god sake, want something good for yourself instead of throwing mudballs on others.

red_emu

Brrrofski

The changes to sunder and nmg makes me think.... Are they going to give medium a pen passive?

Medium needs love. Especially that stealth passive. It's useless for 4/5 of medium players. Take it out, add it to nb passives somewhere.

Also, why does 5 piece medium give less crit than 5 light? I've been running medium in PvP and my crit if I don't use a set which grants crit, is like 29.5%. I get 22% in heavy.... Magica gives 32% . Medium gets 12% WD, but there's heavy sets that proc a lot higher WD, hence the massive heavy armour meta in PvP. Make heavy armour reduce WD and SD by 20% while wearing 5 heavy. It'll encourage people to make a more difficult decision.

This isn't bias either, I play all classes, both stam and mag. Just an observation.

Kolzki

Jewlery crafting? Yay I can finally combine hundings rage with my gold NMG set!

Two weeks later... wait what?!? It’s changed to a debuff that all tanks and three out of five classes already apply?

RIP NMG. You will be missed.

Conduit0

So let me see here, limited testing by the playtest group showed that 2h/bow and bow/bow builds were nearly on par with dw/bow which currently is significantly higher dps than magicka, yet somehow magicka will be way ahead of stamina according to the OP.


I see them knees, they be a jerking.

Kanar

DocFrost72 wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

^

It's not even out on pts and some are calling ZOS evil henchmen of the global anti stam movement. You know, that one that totally exists

Did you play this game when not a single class skill had a stamina morph? It has gotten better but has a ways to go.

themaddaedra wrote: »

This. An instant thread which complains about others' problems being solved instead of wanting themselves something good.

If you said that both Sunder and NMG being nerfed is an overkill, i would agree and i still think that devs will take one of them back to original before launch.

However, for one time in forum history, don't complain for other builds' or other class' problems being solved. Nothing wrong with 2h weapons being 2 set pieces now. That's what (most) people always wanted. For one time god sake, want something good for yourself instead of throwing mudballs on others.

I have always argued against 2handers counting as 2. How did the proponents of this change get their way? They whined and cried on the forums until it happened. See, I actually play 2h stamina and it is currently pretty good. A few improvements are needed but now since the devs are going this way, those other improvements won't happen. That is why I don't like the 2hander change; it will prevent the buffs that I think are needed.