"Strife and its morphs have had their costs increased to be in-line with the cost of Force Pulse"

Marabornwingrion

Well, RIP my sustain on magblade.

The only reason why I was using Funnel instead of Force Pulse in raids was that Funel costs 700 magicka less.

I hate heavy attacking. I really hate them. I can't imagine spamming them in my rotation in trails...

Also in PvP I will probably have more troubles with sustain, especially when I will get hit with resource poisons.

ZOS, this is HUGE and not needed nerf to nightblade sustain. Reconsider please.

Doctordarkspawn

They wont.

They seem to want to force everything through heavy attacking or handicap you to all buggery despite that not being a game players want to play.

(This originally said 'dont like it, dont play, they wont lisen' but Given the fact we now have a new gameplay lead, this may no longer be the case. And we may have less heavy-attacking strategy in future.)

Etrella

and here I am wasting all this time to level my Undaunted and finding Lore books for my mgblade. Should just stop everything and log back on my sorc. Something tells me that the things that help mgblades be a bit better than sorcs now, are about to get a good nerfed, making it more in line or once again below sorcs. Hopefully not

Vahrokh

It's the usual approach: if something is nice and fun, enforce heavy attacks into it.

Apache_Kid

They want everyone to have to do heavy attacks in their rotation to sustain. It's part of their new vision for the game it would seem for some God-forsaken reason.

Drachenfier

Stupid change. And why the damage nerf to Twisting Path??

Marabornwingrion

Drachenfier wrote: »

Stupid change. And why the damage nerf to Twisting Path??

Agree. Path was getting a buff after buff in recend updates, and now nerf.
Why? Looks like ZOS can't make up their mind and will nerf and buff it over and over.

Path in current state is still slightly weaker than Blockade, so this nerf is totally unnecessary.

BigBadVolk

now everyone will run that golden food, and will use force pulse, welcome back homestead long time no see
btw: why not lowering the cost of other spammable abilities instead of increasing one thats fine?

Marabornwingrion

BigBadVolk wrote: »

now everyone will run that golden food, and will use force pulse, welcome back homestead long time no see

Actually, I'm already using Clockwork food in raids with Funnel Health, and my sustain is more than fine. I very rarely need synergies.

I see no point of changing something what already works well. But looks like ZOS didn't learn the lesson since Morrowind sustain nerfs.

btw: why not lowering the cost of other spammable abilities instead of increasing one thats fine?

Agree. If Force Pulce had the same cost as current Funnel, I'd use Force Pulse instead.

Etrella

Apache_Kid wrote: »

They want everyone to have to do heavy attacks in their rotation to sustain. It's part of their new vision for the game it would seem for some God-forsaken reason.

How about letting us choose our own vision for our own characters, we're the ones paying for the game. The main reason I switched to Mgblade was because I found the style of play/rotation challenging, but fun. I was simply tire of heavy attacking with my Sorc. How the XXXK am I supposed to heavy attack with a fire staff in my rotation. Anyway, let me calm down and wait for these path notes lol.

Marabornwingrion

Apache_Kid wrote: »

They want everyone to have to do heavy attacks in their rotation to sustain. It's part of their new vision for the game it would seem for some God-forsaken reason.

I was naive enough to believe that after their vision of Morrowind and all these sustain nerfs they will finally wake up and not make the same mistake twice, in next Chapter. So many people hated these nerfs. Hated that heavy attack based gameplay. Including myself. Why ZOS don't see that they're ruining fun...?

Marabornwingrion

Etrella wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

They want everyone to have to do heavy attacks in their rotation to sustain. It's part of their new vision for the game it would seem for some God-forsaken reason.

How about letting us choose our own vision for our own characters, we're the ones paying for the game. The main reason I switched to Mgblade was because I found the style of play/rotation challenging, but fun. I was simply tire of heavy attacking with my Sorc. How the XXXK am I supposed to heavy attack with a fire staff in my rotation. Anyway, let me calm down and wait for these path notes lol.

Agree. I really enjoyed playing magicka sorc before Morrowind. Sustain was good enough to use Force Pulse and not worry about my magicka in every fight. After Morrowind sorcs in heavy attack builds were performing good, but I couldn't enjoy that kind of gameplay. So I stayed with magblade, were I have a build which I really enjoy because I don't need to heavy attack in long fights.

getemshauna

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight. Liofa was aplying ele drain because selfbuffed test is better sustain (because ele drain is an instant so 1 more free action).
No worm, no orbs. Just dry ele drain. However, it requires to reach the target frequently, because trap is melee and stamina cost, what saves our magicka aswell, and soul harvest melee aswell + it is cheap ult - so again free action what means magicka is saved. So I guess it's gonna be good to get Zaan next patch and just go melee. We don't really wanna use Acceleration because it's magicka cost.
Anyway even with force pulse we will be able to sustain rotations - all we need is to improve our siphoning attacks uptime. Here is the video from a test:
https://youtu.be/sKTSwoePK2Y
It's fully raid setup with 20 points in spell erosion.

Zeni0s

In my mind i see:

2 Jewelry Arcane Spell Damages
1 Jewelry Infused Cost Reduction (increased by 60%).

Not be a big problem.

BigBadVolk

Zeni0s wrote: »

In my mind i see:

2 Jewelry Arcane Spell Damages
1 Jewelry Infused Cost Reduction (increased by 60%).

Not be a big problem.

Ye I thought of that too or 1 arcane one harmony if your group maximizes synergy

Marabornwingrion

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

getemshauna

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

But you will have worm and/or orbs. Putting 1 recovery glyph in ring won't hurt DPS much tho. I don't support change because strife's magicka cost has been already increased in the past, but if it goes live we have to adapt somehow.

getemshauna

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

But you will have worm and/or orbs. Putting 1 recovery glyph in ring won't hurt DPS much tho. I don't support change because strife's magicka cost has been already increased in the past, but if it goes live we have to adapt somehow.

Marabornwingrion

gethemshauna wrote: »

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

But you will have worm and/or orbs. Putting 1 recovery glyph in ring won't hurt DPS much tho. I don't support change because strife's magicka cost has been already increased in the past, but if it goes live we have to adapt somehow.

I will probably also "adapt somehow" (and honestly I need to, because it's my main and only character that I raid with) but I really don't like this change and I hope that player feedback about this will be considered while making final Summerset patch notes.

ZOS, it's not like every magblade have infinite sustain. Our sustain was fine. Not overpowered. No need for nerfs or buffs to it. It was FINE. And if something is fine, there's no need to touch it.

BigBadVolk

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

But you will have worm and/or orbs. Putting 1 recovery glyph in ring won't hurt DPS much tho. I don't support change because strife's magicka cost has been already increased in the past, but if it goes live we have to adapt somehow.

I will probably also "adapt somehow" (and honestly I need to, because it's my main and only character that I raid with) but I really don't like this change and I hope that player feedback about this will be considered while making final Summerset patch notes.

ZOS, it's not like every magblade have infinite sustain. Our sustain was fine. Not overpowered. No need for nerfs or buffs to it. It was FINE. And if something is fine, there's no need to touch it.

agree, but the worst part if they only increase the cost then ye force pulse will be superior and made on skill "useless" at least in raid scenario, will still be good for 3dd runs for dungeons

Marabornwingrion

BigBadVolk wrote: »

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

Astrid_V wrote: »

gethemshauna wrote: »

@Astrid_V
Today I did one quick a 6 million dummy test if force pulse is actually sustainable on magblade in longer fight.

Depends what kind of fight. There are already few mechanics in trials which drain your magicka. And in Cloudrest maybe we will get the same type of mechanics? In that case sustaining boss fights will be much worse.

But you will have worm and/or orbs. Putting 1 recovery glyph in ring won't hurt DPS much tho. I don't support change because strife's magicka cost has been already increased in the past, but if it goes live we have to adapt somehow.

I will probably also "adapt somehow" (and honestly I need to, because it's my main and only character that I raid with) but I really don't like this change and I hope that player feedback about this will be considered while making final Summerset patch notes.

ZOS, it's not like every magblade have infinite sustain. Our sustain was fine. Not overpowered. No need for nerfs or buffs to it. It was FINE. And if something is fine, there's no need to touch it.

agree, but the worst part if they only increase the cost then ye force pulse will be superior and made on skill "useless" at least in raid scenario, will still be good for 3dd runs for dungeons

Yup. In most raids every magblade will run Force Pulse now. Funnel will be good for vma/pvp/no-healer content only.

It's funny when ZOS says that they want more diversity in builds, but making nerfs like this they push all of us to use the same abilities in our builds...

Silver_Strider

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Drachenfier

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Maulkin

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

Drachenfier

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

BigBadVolk

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

ye even in pve its still worse aoe dot then wall of elements, its just they picked a skill randomly and said ye tune it down

Maulkin

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

So if the damage component is useless for PvP then this is a PvE nerf.

Which makes sense if you consider that MagBlade is by far and away the best Magicka DPS class with practically no second at the moment? Although I'd argue we'd need to see where stamina penetration nerfs and changes to sustain (Funnel has cost increase) leave the classes.

Not that I fully agree with the change, I'm playing devil's advocate a bit, but would you prefer if Incap/Soul Harvest or Cripple got nerfed instead? I'd wager not.

Drachenfier

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

So if the damage component is useless for PvP then this is a PvE nerf.

Which makes sense if you consider that MagBlade is by far and away the best Magicka DPS class with practically no second at the moment? Although I'd argue we'd need to see where stamina penetration nerfs and changes to sustain (Funnel has cost increase) leave the classes.

Not that I fully agree with the change, I'm playing devil's advocate a bit, but would you prefer if Incap/Soul Harvest or Cripple got nerfed instead? I'd wager not.

Honestly, I don't use them So I wouldn't care. I've stated many times that I play a Shadow Knight type NB, I don't stealth or incap....oh but I do use Cripple, so I take that back And to be honest, Incap could use a nerf.

But that's completely irrelevant. There's no reason given for this change, and that's because there's not one. They just picked a skill to nerf for the hell of it, apparently. It's a low damage conal aoe, it's one of the worst aoe's in the game.

And using force pulse as a benchmark for strife? Their only similarity is that they do damage. Wat


Now, speaking to the bolded part of your statement: If anything Path needed a buff. It's completely useless in pvp right now, as it stands.

Maulkin

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

So if the damage component is useless for PvP then this is a PvE nerf.

Which makes sense if you consider that MagBlade is by far and away the best Magicka DPS class with practically no second at the moment? Although I'd argue we'd need to see where stamina penetration nerfs and changes to sustain (Funnel has cost increase) leave the classes.

Not that I fully agree with the change, I'm playing devil's advocate a bit, but would you prefer if Incap/Soul Harvest or Cripple got nerfed instead? I'd wager not.

Honestly, I don't use them So I wouldn't care. I've stated many times that I play a Shadow Knight type NB, I don't stealth or incap....oh but I do use Cripple, so I take that back

But that's completely irrelevant. There's no reason given for this change, and that's because there's not one. They just picked a skill to nerf for the hell of it, apparently. It's a low damage conal aoe, it's one of the worst aoe's in the game.

And using force pulse as a benchmark for strife? Their only similarity is that they do damage. Wat

Now, speaking to the bolded part of your statement: If anything Path needed a buff. It's completely useless in pvp right now, as it stands.

The bolded statement makes no sense mate. They've given no reason for any of the changes yet, not just this one, because they haven't spoken to us about them and because they are not final.

But I've given a pretty good reason why that may be. Because they would probably and reasonably want to nerf Magblade DPS without hurting the class in PvP much.

Drachenfier

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'll adapt.
Sure, it sucks having to adapt but it's not as though we aren't getting a plethora of new toys to help us adapt this time around. I mean, between Jewelry traits and Psijic Skills (Infused Weapons will be mandatory so we'll have to adjust regardless)

More upset by Path nerf than Strife nerf TBH.

Adapting doesn't bother me, but seeing a weak ass AOE like Path get nerfed while Hurricane does so much damage just annoys the crap out of me.

Were you using Twisting Path over Refreshing Path in PvP

I've used both, and obviously the damage component for both is useless in pvp. Not so for Hurricane, mind you, so i'm not sure why Path is getting nerfed.

No reason given, just nerfing it.

So if the damage component is useless for PvP then this is a PvE nerf.

Which makes sense if you consider that MagBlade is by far and away the best Magicka DPS class with practically no second at the moment? Although I'd argue we'd need to see where stamina penetration nerfs and changes to sustain (Funnel has cost increase) leave the classes.

Not that I fully agree with the change, I'm playing devil's advocate a bit, but would you prefer if Incap/Soul Harvest or Cripple got nerfed instead? I'd wager not.

Honestly, I don't use them So I wouldn't care. I've stated many times that I play a Shadow Knight type NB, I don't stealth or incap....oh but I do use Cripple, so I take that back

But that's completely irrelevant. There's no reason given for this change, and that's because there's not one. They just picked a skill to nerf for the hell of it, apparently. It's a low damage conal aoe, it's one of the worst aoe's in the game.

And using force pulse as a benchmark for strife? Their only similarity is that they do damage. Wat

Now, speaking to the bolded part of your statement: If anything Path needed a buff. It's completely useless in pvp right now, as it stands.

The bolded statement makes no sense mate. They've given no reason for any of the changes yet, not just this one, because they haven't spoken to us about them and because they are not final.

But I've given a pretty good reason why that may be. Because they would probably and reasonably want to nerf Magblade DPS without hurting the class in PvP much.

It makes no sense? It's a crap ability in pvp and mediocre at best in pve. What possible justification could they have for nerfing Twisting Path? Have you ever seen a thread or a complaint anywhere at any time that gave any indication from any player that Path was OP in any way?

No, is the answer you're looking for. So again, I reiterate - there's no reason for this change. If nobody uses it in pvp, then the vast majority of the complaints against NB are ignored by this change, and it does nothing but screw those that use it in PvE.

Doctordarkspawn

Honestly after looking over some things and the build freedom with the glorious jewelcrafting changes I have to agree it isn't really that much of a problem. Plus, they filtered heavy-attacks in as our main means of recovery. It is what it is.

However, I dont think it'll be that much of a problem. The jewelcrafting potential will help with what Magblade loses as it stands.