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Buff 2-4 piece traits on Major Defile sets (Fasalla's Guile/Durok's Bane)

ewhite106b16_ESO
ewhite106b16_ESO
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These sets are really needed in group PVP with how out of control healing has gotten, but aside from the 5 piece debuff the rest of the set bonuses are utter trash. There's a ton of ways to get max health, healing taken/health recovery are IMO trash compared to other bonuses in PVP. What you end up with especially with 1 character trying to use both these sets is someone who sits there and debuffs healing....that's about all they can do effectively and it's boring as hell. Having the heal debuff "cost" a five piece set bonus vs damage/utility/survivability is enough.

In terms of possible 2-4 piece bonuses having one set designed for magicka chars and another for stamina could work, or hybrid set stats.
Edited by ewhite106b16_ESO on February 25, 2018 11:10PM
  • IZZEFlameLash
    IZZEFlameLash
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    5pc bonus makes up for it. And if you change any of 2-4 piece bonuses, these sets will become even more OP. DO NOT WANT.
    Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel
  • CatchMeTrolling
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    So they could be even more annoying, I honestly feel as though defile is performing much better than healing right now. Defile is so accessible and the fact you can stack it is silly as hell in the current meta.
    Edited by CatchMeTrolling on February 25, 2018 11:24PM
  • ewhite106b16_ESO
    ewhite106b16_ESO
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    5pc bonus makes up for it. And if you change any of 2-4 piece bonuses, these sets will become even more OP. DO NOT WANT.

    These sets aren't OP at all, they are a necessary counter to the insane amount of healing in PVP, especially from "ball" groups. Making these sets more viable for small group use and more fun to run overall is going to help counter the zerg balls, and over the top healing in general. Right now, the zerg ball can afford to have players that don't do much of anything other then sit around and debuff, small groups can't. Healers get to have fun...the same stats that boost healing also boost damage, and the 2-4 piece traits on the main pvp healing sets aren't garbage....so why should players set up to counter healers be stuck with garabage set bonuses?

    EDIT: Zergs are already running this set, changing the bonus setup won't make much of a difference there. Better bonuses DO make the sets much more viable for small groups or individuals though.
    Edited by ewhite106b16_ESO on February 26, 2018 1:00AM
  • Tonturri
    Tonturri
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    I can get durok's to apply a...-45% heal debuff I believe in cp. That's ridiculous, especially for something that can be backbarred.

    Defiles can currently almost.completely negate . You can get...what, 60-70% reduced healing? I don't have many cp into the star, but would get 65% healing debuff.

    Buffing the sets will only have those small groups you want to help end up with the debuffs on them as well if you make the sets more attractive to zergs, who will have to do nothing but get hit in order to p much spell the end of the smaller group.

    This is only a viable change once the cp star to buff defiles is toned down.
  • ewhite106b16_ESO
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    Tonturri wrote: »
    I can get durok's to apply a...-45% heal debuff I believe in cp. That's ridiculous, especially for something that can be backbarred.

    Defiles can currently almost.completely negate . You can get...what, 60-70% reduced healing? I don't have many cp into the star, but would get 65% healing debuff.

    Buffing the sets will only have those small groups you want to help end up with the debuffs on them as well if you make the sets more attractive to zergs, who will have to do nothing but get hit in order to p much spell the end of the smaller group.

    This is only a viable change once the cp star to buff defiles is toned down.

    There's nothing wrong with Durok's + CP getting a 45% heal debuff. Not when there's such a rediculous amount of healing in PVP, especially when you stack multiple sources (EG troll king mask + lingering heal potions + vigor) and that's a rather low end example. The zergs are already running Durok's/Fasalla's, it's small groups/individuals who really need the healing debuffs but get hit alot harder by the poor 2-4 piece bonuses.

    The real problem here is WAY too much healing in PVP to begin with, what I"m proposing is buffing existing tools to counter healing in PVP rather then nerfing PVP heals directly using the battle spirit multiplier.
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
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    I think you're healing synopsis comes from only large scale battle (and CP) point of view.

    Imo over all PvP, defile is much more powerful than heals.

    Like in your example earth gore is probably seen a lot, while in BGs it's never seen
    Gamer tag: DasPanzerKat NA Xbox One
    1300+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er

    Waffennacht' Builds
  • Ragnarock41
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    hurr durr countering ball groups

    Stop throwing *** arguments, every single ball group has a few defile bots now, You can't even make a raid without defile bots anymore because if you do not have them and the other team does, its GG.

    and no, befoul is not fine, its overperforming.

    How can anyone with a brain can think this set will affect everyone the same?

    It forces the enemy team to also run defile bots so both sides are fair. This is just intentional power creep, nothing more.
    Edited by Ragnarock41 on February 26, 2018 1:33AM
  • IZZEFlameLash
    IZZEFlameLash
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    5pc bonus makes up for it. And if you change any of 2-4 piece bonuses, these sets will become even more OP. DO NOT WANT.

    These sets aren't OP at all, they are a necessary counter to the insane amount of healing in PVP, especially from "ball" groups. Making these sets more viable for small group use and more fun to run overall is going to help counter the zerg balls, and over the top healing in general. Right now, the zerg ball can afford to have players that don't do much of anything other then sit around and debuff, small groups can't. Healers get to have fun...the same stats that boost healing also boost damage, and the 2-4 piece traits on the main pvp healing sets aren't garbage....so why should players set up to counter healers be stuck with garabage set bonuses?

    EDIT: Zergs are already running this set, changing the bonus setup won't make much of a difference there. Better bonuses DO make the sets much more viable for small groups or individuals though.

    It will make a difference when you change the set bonuses to more combat oriented stat. Larger groups will always take better advantage of what's supposed to favor smaller groups. To be honest, unless larger group is an unorganized mess or really outplayed, it shouldn't be the case that smaller groups wiping larger groups. Guild groups that outplayed larger groups wiped their outnumbering enemies even before the AOE cap removal.

    Also, smaller groups already have a dedicated defiler running fasalla+durok already in most cases or spread the burdens out by 1 set on 1 person another person running another defile sets. Defile sets do not need buffs at all. They have their places and they are already quite good at what they do. You don't even need that high of damage to kill with those sets around. Sustain is just resource management. Especially when it is stamina character running those sets. I believe you have not seen these sets in action much. I ran it before and boy it is a brutal and fun punishment for healbots wasting their resources for near 0 heals done. If those changed bonuses made sustain better, no other damage sets can compare to what defile sets will be capable of. How will you do damage when you are heavily pressured from that virtually unhealable damage while defiler is sustaining and forcing you to take defensive measures? It is already strong and people are pairing these sets with their builds with decent support sets already. No real need for changes.
    Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel
  • Ultimate_Overlord
    Ultimate_Overlord
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    Buff stamblades! There are too many dumb defile tanks using durok and fasalla in pvp.
  • Ragnarock41
    Ragnarock41
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    Buff stamblades! There are too many dumb defile tanks using durok and fasalla in pvp.

    Your class has major defile on incap, which is dirt cheap and can be spammed very frequently.

    I would go ahead and tell you why your post is very dumb ,but really there is no point.

    On the other side of the coin yes, Your observation game is on point, there are too many dumb defile tanks using durok/fasalla and befoul CP.

    This is an issue because ZOS didn't want to nerf the healbots and their broken purge spam, but instead they introduced a broken CP that destroys anything that isnt a healbot.
    Edited by Ragnarock41 on February 26, 2018 8:09AM
  • Ultimate_Overlord
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    @Ragnarock41 Man, i really dont wanna be rude, but please dont lose yourself in the stamblade qq so much that you cant even recognise obvious sarcasm.
  • Ragnarock41
    Ragnarock41
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    @Ragnarock41 Man, i really dont wanna be rude, but please dont lose yourself in the stamblade qq so much that you cant even recognise obvious sarcasm.

    How can I tell whats sarcastic in a topic asking for even more defile meta buffs? Lol this game is so full of ignorance I can't tell who is serious and who is just being sarcastic.
    Edited by Ragnarock41 on February 26, 2018 10:12AM
  • Feanor
    Feanor
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    These sets encourage zerging. Because the only way you won’t feel being defiled by Duroks and Fasallas is running in a zerg where you have so much overheal that even 45% is nothing.

    Meanwhile in solo and small groups you feel it very much because it can effectively shut down any healing you’ll ever get.

    If you buff the sets they are even more ridiculous than now. The issues would be lesser if anyone had access to a solid purge. But efficient Purge is trash (only 2 effects, costs a ton) and even for Templars the cost increase on ritual has made it harder to maintain purging. Whereas Duroks applies major defile practically with 100% uptime. It’s stupid.
    Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:
    Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard Stamplar
    All chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.
  • CatchMeTrolling
    CatchMeTrolling
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    Btw there’s also crest of cyrodiil which offers damage , health and healing received.
  • Rohaus
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    it’s funny to me that all of a sudden people realize how strong major defile is... where were you people a year+ ago? Oh, that’s right, you were complaining about Black Rose and proc sets...
    YouTube channel Rohaus Lives!
    Daggerfall Covenant
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  • CatchMeTrolling
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    Rohaus wrote: »
    it’s funny to me that all of a sudden people realize how strong major defile is... where were you people a year+ ago? Oh, that’s right, you were complaining about Black Rose and proc sets...

    You mention those as if they weren’t a problem but I don’t think I ever seen someone down play major defile. Defile has been popular, the difference is defile is stronger than it was a year+ ago. The game itself is different from a year+ ago.
  • Dragath
    Dragath
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    yes, buff 2-4 bonuses and nerf the 5pc bonus -> balanced
  • IZZEFlameLash
    IZZEFlameLash
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    Rohaus wrote: »
    it’s funny to me that all of a sudden people realize how strong major defile is... where were you people a year+ ago? Oh, that’s right, you were complaining about Black Rose and proc sets...

    Most organized guild groups ran defiles way before this problem became prominent in the current meta post Morrowind (befoul star). People already new how strong defile was. Black Rose if you ask me was only OP with Redguard passive because it was basically double resource returns and before the change, Redguard passive benefited from stacking stamina. Without Redguard passive, it was as OP as Desert Rose proc now. Which isn't too much.
    Edited by IZZEFlameLash on February 27, 2018 5:36AM
    Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel
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