is the success of things like monster hunter world proof that solo =/= easy?

Wing

for instance, if you say I want to be able to solo something, everyone assumes nerf. (in some cases though this is in fact what some players mean)

but in my case I love soloing the vvardenfell world bosses (those you can, a few have mechanics that you cannot solo, wrothgar is worse in most cases as the amount of adds and damage overwhelms you)

I like the fairly long fights that I can win, but a false move can mean death, but if I manage and time stuff right I come out with a sense of accomplishment like I figured something out or used my skills to achieve something.

(as opposed to for instance a tank holding agro while heals are spammed on him and go for broke DPS nukes a boss)

I would love more world bosses that were singular world bosses (without piles of adds or multiple people required mechanics) that could in fact one hit you if you didn't block right or dodge right, but clearly indicated said attacks and didn't have required multiple people mechanics.

these would play fun, and arguably age better, as for instance some wrothgar world bosses were designed with having raids in mind, when they summon adds they summon LOTS of very hard htting adds all at once and if you try to solo them it will straight up wipe you.

so please ZOS, look at Monster hunter world as inspiration and for ideas of how to do world bosses in the future, so that we can solo them if we want, but its not easy and we can come out with a sense of accomplishment.

HorrorShow

I remember Age of Conan adding solo instance near the end. Dungeons meant to be soloed that were kinda challenging until you got the hang of them.

The problem with solo content is that if not every class/spec can do it, people scream bloody murder.

I play a magblade tank with self heals up the wazoo and decent dps. Love taking on world bosses. But when I played magblade DPS with a focus on being good dps in dungeons, I could not solo a world boss for my life.

So while I enjoy the solo content that is hard, I just don't think they can make it hard and something that all classes could partake in equally.

Tannus15

HorrorShow wrote: »

I remember Age of Conan adding solo instance near the end. Dungeons meant to be soloed that were kinda challenging until you got the hang of them.

The problem with solo content is that if not every class/spec can do it, people scream bloody murder.

I play a magblade tank with self heals up the wazoo and decent dps. Love taking on world bosses. But when I played magblade DPS with a focus on being good dps in dungeons, I could not solo a world boss for my life.

So while I enjoy the solo content that is hard, I just don't think they can make it hard and something that all classes could partake in equally.

All classes can, I've done it with all classes, but you have to focus a build around it. Heavy armour and self heals are paramount. Knight-errant is probably the best armour in the game for this. combine it with a stam dps helm, or even tremor scale, and a stam dps set like VO or TFS and you're good to go.

Wing

HorrorShow wrote: »

I remember Age of Conan adding solo instance near the end. Dungeons meant to be soloed that were kinda challenging until you got the hang of them.

The problem with solo content is that if not every class/spec can do it, people scream bloody murder.

I play a magblade tank with self heals up the wazoo and decent dps. Love taking on world bosses. But when I played magblade DPS with a focus on being good dps in dungeons, I could not solo a world boss for my life.

So while I enjoy the solo content that is hard, I just don't think they can make it hard and something that all classes could partake in equally.

mmmm I figure most of the problem mechanics are the ones requiring you to know when to dodge / block / avoid, and that tends to be class neutral, and as long as telegraphs are proper (and that's really the KEY! thing things like monster hunter or dark souls nail) then its more based on the player.

as I stated I think the huge thing the most people don't think about when they say "oh its the dark souls of blah blah" is what that really means. as I see it its really the telegraphs, there so well done and really allow fights to be challenging but fair as long as your paying attention.

if bosses in eso took a bit more time in pre animation leading up to obvious effects they could hit harder and I don't think people would mind as much, as long as there was some way shape or form to mitigate, dodge, or avoid said effect.

that's far more rewarding then heal through it or hold block.

and yes watching for one attack to avoid sounds easy, until its many different attacks that have different animations leading to different effects that have different things to watch out for or avoid and your in a 10 minute fight and have to not fail once.

when you win, you feel like you really earned it and accomplished something, that same feeling is just no there when your sitting in front of a boss with heals poured into you waiting for the dps to kill it (over simplification but point made)

Faulgor

I used to run Spellscar solo every day when the Yokudan motif was first released. That proved a challenge with different builds, and was quite fun. More content like that would be great. Sadly, everything since Maelstrom Arena has been entirely formulaic (delves, public dungeons, group dungeons, trials), and the dailies in new zones have been anything but challenging (like those for Ashlander and Morag Tong motifs).

Ihatenightblades

Wing wrote: »

for instance, if you say I want to be able to solo something, everyone assumes nerf. (in some cases though this is in fact what some players mean)

but in my case I love soloing the vvardenfell world bosses (those you can, a few have mechanics that you cannot solo, wrothgar is worse in most cases as the amount of adds and damage overwhelms you)

I like the fairly long fights that I can win, but a false move can mean death, but if I manage and time stuff right I come out with a sense of accomplishment like I figured something out or used my skills to achieve something.

(as opposed to for instance a tank holding agro while heals are spammed on him and go for broke DPS nukes a boss)

I would love more world bosses that were singular world bosses (without piles of adds or multiple people required mechanics) that could in fact one hit you if you didn't block right or dodge right, but clearly indicated said attacks and didn't have required multiple people mechanics.

these would play fun, and arguably age better, as for instance some wrothgar world bosses were designed with having raids in mind, when they summon adds they summon LOTS of very hard htting adds all at once and if you try to solo them it will straight up wipe you.

so please ZOS, look at Monster hunter world as inspiration and for ideas of how to do world bosses in the future, so that we can solo them if we want, but its not easy and we can come out with a sense of accomplishment.

Look at it this way if you were able to solo every world boss ( which i know some who can ) you would be asking for more of a challenge and the only difficult content in game would be dlc vet dungeons and trials.

Solo questing can be boring mainly because everything is so easy and most of quests dont involve fighting much.

World bosses are the only difficult monsters for me outside of 4 man and 12 man content and vma which isn't difficult but getting flawless is always a challenge.

Also if you having trouble maybe run a world boss set up? Like heavy julianos for mage or heavy stam set for stamina ( theres plenty )

Other than that i would just look for a healer or tank and then you will def be good.

Last thing we need is a nerf to world bosses

Il also add that i got bored of monster hunter already and have no desire of ever playing it again. Its a really boring and repetitive game after a while with no social community whatsoever with lackluster features.

You either go and hunt a monster or do nothing. Just sucks starting a new quest over and over doing same thing just diff monster.

Games missing a huge element imo. Its still successful but wont be played after a year

Recremen

It certainly means that there are different niches in the market that are best filled by games specializing in that niche.

Iccotak

What I'd like are some form of wandering bosses.
They would be obvious so players could avoid them if they wanted to, but there would be large bosses wandering the landscape that presented a challenge for players.
Like the district bosses in Imperial City

Integral1900

Bear in mind oh ninja players... you are the minority...

I used to be the whole meta vet trial brigade, finaly just burnt out from that communities stifling hypocrisy. Playing normal content again has taught me one thing... most players will never be that good. Most don’t have the time or dedication to do it. In fact there are plenty of players with 690 cp that seem to struggle on normal fungal grotto! So before you try to dark souls this thing remember that if we are here we are not there, some players do like hard games, most don’t...

essi2

Monster Hunter World dynamically changes the monster you are fighting if more people join, I doubt that is doable in the Open World in ESO. Closest you get to something like this is how the Dolmens scale, but that wouldn't work for most World Bosses outside Wrothgar.

Bbsample197

do keep in mind that MH;W is the easiest among all of the installments

Izaki

Tannus15 wrote: »

HorrorShow wrote: »

I remember Age of Conan adding solo instance near the end. Dungeons meant to be soloed that were kinda challenging until you got the hang of them.

The problem with solo content is that if not every class/spec can do it, people scream bloody murder.

I play a magblade tank with self heals up the wazoo and decent dps. Love taking on world bosses. But when I played magblade DPS with a focus on being good dps in dungeons, I could not solo a world boss for my life.

So while I enjoy the solo content that is hard, I just don't think they can make it hard and something that all classes could partake in equally.

All classes can, I've done it with all classes, but you have to focus a build around it. Heavy armour and self heals are paramount. Knight-errant is probably the best armour in the game for this. combine it with a stam dps helm, or even tremor scale, and a stam dps set like VO or TFS and you're good to go.

Or you could just go full DPS and do everything much quicker.

Elsterchen

Wing wrote: »

for instance, if you say I want to be able to solo something, everyone assumes nerf. (in some cases though this is in fact what some players mean)

but in my case I love soloing the vvardenfell world bosses (those you can, a few have mechanics that you cannot solo, wrothgar is worse in most cases as the amount of adds and damage overwhelms you)

I like the fairly long fights that I can win, but a false move can mean death, but if I manage and time stuff right I come out with a sense of accomplishment like I figured something out or used my skills to achieve something.

(as opposed to for instance a tank holding agro while heals are spammed on him and go for broke DPS nukes a boss)

I would love more world bosses that were singular world bosses (without piles of adds or multiple people required mechanics) that could in fact one hit you if you didn't block right or dodge right, but clearly indicated said attacks and didn't have required multiple people mechanics.

these would play fun, and arguably age better, as for instance some wrothgar world bosses were designed with having raids in mind, when they summon adds they summon LOTS of very hard htting adds all at once and if you try to solo them it will straight up wipe you.

so please ZOS, look at Monster hunter world as inspiration and for ideas of how to do world bosses in the future, so that we can solo them if we want, but its not easy and we can come out with a sense of accomplishment.

Not sure you have tried, but doing dungeons solo may be fun for you, too. At least i enjoy doing them (... on normal difficulty) solo. It does take some time and one just can't solo all of them (ty zeni for placing some really debateable deviders in there, like plates to stand on... -.-). However if you like the challenge you may as well grab a key or two this way.

MLGProPlayer

I love to solo world bosses and the group delves/instances in Craglorn. That's the most PvE fun I've had in this game. The general overland stuff is beyond boring. Great quest writing, but the content doesn't challenge you in the slightest.

We need more group delves like that.

Alternatively, normal delves and public dungeons with a difficulty toggle would be nice too. Since all delves and public dungeons are instanced, they could create a vet instance if you have your dungeon finder difficulty set to vet. Just crank up the mob/boss values (more health, resistance, and damage). Nothing fancy.

TheDarkShadow

Integral1900 wrote: »

Bear in mind oh ninja players... you are the minority...

I used to be the whole meta vet trial brigade, finaly just burnt out from that communities stifling hypocrisy. Playing normal content again has taught me one thing... most players will never be that good. Most don’t have the time or dedication to do it. In fact there are plenty of players with 690 cp that seem to struggle on normal fungal grotto! So before you try to dark souls this thing remember that if we are here we are not there, some players do like hard games, most don’t...

They can let the player control the spawn/pull speed. For example skyreach, you can choose to pull everything at once or slowly clean from room to room. Of course the reward must worth something for doing these contents. Motifs are the tradition but it can also be transmute stones, few dozens raw crafting mats, housing items, a part of a runebox for pet/outfit... A good player can pull multiple groups and finish the daily fast while enjoying the challenge, but if you die you are kicked out of the dungeon/failed the quest and have to wait 1 hour before the daily available again. Normal players can still do it slowly but surely pulling 1 group/time.

Runefang

I play mmos for the Multiplayer part. Spending hours playing solo isn't really what I signed up for.

Solo never had to be easy but I'd rather it was so I can get it over with.

blacksghost

I suspect that the avg player, like me, ends up doing Craglorn group stuff, solo not so much out of choice but out of a lack of others willing to randomly group.

I like that stuff gets harder and some stuff is a matter of returning to later but making content that the avg player will never manage is just demoralising.

Doctordarkspawn

Tannus15 wrote: »

HorrorShow wrote: »

I remember Age of Conan adding solo instance near the end. Dungeons meant to be soloed that were kinda challenging until you got the hang of them.

The problem with solo content is that if not every class/spec can do it, people scream bloody murder.

I play a magblade tank with self heals up the wazoo and decent dps. Love taking on world bosses. But when I played magblade DPS with a focus on being good dps in dungeons, I could not solo a world boss for my life.

So while I enjoy the solo content that is hard, I just don't think they can make it hard and something that all classes could partake in equally.

All classes can, I've done it with all classes, but you have to focus a build around it. Heavy armour and self heals are paramount. Knight-errant is probably the best armour in the game for this. combine it with a stam dps helm, or even tremor scale, and a stam dps set like VO or TFS and you're good to go.

You shouldn't be that gear dependant to make something viable.

Doctordarkspawn

It's been no secret that you can make easy fun, and hard fun, just as you can make hard solo content and easy solo content. Something this playerbase outright refuses to accept because it invalidates how they spend much of their time.

Will ESO ever capitalize on it? Doubt it.