Magicka PVE DPS - how are they doing after v3.3.2? Do Mag DK/Templar/Warden/Sorc need buffs?

Vaoh

So on Live, you basically only have need for Magicka Sorc and Magicka NB DPS.
- Mag Sorcs spam Asylum staff Concentrated Force Pulse to provide tons of Concussion procs for better Offbalance uptime on bosses (Increasing raid DPS). They also give Minor Prophecy aka a bit of spell crit to the group, and have nice AoE damage.
- Mag NBs put out good offheals, much higher single target damage than Sorcs, and have better mobility which is nice in trials like vAS. They also give Minor Savagery aka a bit of weapon crit to the group
- Mag DKs are significantly outclassed by Stam DPS, Mag Templar is broken and even if fixed won't be on par in single target DPS to Mag NB, and Mag Warden straight up way too weak and gives no inherent class group support unlike the other four classes (Warhorn covers their 10% health buff)


****On PTS, Offblanace has been changed dramatically, and NB DPS has also been buffed: (according to v3.3.2)****

- "Grim Focus: The stacks you build toward the bow proc for this ability and its morphs will now remain if you recast the ability early, or if the ability expires. The partial stack will be removed if you exit combat."
- "Fixed an issue where you could maintain the Off Balance debuff against boss enemies indefinitely."

As far as I can tell, Mag NBs *should* now be the absolute most powerful Mag DPS. Sorc was the only class that had a chance to be used due mainly to the importance of keeping up Off-Balance, but now any support role can easily proc it with non-NB Mag classes being basically subpar. However, I cannot test on PTS to find out myself so I'd appreciate if others posted their results and testing.

There will still be one Sorc though as a part of each group for the Conduit synergy, and it'd also make it easier on support roles if someone else provided the concussion/burning procs via Asylum Staff in order to buff Mag NBs Blockade of Flames constantly and and obviously debuff the boss with Minor Vulnerability. Still, in terms of DPS, Mag NB is likely far superior due to them not relying on Heavy Attacks like all other classes. Seems to me that similar to last patch, groups will try to fit in as much Stam DPS as possible and then fill with Mag NBs and then 1-2 Mag Sorcs. After these PTS changes I'm pretty sure that groups will first fit in as many Stam DPS as possible, then fill with Mag NB and 1 Sorc (if any). That Sorc will only be necessary if Alkosh is used.

Can people please test thoroughly because if this is all true I really don't like it. Mag Templar, Warden, DK, and Sorc should all be viable in terms of their own DPS output, and next patch it sounds like that won't be the case.


**Lastly I want to add that I actually love this change to Magicka NB. It was a good change to the functionality of the class despite Mag NB not needing a buff, and helps new players a lot while being amazing in laggy situations as well. The problem now is that Mag NB was already the #1 Mag DPS, but have now gotten buffed with the other four classes getting nerfed in the same patch. Those four classes need to be brought on par.

Masel

Vaoh wrote: »

So on Live, you basically only have need for Magicka Sorc and Magicka NB DPS.
- Mag Sorcs spam Asylum staff Concentrated Force Pulse to provide tons of Concussion procs for better Offbalance uptime on bosses (Increasing raid DPS). They also give Minor Prophecy aka a bit of spell crit to the group, and have nice AoE damage.
- Mag NBs put out good offheals, much higher single target damage than Sorcs, and have better mobility which is nice in trials like vAS. They also give Minor Savagery aka a bit of weapon crit to the group
- Mag DKs are significantly outclassed by Stam DPS, Mag Templar is broken and even if fixed won't be on par in single target DPS to Mag NB, and Mag Warden straight up way too weak and gives no inherent class group support unlike the other four classes (Warhorn covers their 10% health buff)


****On PTS, Offblanace has been changed dramatically, and NB DPS has also been buffed: (according to v3.3.2)****

- "Grim Focus: The stacks you build toward the bow proc for this ability and its morphs will now remain if you recast the ability early, or if the ability expires. The partial stack will be removed if you exit combat."
- "Fixed an issue where you could maintain the Off Balance debuff against boss enemies indefinitely."

As far as I can tell, Mag NBs *should* now be the absolute most powerful Mag DPS. Sorc was the only class that had a chance to be used due mainly to the importance of keeping up Off-Balance, but now any support role can easily proc it with non-NB Mag classes being basically subpar. However, I cannot test on PTS to find out myself so I'd appreciate if others posted their results and testing.

There will still be one Sorc though as a part of each group for the Conduit synergy, and it'd also make it easier on support roles if someone else provided the concussion/burning procs via Asylum Staff in order to buff Mag NBs Blockade of Flames constantly and and obviously debuff the boss with Minor Vulnerability. Still, in terms of DPS, Mag NB is likely far superior due to them not relying on Heavy Attacks like all other classes. Seems to me that similar to last patch, groups will try to fit in as much Stam DPS as possible and then fill with Mag NBs and then 1-2 Mag Sorcs. After these PTS changes I'm pretty sure that groups will first fit in as many Stam DPS as possible, then fill with Mag NB and 1 Sorc (if any). That Sorc will only be necessary if Alkosh is used.

Can people please test thoroughly because if this is all true I really don't like it. Mag Templar, Warden, DK, and Sorc should all be viable in terms of their own DPS output, and next patch it sounds like that won't be the case.

Agreed on all this stuff. It is just plain ridiculous and makes it look like they have no clue about what is actually used within endgame raids.

clocksstoppe

sorc needing buffs? nice meme

Masel

clocksstoppe wrote: »

sorc needing buffs? nice meme

Wow. Constructive criticism.

Sorcs were fine as they were, but as off-balance is basically useless now, they wont be needed. Magicka NBs will rule as they do now already, especially in vAS where range and mobility is key.

BlazingDynamo

Top dps class will always shift with each patch. mSorc was #1 for as long as I can possibly remember.

The only problem I can tell here is the people you run with are the ones dictating what you can bring into a trial. Any good player can make any class perform high dps. If you're good at your clsss then it shouldn't matter. If someone is telling you you're not allowed to bring something into a trial it's probably the wrong people you run with.

Tannus15

Yeah, I can't see anything in this summary which I disagree with.

Most of my trials group are slowly moving over to mag-blade or stam-dk simply because they are finding it easier to get better dps, and this is before this patch which looks like it will only widen the gap...

Liofa

Best Magicka DPS gets buffed while worst one gets nerfed even more .

Vaoh

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

Top dps class will always shift with each patch. mSorc was #1 for as long as I can possibly remember.

The only problem I can tell here is the people you run with are the ones dictating what you can bring into a trial. Any good player can make any class perform high dps. If you're good at your clsss then it shouldn't matter. If someone is telling you you're not allowed to bring something into a trial it's probably the wrong people you run with.

@BlazingDynamo Sorry but that's just not true. High DPS achieved through player skill is expected, not something that is used to dictate what class you play ("high dps" is also completely subjective). Class balance and changes in fundamental game mechanics define what is best. As of right now, Stam DPS and Mag NB is best. Sorc was only used due to their great group support, but now they have lost the most important part of it.

You said it yourself - "mSorc was #1 for as long as I can possibly remember."
That means there *is* a best despite you saying it shouldn't matter. I actually 100% agree with you that it should not matter what class you play yet that is where balance currently is. It matters tremendously. Ever seen a DK Healers become taken for more than just feeling unique? Didn't think so.

The mentality you're talking about is the "play how you want to play" sorta thing which is true if you run Vet Fungal Grotto but not if you run Vet Trial Hard Modes. I can bring Magicka Warden into vHoF but no matter how well I perform, it doesn't come even close to what a Mag NB can do. The DPS output achievable by Magicka Warden is literally not even close.

ak_pvp

Liofa wrote: »

Best Magicka DPS gets buffed while worst one gets nerfed even more .

Yeet.

Who is worst now? MDK or Magden?

Vaoh

ak_pvp wrote: »

Liofa wrote: »

Best Magicka DPS gets buffed while worst one gets nerfed even more .

Yeet.

Who is worst now? MDK or Magden?

Mag DK is worse imo. Mag Warden can at least use Eternal Guardian (75ult cost) with Master Architect to buff their allies pretty consistently. Mag DKs take the spot of a Stam DPS and do basically nothing for the group. Tanks can provide Engulfing Flames ._.

LiquidPony

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

Top dps class will always shift with each patch. mSorc was #1 for as long as I can possibly remember.

The only problem I can tell here is the people you run with are the ones dictating what you can bring into a trial. Any good player can make any class perform high dps. If you're good at your clsss then it shouldn't matter. If someone is telling you you're not allowed to bring something into a trial it's probably the wrong people you run with.

Oy vey.

Some groups want to push for high scores or faster times or get that edge that finally gets them a DD title or whatever. In those groups, you don't always get to run what you want to run, you run what's best for the group, so yeah ... the group absolutely does dictate what you can bring into a Trial.

There's nothing "wrong" with those people, they're just playing for different reasons than you are and the people who stick around in that crowd are totally willing do run whatever build/gear/rotation is necessary to help the group. That's the point.

rustic_potato

Well I'm glad I made my nNB after the downfall of magplar.

The mNB were a class that required perfection to achieve ridiculous numbers with this change the difficulty threshold of playing mNB has been reduced significantly. The number of times of cursing and pulling out hairs when it recasted the ability instead of firing the bow on the fifth weave no longer exists.

Also NB is the only class that has a non exploiter spec that performs better than exploiter sec on a target dummy because *** sustain for other classes.

Ranged - check
Top DPS - check
Self sustainable - check
Difficulty threshold removed - check
Shrugs off balance changes - check

mNB is here to stay folks. So might as well enjoy it while it lasts.

Also: Slaughter PVE mDK - check

Vaoh

rustic_potato wrote: »

Well I'm glad I made my nNB after the downfall of magplar.

The mNB were a class that required perfection to achieve ridiculous numbers with this change the difficulty threshold of playing mNB has been reduced significantly. The number of times of cursing and pulling out hairs when it recasted the ability instead of firing the bow on the fifth weave no longer exists.

Also NB is the only class that has a non exploiter spec that performs better than exploiter sec on a target dummy because *** sustain for other classes.

Ranged - check
Top DPS - check
Self sustainable - check
Difficulty threshold removed - check
Shrugs off balance changes - check

mNB is here to stay folks. So might as well enjoy it while it lasts.

Also: Slaughter PVE mDK - check

Yup. Exactly this

Please test on PTS if you have a chance. I really want to get an idea of how each Mag DPS is performing to know how far ahead Mag NB is due to the off balance changes and pretty large (but very good imo) buff to Grim Focus.

Liofa

ak_pvp wrote: »

Yeet.

Who is worst now? MDK or Magden?

mDK is literally the worst class you can play in any PvE content lol . Good job ZOS ...

LadyLethalla

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

Vaoh

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

vMA is really based on how proficient you are with the arena itself. Experience in vMA is absolutely #1.

With that said, Mag Sorc might still be easiest in vMA since they have pets that are great for players who are still inexperienced with the arena. Mag NB is just as easy though if not easier when you are experienced with the arena.

Another thing is that with this change, Mag NB itself became *much* easier to use.

As long as you don't run vMA on a Warden, Templar, or (don't do it) a DK, the arena shouldn't be so bad. Sorc and NB are both great choices.

LadyLethalla

Vaoh wrote: »

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

vMA is really based on how proficient you are with the arena itself. Experience in vMA is absolutely #1.

With that said, Mag Sorc might still be easiest in vMA since they have pets that are great for players who are still inexperienced with the arena. Mag NB is just as easy though if not easier when you are experienced with the arena.

Another thing is that with this change, Mag NB itself became *much* easier to use.

As long as you don't run vMA on a Warden, Templar, or (don't do it) a DK, the arena shouldn't be so bad. Sorc and NB are both great choices.

I think a lot of it comes down to lag as well... refer to the last line of my signature... I can get right up to the very last boss on EU but haven't had any luck getting through the crystal phase. Hell, I can't even consistently get TO the crystal phase yet.
It's a difficult place to learn, made worse by lag. It's also entirely possible that I managed to get that far on pure luck. So I'm now levelling a MSorc's CP in the hope of lag being a bit less on NA.

Liofa

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

@LadyLethalla

I agree with Vaoh . Experience will make vMA easy above anything else . PetSorc is still easiest class to complete vMA with though . Just keep your pets and yourself shielded . Blockade + Liquid Lightning + Familiar Pulse + Heavy Attacks = easy vMA clear . Just cast Power Surge from back bar and keep it up all the time . That's all you need in vMA as a PetSorc . You literally have everything you need in a single skill bar . Burst Heal , Huge Shield , Insane AOE and Single Target DPS . You can also slot Boundless Storm on back bar for extra cheese .

Vaoh

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

vMA is really based on how proficient you are with the arena itself. Experience in vMA is absolutely #1.

With that said, Mag Sorc might still be easiest in vMA since they have pets that are great for players who are still inexperienced with the arena. Mag NB is just as easy though if not easier when you are experienced with the arena.

Another thing is that with this change, Mag NB itself became *much* easier to use.

As long as you don't run vMA on a Warden, Templar, or (don't do it) a DK, the arena shouldn't be so bad. Sorc and NB are both great choices.

I think a lot of it comes down to lag as well... refer to the last line of my signature... I can get right up to the very last boss on EU but haven't had any luck getting through the crystal phase. Hell, I can't even consistently get TO the crystal phase yet.
It's a difficult place to learn, made worse by lag. It's also entirely possible that I managed to get that far on pure luck. So I'm now levelling a MSorc's CP in the hope of lag being a bit less on NA.

Good point with the lag In that case honestly just go Pet Sorc. It will probably always be the easiest vMA class. You won't pull a good score, and you will have a long run in general, but completing the arena should be much more doable as someone who hasn't already completed it like 10+ times (when it starts to just feel super easy imo).

LadyLethalla

Liofa wrote: »

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Would this also mean that MNB would be "easiest" to complete VMA on...? Please say no... not now that I've levelled a mSorc on NA.

@LadyLethalla

I agree with Vaoh . Experience will make vMA easy above anything else . PetSorc is still easiest class to complete vMA with though . Just keep your pets and yourself shielded . Blockade + Liquid Lightning + Familiar Pulse + Heavy Attacks = easy vMA clear . Just cast Power Surge from back bar and keep it up all the time . That's all you need in vMA as a PetSorc . You literally have everything you need in a single skill bar . Burst Heal , Huge Shield , Insane AOE and Single Target DPS . You can also slot Boundless Storm on back bar for extra cheese .

Oh I know what I need to do but there are a lot of times when I don't dare swap bars to cast Power Surge...

@Vaoh I look forward to that xD

xaraan

Don't forget with all these little dps nerfs that directly effect the dps classes, the changes that hit tanks will add up and keep them from using sets like alkosh and the like (in high end content) which will also effect dps.

Granted, this might not effect the 1% awesome guild people that clear vHM trials the first week as tanking for a great team is A LOT easier than tanking for just a decent or ok team of more casual (but still serious) players. (You can even see this in 4 man dungeons - the difference between doing a vHM Falkreath run with a polished group vs pugging it can be insane). But to most of the people tanking - running buff sets will cost them a lot more than running selfish sets just to help them keep up resources and tankiness. So it's worth taking that into consideration when looking at overall group dps ups and downs.

Hamburglarjones

All you can do is laugh

BlazingDynamo

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference. I don't understand why you're saying their dps output will be higher, what exactly is changing that's going to shove the dps up? How have they been "buffed"?

rustic_potato

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference. I don't understand why you're saying their dps output will be higher, what exactly is changing that's going to shove the dps up? How have they been "buffed"?

Well the off balance changes will hurt sustain and DPS of all magika classes except mNB. They dont use HA for sustain and they have CP specs that dont rely on the exploiter passive.

I agree that all classes are viable. It is possible to have a heavy attack based mDK that can do 30k on a target skeleton. But for harder content like hard modes and such NB just became the king of magika DPS.

BlazingDynamo

rustic_potato wrote: »

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference. I don't understand why you're saying their dps output will be higher, what exactly is changing that's going to shove the dps up? How have they been "buffed"?

Well the off balance changes will hurt sustain and DPS of all magika classes except mNB. They dont use HA for sustain and they have CP specs that dont rely on the exploiter passive.

I agree that all classes are viable. It is possible to have a heavy attack based mDK that can do 30k on a target skeleton. But for harder content like hard modes and such NB just became the king of magika DPS.

That's not a direct change to Nightblades though. It's gonna have a different effect on every class, that's just one thing Nightblades have over others. Better sustain. They've always had that and just because Zos has changed the way the game works they shouldn't be punished for it. NBs always brought great utility and mobility to trials and now they're really shining.

I remember running HM vAA back before things got scaled up with 12 Nightblades because you could tank, heal, off heal and dps on them tremendously lol they're a fun class with alot to offer but lets not crush them for it.

Vaoh

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference.

In laggy situations though (at least for console players) it’ll be a huge change, and regardless it’s a pretty big buff. Mag NB was already ahead of all other Mag DPS in CWC. However, a large flaw of Mag NBs was that the skill cap was very high in their rotation so pulling those big numbers was tough. That’s no longer the case, and on top of it all other Mag DPS just got nerfed.

You’re correct, but the issue isn’t just that Mag NB is ahead, but rather that they are ahead by a lot. Like Mag Sorc strong..... back when Mag Sorcs were ridiculous. Mag NB crushes the other classes to the point where you are *gimping* yourself to play another class.

I’m not sure how good of a player you are in terms of endgame PvE, but in my situation you are definitely correct but only because (no I *do not* want to brag but there’s no other way to get the point across from my own experience) I tend to pull more DPS on my Mag Warden than the vast majority of endgame players do on their Mag NB/Sorcs this patch. I’m just very experienced with it because I’ve put so much time into endgame stuff.... and because I only run Warden on fun runs in vHoF/vMoL where the Eternal Guardian is viable.

Yet for all of those players who can’t even beat Vet trials or struggle immensely, there is zero reason to choose something besides Mag NB. Same as when Sorc was OP. Why purposely pull way less DPS when you already struggle with content and need to complete? That’s selfish at the expense of the 11 others in your group. If the gap was small it would not be an issue, but the gap isn’t small. Also Mag NBs give offheals...... they are legit far too above the other Mag classes.

The few players that can push very high scores choose the best classes too because that’s how they’ll push the highest scores. What I’m trying to say is, the only players that can actually make use of any class in clearing content are the very best players, who only do it on “fun runs” anyway. As for everyone else? Mag NB is going to be too far ahead to avoid using, and you’ll get yelled at/talked behind your back probably for not using it. Just not good for the game

Anyway I made this thread to see if Mag NB is truly that far ahead atm. I really hope not but based on the changes idk how they won’t be.

rustic_potato

Vaoh wrote: »

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference.

In laggy situations though (at least for console players) it’ll be a huge change, and regardless it’s a pretty big buff. Mag NB was already ahead of all other Mag DPS in CWC. However, a large flaw of Mag NBs was that the skill cap was very high in their rotation so pulling those big numbers was tough. That’s no longer the case, and on top of it all other Mag DPS just got nerfed.

You’re correct, but the issue isn’t just that Mag NB is ahead, but rather that they are ahead by a lot. Like Mag Sorc strong..... back when Mag Sorcs were ridiculous. Mag NB crushes the other classes to the point where you are *gimping* yourself to play another class.

I’m not sure how good of a player you are in terms of endgame PvE, but in my situation you are definitely correct but only because (no I *do not* want to brag but there’s no other way to get the point across from my own experience) I tend to pull more DPS on my Mag Warden than the vast majority of endgame players do on their Mag NB/Sorcs this patch. I’m just very experienced with it because I’ve put so much time into endgame stuff.... and because I only run Warden on fun runs in vHoF/vMoL where the Eternal Guardian is viable.

Yet for all of those players who can’t even beat Vet trials or struggle immensely, there is zero reason to choose something besides Mag NB. Same as when Sorc was OP. Why purposely pull way less DPS when you already struggle with content and need to complete? That’s selfish at the expense of the 11 others in your group. If the gap was small it would not be an issue, but the gap isn’t small. Also Mag NBs give offheals...... they are legit far too above the other Mag classes.

The few players that can push very high scores choose the best classes too because that’s how they’ll push the highest scores. What I’m trying to say is, the only players that can actually make use of any class in clearing content are the very best players, who only do it on “fun runs” anyway. As for everyone else? Mag NB is going to be too far ahead to avoid using, and you’ll get yelled at/talked behind your back probably for not using it. Just not good for the game

Anyway I made this thread to see if Mag NB is truly that far ahead atm. I really hope not but based on the changes idk how they won’t be.

Well this is a repeat of homestead mSorc situation. I dont know how much viable stam is going to be compared to mNB. They got hit hard by the off balance change too and NB was already pulling comparable numbers.

I am not really complaining about the class cos it is the only class that rewards skilled gameplay right now. Though I miss the times I could Jab and Beam and out dps everyone in the raid lol.

Vaoh

rustic_potato wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference.

In laggy situations though (at least for console players) it’ll be a huge change, and regardless it’s a pretty big buff. Mag NB was already ahead of all other Mag DPS in CWC. However, a large flaw of Mag NBs was that the skill cap was very high in their rotation so pulling those big numbers was tough. That’s no longer the case, and on top of it all other Mag DPS just got nerfed.

You’re correct, but the issue isn’t just that Mag NB is ahead, but rather that they are ahead by a lot. Like Mag Sorc strong..... back when Mag Sorcs were ridiculous. Mag NB crushes the other classes to the point where you are *gimping* yourself to play another class.

I’m not sure how good of a player you are in terms of endgame PvE, but in my situation you are definitely correct but only because (no I *do not* want to brag but there’s no other way to get the point across from my own experience) I tend to pull more DPS on my Mag Warden than the vast majority of endgame players do on their Mag NB/Sorcs this patch. I’m just very experienced with it because I’ve put so much time into endgame stuff.... and because I only run Warden on fun runs in vHoF/vMoL where the Eternal Guardian is viable.

Yet for all of those players who can’t even beat Vet trials or struggle immensely, there is zero reason to choose something besides Mag NB. Same as when Sorc was OP. Why purposely pull way less DPS when you already struggle with content and need to complete? That’s selfish at the expense of the 11 others in your group. If the gap was small it would not be an issue, but the gap isn’t small. Also Mag NBs give offheals...... they are legit far too above the other Mag classes.

The few players that can push very high scores choose the best classes too because that’s how they’ll push the highest scores. What I’m trying to say is, the only players that can actually make use of any class in clearing content are the very best players, who only do it on “fun runs” anyway. As for everyone else? Mag NB is going to be too far ahead to avoid using, and you’ll get yelled at/talked behind your back probably for not using it. Just not good for the game

Anyway I made this thread to see if Mag NB is truly that far ahead atm. I really hope not but based on the changes idk how they won’t be.

Well this is a repeat of homestead mSorc situation. I dont know how much viable stam is going to be compared to mNB. They got hit hard by the off balance change too and NB was already pulling comparable numbers.

I am not really complaining about the class cos it is the only class that rewards skilled gameplay right now. Though I miss the times I could Jab and Beam and out dps everyone in the raid lol.

Stam should be fine. In Asylum (especially HM) I bet there will be all Magblades though

To be clear I don’t want any nerfs to Mag NB. Like zero. They are perfect rn and in a great spot, plus after this specific buff the “floor” has been raised a lot to be much more friendly to those who haven’t put like 1000 hours into their Mag NB lol.

The other Mag classes need to be brought up quite a lot, some more than others.

beetleklee

Gonna level up a MagNB, I've had a level 4 one sitting for a while now. Guess my MagDK will be crafter only until ZOS actually buffs them...but yeah after a year of nerfs that seems unlikely lol.

BlazingDynamo

Vaoh wrote: »

BlazingDynamo wrote: »

My point may have been missed or perhaps I did a poor job at explaining it. But what I was trying to say is one class (or at least from what we've seen with eso thus far) will stand out from the rest as far as dps goes and yes if you want top scores and speed runs you'll have to run that group composition. But regardless any class can be made into a vet trials class with more than enough dps to provide what's wanted as far as clearing the content goes.

I wouldn't exactly say the other classes are behind because of this they just unfortunately no longer meet that top end dps spot. They're still extremely viable.

Perfect balance is never going to be achieved in this game as long as pvp and pve have no seperate balances. Best just play another class when the other isn't performing as well. Sucks but one day Zos might figure it out.

Also I really gotta say this slight change to NBs Grim Focus isn't going to push their dps any higher..only gotta make it easier for those to hit a higher dps that don't have the skilled hands as someone already getting a 3 bow proc in rotation. The players already achieving this wont see a difference.

In laggy situations though (at least for console players) it’ll be a huge change, and regardless it’s a pretty big buff. Mag NB was already ahead of all other Mag DPS in CWC. However, a large flaw of Mag NBs was that the skill cap was very high in their rotation so pulling those big numbers was tough. That’s no longer the case, and on top of it all other Mag DPS just got nerfed.

You’re correct, but the issue isn’t just that Mag NB is ahead, but rather that they are ahead by a lot. Like Mag Sorc strong..... back when Mag Sorcs were ridiculous. Mag NB crushes the other classes to the point where you are *gimping* yourself to play another class.

I’m not sure how good of a player you are in terms of endgame PvE, but in my situation you are definitely correct but only because (no I *do not* want to brag but there’s no other way to get the point across from my own experience) I tend to pull more DPS on my Mag Warden than the vast majority of endgame players do on their Mag NB/Sorcs this patch. I’m just very experienced with it because I’ve put so much time into endgame stuff.... and because I only run Warden on fun runs in vHoF/vMoL where the Eternal Guardian is viable.

Yet for all of those players who can’t even beat Vet trials or struggle immensely, there is zero reason to choose something besides Mag NB. Same as when Sorc was OP. Why purposely pull way less DPS when you already struggle with content and need to complete? That’s selfish at the expense of the 11 others in your group. If the gap was small it would not be an issue, but the gap isn’t small. Also Mag NBs give offheals...... they are legit far too above the other Mag classes.

The few players that can push very high scores choose the best classes too because that’s how they’ll push the highest scores. What I’m trying to say is, the only players that can actually make use of any class in clearing content are the very best players, who only do it on “fun runs” anyway. As for everyone else? Mag NB is going to be too far ahead to avoid using, and you’ll get yelled at/talked behind your back probably for not using it. Just not good for the game

Anyway I made this thread to see if Mag NB is truly that far ahead atm. I really hope not but based on the changes idk how they won’t be.

I mean honestly as much as I hate seeing a thread like this cause it just causes an uproar I get your point. Yeah the classes below mNB should be in line but I'm just afraid that instead of trying to bring those classes up to par with Nightblades, Nightblades will get hit instead. Because that's what Zos tends to do..

Even if the skill required to hit high dps on a mNB will drop with this change I still believe less skilled players will find mSorc easier.

*fyi I tanked vet trials in my 'prime' and only played mSorc in vMA so I was never extremely experienced as a dps in trials. I've also been on a lengthy break from the game. Play very causally I still enjoy ESO just not hard into the 12 man trials anymore, so yeah I'll give you that you are more knowledgeable on the subject I just think you shouldn't make such harsh assumptions on mNB being the be all end all now.

Izaki

As for Grim Focus... In terms of DPS this isn't actually as massive of a buff as everyone seems to be making it out to be. On average good Nightblades are able to get 3 bow procs every 17.something seconds. This change will allow them to squeeze in 1 or maybe 2 extra stacks, which would basically mean an extra bow proc every 3 or 4 rotations. The DPS increase isn't massive. Especially in raids. In 99% of situations this buff will just mean that you can afford to screw up your rotation and not lose too much DPS.