[PvP] Stamwarden; Help with my build and the road so far (@5.3k Crit Resist)

Iduyenn

Hello everyone!

A short story: I am kind of an old owl in this game. Played since beta... yeah, the time, where most of the ppl where levling weeks for vr10 and you only had to be a vampire dk to roam the battlefields (i played a healer then ). Mostly PvE.
After kind of a long time away i am back now... but not only pve... i want to do pvp too. 1v1, smalscale and not embaracing myself in zergs.

Long story short.. i am back and need some help.

1. Step was to figure out, what setup i`d play. I have every class and all caracter slots maxed out. I endet up with my warden, because i kinda like tanking with him in PVE.
2. Step was to give away a *** of materials/upgrade materials for uselesss stuff. Things i will never wear again... but hey... teh gold-standard right?
3. I want to be tanky, but not a turtle. What did i do? I got 5.3k Critresistance. Only later i realized, that its a cannon shoot on pidgeons. After long hours with auntie google i realized, that 4-4.7k on Vivec would be enough.Right? Right!!?
4. Now...here comes the problem: Before i have to prostitute myself for other gear and transmutation cristalls i need some advice, where to put on the feather.
a) should i decrease my CP 55 Resistant to spellshield and heavy armor focus? (Because yeah... in the end i want to loose Blood spawn for something with a bang (Either 1 kena and Krags, or something else).
b) Or i could leve the CP allone, and make my chest, panties and headpiece nirnhoned/reinforced (Iwas dreaming divine for more meow!)
c) I am sure i had some more options, but they kinda got lost.

I would be eternally grateful for some advice, how to optimize. (And no other gear proposals... i am broke for the next year or so...)

Many thanks

I.

PS: I calculated, that instead of Impen on Chest, i would either get +443 Armor or +301 Spellres./Armor with Nirnhoned. Doesnt sound sattisfactory...
PPS: I know, 2h sword would be better... but kinda hate the playstyle.
PPS: And dont get me wrong... i like it so far... but optimisation will help me even more.
PPS: *snip* some appropriate trash talk to my fellow worriors from DC and EP... just to honour the lifestyle. I hope we meet wit meat and mead.



PPS: I kinda would love to see some math about PVP damage mitigation. Correlation between Armor/Spellresistance and Critresistance... I know... you would need an average critdmg percentage... but would be great to have some general sweetspots.
For example: Crit Resistance reduces Crit-dmg modifyer. So if someone hits me with 10k basedmg +6k Crit. I can negate 6k with impen... but shouldn`t the maingoal be 50% dmg mitigation first?

PPS: Btw... Are there sweetspots in "Resistant" (Could test that later myself though)

PPS: Oh, and i know... my stamreg...

Ragnarock41

1. stam warden is pretty much FOTM right now, Its a powerhouse that can tank, heal, provide great utility, can debuff enemies and also do amazing burst/sustained damage. You just can't go wrong with stam warden, It will probably get heavily nerfed in the future but enjoy it while Its strong.

2. I do the same very often just yesterday I made a well fittet morihaus build just to mess with people in cyrodiil. Total waste of my mats and gold yet having fun is the real deal isn't it?

3. More crit resist is always better especially considering even with 4k nightblades still hit very high. But you have a little too much of it you can take off some points from resistant.

4. I guess this was your real question, Well It really depends on your current CP distribution, But I think you're better of with some points into quick recovery and thick skinned than spell shield/heavy armor focus. those are kind of garbage.

5.Don't bother with nirn/reinforced armor, you will regret it trust me.
What you can do instead is getting sturdy on some of your armor pieces+your shield.
You can think ''ewww permablock'' but morrowind literally doubled the base blocking cost, which means sturdy is 2x effective now.
Block costs A LOT, and your low regen will make things difficult.
IF you don't want impen gear, just get sturdy. You can't go wrong with it.
That way your block will cost much less, allowing you to conserve your stamina pool in tough situations. Which will help a lot more than having a little more resistance.

Iduyenn

@Ragnarock41 Thnx!

I know. But while i am a glass cannon in PVE, i dont like to be squishy in PVP at all.
I alway found it very very hard to achieve defence/offence at the same time. Only now, i begin to understand how this works.
But still... a lot is very confusing and ppl always say stuff in general, but dont mention the perks and details of a build. Sometimes its the details, that gets the weagon rolling.

I think this is the main reason, why ppl can copy any build and still do a lot less with it. The other part is the general understanding and l2p ofc.

I for one, have no clue at all how to tank 5 ppl and put presure at the same time. For example right before i went offline. A mWarden put me to bed with 8k from the frost aoe and 5k pidgeon. And i am still on 4.6k Critresistance and 28k- 34k armor/spellresistance. Its just crazy how tanky some ppl can be and then give me those dmg numbers.

Thnx for your advice. I definitely will think about sturdy. But one or two items in sturdy... is that a notable difference?

Thnx again! Soon after i read your response i changed some things in CP. Played until 3 am... and i am very happy. Though... i guess its not perfect... yet.

good night.

Ragnarock41

line of sight is key here,
Your positioning has great impact on what is gonna happen.
Try to always have a close cover nearby, a rock, a wall, a tree, just something that can break line of sight.
This is pretty much the number 1 survival rule for any solo player in cyrodiil.

But obviously magicka warden is cancer to fight against when you are outnumbered and even worse when solo. I understand your pain, and you are not the only one suffering from this. My advice is, if you trust yourself, try to take out the magwarden first or avoid at all costs.
Just as I said above, break the line of sight, make that warden go out of his comfort zone,act like you're gonna run forever, then suddenly face him on your own terms, that is gonna your best chance.

About sturdy:
2 sturdy in gold is %9 cost reduction to blocking, combined with one shield-play glyph it makes a great difference.
Of course its just personal preference, This is how I run most of my SnB builds, always at least 2 sturdy and a shield-play glyph
Since DK isn't mobile and wings arent working perfectly I find it quite useful to be able to block whenever I want, but holding it for long kills my stamina pool really fast. For your case you might not need it because warden has actually better sustain and mobility, which means you can utilize line of sight more effectively.

Thing is , if you like blocking when things get tough, I would advice going full sturdy because It is super cost-effective but zos is about to change how block works so I would wait before making any investments.

They want to solve permablocking which might be done in two ways,
1. they are gonna nerf sturdy,shield-play and cost reduction from CP. maybe all of them, or maybe just some of them.
2. they are gonna add block fatique which I seriously doubt.

in both cases you might end up wasting your time and resources, so I would wait before seeing whats changed in update 17.

Lexxypwns

I think building for true perma-block on offensive stamden setups is bad. It’s virtually impossible to land sub consistently with the blocking snare and you’ll usually have to give something else up to build for that much block.

As a warden you’ve got stellar healing and you’re going to be using block for short turtle periods when pressured hard or tap-blocking CCs. Simply playing smart and timing blocks is adequate blocking imo. That being said, your biggest threats are defile and big crit burst. Honestly, I run my stamden between 1600 and 2500 depending on my off-bar SnB set, lower if it’s a defensive set and higher if I’m using offense back bar.

For regen, fully buffed, with netch Heavy Armor ~1700 medium 2k++. Without netch ~2k and 2400 I’d say, but you can run much, much lower with experience. And the tanker the build the more heavy attacks you can incorporate.

I think the sweet spot for weapon damage is ~4K but you can run less if you’re using defile(corrupting, reverb). Basically you need to put enough burst on a target with your combo that they can’t recover properly

Waffennacht

Builds that hit that hard need to be pressured to prevent them from killing you. Because they usually get hit hard they can't keep on the offensive while you are too. If you're in a bad spot, outnumbered, or forced to turtle it's very hard to recover and win imo.

lynog85

4.3k crit resist is where crits start tailing off. Drop impreg for bonepirate mate and youll be alot better off

Gan Xing

I've also been struggling to get anywhere with my warden.

granted, i'm crazy cause I'm trying to build for hybrid (which doesn't work)

I'm running Spriggan and Shacklebreaker, 5 light so I have sufficient spell and weapon penetration, and when buffed, around 3k weapon damage. When timed right, my burst is decent, and I have killed several players with it, but once you face someone who knows what they are doing, you start falling off. I have about 30k magicka and stamina, but atm, I have s*** pen resistance (need to change a few items)

running s&b and dual

Arobain

crit resistance caps out at 50% reduction, which would be at 3300, so anything above is useless

Lexxypwns

Arobain wrote: »

crit resistance caps out at 50% reduction, which would be at 3300, so anything above is useless

nope, crit resist cap in game is ~5000 which is a ~74% crit damage reduction. Your data is incorrect

Arobain

well i'm looking it up again now and every sources says 50% which is 3300

Lexxypwns

Arobain wrote: »

well i'm looking it up again now and every sources says 50% which is 3300

"Now critical resistance works very differently from the other forms of resistance. What it does is it lowers the enemy players critical hit damage modifier. A characters base modifier is 1.5 which means that if you land a critical hit then you deal 50% more damage. There are ways to improve this, such as minor and major force or the Champion point system. What we are gonna be looking at of course is how we can reduce that modifier. This one is very special cause unlike mitigation that is a multiplicative reduction this one is actually a subtractive one. This is the formula:

If a player has base critical modifier and they hit an enemy player that has 100 points into Resistant then their modifier will be affected like this:

1.5-(1699/68/100)=1.5-0.2498529=1.5-0.25=1.25

Finding out what the % per resistance was was not easy but from my testing I have found that it is 68(if someone else has a different number I would love to see it.). This means that 100 points into Resistant gives you ~25% critical hit resistance. The total amount of critical hit resistance possible is 5067 or 74.5%. I now want to make something perfectly clear, THERE IS NO CRITICAL RESISTANCE HARD CAP! Ok? Ok! There isn’t even enough critical resistance available to justify having it. Max resistance is 74.5% and highest possible critical damage modifier is over 100%."

per @paulsimonps who tested it.

Iduyenn

First of all: Thnx so much for all those answers! They all helped me a lot!

I reduced my Impen to 1.8-2.4k and i feel very good. Ok, there are some funny sorcs stacking Critdmg... at least i accuse them of that (To procc more boom-crit- frags). Soul assult and vicious death is a problem too... well the 2nd thing is realy another problem though ^^

The thing is: Armor @20-28k full buffed helps a lot in various situations. Especially for someone like me who need a lot of pvp-l2p. All those dodge-rolling, cloaking, line- of siters (basically every pvp-er) are hard to hit. Tap target helps a lot, but still... some adjustments for me.
The downside is, i only get like 3k weapondmg. Perhaps i need to find other strategies how to put a good burst-combination on a target. (Good thing.. i am very hard to kill in 1v1 and the fights are interesting).
Right now, i am keeping my ultimate for oh-*** moments. (basically every situation 1vx)

Its just; I am always amazed by those solo-players, who have this incredible pressure-thing (probabely with clever alchemist) and in the next moment they tank a whole group to death, sometimes even me.

I played around a lot in the last two days. For example i crafted the Fortified brass set and i wear spriggan+Hunding`s now (until i get my bone pirate). Altough i would prefer 1 Pone Pirate weapon each, because of 1-1-5. And that will be a grind, even if i go with my stamsorc.

Oh and i could take another head-shoulder set. But rng on the undaunted chest is not with me (mag and stam).

Warden has definately become "my class". I even have a 2nd Warden. Doing a magicka PVP build on him.
50k+ Magicka is awsome :P (Though i am asking myself if i should take 5heavy for surviability. I dont like to be glass cannon in pvp).

Thx again and i will stay in this thread for any more inputs, ideas or thoughts.

I.

Waffennacht

@Iduyenn if you are struggling and/or also interested in Fortified Brass, I highly recommend checking out The Brass Soldier - A Build Guide (Click Me!)

Iduyenn

Thnx! Very interesting build. The question would be if 5 medium passive + Brass > 5 Heavy and 2 dps sets. (They see to agree on it though).

I am interested for my tanky magicka warden 5 light Brass + Necropotence or something.

Ah... all those possibilities.

I am also thinking about bloodspawn, because there are a lot of fights, when i cant bring my light attacks on my opponents... most of the time actually... until the gap is closed. At least i would have lots of ultimates.

Lexxypwns

Iduyenn wrote: »

Thnx! Very interesting build. The question would be if 5 medium passive + Brass > 5 Heavy and 2 dps sets. (They see to agree on it though).

I am interested for my tanky magicka warden 5 light Brass + Necropotence or something.

Ah... all those possibilities.

I am also thinking about bloodspawn, because there are a lot of fights, when i cant bring my light attacks on my opponents... most of the time actually... until the gap is closed. At least i would have lots of ultimates.

Heavy passives are better than medium. The only reason to run medium is so you can use shuffle and either keep rally or not run a 2h at all

Iduyenn

@Lexxypwns Since i kinda got ot on my own topic in discussing a magicka build... would you say, that on a magicka warden light armor + Brass > heavy passives?

The thing with my stamwarden is; I kinda dont like 2h. The only thing i played was a 2h MSA Axe with the bleed. But i acidently destroyed it... perhaps my moment of agonizing trauma.

Lexxypwns

Iduyenn wrote: »

@Lexxypwns Since i kinda got ot on my own topic in discussing a magicka build... would you say, that on a magicka warden light armor + Brass > heavy passives?

The thing with my stamwarden is; I kinda dont like 2h. The only thing i played was a 2h MSA Axe with the bleed. But i acidently destroyed it... perhaps my moment of agonizing trauma.

Yes, but I don’t have enough mag warden experience to say if brass is needed, though, I know a lot of them rely on HoTs+big dampen shield.

For stam warden you’re not tied to 2h. SnB is superior in a 1v1 and DW probably is as well. I’ve run SnB + DW in medium with cowards back bar that is very nice for kiting and bursting. 2h/DW works for a heavy armor brawler as well but I felt compelled to run invigorating drain for my CC. The meta is probably 7th/Malu + back bar flavor set

Edit: For your specific setup, I'd change the back bar glyph to weapon power then change your main hand front bar to nirn+precise instead of sharp+precise. That alone is going to put you at ~4500 weapon damage, a significant increase to your burst. Then you should reconsider your green CP allotment, befoul scales incredibly well and the only workable CC you have is reverb, which gives you major defile. Those two things will improve your burst and pressure and make it easier to get kills.

Gan Xing

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Iduyenn wrote: »

@Lexxypwns Since i kinda got ot on my own topic in discussing a magicka build... would you say, that on a magicka warden light armor + Brass > heavy passives?

The thing with my stamwarden is; I kinda dont like 2h. The only thing i played was a 2h MSA Axe with the bleed. But i acidently destroyed it... perhaps my moment of agonizing trauma.

Yes, but I don’t have enough mag warden experience to say if brass is needed, though, I know a lot of them rely on HoTs+big dampen shield.

For stam warden you’re not tied to 2h. SnB is superior in a 1v1 and DW probably is as well. I’ve run SnB + DW in medium with cowards back bar that is very nice for kiting and bursting. 2h/DW works for a heavy armor brawler as well but I felt compelled to run invigorating drain for my CC. The meta is probably 7th/Malu + back bar flavor set

Edit: For your specific setup, I'd change the back bar glyph to weapon power then change your main hand front bar to nirn+precise instead of sharp+precise. That alone is going to put you at ~4500 weapon damage, a significant increase to your burst. Then you should reconsider your green CP allotment, befoul scales incredibly well and the only workable CC you have is reverb, which gives you major defile. Those two things will improve your burst and pressure and make it easier to get kills.

I've been running around with a hybrid warden, she has solid burst damage (if I line up her skills properly). I use dual and s&b and light. I use it with spriggans and shacklebreaker, and buffed have 3k weapon damage and 2.7k spell. I also have significant penetration as well as about 30k magicka and stamina. With the thief, I have 30% crit chance. Really the only thing I struggle with is my self healing. Even with vigor and the stam healing mushrooms, I struggle to get a significant burst heal.