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so... will now everyone change from HA to light and medium..?!?

  • TheDoomsdayMonster
    TheDoomsdayMonster
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    KingJ wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    @Lexxypwns

    I guess its not really worth arguing about, but I have killed many good players with that combo; too bad you are on Xbox and not ps4 as

    I literally cannot even begin to fathom dying to a combo that's got literally 0 burst damage and is relying on a conal DoT and 2.5k batswarm ticks to do all of its killing. That's the definition of going full potato.

    There's no snares and you're starting your combo by giving the opponent CC immunity, ensuring they can heal anytime their health pool gets too pressured until the end of bats. There's literally nothing in your combo that's gonna do even 5k damage on a non-crit and nothing that's gonna break a 7k crit. I'm sure you can put out pressure but I cannot imagine dying to "sweeps til they die" on a build with no snares and no burst mechanics outside of an expensive ultimate. And the passive healing from sweeps+bats IS NOT enough healing to keep you from getting smashed hard with a counter burst and put on your back foot, meaning you have to charge bats again to even begin your combo.

    You're literally praying for Burning light to proc enough times that you actually can put out some semblance of burst and that's hard to bank on since sweeps is so easy to kite.

    Too bad I cant show you 1st hand...

    Your opinion on this is all wrong; I use this combo all the time...its very powerful...and it kills.

    But anyway, we are off topic...
    Record a video of you dueling a competent player with the build I'm sure PS4 has a recording feature.

    It does, but you gotta upload to Facebook (which I'm not on) then take it from there to Youtube...

    I cant be bothered to do all of that...

    You can upload straight to YouTube.

    How?

    I cant recall seeing that option; last I looked (and its been a while) the only options were Twitch and Facebook...

    After making the video with share factory, press share and it will begin rendering. When thats finished you'll be given 4 options to upload to.

    Ah...thanx!

    :)

    Edit: your name does look familiar btw; are you DC?
    Edited by TheDoomsdayMonster on October 18, 2017 10:40PM
    Unyeilding Bias
    PSN TheLordofMurder
    PS4 NA
    Magicka Templar
    DC
    The Combat Physician: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKaqUVm_8JE&t=142s
  • KRBMMO
    KRBMMO
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    Medium is still the worst for PvP. Even moreso because you can't slot Annulment without having 5 light NB for example just has no defense at all in medium. This patch doesn't make medium worth it and light is basically the same as before.
  • Lexxypwns
    Lexxypwns
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    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst
    Edited by Lexxypwns on October 18, 2017 10:49PM
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
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    KingJ wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    @Lexxypwns

    I guess its not really worth arguing about, but I have killed many good players with that combo; too bad you are on Xbox and not ps4 as

    I literally cannot even begin to fathom dying to a combo that's got literally 0 burst damage and is relying on a conal DoT and 2.5k batswarm ticks to do all of its killing. That's the definition of going full potato.

    There's no snares and you're starting your combo by giving the opponent CC immunity, ensuring they can heal anytime their health pool gets too pressured until the end of bats. There's literally nothing in your combo that's gonna do even 5k damage on a non-crit and nothing that's gonna break a 7k crit. I'm sure you can put out pressure but I cannot imagine dying to "sweeps til they die" on a build with no snares and no burst mechanics outside of an expensive ultimate. And the passive healing from sweeps+bats IS NOT enough healing to keep you from getting smashed hard with a counter burst and put on your back foot, meaning you have to charge bats again to even begin your combo.

    You're literally praying for Burning light to proc enough times that you actually can put out some semblance of burst and that's hard to bank on since sweeps is so easy to kite.

    Too bad I cant show you 1st hand...

    Your opinion on this is all wrong; I use this combo all the time...its very powerful...and it kills.

    But anyway, we are off topic...
    Record a video of you dueling a competent player with the build I'm sure PS4 has a recording feature.

    It does, but you gotta upload to Facebook (which I'm not on) then take it from there to Youtube...

    I cant be bothered to do all of that...

    You can upload straight to YouTube.

    How?

    I cant recall seeing that option; last I looked (and its been a while) the only options were Twitch and Facebook...

    After making the video with share factory, press share and it will begin rendering. When thats finished you'll be given 4 options to upload to.

    Ah...thanx!

    :)

    Edit: your name does look familiar btw; are you DC?

    No way hose!! FTQ!
  • Lexxypwns
    Lexxypwns
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    technohic wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Light has been better than heavy, passive wise, since the sharpened nerf.

    There's simply no efficient way to recoup the penetration that light armor provides back into a build without sacrificing too many other things. If you're a magika build and you've been running heavy you've been seriously gimping your damage just for some tankiness you can pick up elsewhere.

    Medium still has at least 1 really bad combat passive(sneak speed) and 1 that's less desirable (dodge roll cost reduction) because of several nerfs to the defensive mechanic it promotes.

    Well, in a certain way that's true - but keep in mind that penetration is useless vs dmg shields, where as heavy armor Wrath passive (and any further damage you could pick up by not having to use a defensive set) still work against them.


    That said, with Wrath passive gone there's no real alternative to light armor anymore, it'll just deal better damage in every scenario.

    keep in mind that if you're having trouble killing builds whose primary defense is damage shields that light armor will actually do more than heavy to help you. This is simply because the burst available in light is such that you can routinely melt people within the window of a single, well-timed, CC. Whereas, in heavy, you have to allow wrath to charge and still need another big damage set to approach the damage light armor has.

    If you're trying to brute force damage shields down in 2017 that's a YOU issue not a question of whether light is stronger than heavy. For reference, wrath adds ~2% damage and concentration adds ~8% and that's not even counting the crit passives. A typical damage set is going to give you about 5-7% damage. Light was already superior in every scenario because nobody keeps a 100% uptime on shields and as soon as you hit that health pool light armor adds like 13% more damage than heavy. The key to killing someone who is relying on damage shield for their defense is a well timed CC+burst combo as their shield drops either from pressure or from timing.

    Well, I've always done better with heavy armor on my magplar than with light - granted I haven't played my magplar much recently.

    There aren't much good, reliable CC options for a magplar (nor a lot of burst damage for a sweeps focused build) which might have a lot to do with it - it's always been important to be able to pressure down those shields efficiently with sweeps & DoTs on magplar.


    I can see how light armor should typically be better for other classes (& Dark Flare magplar builds) though.

    Not that it matters after next patch, light will just be better for all builds :neutral:

    Destructive reach is the best CC option for magplar btw and imo its the best CC in the game that doesn't break block.

    Yeah, it's good - but requires using destro staff.

    I don't think destro staff synergizes well with templar because the damage is such a mix between AoE (Sweeps) & single target (Unstable Core, Purifying Light, Destructive Reach/Clench, Vampire's Bane), meaning you can't feasibly get the full benefit from Ancient Knowledge passive.

    I just feel DW/S&B is the way to go for the classic Sweeps magplar (rev bash can act as a decent CC)- I'd definitely use destro on a Flare build tho.

    I mean, any destro, including weaves is better damage than DW by a mile and my personal experience with magplar I rarely cast more than a couple sweeps in a row. Your DoTs have low duration and so does PL, you just don't have time to spam your spammable a whole lot and you really do lose a lot of pressure from weaving. DW or not you'll never kill good players without PL explosions and the best way to fill them up is on a destro build.

    That's not even mentioning you can run ele drain and use the good morph of rune that gives minor protection+vitality instead of the regen one. And also increases your damage to levels a DW build can't dream of

    SnB back bar a must though imo

    The bolded part is definitely not true...

    On my Dual Weild Magplar, I have a burst combo that I use to kill good players and Purifying Light isn't part of the equation:

    1) Immovable PoT
    2) Structured Entropy...
    3) Toppling Charge...
    4) Devouring Swarm...
    5) Puncturing Sweeps until dead...



    That’s probably not that good of players.
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    raasdal wrote: »
    Assuming 5 pc in the tree.
    Light armor-
    20% Regen
    10%Cost reduction
    Spell resistance
    Crit- 2.1k with 5 pc
    Penetration

    Great damage perks vs anything without a shield, worthless against. They also do not effect healing.

    Medium-
    Crit- 1.6k so slightly less
    20% Regen
    10% cost reduction
    20% Sneak cost reduction-ok it's bad
    15% detectable radius reduction- ok its bad
    12%weapon damage
    15% faster while sprinting
    20% roll dodge cost reduction- base is 3.6k cost

    Mediums damage passives effect shields and healing, however do not provide as much raw damage vs a target. Good trade off imo. They need the healing. The main issue with medium imo is zos making everything undodgable.

    New Heavy-
    1.8k physical and spell resistance
    20%heath recovery- useless on most builds
    540 Stamina and magicka given when hit every 4 seconds. Essentially 135 stam and mag regen conditionally. Great for off pool regen, awful for main pool.
    10%max health
    8% healing recieved
    25%more resource return on heavy attacks.

    Yes they make you able to take more damage. But 1.8k resistance, average 2.5k hp if they're building for damage, and 8% extra healing(hard countered by defile), hardly make anyone unkillable. BLOCKING does.

    FIX BLOCKING FORMULA SO IT EFFECTS AND FIXES PERMABLOCKING AND DOESNT IMPACT EVERY OTHER BUILD BUT THE ONE YOU ARE TRYING TO IMPACT!!!!

    Stop making everything undodgable. It's a whole armor types defense.

    I still love medium armor.

    The difference between HA and MA/LA is not 1800 resist. It is more. You are only comparing Passives, and forgetting to account for the natural resistance of each armor type.

    Medium armor is literally 3/4 of the resistance of heavy armor.

    Also Armor penetration exists in this game.

    Throw in a heavy chest, bloodspawn, resist buffs and you're at a respectable level. Add in SnB for the reduced damage from range and the ability to relieve pressure blocking birds, soul assault, etc and a good defensive ult. Plus major evasion that non-NB heavy builds won't have and the rally burst heal/the fact that a heavy build with rally has no mobility. Then add in dodge rolls for situations where you can make a sorc miss his whole combo. Then look at sprint speed for kiting.

    I think medium is really attractive next patch right now, but that could just be my preference for squirrelly builds.

    You’re describing my next step in my Templar where I was thinking of going sword and shield, Tavas on shield bar and Hunding always up. And Bloodspawn. Was going to give up on empowering sweep and run shield wall even though it’s nerfed.

    Still; Templar doesn’t have cheap major expedition to go with sprint so it’s either give up rally or bow roll. Or I could go dual wield and use the AOE defense rather than 1h shield

    Cowards back bar ;) shuffle, ritual, sprint+major expedition and protection.

    Imo cowards is BiS back bar on stam. I'm pretty new to stam theorycrafting though since I've been on hiatus or playing primarily magika for the last 8 months.

    The way I see it you build tanky AF to stand your ground in heavy or you build to kite in medium and cowards is the best option for kiting IMO although eternal hunt is a good choice if you prefer a damage set with jewels.
    Edited by Lexxypwns on October 18, 2017 10:55PM
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst

    How often are you sprinting while in combat? Or is this just kite and burst when dbos is up?
  • Lexxypwns
    Lexxypwns
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    @TheDoomsdayMonster major defile exists and my tooltip for it on my mageblade is 42%. My will hits ~8k non-crit and soul harvest slightly harder
    Edited by Lexxypwns on October 18, 2017 11:02PM
  • Minno
    Minno
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Light has been better than heavy, passive wise, since the sharpened nerf.

    There's simply no efficient way to recoup the penetration that light armor provides back into a build without sacrificing too many other things. If you're a magika build and you've been running heavy you've been seriously gimping your damage just for some tankiness you can pick up elsewhere.

    Medium still has at least 1 really bad combat passive(sneak speed) and 1 that's less desirable (dodge roll cost reduction) because of several nerfs to the defensive mechanic it promotes.

    Well, in a certain way that's true - but keep in mind that penetration is useless vs dmg shields, where as heavy armor Wrath passive (and any further damage you could pick up by not having to use a defensive set) still work against them.


    That said, with Wrath passive gone there's no real alternative to light armor anymore, it'll just deal better damage in every scenario.

    keep in mind that if you're having trouble killing builds whose primary defense is damage shields that light armor will actually do more than heavy to help you. This is simply because the burst available in light is such that you can routinely melt people within the window of a single, well-timed, CC. Whereas, in heavy, you have to allow wrath to charge and still need another big damage set to approach the damage light armor has.

    If you're trying to brute force damage shields down in 2017 that's a YOU issue not a question of whether light is stronger than heavy. For reference, wrath adds ~2% damage and concentration adds ~8% and that's not even counting the crit passives. A typical damage set is going to give you about 5-7% damage. Light was already superior in every scenario because nobody keeps a 100% uptime on shields and as soon as you hit that health pool light armor adds like 13% more damage than heavy. The key to killing someone who is relying on damage shield for their defense is a well timed CC+burst combo as their shield drops either from pressure or from timing.

    Well, I've always done better with heavy armor on my magplar than with light - granted I haven't played my magplar much recently.

    There aren't much good, reliable CC options for a magplar (nor a lot of burst damage for a sweeps focused build) which might have a lot to do with it - it's always been important to be able to pressure down those shields efficiently with sweeps & DoTs on magplar.


    I can see how light armor should typically be better for other classes (& Dark Flare magplar builds) though.

    Not that it matters after next patch, light will just be better for all builds :neutral:

    Destructive reach is the best CC option for magplar btw and imo its the best CC in the game that doesn't break block.

    Yeah, it's good - but requires using destro staff.

    I don't think destro staff synergizes well with templar because the damage is such a mix between AoE (Sweeps) & single target (Unstable Core, Purifying Light, Destructive Reach/Clench, Vampire's Bane), meaning you can't feasibly get the full benefit from Ancient Knowledge passive.

    I just feel DW/S&B is the way to go for the classic Sweeps magplar (rev bash can act as a decent CC)- I'd definitely use destro on a Flare build tho.

    I mean, any destro, including weaves is better damage than DW by a mile and my personal experience with magplar I rarely cast more than a couple sweeps in a row. Your DoTs have low duration and so does PL, you just don't have time to spam your spammable a whole lot and you really do lose a lot of pressure from weaving. DW or not you'll never kill good players without PL explosions and the best way to fill them up is on a destro build.

    That's not even mentioning you can run ele drain and use the good morph of rune that gives minor protection+vitality instead of the regen one. And also increases your damage to levels a DW build can't dream of

    SnB back bar a must though imo

    The bolded part is definitely not true...

    On my Dual Weild Magplar, I have a burst combo that I use to kill good players and Purifying Light isn't part of the equation:

    1) Immovable PoT
    2) Structured Entropy...
    3) Toppling Charge...
    4) Devouring Swarm...
    5) Puncturing Sweeps until dead...



    That’s probably not that good of players.
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    raasdal wrote: »
    Assuming 5 pc in the tree.
    Light armor-
    20% Regen
    10%Cost reduction
    Spell resistance
    Crit- 2.1k with 5 pc
    Penetration

    Great damage perks vs anything without a shield, worthless against. They also do not effect healing.

    Medium-
    Crit- 1.6k so slightly less
    20% Regen
    10% cost reduction
    20% Sneak cost reduction-ok it's bad
    15% detectable radius reduction- ok its bad
    12%weapon damage
    15% faster while sprinting
    20% roll dodge cost reduction- base is 3.6k cost

    Mediums damage passives effect shields and healing, however do not provide as much raw damage vs a target. Good trade off imo. They need the healing. The main issue with medium imo is zos making everything undodgable.

    New Heavy-
    1.8k physical and spell resistance
    20%heath recovery- useless on most builds
    540 Stamina and magicka given when hit every 4 seconds. Essentially 135 stam and mag regen conditionally. Great for off pool regen, awful for main pool.
    10%max health
    8% healing recieved
    25%more resource return on heavy attacks.

    Yes they make you able to take more damage. But 1.8k resistance, average 2.5k hp if they're building for damage, and 8% extra healing(hard countered by defile), hardly make anyone unkillable. BLOCKING does.

    FIX BLOCKING FORMULA SO IT EFFECTS AND FIXES PERMABLOCKING AND DOESNT IMPACT EVERY OTHER BUILD BUT THE ONE YOU ARE TRYING TO IMPACT!!!!

    Stop making everything undodgable. It's a whole armor types defense.

    I still love medium armor.

    The difference between HA and MA/LA is not 1800 resist. It is more. You are only comparing Passives, and forgetting to account for the natural resistance of each armor type.

    Medium armor is literally 3/4 of the resistance of heavy armor.

    Also Armor penetration exists in this game.

    Throw in a heavy chest, bloodspawn, resist buffs and you're at a respectable level. Add in SnB for the reduced damage from range and the ability to relieve pressure blocking birds, soul assault, etc and a good defensive ult. Plus major evasion that non-NB heavy builds won't have and the rally burst heal/the fact that a heavy build with rally has no mobility. Then add in dodge rolls for situations where you can make a sorc miss his whole combo. Then look at sprint speed for kiting.

    I think medium is really attractive next patch right now, but that could just be my preference for squirrelly builds.

    You’re describing my next step in my Templar where I was thinking of going sword and shield, Tavas on shield bar and Hunding always up. And Bloodspawn. Was going to give up on empowering sweep and run shield wall even though it’s nerfed.

    Still; Templar doesn’t have cheap major expedition to go with sprint so it’s either give up rally or bow roll. Or I could go dual wield and use the AOE defense rather than 1h shield

    Cowards back bar ;) shuffle, ritual, sprint+major expedition and protection.

    Imo cowards is BiS back bar on stam. I'm pretty new to stam theorycrafting though since I've been on hiatus or playing primarily magika for the last 8 months.

    The way I see it you build tanky AF to stand your ground in heavy or you build to kite in medium and cowards is the best option for kiting IMO although eternal hunt is a good choice if you prefer a damage set with jewels.

    I may have gotten cowards to work on mag back bar. But don't quote me just yet; need to farm+test if trading 3k mag is worth it.

    But I agree, Stam was looking for extra mitigation and they got it via cowards on easy to use shift -key.
    Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
    - Guild-lead for MV
    - Filthy Casual
  • Minno
    Minno
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst

    How often are you sprinting while in combat? Or is this just kite and burst when dbos is up?

    If it's similar to prisoners, you'll be sprinting all the time.
    Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
    - Guild-lead for MV
    - Filthy Casual
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Minno wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst

    How often are you sprinting while in combat? Or is this just kite and burst when dbos is up?

    If it's similar to prisoners, you'll be sprinting all the time.

    You it's a lot harder to Sprint and follow that up with a weave on ps4 i guess. I hated how half of the time my skill wouldn't work since I'd still be in the sprinting animation. I am strictly taking about while pressuring, not if there is space or using it as a gap closer.
  • Minno
    Minno
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    Minno wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst

    How often are you sprinting while in combat? Or is this just kite and burst when dbos is up?

    If it's similar to prisoners, you'll be sprinting all the time.

    You it's a lot harder to Sprint and follow that up with a weave on ps4 i guess. I hated how half of the time my skill wouldn't work since I'd still be in the sprinting animation. I am strictly taking about while pressuring, not if there is space or using it as a gap closer.

    That's fair to say. I'm coming from a PC perspective so I have sprint close by.

    Can you remind controller buttons? Maybe trade synergy with Sprint if that's easier?
    Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
    - Guild-lead for MV
    - Filthy Casual
  • TheDoomsdayMonster
    TheDoomsdayMonster
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    @TheDoomsdayMonster major defile exists and my tooltip for it on my mageblade is 42%. My will hits ~8k non-crit and soul harvest slightly harder

    That's cool, but I'd be getting healing from Sweeps, Entropy, Swarm, and the Combat Physician Damage Shield will proc (63% Spell Crit); and of course I will pop an Immovable PoT prior to the combo to prevent me from being Hard CC'ed...

    Its enough to allow me to go toe to toe with anyone for the 5 secs that Devouring Swarm lasts; most often even strong Stam builds are forced to either run from me or stand their ground and die...

    Edited by TheDoomsdayMonster on October 18, 2017 11:22PM
    Unyeilding Bias
    PSN TheLordofMurder
    PS4 NA
    Magicka Templar
    DC
    The Combat Physician: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKaqUVm_8JE&t=142s
  • technohic
    technohic
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    DDuke wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Light has been better than heavy, passive wise, since the sharpened nerf.

    There's simply no efficient way to recoup the penetration that light armor provides back into a build without sacrificing too many other things. If you're a magika build and you've been running heavy you've been seriously gimping your damage just for some tankiness you can pick up elsewhere.

    Medium still has at least 1 really bad combat passive(sneak speed) and 1 that's less desirable (dodge roll cost reduction) because of several nerfs to the defensive mechanic it promotes.

    Well, in a certain way that's true - but keep in mind that penetration is useless vs dmg shields, where as heavy armor Wrath passive (and any further damage you could pick up by not having to use a defensive set) still work against them.


    That said, with Wrath passive gone there's no real alternative to light armor anymore, it'll just deal better damage in every scenario.

    keep in mind that if you're having trouble killing builds whose primary defense is damage shields that light armor will actually do more than heavy to help you. This is simply because the burst available in light is such that you can routinely melt people within the window of a single, well-timed, CC. Whereas, in heavy, you have to allow wrath to charge and still need another big damage set to approach the damage light armor has.

    If you're trying to brute force damage shields down in 2017 that's a YOU issue not a question of whether light is stronger than heavy. For reference, wrath adds ~2% damage and concentration adds ~8% and that's not even counting the crit passives. A typical damage set is going to give you about 5-7% damage. Light was already superior in every scenario because nobody keeps a 100% uptime on shields and as soon as you hit that health pool light armor adds like 13% more damage than heavy. The key to killing someone who is relying on damage shield for their defense is a well timed CC+burst combo as their shield drops either from pressure or from timing.

    Well, I've always done better with heavy armor on my magplar than with light - granted I haven't played my magplar much recently.

    There aren't much good, reliable CC options for a magplar (nor a lot of burst damage for a sweeps focused build) which might have a lot to do with it - it's always been important to be able to pressure down those shields efficiently with sweeps & DoTs on magplar.


    I can see how light armor should typically be better for other classes (& Dark Flare magplar builds) though.

    Not that it matters after next patch, light will just be better for all builds :neutral:

    Destructive reach is the best CC option for magplar btw and imo its the best CC in the game that doesn't break block.

    Yeah, it's good - but requires using destro staff.

    I don't think destro staff synergizes well with templar because the damage is such a mix between AoE (Sweeps) & single target (Unstable Core, Purifying Light, Destructive Reach/Clench, Vampire's Bane), meaning you can't feasibly get the full benefit from Ancient Knowledge passive.

    I just feel DW/S&B is the way to go for the classic Sweeps magplar (rev bash can act as a decent CC)- I'd definitely use destro on a Flare build tho.

    I mean, any destro, including weaves is better damage than DW by a mile and my personal experience with magplar I rarely cast more than a couple sweeps in a row. Your DoTs have low duration and so does PL, you just don't have time to spam your spammable a whole lot and you really do lose a lot of pressure from weaving. DW or not you'll never kill good players without PL explosions and the best way to fill them up is on a destro build.

    That's not even mentioning you can run ele drain and use the good morph of rune that gives minor protection+vitality instead of the regen one. And also increases your damage to levels a DW build can't dream of

    SnB back bar a must though imo

    The bolded part is definitely not true...

    On my Dual Weild Magplar, I have a burst combo that I use to kill good players and Purifying Light isn't part of the equation:

    1) Immovable PoT
    2) Structured Entropy...
    3) Toppling Charge...
    4) Devouring Swarm...
    5) Puncturing Sweeps until dead...



    That’s probably not that good of players.
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    raasdal wrote: »
    Assuming 5 pc in the tree.
    Light armor-
    20% Regen
    10%Cost reduction
    Spell resistance
    Crit- 2.1k with 5 pc
    Penetration

    Great damage perks vs anything without a shield, worthless against. They also do not effect healing.

    Medium-
    Crit- 1.6k so slightly less
    20% Regen
    10% cost reduction
    20% Sneak cost reduction-ok it's bad
    15% detectable radius reduction- ok its bad
    12%weapon damage
    15% faster while sprinting
    20% roll dodge cost reduction- base is 3.6k cost

    Mediums damage passives effect shields and healing, however do not provide as much raw damage vs a target. Good trade off imo. They need the healing. The main issue with medium imo is zos making everything undodgable.

    New Heavy-
    1.8k physical and spell resistance
    20%heath recovery- useless on most builds
    540 Stamina and magicka given when hit every 4 seconds. Essentially 135 stam and mag regen conditionally. Great for off pool regen, awful for main pool.
    10%max health
    8% healing recieved
    25%more resource return on heavy attacks.

    Yes they make you able to take more damage. But 1.8k resistance, average 2.5k hp if they're building for damage, and 8% extra healing(hard countered by defile), hardly make anyone unkillable. BLOCKING does.

    FIX BLOCKING FORMULA SO IT EFFECTS AND FIXES PERMABLOCKING AND DOESNT IMPACT EVERY OTHER BUILD BUT THE ONE YOU ARE TRYING TO IMPACT!!!!

    Stop making everything undodgable. It's a whole armor types defense.

    I still love medium armor.

    The difference between HA and MA/LA is not 1800 resist. It is more. You are only comparing Passives, and forgetting to account for the natural resistance of each armor type.

    Medium armor is literally 3/4 of the resistance of heavy armor.

    Also Armor penetration exists in this game.

    Throw in a heavy chest, bloodspawn, resist buffs and you're at a respectable level. Add in SnB for the reduced damage from range and the ability to relieve pressure blocking birds, soul assault, etc and a good defensive ult. Plus major evasion that non-NB heavy builds won't have and the rally burst heal/the fact that a heavy build with rally has no mobility. Then add in dodge rolls for situations where you can make a sorc miss his whole combo. Then look at sprint speed for kiting.

    I think medium is really attractive next patch right now, but that could just be my preference for squirrelly builds.

    You’re describing my next step in my Templar where I was thinking of going sword and shield, Tavas on shield bar and Hunding always up. And Bloodspawn. Was going to give up on empowering sweep and run shield wall even though it’s nerfed.

    Still; Templar doesn’t have cheap major expedition to go with sprint so it’s either give up rally or bow roll. Or I could go dual wield and use the AOE defense rather than 1h shield

    Cowards back bar ;) shuffle, ritual, sprint+major expedition and protection.

    Imo cowards is BiS back bar on stam. I'm pretty new to stam theorycrafting though since I've been on hiatus or playing primarily magika for the last 8 months.

    The way I see it you build tanky AF to stand your ground in heavy or you build to kite in medium and cowards is the best option for kiting IMO although eternal hunt is a good choice if you prefer a damage set with jewels.

    I’m liking this idea more and more but; thinking I need to go farm Fury or 7 th legion jewels and weapon. Thinking about sprinting into combat with shuffle , focus, and cowards giving major evasion, major expedition, major Protection, minor protection , minor vitality, major resolve, major Ward while HOTs are ticking and I’m building up weapon damage as I’m getting hit.

    Stamplar is an orc though so I may want to go for a melee attack that makes use of the passive for melee hits but does synergize with sprinting
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
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    Minno wrote: »
    Minno wrote: »
    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Adenoma wrote: »
    @technohic , get major expedition from lingering health + speed pots. It's around 1k HoT and with major expedition always up you can kite like crazy to make use of that baseline heal from the pot while you line of sight. I pretty much only use those on heavy armor stamwarden running S&B/S&B. I'll be doing the same next patch when I start testing medium armor Tava's stamwarden.

    Not a bad idea. Will have to get rid of Hunding though. Wasn’t thinking before but I’ll need a loot set for jewelry if I’m running Tavas.

    Edit: wonder if I should just run cowards and keep my golden Hunding

    Cowards+hundings is my favorite stamden setup so far. I run cowards jewels+SnB with Hundings body-heavy legs and chest 2 BS/Slime/Kena and dw shackle weapons nirn axe-infused sword(dagger may be better, idk).

    If you need a gap closer then run Asylum 2h in nirn next patch and maelstrom 2h in nirn this patch.

    The DW variant caps out around 4.1 weapon damage buffed and sits above 50% crit. It's huge burst on a kite build and I really like the ability to use sprint as a defensive mechanic, a lot of people don't expect a quick CC then sprint to LoS. It has great synergy with SA as well since you can have it go off just as you step into LoS then drops DBoS(empower it as SA is about to explode) and light attack, block or roll cancel a tornado and with good crits you've just unloaded ~25k damage counting the DB DoT and your weapon glyph proc'ing. Not including the axe bleed. If you're playing against less aware opponents you can enter los sooner and add a bird at the start of the combo for even more lolburst

    How often are you sprinting while in combat? Or is this just kite and burst when dbos is up?

    If it's similar to prisoners, you'll be sprinting all the time.

    You it's a lot harder to Sprint and follow that up with a weave on ps4 i guess. I hated how half of the time my skill wouldn't work since I'd still be in the sprinting animation. I am strictly taking about while pressuring, not if there is space or using it as a gap closer.

    That's fair to say. I'm coming from a PC perspective so I have sprint close by.

    Can you remind controller buttons? Maybe trade synergy with Sprint if that's easier?

    You can, i have changed mine up some to benefit bar swaps and character motion. You can only swap 1 key for another, and synergies is triangle plus circle.
    Edited by Brutusmax1mus on October 19, 2017 12:14AM
  • Zenartista
    Zenartista
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    Assuming 5 pc in the tree.
    Light armor-
    20% Regen
    10%Cost reduction
    Spell resistance
    Crit- 2.1k with 5 pc
    Penetration

    Great damage perks vs anything without a shield, worthless against. They also do not effect healing.

    Medium-
    Crit- 1.6k so slightly less
    20% Regen
    10% cost reduction
    20% Sneak cost reduction-ok it's bad
    15% detectable radius reduction- ok its bad
    12%weapon damage
    15% faster while sprinting
    20% roll dodge cost reduction- base is 3.6k cost

    Mediums damage passives effect shields and healing, however do not provide as much raw damage vs a target. Good trade off imo. They need the healing. The main issue with medium imo is zos making everything undodgable.

    New Heavy-
    1.8k physical and spell resistance
    20%heath recovery- useless on most builds
    540 Stamina and magicka given when hit every 4 seconds. Essentially 135 stam and mag regen conditionally. Great for off pool regen, awful for main pool.
    10%max health
    8% healing recieved
    25%more resource return on heavy attacks.

    Yes they make you able to take more damage. But 1.8k resistance, average 2.5k hp if they're building for damage, and 8% extra healing(hard countered by defile), hardly make anyone unkillable. BLOCKING does.

    FIX BLOCKING FORMULA SO IT EFFECTS AND FIXES PERMABLOCKING AND DOESNT IMPACT EVERY OTHER BUILD BUT THE ONE YOU ARE TRYING TO IMPACT!!!!

    Stop making everything undodgable. It's a whole armor types defense.

    I still love medium armor.

    Yesss. Medium armor is so much fun

    That whole block casting is a big issue for me. I don't understand how this is allowed.
  • Kas
    Kas
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    imho heavy will still be the way to go for everyone who want to use high self healing. vigor is still an incredible skill for pvp. however, not only the passives, also the available sets make it work so much better in heavy. medium has little more than hundings for damage + heal boosts (penetration etc are purely offensive), whereas 7th, rav, etc do a lot for also boosting your vigor ticks.

    thus, there will still be a lot of HA around. that said, i think we'll see more eternal hunt + damage set dodge builds in medium. however, while this may also work on other classes, it's just so much better on NB. imho CWC will 70% NBs across solo players (stamblades doding, cloaking and spamming incap and magblade may also be in quite a good spot, the cost increase on resto ult is less nerf than most other classes will experience). don't think much will change about trains though I haven really looked at the acid arrow changes (really nto excited about the ability but since I haven't even looked at the numbers post patchnotes -- who knows? same with eclipse: increadible buffs to a bad ability, didn't really bother figuring out how good it is after patch)
    Edited by Kas on October 19, 2017 9:41AM
    @bbu - AD/EU
    Kasiia - Templar (AR46)
    Kasiir Aberion - Sorc (AR38)
    Dr Kastafari - Warden (~AR31)
    + many others
  • TheMystid
    TheMystid
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    I dropped heavy armor on my Stamdk and started to use medium after Morrowind.. What it feels like? Less resistances and basically the same damage I had before :s
    a, say, +15% weapon damage buff wouldnt hurt at all....
    PC EU

    Nostalgic StamDk
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Cowards back bar ;) shuffle, ritual, sprint+major expedition and protection.

    Imo cowards is BiS back bar on stam. I'm pretty new to stam theorycrafting though since I've been on hiatus or playing primarily magika for the last 8 months.

    The way I see it you build tanky AF to stand your ground in heavy or you build to kite in medium and cowards is the best option for kiting IMO although eternal hunt is a good choice if you prefer a damage set with jewels.

    Wondering if I should go this route for my Stamplar, I don't use any bow abilities on back bar at all. So if I had to swap to cowards;

    So I would be;

    swapping out 3 pc agility jewelry
    bow

    Add;
    Cowards S+B + jewelry

    build would then be;

    5pc Bone pirate armor/body, 2pc troll king, 5pc coward back bar, 1 gold random 2h front bar

    Wonder if i could get this to work and have good weap dmg on jewelry pieces

    Coward comes in robust right?
    Edited by Takes-No-Prisoner on October 19, 2017 2:09PM
  • Lexxypwns
    Lexxypwns
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Cowards back bar ;) shuffle, ritual, sprint+major expedition and protection.

    Imo cowards is BiS back bar on stam. I'm pretty new to stam theorycrafting though since I've been on hiatus or playing primarily magika for the last 8 months.

    The way I see it you build tanky AF to stand your ground in heavy or you build to kite in medium and cowards is the best option for kiting IMO although eternal hunt is a good choice if you prefer a damage set with jewels.

    Wondering if I should go this route for my Stamplar, I don't use any bow abilities on back bar at all. So if I had to swap to cowards;

    So I would be;

    swapping out 3 pc agility jewelry
    bow

    Add;
    Cowards S+B + jewelry

    build would then be;

    5pc Bone pirate armor/body, 2pc troll king, 5pc coward back bar, 1 gold random 2h front bar

    Wonder if i could get this to work and have good weap dmg on jewelry pieces

    Coward comes in robust right?

    Yeah, it's available in robust jewels. You'll be at ~2200 regen with cowards, bone pirate I think, which should cover your sustain. I personally don't like to run a gap closer so I don't run 2h. However, an asylum 2h in nirn with a nice poison would have great synergy with this setup. You'd sit at ~3800-4000 weapon damage with infused berserker glyph back bar.
  • technohic
    technohic
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    Kept Hundings but got Cowards gear on my stamplar. Went 2 hander with dual wield as my sprint bar so I used deadly cloak (other morph not needed with cowards) to reduce AOE damage and then I have reverse slice for a quick weapon swap ani cancel into executioner. Just now testing it out and I really love it.
  • Takes-No-Prisoner
    Takes-No-Prisoner
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    I was just thinking of using Cowards as DW. It does look really promising!

    Though I think S+B will fit the small scale style I think I want to go for. I like 2H and S+B cowards would work with 2-3 other people. I got a friend who switched his Stamden to MagDen for small scale. So, I wanna take him up on small scaling with him on DC.

    I am excited to get the jewelry for this set and science it out on the field.
  • Avnr
    Avnr
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    HA 389 wpn dmg(200 wrath 189 vma), 32k resist
    for
    LA -369 wpn + spell pen , 12k resist

    just to die like a fly

    i don't animation cancel or macro(yeah i'm slow) , so i need the resist to give me time to react
    I need the extra wpn damage to do some damage , it's not like i one shoot kill anyone
  • Anti_Virus
    Anti_Virus
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    Lexxypwns wrote: »
    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    raasdal wrote: »
    Assuming 5 pc in the tree.
    Light armor-
    20% Regen
    10%Cost reduction
    Spell resistance
    Crit- 2.1k with 5 pc
    Penetration

    Great damage perks vs anything without a shield, worthless against. They also do not effect healing.

    Medium-
    Crit- 1.6k so slightly less
    20% Regen
    10% cost reduction
    20% Sneak cost reduction-ok it's bad
    15% detectable radius reduction- ok its bad
    12%weapon damage
    15% faster while sprinting
    20% roll dodge cost reduction- base is 3.6k cost

    Mediums damage passives effect shields and healing, however do not provide as much raw damage vs a target. Good trade off imo. They need the healing. The main issue with medium imo is zos making everything undodgable.

    New Heavy-
    1.8k physical and spell resistance
    20%heath recovery- useless on most builds
    540 Stamina and magicka given when hit every 4 seconds. Essentially 135 stam and mag regen conditionally. Great for off pool regen, awful for main pool.
    10%max health
    8% healing recieved
    25%more resource return on heavy attacks.

    Yes they make you able to take more damage. But 1.8k resistance, average 2.5k hp if they're building for damage, and 8% extra healing(hard countered by defile), hardly make anyone unkillable. BLOCKING does.

    FIX BLOCKING FORMULA SO IT EFFECTS AND FIXES PERMABLOCKING AND DOESNT IMPACT EVERY OTHER BUILD BUT THE ONE YOU ARE TRYING TO IMPACT!!!!

    Stop making everything undodgable. It's a whole armor types defense.

    I still love medium armor.

    The difference between HA and MA/LA is not 1800 resist. It is more. You are only comparing Passives, and forgetting to account for the natural resistance of each armor type.

    Medium armor is literally 3/4 of the resistance of heavy armor.

    Also Armor penetration exists in this game.

    Throw in a heavy chest, bloodspawn, resist buffs and you're at a respectable level. Add in SnB for the reduced damage from range and the ability to relieve pressure blocking birds, soul assault, etc and a good defensive ult. Plus major evasion that non-NB heavy builds won't have and the rally burst heal/the fact that a heavy build with rally has no mobility. Then add in dodge rolls for situations where you can make a sorc miss his whole combo. Then look at sprint speed for kiting.

    I think medium is really attractive next patch right now, but that could just be my preference for squirrelly builds.

    Definitely this.
    Power Wealth And Influence.
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
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    technohic wrote: »
    Kept Hundings but got Cowards gear on my stamplar. Went 2 hander with dual wield as my sprint bar so I used deadly cloak (other morph not needed with cowards) to reduce AOE damage and then I have reverse slice for a quick weapon swap ani cancel into executioner. Just now testing it out and I really love it.

    Blade cloak and its morphs are so underrated in pvp.
  • technohic
    technohic
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    technohic wrote: »
    Kept Hundings but got Cowards gear on my stamplar. Went 2 hander with dual wield as my sprint bar so I used deadly cloak (other morph not needed with cowards) to reduce AOE damage and then I have reverse slice for a quick weapon swap ani cancel into executioner. Just now testing it out and I really love it.

    Blade cloak and its morphs are so underrated in pvp.

    I need to test but does it also work on cone attacks?
  • Brutusmax1mus
    Brutusmax1mus
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    technohic wrote: »
    technohic wrote: »
    Kept Hundings but got Cowards gear on my stamplar. Went 2 hander with dual wield as my sprint bar so I used deadly cloak (other morph not needed with cowards) to reduce AOE damage and then I have reverse slice for a quick weapon swap ani cancel into executioner. Just now testing it out and I really love it.

    Blade cloak and its morphs are so underrated in pvp.

    I need to test but does it also work on cone attacks?

    Yes
  • Dojohoda
    Dojohoda
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    Considering how a player would have to play to benefit from Wrath, I'm not convinced that removing Wrath is a gear-changing nerf for many of us.

    Regarding not having the snare removal from Shuffle, the player in 5 heavy could try Mist (if a vampire), or use Forward Momentum instead of Rally (2-hand skill), or Retreating Manuvers ( expensive to cast).

    I primarily run a magblade in PVP and sometimes use 5 heavy, but I don't use it for Wrath, so I will continue to run either 5+ light or 5 heavy, depending on "stuff".
    Fan of playing magblade since 2015. (PC NA)
    Might be joking in comments.
    -->(((Cyrodiil)))<--
  • Strider__Roshin
    Strider__Roshin
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    It depends really. Light armor is definitely the way to go because of how strong damage shields are, and the penetration passive is incredibly strong.

    I still don't see a reason to go medium though. Even without Wrath you can achieve incredibly high weapon damage in all heavy, and because of your weak dodge rolling is pure mitigation and increased healing received is the better route to go.

    So yes light armor is definitely better than heavy. But medium armor is way too swishy to justify using over heavy, and the damage increase you get from medium isn't really that much.
  • technohic
    technohic
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    Dojohoda wrote: »
    Considering how a player would have to play to benefit from Wrath, I'm not convinced that removing Wrath is a gear-changing nerf for many of us.

    Regarding not having the snare removal from Shuffle, the player in 5 heavy could try Mist (if a vampire), or use Forward Momentum instead of Rally (2-hand skill), or Retreating Manuvers ( expensive to cast).

    I primarily run a magblade in PVP and sometimes use 5 heavy, but I don't use it for Wrath, so I will continue to run either 5+ light or 5 heavy, depending on "stuff".

    Magblade might be the only magicka class I would like to run in light armor and I am working on getting mats to craft what I need yet to convert mine over. Was still getting used to magblade and heavy provides a lower ceiling but a higher floor. Cant wait to see what it looks like with LA passives. I just hate keeping shields up other than using healing ward when needed.
  • Lexxypwns
    Lexxypwns
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    technohic wrote: »
    Dojohoda wrote: »
    Considering how a player would have to play to benefit from Wrath, I'm not convinced that removing Wrath is a gear-changing nerf for many of us.

    Regarding not having the snare removal from Shuffle, the player in 5 heavy could try Mist (if a vampire), or use Forward Momentum instead of Rally (2-hand skill), or Retreating Manuvers ( expensive to cast).

    I primarily run a magblade in PVP and sometimes use 5 heavy, but I don't use it for Wrath, so I will continue to run either 5+ light or 5 heavy, depending on "stuff".

    Magblade might be the only magicka class I would like to run in light armor and I am working on getting mats to craft what I need yet to convert mine over. Was still getting used to magblade and heavy provides a lower ceiling but a higher floor. Cant wait to see what it looks like with LA passives. I just hate keeping shields up other than using healing ward when needed.

    You don't need harness or dampen on light armor mageblade
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