Elemental Storm/Rage - Eye of the Storm - Changes to make the skills more interesting/balanced?

Avran_Sylt

This is my thought on it:
EotS's damage is fine, but allowing it to stack upon other skills adds a whole bunch of stuff that's hard to balance. Elemental Rage is good in PvE, but only has use in tight and condensed spots in PvP, you'd not use it in the open.
So, my suggestion would be to add in elemental effects to the base skill - Elemental Storm, up the effects on rage, and make EotS a channel.

Elemental Storm:
Fiery Storm - Increases the Damage by 10%
Icy Storm - Immobilizes enemies for 3 seconds
Thunderous Storm - Increases the duration by 2 seconds

Elemental Rage:
Fiery Rage - Burning enemies take 10% additional damage
Icy Rage - Enemies within the storm are afflicted with Major Maim for [x] seconds
Thunderous Rage - The initial tick stuns all enemies, afterwards, Concussed enemies are stunned when damaged by this ability.

Eye of the Storm:
Becomes Channeled, no movement penalty.
While channeled the AoE follows the caster and deals 10% additional damage. Whenever the channel ends, the AoE remains for the rest of the duration at the location the channel stopped.

Fiery Storm - Increases the Damage by 10%
Icy Storm - Immobilizes enemies for 3 seconds
Thunderous Storm - Increases the duration by 2 seconds


I've never actually used EOTS to bomb zergs, so these changes are uninformed. Your thoughts?

GreenSoup2HoT

Other

How about we balance the ultimate first before adding or changing how it works.

Sandman929

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

How about we balance the ultimate first before adding or changing how it works.

I'm not sure it can be balanced as long as it's a large moving AoE ultimate. The power is in groups stacking these ultimates. If damage is reduced to Bat's level, that'd be a start. If a group stacks 5-6 Devouring Swarms with Proxies and Negates that'll kill lots of people too, but not nearly as many as EotS.

Avran_Sylt

@GreenSoup2HoT
EotS, Rage, or Both and the Initial skill?

GreenSoup2HoT

Other

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

EotS, Rage, or Both and the Initial skill?

Just EotS. Rage has counterplay because you can walk out of it. You cant walk out of a competent players EotS when he has access to gap closers and immovable pots.

If EotS had the pts damage model, the game would be in such a good place.

Avran_Sylt

@GreenSoup2HoT
That's why I'm suggesting it becomes a channeled ability. It'll still deal good damage, but aside from Major/Minor Expedition, you won't be able to gap close as effectively.

GreenSoup2HoT

Other

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@GreenSoup2HoT
That's why I'm suggesting it becomes a channeled ability. It'll still deal good damage, but aside from Major/Minor Expedition, you won't be able to gap close as effectively.

Thing is the abilitys function isnt an issue. I have no isses with people gap closing on you with it up.

Its the fact its dealing ticks of upwards to 5k+ in pvp as a sustained damage ulty is the problem.

Wall of text.

To be unblockable, undodgeable with such high damage per second all while dealing fire damage baffles me in conparison to every other ultimate in the game.

If it was the pts damage model, group play would need variety of ultimates to really mess up other groups. You would need the stun of dawnbreakers and meterors. You would need roots to gain full duration value.

It should of been a longer duration bat swarm that deals fire damage and applys status effects (pts damage model). Still very powerful in its own right. What zos did to the skill was straight up careless in comparison to every ultimate in the game.

Why should an ultimste that follows you do more damage then Meteor (with total ground based dot included)?

Nothing even compares to this in its current state. I was happy this ability came out to pts until it went live without any testing whatsoever in group play and got buffed enormously... i died on the inside.

I'm not even going to get into how Emperor turns this ultimate into something even more ridiculous then it already is....

(Please note that this is not a l2p issue or has anything to do with me. This is me strictly speaking about the balance of this ultimate in comparison to the other ultimate's and how i feel it should of been balanced for the greater good of the game.)

Avran_Sylt

@GreenSoup2HoT

Ugh. Well, guess I'm gonna have to get the numbers and base damage of EotS and compare that to the DK's Shifting Standard. Just to nerf the damage compared to how the DK Shifting standard has two relocation instances, while EotS has 7 relocation instances.

Edit: or buff the *** outta Shifting Standard.

idk

Not suggesting EoTS should or should not be changed, but making it a channel will make it useless.

Not only would it be pointless to have it continue being a PBAoE since the player casting it cannot move, but no one wants to use a skill that locks them in place even if Zos made it not interruptible, BTW, a channeled skill that is not interruptible can still be interrupted if something knocks the caster unless Zos changed that. Have seen it happen with the Templar healing ult, but since it is rarely used I have no idea if that was ever changed to where the caster cannot be moved.

GreenSoup2HoT

Other

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@GreenSoup2HoT

Ugh. Well, guess I'm gonna have to get the numbers and base damage of EotS and compare that to the DK's Shifting Standard. Just to nerf the damage compared to how the DK Shifting standard has two relocation instances, while EotS has 7 relocation instances.

Edit: or buff the *** outta Shifting Standard.

Shouldn't have to buff basically every single ultimate in place of 1 that is over-performing though. All the ground based ultimate's were decent before eye of the storm was released. people used to use a large variety of ultimate's before its release.

i like the eye of the storm. i like what kind of gameplay it brings to the table. i like zerg bombing, zerg trains and a lot of aspects of pvp. i even like proc sets with awesome effects and utility. its just every single time zos brings something into the game the numbers are wrong or bugged.

idk

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@GreenSoup2HoT

Ugh. Well, guess I'm gonna have to get the numbers and base damage of EotS and compare that to the DK's Shifting Standard. Just to nerf the damage compared to how the DK Shifting standard has two relocation instances, while EotS has 7 relocation instances.

Edit: or buff the *** outta Shifting Standard.

It does not work that way. It is not about comparing the movement of the two ults because they really work differently outside of that they are DoTs.

EotS lasts 7 seconds, period. That should be 8 ticks of damage since the dot ticks every second.

Shifting Standards lasts 15 seconds and when moved the time is refreshed for another 15 seconds. The total would not be 30 seconds since it needs to be picked up before it ends and probably needs to be placed again quickly. Maybe say 25 seconds.

Avran_Sylt

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

I was referring to how EotS has 8 separate instances of damage, each of which can have a different location associated with it. A total of 8 locations of damage.

Shifting standard does have a maximum of 29 Instances of damage, but it can only have 2 locations of damage.

In PvE location of damage is normally irrelevant, as your tank is most likely gonna group adds and hold them in one spot. In PvP location is extremely important as players tend to move a hell of a lot more to actively avoid damage.

Of course after that you need to look at the utility each of them provides, through interactions with various passives and what not.

Edit: Also, don't forget that channelled skills are not exclusively stationary (Flurry), I also state that the player should have normal movement.

@GreenSoup2HoT

Of course not, I do think that it needs some adjusting to bring it down on par with other bombing skills.

idk

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

I was referring to how EotS has 8 separate instances of damage, each of which can have a different location associated with it. A total of 8 locations of damage.

Shifting standard does have a maximum of 29 Instances of damage, but it can only have 2 locations of damage.

In PvE location of damage is normally irrelevant, as your tank is most likely gonna group adds and hold them in one spot. In PvP location is extremely important as players tend to move a hell of a lot more to actively avoid damage.

Of course after that you need to look at the utility each of them provides, through interactions with various passives and what not.

Edit: Also, don't forget that channelled skills are not exclusively stationary (Flurry), I also state that the player should have normal movement.

@GreenSoup2HoT

Of course not, I do think that it needs some adjusting to bring it down on par with other bombing skills.

PvE is irrelevant as the movable morphs of each skill offer significantly less benefit then. This is purely PvP.

Further, both aspects of the morph would need to be taken into consideration and especially so since the DK has great CC available to them, though for 1v1 a skilled DK would not use the standard ult anyhow.

To be considered, there is only two channeled skill that permits movement, off the top of my head. But of significance, that skill is single target, mostly, and the morph with the longer duration is channeled in half the duration as EotS. Oh, and that morph changes it's target location as well, since it will follow the movement of the target.

In the end, counters need to be considered. I do not know what they are outside of sorc negate if that ult would work, but of course that is class specific. If there is a counter that is not class specific then that suffices regardless if someone chooses to use it or not.

As for bombing skills, Proxy det with the guaranteed crit of shadowy disguise into a good size group on a flag is still pretty solid. Even stacking maximum inpen does not fully negate the bonus crit damage.

Sharee

Other

What needs to be done is stop allowing multiple storms to stack.

Simply give players who got damaged by storm 0.9 seconds of immunity to further storm damage. Since it ticks once every second, a single storm will be unaffected by this change.

Vicarra

Needs Work

Sharee wrote: »

What needs to be done is stop allowing multiple storms to stack.

This seems to be the biggest issue to me as well. It takes no skill to do it, either. People keep complaining about magsorcs because they have two useful execute skills. However, during the Midsummer event it wasn't that that kept killing me - it was the EotS trains and the accompanying lagspikes that killed me. When Cyro was already laggy enough as it was, having 15 players pop this at once and run across you means instant death if you lag so hard you can't move out of the way.

I'm not sure how they can make it un-stackable, but reducing the number of players who can be hit by it, as they've done with previous sorc aoe spells, would be a good start.

GreenSoup2HoT

Other

Vicarra wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

What needs to be done is stop allowing multiple storms to stack.

This seems to be the biggest issue to me as well. It takes no skill to do it, either. People keep complaining about magsorcs because they have two useful execute skills. However, during the Midsummer event it wasn't that that kept killing me - it was the EotS trains and the accompanying lagspikes that killed me. When Cyro was already laggy enough as it was, having 15 players pop this at once and run across you means instant death if you lag so hard you can't move out of the way.

I'm not sure how they can make it un-stackable, but reducing the number of players who can be hit by it, as they've done with previous sorc aoe spells, would be a good start.

Previously caltrops was unstackable. They have the know how to make it work....

all though i personally dont think this is the right solution compared to just straight up adjusting the damage/duration.

zos tried to alliveate high hp bar spikes and eots did the opposite creating 100% killzones when only 3-4 people stacked it.

the fact this ult applies status effects contributes to the lag problem though.