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Where is the quality in PvP? Campaign's and Performance. Let's Discuss.

  • Durham
    Durham
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    This one is pretty bad ... Horrible decision to kill Haderous that acted like a spill over server at prime time..... So with Vivec so full lag is horrid much more often.... Huge Q's last night I read where it reach 200+ on the red side.... What makes this sooo bad is the extreme slow reaction time of ZOS. What makes people angry is the lack of communication on the issue...

    For example;
    If you post on the boards: My horse is yellow he is the wrong color, you will get a response and maybe ask for a screenshot

    If you post on the boards: Lag is horrid in Cyrodil or Q times in Cyrodil and it gets 100 reads and stays at the top for 2 days there will be no respose from ZOS its like it does not exist....
    Edited by Durham on June 24, 2017 4:41PM
    PVP DEADWAIT
    PVP The Unguildables
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
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    Durham wrote: »
    This one is pretty bad ... Horrible decision to kill Haderous that acted like a spill over server at prime time..... So with Vivec so full lag is horrid much more often.... Huge Q's last night I read where it reach 200+ on the red side.... What makes this sooo bad is the extreme slow reaction time of ZOS. What makes people angry is the lack of communication on the issue...

    For example;
    If you post on the boards: My horse is yellow he is the wrong color, you will get a response and maybe ask for a screenshot

    If you post on the boards: Lag is horrid in Cyrodil or Q times in Cyrodil and it gets 100 reads and stays at the top for 2 days there will be no respose from ZOS its like it does not exist....

    I'm still trying to decipher how one gets a Dev response in the bug forum...

    Like you said "horse yellow" or "my crowns disappeared" they get a response like, "looking into it" or "check your messages PM sent"

    But a legitimate and proven budding seeds bug post goes ignored, like again you said, at the top of the page for days.
    Gamer tag: DasPanzerKat NA Xbox One
    1300+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er

    Waffennacht' Builds
  • NBrookus
    NBrookus
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    9pm central -- so the west coast was just logging in.

    aTsw1X8.png
  • Chakei
    Chakei
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    I've thought for awhile that a minimum CP campaign would be interesting. Giving people with lower cp a place to learn pvp better while allowing the seasoned, maxed players a place to do their thing may be worth a try. Can't be any worse than the current state of things.
  • TheBonesXXX
    TheBonesXXX
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    I think PvP is in a decent state.. definitely not the worst.
  • Durham
    Durham
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    I think PvP is in a decent state.. definitely not the worst.

    Its the worst if you play CP ...You can no longer get away from the LAG .. huge miscalculation on ZOS's part on battlegrounds and no CP player movement .... The majority of people in PVP will not accept non CP and will leave the game as a point of the matter....
    PVP DEADWAIT
    PVP The Unguildables
  • Durham
    Durham
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    Chakei wrote: »
    I've thought for awhile that a minimum CP campaign would be interesting. Giving people with lower cp a place to learn pvp better while allowing the seasoned, maxed players a place to do their thing may be worth a try. Can't be any worse than the current state of things.

    We need another CP campaign its that simple .... It needs modified rules against EMP farming .. maybe crown factions leader instead of a person.... I just want a low lag (Haderous) like server back....
    PVP DEADWAIT
    PVP The Unguildables
  • Trashkan
    Trashkan
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    I just want some balance. The current state of PvP leaves no balance with proc sets running around and people are getting better with them making a one on one fight with any other build but a proc build is almost certain death. The way people can ignore wpn damage and stack everything into a tanky proc build is just ridiculous. Proc sets should scale off of weapon or spell damage. Or should have a % on proc not just a freebie. PvP is just getting real cheesy and I think people have had enough.
  • Chakei
    Chakei
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    Durham wrote: »
    Chakei wrote: »
    I've thought for awhile that a minimum CP campaign would be interesting. Giving people with lower cp a place to learn pvp better while allowing the seasoned, maxed players a place to do their thing may be worth a try. Can't be any worse than the current state of things.

    We need another CP campaign its that simple .... It needs modified rules against EMP farming .. maybe crown factions leader instead of a person.... I just want a low lag (Haderous) like server back....

    Agreed, but you're still going to run into the same issues with power creep and experienced, vet PVP players who will take advantage of the lower end of the population. Give the two sides campaigns that cater and leave 1 open CP campaign if that's what people want. The vet PVP community has hung on for awhile and it's getting harder to. More changes than this need to be had, but it's a starting point. They should at least be open to testing things out. "Should".
  • TheBonesXXX
    TheBonesXXX
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    Durham wrote: »
    I think PvP is in a decent state.. definitely not the worst.

    Its the worst if you play CP ...You can no longer get away from the LAG .. huge miscalculation on ZOS's part on battlegrounds and no CP player movement .... The majority of people in PVP will not accept non CP and will leave the game as a point of the matter....

    That's because they don't realize they crutch on it, I moved to non-CP after wanting to be competitive in Battlegrounds and theres a lot of players who simply lack the instincts and know how to play the game.

    PvP needs set pruning and just put some simple/standard sets that will ALWAYS stand the test of time..

    Get rid of CP period it was the dumbest thing in the game ever introduced.. balance around Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds. Players who need that cost reduction weren't as good as they thought they were.

    Let them leave, they're going to surf to the next title release anyway.

    Everyone doesn't want gear homogenization, guess what.. too bad. Less sets choices the more skills and balance can be addressed. That's the cold hard fact, the less sets.. the better.
  • RobTheAxe
    RobTheAxe
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    I think a good but drastic choice would be to remove all equipment from PVP entirely and leave only skill selection and possibly stat points, I agree, I was going to post this the other day, but thought it was a bit extreme.

    At this point gear sets are a great idea and a great part of the game but their implementation leaves much to be desired
  • Rickter
    Rickter
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    There were two things that caused the current situation:

    1) (and i do think this is the number one thing) STREAMERS constantly preached that no CP was the absolute best pvp experience you were going to have. They were quite vocal, at least the top three you hear about most were, and they pushed noCP as being the definitive competitive pvp experience. These same streamers were invited to ZOS HQ and had the direct ear of the developers on their thoughts and opinions. Whether they were listened to or not is irrelevant. They still got direct access. dont believe me? just read the following post. Please note: the reference to the fact that lag caused "poor stream viewership" agenda driven garbage:
    FENGRUSH wrote: »
    There are skilled players on CP and nonCP campaigns. Theres a difference in playstyles. A lot of skilled players that played nonCP actually enjoyed it and preferred it during the nonCP week. The difference is what the actual server environments have.

    If I go to TF Im going to see more massive ball groups - that is the clearest distinction I can draw immediately. The population is higher, and that is just how it is. That is where people have invested money in builds that work there and they dont typically translate directly to a nonCP environment. So people do what is comfortable. On top of that - people have more survival there.

    Discussion of TTK is another thing altogether than the above mentioned. The above mentioned is a big reason I dont like going to TF in the first place. The environment is unenjoyable and also degrades performance. Nobody enjoys watching a stream where your skills arent working because of the amount of players around you. TTK (from group vs small scale/solo) is another discussion to approach and how CP impacts that. Ultimately, the CP ceiling is constantly raised, and as time has gone forward, the gameplay has felt less skilled and less punishing for mistakes. This has translated to a less enjoyable and fulfilling experience for me as a PvPer, and many others that have stopped bothering to log in. Do I actually want TTK to be lower? The answer is actually no. I want burst to be lower, and I want healing to be lower. I want both of them to matter, pressure vs sustain. This is the point of the battle spirit that was put into Cyro to begin with - the issue there is the CP system layered on it and it didnt actually address specific skills in PvP, it was a broad stroke 'fix'. These concepts have been stripped from the game in part due to equipment changes (One Tamriel specifically) and the constant increase of CP.

    People can sustain on noCP as well. They are just used to building in a way where CP provides a majority of their sustain and stat coverage, and everything in equip+enchants goes towards your effect (damage, healing, tankiness).

    Do you think PvP is in a good place right now as population and interests continue to go downward? Peoples enjoyment of fights that feel so predictable theyre practically scripted? There is no justification on my part. Its an opinion, and its one that makes a lot more sense than the 'champions go to TF' outlook you have. Its also an opinion that makes sense to not just myself, but to the developers who have noted nonCP will likely be the primary feature of battlegrounds. Reason being that gameplay becomes ruined by people that know how to manage the CP spectrum very well. Theres too much there - even with changes coming to it. CP should not offer progressive passive increases to all stats and resources. It should be a place someone specializes in character differences that offer alternative playstyle options, not passive strength. New players are turned away from the necessity of needing max CP to compete in PvP as well - this is absolutely poor design for a game that wants to encourage growth in PvP.

    Blanket statements of "Ultimately, the CP ceiling is constantly raised, and as time has gone forward, the gameplay has felt less skilled and less punishing for mistakes. This has translated to a less enjoyable and fulfilling experience for me as a PvPer, and many others that have stopped bothering to log in."

    you dotn think that was repeated to ZOS developers? please. Its the dribble that put noCP > CP

    2) CP balancing: This is another major influencer into why we see the constant complaints. ZOS balanced CP to where the opinions of the above quote are addressed almost entirely, yet removed CP for BGs and majority campaigns. Now proc sets and poisons are more significant to the noCP player and they want their (now balanced) CP gameplay.

    These two factors are why the entire community is in an uproar about the situation. Devs were CONVINCED noCP was the directio nthey needed to go. but balanced CP to where we didnt need to get rid of it. completely polar contradictions causing chaos. almost like two teams worked on pvp at the same time.
    RickterESO
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  • IZZEFlameLash
    IZZEFlameLash
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    The lag and constant disconnect is really making my game experience unplayable. This is the worst I've experienced so far from any multiplayer games. What do they even do in maintenance?

    Also, those preaching for no-CP, no-CP will be the same as no-CP on CP campaign event showed. Lag was same if not worse due to people flocking in for double AP. If no-CP was as populated, then it'd lag very much. No-CP atm is only fun for proctards anyways. Easy success stemming from less damage resistance and etc. I do fine but I do see the issues in no-cp such as that. Proc builds and poisons way overperform there. Until then, nope.
    Edited by IZZEFlameLash on June 26, 2017 4:46PM
    Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel
  • Beardimus
    Beardimus
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    The problem with no CP isn't just lack of CP to back people up. It's the empty feeling that CP160-630 is the same without it. Makes that effort getting CP pointless
    Xbox One | EU | EP
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  • akray21
    akray21
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    Beardimus wrote: »
    The problem with no CP isn't just lack of CP to back people up. It's the empty feeling that CP160-630 is the same without it. Makes that effort getting CP pointless

    CP was a mistake and should never have been implemented... It shouldn't take a new player over a year to catch-up and be on the same field as the big boys.
  • NBrookus
    NBrookus
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    If combat were balanced around no CP, I'd be there. But it's not. When damage proc sets rolled it, I checked out of no CP and won't be back until they are addressed. Those streamers preaching no CP are utilizing the unbalanced stuff to the extreme. Fine, I get it: if there were a magicka Viper I'd be all over it.

    I think this update CP is pretty well balanced within itself. Siphoner also is a fair match for the nerfed poisons. If the next update manages to balance proc sets in a way so that they aren't OP in no CP, I think we will be in a good position to make either CP or no CP a viable choice depending on one's gameplay preference.
  • NeillMcAttack
    NeillMcAttack
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    Derra wrote: »
    I stopped reading when i read about nonCP performing better.

    Even the devs posted after testing a week of enforced nonCP that they were unable to trace any noticeable performance increase with disabled CP.
    Which happens to mirror my personal experience on the matter.

    I'd really like to see that post. I specifically remember rich speaking on ESO live stating "they are aware of Cyro performance, particularly in the CP campaigns".

    But it doesn't matter, currently AvA is non existent. It's lag, queues, disconnects, and so on.

    Look @Derra I've posted this many times and i will post a link again just to show.
    This is a clip of gameplay i took 2 days after Azura Star changed from a CP campaign to a non-CP campaign. I had to queue to get in as was normal, the popularity of the campaign was still very high.
    https://youtu.be/D2k90y55Ru4

    I arrived and the reds were starting on knocking their 4th wall to enter aleswell. I took the clip because I was genuinely blown away by the performance, no hic-ups, no stutters, no lag whatsoever. This is literally 2 days after the campaign was an absolute lagfest all over the map. This fight went on for over an hour from when I arrived and the yellows were even involved. I had zero issues.

    Now, you can watch and read if you like, but what nobody can currently do, is show me AvA of the quality in that video, I don't know about PC but certainly not on console. That is what the thread is about. It's not entirely about CP vs non-CP quality. It's far more to do with having the ability to find quality AvA, CP or no-CP.

    Back on topic, do you think it would be a bad idea to restrict players with no CP on thier account from entering the CP campaign, being that they are always going to go where the highest populations are. I mean, they need other players, they can't even fight NPC's at resources, why are they fighting players that are infinitely stronger than them?
    PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvP
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  • NeillMcAttack
    NeillMcAttack
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    Lucky28 wrote: »
    Lucky28 wrote: »
    And here all the rage was "no CP is more popular" during the No CP test.

    Even without the other campaigns, both no CPs are practically empty on console

    On PC that kind of is the case, is it not? They are at least a hell of a lot closer.

    It is in my opinion that console "meta" is very far behind PC also. The problem with CP is that ZOS have just kicked the can down the road with how CP will cause a lot of problems with balance in the future. When players have more points again to dump more into bastion, more into healing done and recieved, etc. etc. we will see the same issues.
    PC players are just in a better position to realize this, thus the greater interest in no CP over there.

    not really. at least not on NA. Sotha Sil has alright population but Almalexia is completely dead with everyone literally jammed into Vivec it's horrible.

    had used to have some pretty good PvP and good population now it's just where people go to get skyshards and do PvE stuff. :(

    As I have no way of judging, what number of players in the CP campaign are totally new players? If it's anything like PS4 it's at least 30%. They are clearly not where they should be hence the point of the thread.

    And we can also assume that many of the experienced players are in BG's.

    ZOS need to force more balanced populations across the campaigns or this will never stop. And the quality of AvA will never improve.

    they are where they want to be.

    Getting rid of one of the CP campaigns in favor of no CP which was/is not as popular as CP PvP was a mistake that needs to be remedied. ZOS can't force people to play on Campaigns they don't want to play on. all they can do is give an alternative which they actually took the alternative away hence the major issue here.

    @Lucky28
    Why can't my level 32 warden do vet dungeons? Why am I restricted from playing VET content? Well, it's because it's impossible, the numbers don't add up. It's the very same with letting new players into the VET campaign no?
    But the funniest part is, they only want to be where the numbers are. They NEED help fighting even NPC's. They want to experience big battles but in the end all they get is lag, disconnects, and queue times.

    I want ZOS to improve the quality of AvA for everyone. I'm not being exclusionary beyond how the basic game mechanics already exclude new players from being anything but a number on the pop count in that campaign.
    PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvP
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  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    Karm1cOne wrote: »
    The problem is self perpetuating. Nobody goes into noncp because nobody is there. So people move out to cp campaigns and the balance gets worse. If a few guilds moved onto noncp for a month or 2, populations would balance. Most guild groups don't want to change their builds or group comps, do this isn't going to happen.

    This isn't the reason I don't go into nocp. The actual reason is that I simply don't like it. The only way to get me into no CP is removing other options like bgs have done.
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  • TheBonesXXX
    TheBonesXXX
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    Durham wrote: »
    This one is pretty bad ... Horrible decision to kill Haderous that acted like a spill over server at prime time..... So with Vivec so full lag is horrid much more often.... Huge Q's last night I read where it reach 200+ on the red side.... What makes this sooo bad is the extreme slow reaction time of ZOS. What makes people angry is the lack of communication on the issue...

    For example;
    If you post on the boards: My horse is yellow he is the wrong color, you will get a response and maybe ask for a screenshot

    If you post on the boards: Lag is horrid in Cyrodil or Q times in Cyrodil and it gets 100 reads and stays at the top for 2 days there will be no respose from ZOS its like it does not exist....

    Performance in Cyrodiil was sacrificed at the alter of PvE. When the rest of the game was running like ass and Cyrodiil was running well it was neglected and they just do not want to undo those changes..

    Then they inflated the numerical values in the game and caused the game to make more calculations then whats necessary.

    Making the problems worse, not to mention they have a habit of making pretty things over well performing things because they take the fantasy aspect of the game way to seriously at the expense of more functionality.

    Also, players have a habit of saying they "earned" something in a video game. This isn't a profession, its a hobby and a luxury.
  • NeillMcAttack
    NeillMcAttack
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    Rickter wrote: »
    There were two things that caused the current situation:

    1) (and i do think this is the number one thing) STREAMERS constantly preached that no CP was the absolute best pvp experience you were going to have. They were quite vocal, at least the top three you hear about most were, and they pushed noCP as being the definitive competitive pvp experience. These same streamers were invited to ZOS HQ and had the direct ear of the developers on their thoughts and opinions. Whether they were listened to or not is irrelevant. They still got direct access. dont believe me? just read the following post. Please note: the reference to the fact that lag caused "poor stream viewership" agenda driven garbage:
    FENGRUSH wrote: »
    There are skilled players on CP and nonCP campaigns. Theres a difference in playstyles. A lot of skilled players that played nonCP actually enjoyed it and preferred it during the nonCP week. The difference is what the actual server environments have.

    If I go to TF Im going to see more massive ball groups - that is the clearest distinction I can draw immediately. The population is higher, and that is just how it is. That is where people have invested money in builds that work there and they dont typically translate directly to a nonCP environment. So people do what is comfortable. On top of that - people have more survival there.

    Discussion of TTK is another thing altogether than the above mentioned. The above mentioned is a big reason I dont like going to TF in the first place. The environment is unenjoyable and also degrades performance. Nobody enjoys watching a stream where your skills arent working because of the amount of players around you. TTK (from group vs small scale/solo) is another discussion to approach and how CP impacts that. Ultimately, the CP ceiling is constantly raised, and as time has gone forward, the gameplay has felt less skilled and less punishing for mistakes. This has translated to a less enjoyable and fulfilling experience for me as a PvPer, and many others that have stopped bothering to log in. Do I actually want TTK to be lower? The answer is actually no. I want burst to be lower, and I want healing to be lower. I want both of them to matter, pressure vs sustain. This is the point of the battle spirit that was put into Cyro to begin with - the issue there is the CP system layered on it and it didnt actually address specific skills in PvP, it was a broad stroke 'fix'. These concepts have been stripped from the game in part due to equipment changes (One Tamriel specifically) and the constant increase of CP.

    People can sustain on noCP as well. They are just used to building in a way where CP provides a majority of their sustain and stat coverage, and everything in equip+enchants goes towards your effect (damage, healing, tankiness).

    Do you think PvP is in a good place right now as population and interests continue to go downward? Peoples enjoyment of fights that feel so predictable theyre practically scripted? There is no justification on my part. Its an opinion, and its one that makes a lot more sense than the 'champions go to TF' outlook you have. Its also an opinion that makes sense to not just myself, but to the developers who have noted nonCP will likely be the primary feature of battlegrounds. Reason being that gameplay becomes ruined by people that know how to manage the CP spectrum very well. Theres too much there - even with changes coming to it. CP should not offer progressive passive increases to all stats and resources. It should be a place someone specializes in character differences that offer alternative playstyle options, not passive strength. New players are turned away from the necessity of needing max CP to compete in PvP as well - this is absolutely poor design for a game that wants to encourage growth in PvP.

    Blanket statements of "Ultimately, the CP ceiling is constantly raised, and as time has gone forward, the gameplay has felt less skilled and less punishing for mistakes. This has translated to a less enjoyable and fulfilling experience for me as a PvPer, and many others that have stopped bothering to log in."

    you dotn think that was repeated to ZOS developers? please. Its the dribble that put noCP > CP

    2) CP balancing: This is another major influencer into why we see the constant complaints. ZOS balanced CP to where the opinions of the above quote are addressed almost entirely, yet removed CP for BGs and majority campaigns. Now proc sets and poisons are more significant to the noCP player and they want their (now balanced) CP gameplay.

    These two factors are why the entire community is in an uproar about the situation. Devs were CONVINCED noCP was the directio nthey needed to go. but balanced CP to where we didnt need to get rid of it. completely polar contradictions causing chaos. almost like two teams worked on pvp at the same time.

    @Rickter
    Sadly, as we have seen in the past, having another CP Campaign isn't going to increase the quality of the current one. The top populated campaign will always and has always had queues in prime time. Not because of CP, but simply because it has the highest population.

    Now about CP balance and what the filthy blue fengrush was speaking on.
    Now, I will agree that PvP gameplay, when one can find it, in the CP campaign is in a much better state than the previous patch. To do this ZOS had to cut some stars in half, remove some, and also place some counter nodes in there. But with players stats ever increasing, with more points to spend, soon quick recovery and bastion will need toning down. Maybe even the block cost reduction too. You must understand that players like Fengrush have been hardcore into PvP for a long time. They understood the meta and the direction CP were taking PvP. When CP stars allow a player more damage just thanks to stats, more health, more resistances, more healing and bigger shields etc. The meta can start moving in a direction where players aren't dying anymore. As a PvP player, only being able to kill less experienced, and less equipped players can be majorly frustrating.

    Anyway, I agree that ZOS have dropped the ball on AvA this patch, funnily enough,.... and BG's, yeeah.... PvP in general. But what can be done to remedy this? Is it a simple case of adding another CP campaign and letting CP be active in BG's? Personally I don't think so.
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  • Rickter
    Rickter
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    @NeillMcAttack

    everything you listed is why noCP was lauded as "superior".

    And i dont necessarily disagree. So if its common to see that:
    with players stats ever increasing, with more points to spend, soon quick recovery and bastion will need toning down. Maybe even the block cost reduction too. You must understand that players like Fengrush have been hardcore into PvP for a long time. They understood the meta and the direction CP were taking PvP. When CP stars allow a player more damage just thanks to stats, more health, more resistances, more healing and bigger shields etc. The meta can start moving in a direction where players aren't dying anymore. As a PvP player, only being able to kill less experienced, and less equipped players can be majorly frustrating.

    then why are we seeing threads complaining they want CP back?

    This is what I've been trying to say:

    A vocal minority with celebrity status backed and advocated noCP for whatever reasons, some legitimate, some for selfish agenda. A large portion of ESO players support and back these said players and their opinions. ZOS makes PvP majority noCP. Players are now crying they want CP campaigns back.

    I am confused and Im of the mind that the ESO players "made their bed, now lay in it"

    Stop supporting fengrush and everyone else because they pushed for what everyone seems to be crying about.
    RickterESO
    PC | NA | DC
    YouTube
    ______________________
    Guilds:
    Requiem GM | Dark Sisterhood Blood Knight | Legend Mod | Legend GvG Mod
    PvP:
    Bloodletter | StamDK | Alliance Rank 46 | Former Emperor of Shor (2018) | Former Emperor of Thornblade #4terms (2015)
    PvE:
    vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMA | vDSA | vMoL | ALL Vet 4 Man Dungeons


  • NeillMcAttack
    NeillMcAttack
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Karm1cOne wrote: »
    The problem is self perpetuating. Nobody goes into noncp because nobody is there. So people move out to cp campaigns and the balance gets worse. If a few guilds moved onto noncp for a month or 2, populations would balance. Most guild groups don't want to change their builds or group comps, do this isn't going to happen.

    This isn't the reason I don't go into nocp. The actual reason is that I simply don't like it. The only way to get me into no CP is removing other options like bgs have done.

    @Karm1cOne and @timidobserver

    I fully understand that players prefer CP. In fact I have been having quite a bit of fun, outside prime time of course, in Vivec on my level 32 Stam warden. CP helps with regard his low level, as long as i don't let him out level his gear too much, he can compete.

    The real self perpetuating problem is the fact that everyone, new and experienced players, want to play in the most populated and most competitive campaign. Currently that is Vivec of course. New players will queue in, get in, and are forced to stack with anyone as they can't do anything themselves. NPC's are too tough, in all campaign's that is, CP players can defeat them with one hand, and they still want to experience large action. So round and round it goes.
    Edited by NeillMcAttack on June 29, 2017 3:20PM
    PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvP
    Tiidehunter Nord StamDK EP PvP Main
    Legion Commander Tresdin Stamplar DC PvE Main
    Sephirith Altmer MagPlar EP Gondar the Bounty Hunter Khajiit StamBlade DC
    The Dirge Redguard StamNecro EP Disruptor Stormcrafter Nord StamSorc AD
    Lone Druid Bosmer Stam Warden EP Necro-Phos Argonian MagBlade AD
    @ McAttack in game
    Played since beta, and then on console at release, until the game became unplayable on console.
  • NeillMcAttack
    NeillMcAttack
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Rickter wrote: »
    @NeillMcAttack

    everything you listed is why noCP was lauded as "superior".

    And i dont necessarily disagree. So if its common to see that:
    with players stats ever increasing, with more points to spend, soon quick recovery and bastion will need toning down. Maybe even the block cost reduction too. You must understand that players like Fengrush have been hardcore into PvP for a long time. They understood the meta and the direction CP were taking PvP. When CP stars allow a player more damage just thanks to stats, more health, more resistances, more healing and bigger shields etc. The meta can start moving in a direction where players aren't dying anymore. As a PvP player, only being able to kill less experienced, and less equipped players can be majorly frustrating.

    then why are we seeing threads complaining they want CP back?

    This is what I've been trying to say:

    A vocal minority with celebrity status backed and advocated noCP for whatever reasons, some legitimate, some for selfish agenda. A large portion of ESO players support and back these said players and their opinions. ZOS makes PvP majority noCP. Players are now crying they want CP campaigns back.

    I am confused and Im of the mind that the ESO players "made their bed, now lay in it"

    Stop supporting fengrush and everyone else because they pushed for what everyone seems to be crying about.

    @Rickter
    I don't want to go back and forth with what players want? What is best? Why CP will be an issue again in the future?
    I wasn't "supporting" fengrush, I was explaining his perspective.

    Players are not crying they want CP campaign back. Players are crying that they have nowhere to play, at all, due to performance and quality. That's the bottom line. Do you think that all the lag, performance, disconnect, queue times threads will go away with adding another CP Camapign? They won't, they were here before the patch, they will be here after. Players will still queue into the highest pop server all day long. Which is bumped by new players that can't even compete against NPC's therein let alone max CP players.
    PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvP
    Tiidehunter Nord StamDK EP PvP Main
    Legion Commander Tresdin Stamplar DC PvE Main
    Sephirith Altmer MagPlar EP Gondar the Bounty Hunter Khajiit StamBlade DC
    The Dirge Redguard StamNecro EP Disruptor Stormcrafter Nord StamSorc AD
    Lone Druid Bosmer Stam Warden EP Necro-Phos Argonian MagBlade AD
    @ McAttack in game
    Played since beta, and then on console at release, until the game became unplayable on console.
  • apostate9
    apostate9
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Vizier wrote: »
    Cyrodiil needs more meaningful objectives than keeps. Primarily by providing more resources that effect keeps but are much further away. Can things like the quest hubs, other towers, important mines, water sources, roads etc. This will effectively spread the fighting around the map that is largely unused and provide more options between Zerg and small group play.

    Maybe make multiple goals that truly need to be held simultaneously, and which make keeps actually meaningful so there is less keep ping-pong. One thought:

    MINE - Provides a "Well Maintained" buff to friendlies on the keep grounds. +5% to physical resistance to any friendly on the keep grounds. Lose the mine, lose the buff.

    FARM - Provides a "Well Fed" buff to friendlies on the keep grounds. +2% to the overall effect of active food/drink buffs. Lose the farm, lose the buff.

    LUMBERMILL - Provides a "Fletching" buff to friendlies on the keep grounds. +4 meter range on all ranged weapon attacks while on the grounds. Lose the mill...lose the buff.

    NOBLE OBLIGATION - Provides +1% healing received from all sources to friendlies on keep grounds ONLY IF 4+ members of the owning guild are present on the grounds! Claim the keep for a troll guild, and screw your allies out of this buff...This also encourages real PvP guilds to defend their own keeps.

    It creates more defender's Advantage and makes the resources legitimately valuable to players. Just a thought...

    @ZOS_BrianWheeler
    Edited by apostate9 on June 29, 2017 4:03PM
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    I run around the 30 day and 7 day no CP campaign...

    Been two nights now without seeing an enemy...

    :(
    Gamer tag: DasPanzerKat NA Xbox One
    1300+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er

    Waffennacht' Builds
  • kuro-dono
    kuro-dono
    ✭✭✭✭
    no cp campaigns are definetly best quality pvp as long as there isnt too much of griefing, nightcapping or aoe choo choo:ing going on.
  • kuro-dono
    kuro-dono
    ✭✭✭✭
    I run around the 30 day and 7 day no CP campaign...

    Been two nights now without seeing an enemy...

    :(

    too bad on your platform everyone wants to play godmode, pc eu its quite nicely balanced the populations.
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    kuro-dono wrote: »
    I run around the 30 day and 7 day no CP campaign...

    Been two nights now without seeing an enemy...

    :(

    too bad on your platform everyone wants to play godmode, pc eu its quite nicely balanced the populations.

    The real question becomes, do I join the CP campaign and have to deal with a very long que or do I keep to no CP for free instant teleports? Hrm...
    Gamer tag: DasPanzerKat NA Xbox One
    1300+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er

    Waffennacht' Builds
  • Malic
    Malic
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    The problem really stems from your expectations. Youre expectations are too high. Have you just recently started playing The Elder Scrolls Online PVP? If so Im hoping I helped my short, succinct and accurate first two sentences.

    If you've been here for a while (I'd say over 6 months, I concede thats completely arbitrary though) and you have not tempered your expectations you are a complete idiot and no amount of discussion can mitigate your stupidity.
    Edited by Malic on June 29, 2017 4:09PM
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