unintended feature? regarding crown bought furniture.

dsalter

i know i might get some serious hate for this but why is the stuff bought with crowns able to be sold in game to other players? isn't that technically gold selling?

Lyserus

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

dsalter

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

Gilvoth

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

yes they could and did so for a long time.
and by the way, why do you think its "bad"
people are broke ingame, we need a way to make gold.
this is not new to MMO's infact eso is the only MMO i have ever played that did not have the ability to buy from the crown store and then sell to people so i could make gold.

Lyserus

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

Shimmer

Uh i would also like to know @ZOS_GinaBruno because that is essentially gold selling...

Gilvoth

Lyserus wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

you can buy mimik stones and sell the armor made from them, thats no different then furniture.

Lyserus

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

you can buy mimik stones and sell the armor made from them, thats no different then furniture.

aye that's what i talked about..

Gilvoth

they said that in data mining it showed the ability to sell purchased homes to other players.

Shimmer

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

you can buy mimik stones and sell the armor made from them, thats no different then furniture.

It is absolutely different. The mimic stone allows you to create armor of styles that exist in game. The crown store furniture
Can't be obtained in game.

Gilvoth

Sylance9 wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

you can buy mimik stones and sell the armor made from them, thats no different then furniture.

It is absolutely different. The mimic stone allows you to create armor of styles thst exist in game. The crown store furniture
Can't be obtained in game.

i bought it with gold and sold it to a player, is excactly the same thing.

Shimmer

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Sylance9 wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

are you referring to the imperial furnitures?

there are no offical feedback that imperial furniture blueprints are crown-exclusive yet...there is a slightly chance it is just rare

though, we shall see how ZOS respond this @ZOS_GinaBruno

you can buy mimik stones and sell the armor made from them, thats no different then furniture.

It is absolutely different. The mimic stone allows you to create armor of styles thst exist in game. The crown store furniture
Can't be obtained in game.

i bought it with gold and sold it to a player, is excactly the same thing.

Buying something with crowns and selling that purchased item for gold is gold buying and different than buying something for gold and selling it for gold....

Shimmer

Let's be clear here, I would be interested to know what items you are talking about. You really didn't indicate what items they were that you were able to sell, if they were ones that can be obtained in game.

AoDD33pfri3d

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

Lyserus wrote: »

well that happened long ago when crown-exclusive motifs are released...

true but not to the point where you can buy them, then straight away put them on a guild vendor

yes they could and did so for a long time.
and by the way, why do you think its "bad"
people are broke ingame, we need a way to make gold.
this is not new to MMO's infact eso is the only MMO i have ever played that did not have the ability to buy from the crown store and then sell to people so i could make gold.

I agree it helps crown buyers like us and helps the buyer to get that item, regardless they couldn't afford it or be a 15 year old that can't buy from the crown store.

Shimmer

There are two arguments going on here: whether it has become pay to win (the ability to buy gold), and why pay to win is bad.

ESO is one of two remaining AAA MMO's where real world disposable income cannot gain you significant advantage in game over other players with less disposable income. These other games, and if this is true of eso, are "pay to win". I am not going to get Ito a discussion over whether pay to win is bad or not, but it is something I, and much of the community would not like to see happen with ESO.

If this is true that you can buy items in the crown store and sell them for in game gold, particularly items which are not available in game through gameplay, then ESO clearly has become pay to win.

Gilvoth

how are people winning by recieving items that are purely cosmetic and only for thier homes or for the apperiance of armor or even mounts and clothing ?

it's not. nothing was won.

the ability to "buy" with real life money a sword that has 10X more damage thn other people with real life money is pay to win.

what you are refering to is paying for cosmetic items and then selling them to people ingame for ingame gold. and that is not pay to win.
thats simply

"pay to look good"

dsalter

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

how are people winning by recieving items that are purely cosmetic and only for thier homes or for the apperiance of armor or even mounts and clothing ?

it's not. nothing was won.

the ability to "buy" with real life money a sword that has 10X more damage thn other people with real life money is pay to win.

what you are refering to is paying for cosmetic items and then selling them to people ingame for ingame gold. and that is not pay to win.
thats simply

"pay to look good"

gold can buy you materials, consumables, gear.
crowns cannot.
a way to convert crowns into items then turn those items directly into gold is buying gold.
do you win? no.
does it buy you an advantage over others? yes.
how so? because you can use your real wallet to gain an upper hand on your ingame wallet. thankfully nothing is stupidly good thats worth gold... yet...

dsalter

Sylance9 wrote: »

Let's be clear here, I would be interested to know what items you are talking about. You really didn't indicate what items they were that you were able to sell, if they were ones that can be obtained in game.

everything that can be placed in the home via crowns. EVERYTHING.

Gilvoth

dsalter wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

how are people winning by recieving items that are purely cosmetic and only for thier homes or for the apperiance of armor or even mounts and clothing ?

it's not. nothing was won.

the ability to "buy" with real life money a sword that has 10X more damage thn other people with real life money is pay to win.

what you are refering to is paying for cosmetic items and then selling them to people ingame for ingame gold. and that is not pay to win.
thats simply

"pay to look good"

gold can buy you materials, consumables, gear.
crowns cannot.
a way to convert crowns into items then turn those items directly into gold is buying gold.
do you win? no.
does it buy you an advantage over others? yes.
how so? because you can use your real wallet to gain an upper hand on your ingame wallet. thankfully nothing is stupidly good thats worth gold... yet...

thats just not true.
i know people whom have millions of gold, they have won nothing.
they are no better in thier game then those whom have 100 gold.

dsalter

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

dsalter wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

how are people winning by recieving items that are purely cosmetic and only for thier homes or for the apperiance of armor or even mounts and clothing ?

it's not. nothing was won.

the ability to "buy" with real life money a sword that has 10X more damage thn other people with real life money is pay to win.

what you are refering to is paying for cosmetic items and then selling them to people ingame for ingame gold. and that is not pay to win.
thats simply

"pay to look good"

gold can buy you materials, consumables, gear.
crowns cannot.
a way to convert crowns into items then turn those items directly into gold is buying gold.
---->do you win? no. <----
does it buy you an advantage over others? yes.
how so? because you can use your real wallet to gain an upper hand on your ingame wallet. thankfully nothing is stupidly good thats worth gold... yet...

thats just not true.
i know people whom have millions of gold, they have won nothing.
they are no better in thier game then those whom have 100 gold.

did you even attempt to read it?

Ackwalan

It is just a test to see how upset people would get about a crown for gold system. If there is not to much uproar, expect to see the "gifting" system to hit the crown store.

Shimmer

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

how are people winning by recieving items that are purely cosmetic and only for thier homes or for the apperiance of armor or even mounts and clothing ?

it's not. nothing was won.

the ability to "buy" with real life money a sword that has 10X more damage thn other people with real life money is pay to win.

what you are refering to is paying for cosmetic items and then selling them to people ingame for ingame gold. and that is not pay to win.
thats simply

"pay to look good"

The gold earned from selling items from the crown store can be used to purchase some of the best items in game thus giving you an in game advantage. That sir, is pay to win.

DigitalShibby

So let's pretend someone gets very rich selling crown bought furniture for gold.. okay.. now what..?? Do you know how many players are sitting on 5-10-15-20+ million gold and nothing to do with it? Nothing to spend it on. I have just below 7 mill personally and absolutely nothing to buy. The best gear in the game doesn't come from purchasing it, almost all the best in slot gear is bind on pickup. Sure you have some random things like spinners, mothers sorrow, spriggans that sell for high prices but even if you used that ill-gotten gold for purchasing those sets you still have no advantage over anyone else. People can still buy gold from gold selling companies, having a ton of gold offers no advantages.
And I'm not advocating that this is right, I personally believe that nothing obtained via crowns should be sold for gold.. however I don't see it causing a gap or problem that injures the economy, game or it's player base.
I assume it's better value spending money to buy from gold farming companies than it is buying crowns to flip furnishings for "profit."

dsalter

DigitalShibby wrote: »

So let's pretend someone gets very rich selling crown bought furniture for gold.. okay.. now what..?? Do you know how many players are sitting on 5-10-15-20+ million gold and nothing to do with it? Nothing to spend it on. I have just below 7 mill personally and absolutely nothing to buy. The best gear in the game doesn't come from purchasing it, almost all the best in slot gear is bind on pickup. Sure you have some random things like spinners, mothers sorrow, spriggans that sell for high prices but even if you used that ill-gotten gold for purchasing those sets you still have no advantage over anyone else. People can still buy gold from gold selling companies, having a ton of gold offers no advantages.
And I'm not advocating that this is right, I personally believe that nothing obtained via crowns should be sold for gold.. however I don't see it causing a gap or problem that injures the economy, game or it's player base.
I assume it's better value spending money to buy from gold farming companies than it is buying crowns to flip furnishings for "profit."

yet.

theres a reason most MMO's try to find a huge game cash sink every DLC/Expansion so that they cant own a monopoly

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Get over it. Once the crown store hit, it was only a matter of time. And it will just keep getting worse. They have already mentioned testing a way to gift crowns. If this is a problem for you, it is best to get out while you can.

Shimmer

DigitalShibby wrote: »

So let's pretend someone gets very rich selling crown bought furniture for gold.. okay.. now what..?? Do you know how many players are sitting on 5-10-15-20+ million gold and nothing to do with it? Nothing to spend it on. I have just below 7 mill personally and absolutely nothing to buy. The best gear in the game doesn't come from purchasing it, almost all the best in slot gear is bind on pickup. Sure you have some random things like spinners, mothers sorrow, spriggans that sell for high prices but even if you used that ill-gotten gold for purchasing those sets you still have no advantage over anyone else. People can still buy gold from gold selling companies, having a ton of gold offers no advantages.
And I'm not advocating that this is right, I personally believe that nothing obtained via crowns should be sold for gold.. however I don't see it causing a gap or problem that injures the economy, game or it's player base.
I assume it's better value spending money to buy from gold farming companies than it is buying crowns to flip furnishings for "profit."

The difference is they earned it IN GAME, and not with their wallet, which others without a disposable income can do. I congratulate you on your ability to earn gold, but you in fact EARNED IT. Being able to make gold from crowns does in fact give you an in game advantage other those without a disposable income.

JWKe

Better the gold be purchased through a legitimate party that is Zo$ then some shoddy gold selling website. Besides, isn't it the same with WoW tokens, or Runescape bonds where players could buy these items with IRL money from Blizzard or Jagex and sell them for in game gold? It seems to be a universally accepted practice in most MMOs nowadays.

Shimmer

JWKe wrote: »

Better the gold be purchased through a legitimate party that is Zo$ then some shoddy gold selling website. Besides, isn't it the same with WoW tokens, or Runescape bonds where players could buy these items with IRL money from Blizzard or Jagex and sell them for in game gold? It seems to be a universally accepted practice in most MMOs nowadays.

It is the same as wow tokens and runescape. Those games are pay to win, or pay to advance if you would rather call it. Until now the crown store has kept trading and selling items purchased because the community voiced its concern with it becoming pay to win. I would really like to know if this was intentional.

MissBizz

Absolutely a bug. I'm positive it even says in the patch notes that crown store bought items are not able to be traded or sold.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Crown store items can be bought and sold in game.

Gilvoth

Sylance9 wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

So let's pretend someone gets very rich selling crown bought furniture for gold.. okay.. now what..?? Do you know how many players are sitting on 5-10-15-20+ million gold and nothing to do with it? Nothing to spend it on. I have just below 7 mill personally and absolutely nothing to buy. The best gear in the game doesn't come from purchasing it, almost all the best in slot gear is bind on pickup. Sure you have some random things like spinners, mothers sorrow, spriggans that sell for high prices but even if you used that ill-gotten gold for purchasing those sets you still have no advantage over anyone else. People can still buy gold from gold selling companies, having a ton of gold offers no advantages.
And I'm not advocating that this is right, I personally believe that nothing obtained via crowns should be sold for gold.. however I don't see it causing a gap or problem that injures the economy, game or it's player base.
I assume it's better value spending money to buy from gold farming companies than it is buying crowns to flip furnishings for "profit."

The difference is they earned it IN GAME, and not with their wallet, which others without a disposable income can do. I congratulate you on your ability to earn gold, but you in fact EARNED IT. Being able to make gold from crowns does in fact give you an in game advantage other those without a disposable income.

you keep saying that it is pay to win but that simply is not true, we have shown you proof that your belief is not what is happening here in eso.
you cannot pay to win in eso.
the only way to do that is if you can use real life money to buy ingame items that can be used to kill other people and / or kill PvE Bosses that other people ingame Cannot get.

please try to understand.
people whom have millions of gold, they have won nothing.
they are no better in thier game then those whom have 100 gold.

Shimmer

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Sylance9 wrote: »

DigitalShibby wrote: »

So let's pretend someone gets very rich selling crown bought furniture for gold.. okay.. now what..?? Do you know how many players are sitting on 5-10-15-20+ million gold and nothing to do with it? Nothing to spend it on. I have just below 7 mill personally and absolutely nothing to buy. The best gear in the game doesn't come from purchasing it, almost all the best in slot gear is bind on pickup. Sure you have some random things like spinners, mothers sorrow, spriggans that sell for high prices but even if you used that ill-gotten gold for purchasing those sets you still have no advantage over anyone else. People can still buy gold from gold selling companies, having a ton of gold offers no advantages.
And I'm not advocating that this is right, I personally believe that nothing obtained via crowns should be sold for gold.. however I don't see it causing a gap or problem that injures the economy, game or it's player base.
I assume it's better value spending money to buy from gold farming companies than it is buying crowns to flip furnishings for "profit."

The difference is they earned it IN GAME, and not with their wallet, which others without a disposable income can do. I congratulate you on your ability to earn gold, but you in fact EARNED IT. Being able to make gold from crowns does in fact give you an in game advantage other those without a disposable income.

you keep saying that it is pay to win but that simply is not true, we have shown you proof that your belief is not what is happening here in eso.
you cannot pay to win in eso.
the only way to do that is if you can use real life money to buy ingame items that can be used to kill other people and / or kill PvE Bosses that other people ingame Cannot get.

please try to understand.
people whom have millions of gold, they have won nothing.
they are no better in thier game then those whom have 100 gold.

......you keep saying what you are saying but you are wrong. Op says items that he purchased from the crown store could be sold in game for gold.

Let's say 2 players start playing at the same time, we'll call them player A and player B. Player A has a ton of disposable income, player B does not. Player A purchases crowns and items from the store, and turns around and sells them in game for gold. Player B is still grinding for gold. Player A now has more money than player B can imagine and is able to do more things in game. Player A now can purchase items that allow him to compete at a level player B will spend months maybe even years to achieve thus giving player A an advantage over player B. Pay to win is buying something with real world money that would give you an advantage over another player. Player A clearly has an advantage over player B.

Is that easier to understand?