How do you learn to tank outside dungeons?

theslynx

tl;dr - How do you learn to tank outside of dungeons?

I want to be able to tank effectively in normal dungeons (and eventually the odd veteran dungeon when I get better gear). I bought some passable heavy gear when I hit 160 while I rank up crafting (Mark of the Pariah set, Endurance pieces, for 25k health, 28k resistances, 1.2k stamina regeneration).

I think I understand the basic concepts - hold aggro with taunts, block damage, interrupt mobs when they get cute, mix in heavy and light attacks to regen stamina and charge ultimates, and provide buffs to the party when there's a chance. I've been using basic tank skills like Pierce Armour, Radiant Aura, Breath of Life, etc.

At this point, I think the issue isn't so much gear or skills, but actually doing this stuff in practice: getting a sense for resource management, learning to target the right foes, understanding spacing during a fight, etc. I've only joined random normal dungeons a couple of times, but got kicked almost instantly both times. And honestly, I'd rather have some confidence in my skills before entering dungeons anyway, especially since I have 260+ latency.

So how can a person train tanking outside of dungeons, especially when you might have to do it solo? It feels like open world and solo content demand a completely different set of tactics. Reading guides is nice, but it's like reading a guide about how to pilot a plane and then just being put in the *** of a commercial jet and sent off. Are there specific missions with AI companions I should target that teach the basics or allow you to try it out? Should I run around trying to tank world bosses? Follow players in public dungeons?

Help is appreciated. (Apologies if this is the wrong forum category; several seemed applicable.)

inflaburwb17_ESO

theslynx wrote: »

... interrupt mobs when they get cute...

Love the phrasing.

pattyLtd

You can't not efficiently anyway.
Tank is a support role when you are playing solo there isn't anyone to support.

But that's just my opinion and i truelly hope you'll get more usefull responses

Enslaved

Hm.. Maybe go to public dungeons, there are plenty action there, random ppl will come, practice on bosses there.
Your goal should be to taunt bossand keep him on you all the time in one spot. Most of dungeons need that type of tanking. Gl man.

susmitds

Find a single boss world boss without people. Try to see how long you can survive. Once you have mastered that and survive without external help, move to a double boss world boss and repeat. Once that is easy for you and test your survivability against a triple boss world boss. If the triple bosses fail to kill you, then you should be ready for vet dungeons.

ScooberSteve

World bosses in orsinium are a good start.

elantaura

I take myself to world bosses it takes me about 20mins to kill them but gives a good opportunity to practice the fine art of not dying whilst being sm smacked silly.
Having said that picking a high traffic area is better as usually someone will see you not dying and think free loot and help kill it.

inflaburwb17_ESO

I started an Orc DK as my tank character. I'm only level 12 now, but once I hit level 10 I haven't done anything BUT dungeons with group finder.

I have 2 other characters, with which I think I have done a combined total of 3 dungeons. A NB (my main character) and my very very first character, an utterly useless DK. I don't even know why I keep him around.

I started this latest character because I was seriously apprehensive of dungeons, coupled with the fact that I just couldn't find any groups when queuing as a DD.

As said, I started dungeoning the moment I hit level 10, with only 3 skills in my bar : Puncture, Spiked Armor and Stonefist. I have not been kicked so far and dungeoning has turned out to be a ball. This tank is turning out to be the most fun character I have ever played in ESO.

I'm learning as I go along. But I have found that taking on overland bosses with some other players, especially the ones with minions, helped me a bit. And what is nice here is that you don't have to be in a group to take on these bosses. Check the zone chat for when people say a certain boss is up and pitch in when others are fighting it.

NewBlacksmurf

Queue and practice in normal with pugs.

Anything else is a waste of time cause learning the fights is "how" you learn. Other than this....there's no way

Some watch videos before jumping in but at some point Youll need hands own experiences.

DoccEff

Practice on world bosses. As mentioned above, the ones in Wrothgar are good for that since they are much stronger than normal ones and spawn adds and more stuff.
Or just do normal dungeons. You really don't need much skill for them.

Curragraigue

Before I started tanking I DPS'd keeping a close eye on what the tanks were doing. However as others have said the best way to learn is to do. Try a few normal dungeons then watch some tanking videos to refine build and skills if you are concerned about it.

Liofa

You cannot learn tanking by reading stuff . Your training method should be visual . If you don't see what must be done in certain situation , you will not be remembering it most of the time . Go to Youtube . Watch videos from tank PoV . That is the most efficent way of learning stuff .

For example , you will try tanking Hel Ra . If I tell you to spam Igneous Shield during Channeling Sweeps attack while fighting The Warrior , you will probably forget it . BUT , if you watch it and see what it actually looks like in the actual game , you will understand what must be done and start doing it .

I remember my first completion of vMoL , I did almost exactly the same as what Hodor's tank did . Before going in , I went to Youtube and watched that video numerous times . Both from Alcast's PoV to understand what should I do to keep my allies safe ; and from tank's pov to understand exactly what to do as tank to survive . After countless replays and practices I made , I learned exactly what to do and completed it . On my second run , I tanked it with my own playstyle . Now , I know the fight perfectly , I can tank it with any class , magicka or stamina .

About a month ago , I got used to the fight and feeling confident with my build and what I do , I tanked HM with my own playstyle . Didn't learn it from any other tank .

I was in a casual guild , learned from the guild master himself . I was off-tanking and he was the main tank . I watched every move in every fight . This is how I started tanking . Now , I completed every content in the game with my own playstyle that I created . Easiest to hardest .

You can get experience with PUG tanking . BUT , getting experience and learning are not the same thing . Always have someone to teach you . It doesn't have to be someone you know in-game . Watching videos is more than enough but try to understand every move and why they do it . Some Youtubers won't put up their build but you can figure it out yourself by checking their addons , giving attention to animations of set procs , different skill effects . You can even understand what traits they are using by looking at their damage taken and their Crusher enchant proc rate .

Final words . Don't believe everything you hear on Youtube . Test it yourself . Drop your block and see which attack deals how much damage . Blocking an attack that doesn't even scratch doesn't make anyone a better tank . You can drop your block and be faster on your feet if necessary . You can do light attacks to proc Crusher enchant so your DDs can do more damage . You can also proc it with a Heroic Slash but it costs a lot of stamina . Light attack is free . When vMoL started to getting completed by a lot of guilds , they were saying that tanks need capped resists(33k) , at least 30k Health and cannot drop block or you die . I tanked it with 18k resistances and 25k Health only blocking necessary attacks . You can find the video here .

Hope my words will help you . Remember , learn visually and test things yourself . Ask your betters about mechanics and never get satisfied with what you have . No one is best . You can always get better .

SirCritical

Great explanation from Liofa! But first, you'll need a team, and with quite stable members, because if you change something in your build, and things go on a different way than earlier, you won't know if it is the effect of your changes, or it comes from just the different setup of the squad.

Maybe you should find a guild which does dungeon runs often.

Vaoh

Hello there! I'm going to try to help you out here as much as possible.

I'm a Magicka Sorc main, and have DPSed all content this game has to offer many times over. Very good at it as well. I have also tanked Vet Dragonstar Arena and lots of other content using a PvP Sorc tank build. If there's one thing to learn from ESO, it is this: Understanding mechanics (experience) = much better performance

No other way around it. You will not perform very well until you comprehend what exactly you are up against. This is okay though. In general, you'll want to prioritize taunting a boss at all times. Taunt everything though. Remember that you are not the one dealing damage, so you must be a fortress whilst buffing your groupmates. Cast Echoing Vigor, Aggressive Warhorn, etc

For your armor, you will want to run either 7 Heavy armor (7/0/0) or 5 Heavy, 1 Medium, 1 Light (5/1/1) to make use of the powerful Undaunted skill tree passives. Use One Hand and Shield on both weapon bars no matter what.

For your sets, you have a lot of choices. Here are some most used tanking sets.
• *Ebon Armory*
• Alkosh
• Lunar Bastion
• Tava's Favor
• Hist Bark
• Armor Master
• Blood Spawn
• Lord Warden
• Mighty Chudan
• Akaviri Dragonguard

Trait-wise, your gear goes as follows:
Helm, Chest, Legs - Reinforced
Boots, Hands, Belt, Shoulders - Sturdy
Mace/Sword/Axe/Dagger - Defending
Shield - Nirnhoned, Reinforced

Good luck with your tanking in the future!

theslynx

Thanks for the responses, all. Will try to soak it in.

It seems like most people think practical experience is gotten just through random normal dungeons or world bosses, so I guess that's the next step.

I do wish there were actual quests in the game with NPCs that let you practice support roles; it seems all end-game content is built around roles, while solo content is mostly built around ignoring them or mostly playing DPS. I would love to practice different builds and tactics without hampering someone else's play time with what may prove untenable.

Brokensocket

You have the concept right, i just started vet dungeons after 2 norm tests, i get compliments on my tanking and asked to join for farming. You just need to understand your role, which really sounds like you already do, make sure you have decent gear and good skills for your class

Tan9oSuccka

I usually tank with 5 Hundings Rage, 2 Tremorscale, (All heavy) 3 Agility, and 2 Endurance.

The same setup works great in solo questing as well.

I tried the meat bag sets mentioned above, but I think some of them are overkill.

Solo questing with Armor master is not fun at all, trust me.

Draxys

Same way you learn how to play basketball without a goal.... you don't. You just gotta hop in a group and go for it. If you're prepared, it'll go a lot smoother than it otherwise could.

TheUrbanWizard

Doing dungeons is only way.. I just hope you join groups that are forgiving of the fact your learning. Normal vanilla dungeons are your best bet, not to intense.

raj72616a

learn tanking in vet dungeons. most normal dungeons do not require proper tanking. and normal dungeons you will meet low level healers who don't have the skills to support you yet. and dps who queue for vet dungeon are usually stronger than those who queue for normal.

just choose the easy ones first, like Fungal Grotto I, and the other I dungeons. then maybe Arx, Volenfall, Tempest Island, Direfrost, Selene (thats the order i recommend). then the II dungeons. leave WGT, ICP, CoS, RoM for the last.

then normal trials. then ver trial.

Prof_Bawbag

I too am in a similar position to yourself, however, slightly more further forward if that makes sense. Like others have stated, practice on overland bosses at first, then find someone or a couple of people who will take the time out and help you and won't get all elitist when you inevitably f up. Because you will f up and that's a guarantee. No one, even those with their God almighty superiority complexes ran dungeons without a few deaths under their belts at the start. Most just paper over that little fact and think you should hit the ground running, when next to no one has ever done that.

Believe it or not, there are some very, very helpful people on these forums that rarely get involved in all these dungeon threads you see popping up regularly on here bashing noobs. Instead they prefer to help people in the build forums and offer very good advice. Some may even allow you to tag along with them to learn the ropes.

I see @pattyLtd has posted within this thread already. He/she is one of those very people who took the time out to help me on my DK build. @Oreyn_Bearclaw and @Liofa are also users that go that extra mile to help others.

theslynx

Draxys wrote: »

Same way you learn how to play basketball without a goal.... you don't. You just gotta hop in a group and go for it. If you're prepared, it'll go a lot smoother than it otherwise could.

To be fair, I have played basketball quite a bit, and the analogy is inexact. I started with just a net and a ball, then added another player, then a few, then joined a team. There are gradations at play to encourage growth. But I do take your point.

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

I too am in a similar position to yourself, however, slightly more further forward if that makes sense. Like others have stated, practice on overland bosses at first, then find someone or a couple of people who will take the time out and help you and won't get all elitist when you inevitably f up....

Thanks. Glad to hear you're making progress.

Artemiisia

I know some tanks, went into trials alone and trained tanking on first boss, practicing on staying alive as long as possible.

For me personally, I learned it when I made the switch from only being a dd to going tank as well, with friends in my group doing dungeons

Koensol

I have to agree with those above saying it is learning by trial and error. You have to learn your reflexes. Start by doing normal dungeons. Tanking is more than just tank and spank a boss so practicing on worlbosses isn't gonna cut it. I have to say you are unlucky for getting kicked twice, normally that doesn't happen. Especially on a tank there is less 'requirement' on gear/cp.

Some principles to keep in mind. Nothing too specific.
On trash packs:
- try to keep mobs together, cc them, as much as you can.
- always go in first, and taunt some of the more dangerous mobs to stop them from swarming your healer. The rest will work out by itself, especially if you have dps that melt face.

On bosses:
- Always try to face the boss away from your group. Many bosses have a frontal cone AoE attack. There is always the mindless dps/healer that likes to run all over the place, including in front of the boss. If they die, don't feel bad. Its their own fault.
- Keep the boss debuffed, and the group buffed. For example, try to always keep pierce armor up, as it nicely increases the dps of your group.

The rest is just common sense, as in: dodge AoE, block heavy attacks, interrupt if possible. Its not that hard and I'm sure you will find your style soon enough

Dasovaruilos

World Bosses are a good start if you don't want to go straigh to dungeons.

There are a few that will respect taunts basically the whole time and you can see how much you can take.

And there are the Orsinium and Craglorn ones that will hit pretty hard. You can test there how you are doing and nobody is going to be angry if you make a mistake or die.

I leveled a tank during New Life and just went straight to normal dungeons, though. I can't see much in terms of actual resist, since I'm CP cap and don't take much damage, but it is great to learn rotations, positioning, resource management...

akl77

Pvp, duel.

gangyzgirl

The way I worked and practiced my tank was two ways.

I had a good friend who I quest with all the time. We did Cadwells silver on my tank in training and her dps. I would practice taunting and tanking holding large swarms of mobs while she did damage. This gave me practice of holding agro and practicing self heals and wards.

when alone, I would find world bosses. Odds were usually that people would show up in groups to take them out. I would seek a group like this and taunt while they did damage, or solo the wb slowly wearing it down until it was dead or another player came along and helped kill it.

It was only when I unlocked most of my sword and board skills and morphed them that I felt ready to practice in dungeons. First with people I knew who understood I was still learning and then finally to the point I felt confident in doing random dungeons.

Being a tank is a lot of fun, I know I do more pledges on him than I do my healer.

Johngo0036

@theslynx - what i did was tanking the world bosses, when i was happy with my performance i moved to queueing for the normal random dungeons as a tank,

Tanked many of them watched you tube videos on what tanks should be doing...

This is a role where you just jump in and get your hand dirty.. no practicing really..

HatchetHaro

World bosses is a good place to practice tank rotations if you have a healer or can self-heal for quite a lot.

Let's be real, though, tanks are the easiest role to gear for, but the hardest role to play properly in terms of skill. In order to tank properly, you need simple decent gear and a full understanding of what exactly to do. That means knowing all the exact mechanics for each dungeon boss. 30k health and 20k resistances is enough to tank all vet dungeons properly if you know what you are doing.

You're probably better off just queueing for dungeons again or getting some guildies to help you out. Once you get a feel for it and know all the mechanics of the dungeons, you're golden, and can start working on utility and buffing.

You learn quicker by doing vet dungeons, by the way; remember to tell your group that you're inexperienced with the dungeon if you're inexperienced with the dungeon. In normal dungeons, groups will simply just burn through everything. That's how I learned to tank effectively, anyway; just queue for vet dungeons through group finder and ask for help and explanations on mechanics; most of the time people are helpful enough.

Asardes

Well, the armor traits are up to anyone's choice. I personally like to have infused on big pieces and shield, and divines on the small ones, because I enchant with tri-glyphs and run atronach mundus. I have a full stamina build, 24K in tanking gear, but I run Ebon Armory so my health is where it needs to be, around 28K, with no boosts, just from the gear bonuses, enchants, heavy armor and undaunted passives. I only run shield play enchants on jewelry, and CPs in block cost reduction, because cost reduction has diminishing returns. I stack only magicka, around 18K, and magicka recovery, which is ~1.7K from consumable, various passives, and mundus stone. I have enough stamina to block, enough health to survive and enough magicka and sustain to cast and recast utility skills. For DK magicka recovery is a substitute for the stamina recovery you lack while blocking. I just cast ingenous shield and I get back 5% stamina. When I don't need to block, I can chain and talon mobs all the time without running out.

My gear is:
2 Bloodspawn or Lord Warden heavy, infused head and divines shoulder, tri-glyphs
5 Ebon Armory, heavy, infused legs, divines feet, 3 healty jewelry, shield play enchantments
5 Tava's Blessing, heavy infused chest, medium divines hands, light divines waist, infused shield, all with tri glyphs, defending swords with crusher enchantments

But of course this is an end game build, it depends a lot on having CPs, BiS gear and a lot of experience. For a beginner tank, who lacks the materials to gold and enchant everything, get monster heads in perfect traits, reinforced and sturdy might be actually better. I ran reinforced on most of my armor with 7/7 heavy for a long time while I was leveling undaunted and getting CPs on my main character.