VMA - Some Ramblings of Sorts...

Ch4mpTW

As a compliment to a few of the threads I made recently about VMA, I figured I'd make this 1 as my closing thoughts on VMA.

To put it simply...? VMA is a video game hell. I've never once played content in a game before, that made me truly dread it. I've never touched a game that made me so: Angry, bitter, resentful, and full of hate. But VMA has done this. I have played the Dark Souls series, Bloodbourne, Mario Kart series, Ghouls and Ghosts, Contra, Castlevania, Devil May Cry series, Mega Man series, etc. Tons of games that are viewed upon as "hard", but none as ridiculous as VMA. But, what about VMA makes it so "hard". Well... It's a combination of things. An odd combination, that is rather unhealthy to put it simply. Elevated blood pressure, stress, rage, etc. are all incredibly unhealthy for the human body. And can lead to pretty serious consequences. But like... Is it that serious...?

And sure, it does become easier the more you invest your time in it... But was it worth it...? Was it worth the elevated blood pressure, the anger, the hostility, the negative emotions basically that video games are there to remove us from? After all, video games are supposed to be a form of entertainment. Something to take us away from stress, and something be used as a tool to relax. Why is it so encouraged to deal with VMA, just for weapons that 1 may end-up being no longer BIS? Why do we as members of the ESO community place such high regard for those who complete VMA, and sport such weapons?

And sure, I am more than aware of the simple fact that, "No one is forcing you to play it. You don't NEED Maelstrom weapons, and they're not required. It's just that you choose to have them." But in the end, they are kinda needed. They are needed to clear certain content, and make content easier. So in a sense, yes. You are forced to endure it. So then that begs the next question...

Why was this type of content created...? Was it created as a means of testing out the portion of "hard content" lovers of ESO, and giving them something to participate in? While also assisting the power-creep? Was it created to give a sense of accomplishment to those with high amounts of patience, and mechanics understanding? After all, a vast majority of VMA is mechanics. But then, if that were the case — why are there so many elements to RNG involved while going about performing the mechanics...? Wouldn't that be conflicting? I mean this is obvious in Stages 5, 7, and 9. As there are tons of conflicting things all about. But, for what...? What exactly is the point...?

... What is the point of VMA? I sit here now staring at my bank full of these Maelstrom Weapons, and I feel somewhat disgusted in myself. I endured so much, for digital weapons that at the end of the day don't mean a thing. I subjected myself to tons of negative emotions and my body to numerous days and evenings without sleep, and for what...? Why? I don't know actually. But, I just... I don't know. I just don't know anymore. I suppose I hit "the wall of enlightenment", but that wall makes me feel more and more foolish the more I move toward it. What was actually gained at the end of the day, besides regret and time lost that I can never get back...? Well... I don't know. I just... I just don't know. ._.

Reorx_Holybeard

Great thoughts there! I just finished a vMA myself, run #4 on my Magplar and for once the bugs/latency were kept to a minimum. Out the 8 deaths (first time breaking the 15 death barrier!) there were only 1 or 2 that were "odd"...the rest were just a l2p. And you know, it was a relatively fun but challenging 1.5 hours. Its the runs where you can't medium weave because the latency is so high or where you get one bug after another or where the RNG is not in your favour and no amount of skill will help. Unfortunately, those runs suck the fun out all the others.

I'm hoping I'm at the point where I can run it once a week and stay on the leaderboards (I missed last week by 1 spot...ugh) so I just have to do it once a week and get two weapons. I think/hope I can handle even one bug filled run a week....we'll see I guess.

Ch4mpTW

Reorx_Holybeard wrote: »

Great thoughts there! I just finished a vMA myself, run #4 on my Magplar and for once the bugs/latency were kept to a minimum. Out the 8 deaths (first time breaking the 15 death barrier!) there were only 1 or 2 that were "odd"...the rest were just a l2p. And you know, it was a relatively fun but challenging 1.5 hours. Its the runs where you can't medium weave because the latency is so high or where you get one bug after another or where the RNG is not in your favour and no amount of skill will help. Unfortunately, those runs suck the fun out all the others.

I'm hoping I'm at the point where I can run it once a week and stay on the leaderboards (I missed last week by 1 spot...ugh) so I just have to do it once a week and get two weapons. I think/hope I can handle even one bug filled run a week....we'll see I guess.

Best of luck and wishes to you comrade. I hope you get all you wanted, and then some.

OutLaw_Nynx

For me, I've never beaten it on vet on my Stam DK. I probably never will. It's making me feel like I'll never be a good player because I can't beat it. I wish I had your problems of feeling like there is a no point of it.

Round 3 is hell. I hate it. I get confident sometimes and end up turning my ps4 off because I don't want to hate the game. I'm right now laying dead on the ground just wondering if I should even bother trying again.

When I mention I'm struggling with round 3 people laugh. I find vMA frustrating and difficult. The comments of "lol git gud, OutLaw" don't help. They make me want to never try again.

Pallio

Finishing it to find that garbage deconstruction weapon you worked so hard for makes it all worthwhile, not....

Aspi90

Thats the point, I need 1h for vMA and die like 5 times (damn ice and poison "mechanics"...) and half of my weapons are decisive, only one sharpened, zero precise. Thats so frustrating.
But nothing new too tho....

FrostFallFox

I'm still waiting for some rings to drop honestly

sekou_trayvond

OP opined:

"What is the point of VMA? I sit here now staring at my bank full of these Maelstrom Weapons, and I feel somewhat disgusted in myself. I endured so much, for digital weapons that at the end of the day don't mean a thing. I subjected myself to tons of negative emotions and my body to numerous days and evenings without sleep, and for what...? Why? I don't know actually. But, I just... I don't know."

Those are Jack Handy-quality deep thoughts right there.

Bandit1215

OutLaw_Nynx wrote: »

For me, I've never beaten it on vet on my Stam DK. I probably never will. It's making me feel like I'll never be a good player because I can't beat it. I wish I had your problems of feeling like there is a no point of it.

Round 3 is hell. I hate it. I get confident sometimes and end up turning my ps4 off because I don't want to hate the game. I'm right now laying dead on the ground just wondering if I should even bother trying again.

When I mention I'm struggling with round 3 people laugh. I find vMA frustrating and difficult. The comments of "lol git gud, OutLaw" don't help. They make me want to never try again.

Storm proof is truly a title to bear with pride and honor, and even more so flawless conqueror, but it should never deter you from wether or not you think you are good at the game. The people saying lol git gud are just there to make you feel terrible. I struggled a LOT on my first completion of vMA. It literally took me 3 days, and I played that content 7 hours for each of those 3 days, so basically it took me 21 hours to do it (I should mention i am a student and completed vMA over the summer so thats why i had so much time). I almost went insane and cried myself to sleep when I finished. If you are anywhere below 350 CP, you will struggle alot. If you do not have a clear cut build that you are 100% comfortable with, you will die a lot. vMA takes intense commitment and dedication, but most of all it takes patience. If you happen to be the person who has zero patience for anything, vMA is NOT for you. Good luck my friend, and may you bear the title Stormproof one day, stand tall and say, f*** vMA!

newtinmpls

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

I am more than aware of the simple fact that, "No one is forcing you to play it. You don't NEED Maelstrom weapons, and they're not required. It's just that you choose to have them." But in the end, they are kinda needed. They are needed to clear certain content, and make content easier. So in a sense, yes. You are forced to endure it.

I'll start with a line from MST 3K

"just repeat to yourself it's just a show

I should really just relax"

And I will also point out that in many schools of thought, the humble humiliation is a valid way to enlightenment.

But finally, I will disagree. There is no content in the game that you can do with them, that you cannot do without them. If it was fun, yeah.

But to paraphrase Teegan Jevanka (sp?) from the 6th Doctor (Doctor Who the original series), when it stops being fun. Stop.

Mojmir

I'd rather drink lava

Mojmir

I'd rather drink lava

Espica

I often find it ludicrous the way things happen to make situations worse. It's really really annoying.

I bash a caster, magically the bash pulls him to my back, I have to reposition myself and ends eating a shock wave -_-
An atronach power-hits me, instead of pushing it pulls me to the boss's charged AoE attack.
Two poison plants guarding an archer in the poison stage. Besides those plants like to camouflage with the stage a lot.

Did they change the lamia's range attack in stage 3? I don't remember that it pulled you when hit from the back. It looks like it's a knock-back no matter the direction of the hit.

Francis_Toliver

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

As a compliment to a few of the threads I made recently about VMA, I figured I'd make this 1 as my closing thoughts on VMA.

And sure, I am more than aware of the simple fact that, "No one is forcing you to play it. You don't NEED Maelstrom weapons, and they're not required. It's just that you choose to have them." But in the end, they are kinda needed. They are needed to clear certain content, and make content easier. So in a sense, yes. You are forced to endure it. So then that begs the next question...
. ._.

Odd, that you think that "they are kinda needed."

People completed all the games content before VMA was created. Since then people have completed all the games content (except vma) without a Maelstrom weapon. So the correct response is...no you do not need Maelstrom weapons. they are not "kinda needed".

So "needing" a shiny Maelstrom weapon is more about wanted the latest, newest, cool thing, i.e. consumerism at its finest, then it is about anything "needed".

What is interesting is how much pain folks will put themselves in, in order to get the new shiny thing being offered.

For those with an ancient memory, (or access to youtube), it all reminds me of a song/movie by Ringo Star

"If you want it, here it is, come and get it...
but you better hurry cause it's going fast!

If you want it, anytime, I can get it
but you better hurry cause it will not last!

Would you walk away from a fool and his money?"


Now, if you want that shiny, and are willing to pay the price then all well and good. But then why all the "deep thoughts"? Buyers remorse?

Of course it may just be that folks are going through hours and hours of pain because its a fun test of skill....

Jazbay_Grape

Reading this made me feel better about the abysmal failure that my attempt at VMA was.

Ch4mpTW

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

As a compliment to a few of the threads I made recently about VMA, I figured I'd make this 1 as my closing thoughts on VMA.

And sure, I am more than aware of the simple fact that, "No one is forcing you to play it. You don't NEED Maelstrom weapons, and they're not required. It's just that you choose to have them." But in the end, they are kinda needed. They are needed to clear certain content, and make content easier. So in a sense, yes. You are forced to endure it. So then that begs the next question...
. ._.

Odd, that you think that "they are kinda needed."

People completed all the games content before VMA was created. Since then people have completed all the games content (except vma) without a Maelstrom weapon. So the correct response is...no you do not need Maelstrom weapons. they are not "kinda needed".

So "needing" a shiny Maelstrom weapon is more about wanted the latest, newest, cool thing, i.e. consumerism at its finest, then it is about anything "needed".

What is interesting is how much pain folks will put themselves in, in order to get the new shiny thing being offered.

For those with an ancient memory, (or access to youtube), it all reminds me of a song/movie by Ringo Star

"If you want it, here it is, come and get it...
but you better hurry cause it's going fast!

If you want it, anytime, I can get it
but you better hurry cause it will not last!

Would you walk away from a fool and his money?"


Now, if you want that shiny, and are willing to pay the price then all well and good. But then why all the "deep thoughts"? Buyers remorse?

Of course it may just be that folks are going through hours and hours of pain because its a fun test of skill....

Hm... Interesting.

juhasman

FrostFallFox wrote: »

I'm still waiting for some rings to drop honestly

There will be option to get golden jewelery from vMA and trials from cyrodill vendor in update 12. Excluding VO , IA and EY jewelery i tthink but still....

juhasman

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

As a compliment to a few of the threads I made recently about VMA, I figured I'd make this 1 as my closing thoughts on VMA.

And sure, I am more than aware of the simple fact that, "No one is forcing you to play it. You don't NEED Maelstrom weapons, and they're not required. It's just that you choose to have them." But in the end, they are kinda needed. They are needed to clear certain content, and make content easier. So in a sense, yes. You are forced to endure it. So then that begs the next question...
. ._.

Odd, that you think that "they are kinda needed."

People completed all the games content before VMA was created. Since then people have completed all the games content (except vma) without a Maelstrom weapon. So the correct response is...no you do not need Maelstrom weapons. they are not "kinda needed".

So "needing" a shiny Maelstrom weapon is more about wanted the latest, newest, cool thing, i.e. consumerism at its finest, then it is about anything "needed".

What is interesting is how much pain folks will put themselves in, in order to get the new shiny thing being offered.

For those with an ancient memory, (or access to youtube), it all reminds me of a song/movie by Ringo Star

"If you want it, here it is, come and get it...
but you better hurry cause it's going fast!

If you want it, anytime, I can get it
but you better hurry cause it will not last!

Would you walk away from a fool and his money?"


Now, if you want that shiny, and are willing to pay the price then all well and good. But then why all the "deep thoughts"? Buyers remorse?

Of course it may just be that folks are going through hours and hours of pain because its a fun test of skill....

It's not a race to get ,,new shiny thing" because it's ,,latest , newest cool thing" . It's because this weapons can increase Your dps by 30% comparing to best setup without them which is pretty handy in veteran trials.

LadyNalcarya

I dont know about other games, imo Devil May Cry 3 bloody palace is much more difficult and unforgiving, especially in original ps2 version (like pretty much any challenging content where one death means starting over lol).
Though I think that vMA feels really clunky and it exposes major issues of ESO combat: weird lag spikes and other bugs (like when you get him by red when youre not in the circle). Also I dont like the fact that a solo instance drops BiS items for group content.
So I agree its hardly an enjoyable experience (theres not many people that do it for fun, most of us are just grinding). I farmed it a lot and I had this weird claustrophobic feeling all the time, and when I got my vMA destro, I was relieved it was over. Wouldve been much better if we had some sort of token system tbh and if they could fix the lags and disconnects (god knows how many of my flawless runs were ruined by random dc to login screen!).

sluice

Token system, please.

Stoopid_Nwah

Like I posted elsewhere, would it be so awful to implement a system where those who have completed VMA can receive 1 token/run in addition to a random Maelstrom weapon and could also purchase 1 token/like 25k gc, 10k tel-var, or 50k ap? Then 25 tokens could be used to change the trait on an already owned weapon and 100 tokens could get you your choice of weapon+trait...just a thought as you wouldn't have to grind maelstrom 25+ times, but could do a combination of the above options to get tokens (PVPers wouldn't have to spend time outside of Cyrodiil or IC Sewers and PVErs could do trials and sell the gear for gc to buy tokens and those who "enjoy" Maelstrom can continue doing runs while still building up tokens).

Mortehl

Everyone thinks they aren't needed until they get a set of one handers and have their bleeds tick for over 20k in a vet speed run trial. Or until they realize how much more situationally aware they've become compared to the dead potatoe in the red circle next to them.

It's almost universally true.

newtinmpls

Mortehl wrote: »

vet speed run trial.

ACk.... exactly the type of player I never want to run into in a PUG

juhasman

sluice wrote: »

Token system, please.

It'll never happen.

newtinmpls

juhasman wrote: »

It's not a race to get ,,new shiny thing" because it's ,,latest , newest cool thing" . It's because this weapons can increase Your dps by 30% comparing to best setup without them which is pretty handy in veteran trials.

OP started this thread with a number of questions which I will paraphrase:

Does this increase power creep? Yes it does.

Can you do endgame content without it? Yes you can.

Both of those things of course make fights easier. But what fights are being chosen.

To me it looks like OP was stuck in a vMA grind.... intending to end up in a trial grind.

For me that's not fun. But if it is for someone else - well definitely go for it.