Token System For End Game Gear?

iam117

Having Crap traits and a crap rng system sucks, especially when there is so much rng, and so many crappy traits :P so, i know its been suggested before but would you prefer a token system for being able to choose certain pieces of end game gear in specific traits? something like trade in 10x item for 1x item in trait of your choice. or run 5x get 1x token, gear costs x tokens for each piece. where would you like to see this implemented if it were to be implemented. does this idea suck? explain.

Vote. Discuss.

Gidorick

Similar to my Ahren Jebus- A Bound Gear Trader Merchant Concept

iam117

Gidorick wrote: »

Similar to my Ahren Jebus- A Bound Gear Trader Merchant Concept

yep

hedna123b14_ESO

Make this happen!

KochDerDamonen

I'd be happy if it was like
1)offer x number of items from a loot pool
1.1)If all items are of the same set, guarantee the drop to also be
1.2)If all items are the same item type, guarantee the drop to also be
1.3)In case of prior conditions being met, ban the traits of the offered items from the drop
2)offered items are permanently deleted
3)Player is offered 1 / a choice of 1 from a few items from the pool they crafted

It feels a bit like the path of exile merchant crafting in my head, I like it. Still RNG, but if you plan ahead you can guarantee the exact thing you want with effort!


Edit: as an afterthought, this would also raise the value of selling/trading unwanted items instead of vendoring/deconning them. ie, imagine how willing you'd be to pay for a sturdy piece if you knew it would guarantee a divine's drop

Chillic

Watch them announce this, then everyone finds out the tokens are on their own RNG system

hedna123b14_ESO

Chillic wrote: »

Watch them announce this, then everyone finds out the tokens are on their own RNG system

I wouldnt be surprised

xilfxlegion

Would prefer a system where you have the option of re-rolling the traits.

Artis

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

hedna123b14_ESO

Artis wrote: »

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

We already had one thread like this artis...Ill just let this poll tell you how wrong you are...

iam117

Artis wrote: »

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

never played wow so no comment there, but, who says there could be no rare or significant gear, imagine if each piece costs 30 tokens, at 1 token per run, and each weapon costed 80 tokens, thats still a shite ton of runs, but a sight better than some poeple running 200 times and still not getting desired weapon, even in a crappy trait.

big difference in rare gear and rng?

hedna123b14_ESO

liv3mind wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

never played wow so no comment there, but, who says there could be no rare or significant gear, imagine if each piece costs 30 tokens, at 1 token per run, and each weapon costed 80 tokens, thats still a shite ton of runs, but a sight better than some poeple running 200 times and still not getting desired weapon, even in a crappy trait.

big difference in rare gear and rng?

give up now before he sucks you into his deep dark hold of cummunist "its ok that we suffer, as long as we suffer equally"

Artis

liv3mind wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

never played wow so no comment there, but, who says there could be no rare or significant gear, imagine if each piece costs 30 tokens, at 1 token per run, and each weapon costed 80 tokens, thats still a shite ton of runs, but a sight better than some poeple running 200 times and still not getting desired weapon, even in a crappy trait.

big difference in rare gear and rng?

That simply means that it will take 50 more tokens to get a weapon. So from the point of view of a player - it will take more time for this player to get this weapon. But looking at other players you will see that in a month or two everyone will have those weapons. So it won't matter how much time it took, if you consider a limit where time approaches infinity (well, just some large value), everyone will have enough tokens.

It is better for a certain player, if he wants that piece of gear. But is it better for everyone that everyone will have access to everything and getting something will be just a matter of time? I'm not convinced, to be honest.

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

give up now before he sucks you into his deep dark hold of cummunist "its ok that we suffer, as long as we suffer equally"

Haha brainwashing is strong in this one. So whatever is different from what you think is communist? I see. LOL and what an irony that it's you and OP who say that everyone should have the same gear in the end. Now that's communism right there. My point is different. It's closer to what was happening before communism - someone gets weapons and someone just doesn't You're either lucky or not. You can work hard and maybe overcome it, but you shouldn't count on it.

The whole point of RNG is that whenever you get a certain piece of gear you feel lucky and rewarded. If everything is easy to get and is just a matter of time - then that removes fun and makes a game more like work. Where you put in certain amount of hours and expect a certain reward. No, you shouldn't expect any rewards. You should play for fun because you like the process and when you get some cool items - that makes it even more fun.


The proposed system just makes every item kinda like a crafted item. You gather tokens (instead of mats) and get a weapon of your choice (instead of crafting). Then why not just remove all loot from bosses/mobs and make everything crafted?

Lucious90

Do this, and have a pvp gear vendor and a Pve gear vendor.

Though for the Pve side they would need to really amp up their end game raid progression to make it worth it.




The proposed system just makes every item kinda like a crafted item. You gather tokens (instead of mats) and get a weapon of your choice (instead of crafting). Then why not just remove all loot from bosses/mobs and make everything crafted? [/quote]

No reason to do this. Wow did it perfectly. A good gear for entering into your desired content. And it does take the sting off of the RNG hate that can befall a poor Dragon Slayer or People Slayer

Artis

Lucious90 wrote: »

No reason to do this. Wow did it perfectly. A good gear for entering into your desired content. And it does take the sting off of the RNG hate that can befall a poor Dragon Slayer or People Slayer

In wow you could do every dungeon once a day and every raid once a week. Not to mention, that you could buy top gear with tokens - it was, like you noticed, just entry gear. In ESO we already have access to entry gear with no tokens. Crafted gear will do. So why do we want tokens for top gear again?

iam117

Artis wrote: »

That simply means that it will take 50 more tokens to get a weapon. So from the point of view of a player - it will take more time for this player to get this weapon. But looking at other players you will see that in a month or two everyone will have those weapons. So it won't matter how much time it took, if you consider a limit where time approaches infinity (well, just some large value), everyone will have enough tokens.

It is better for a certain player, if he wants that piece of gear. But is it better for everyone that everyone will have access to everything and getting something will be just a matter of time? I'm not convinced, to be honest.

no, if they have a progressively changing end game, with content and gear that is upgraded, this will be a non issue, because currently equipped gear becomes less valuable with level changes, find a way to make tokens/gear only echange for the level they were earned at. if the game stays stagnant and stale, and does not change content, armor sets, or raise cp, then yes, your argument is valid.

Solid_Metal

back to FF14 all over again~

seriously tho....rather than token i prefer fully craftable equipment that some of the ingridients are only obtainable in end game dungeon, no RNG, its guarantee to drop, but RNG the amount of it

Utildai

No, this isn't WOW....

Serkazong

Don't care if its tokens or drops, I just don't want it too grindy.

Artis

liv3mind wrote: »

no, if they have a progressively changing end game, with content and gear that is upgraded, this will be a non issue, because currently equipped gear becomes less valuable with level changes, find a way to make tokens/gear only echange for the level they were earned at. if the game stays stagnant and stale, and does not change content, armor sets, or raise cp, then yes, your argument is valid.

But they don't. When was the last time we got something new to replace old stuff? We got vMOL but vMA weapons are still sought after. We had the same CP cap for how long? That's what I'm saying, the game is stagnant. And it will be like that for a while. Since now it's b2p and they just release a small DLC every quarter, there's no reason to expect huge updates with lots of new dungeons and gear. We'll get 1-2 dungeons. They won't pack them with all new gear obviously. They will distribute gear over all DLCs to make people buy them. The best thing we can expect for keeping the content diverse is that they will scale all existing content to create an illusion that endgame content is huge.

[snip]

Solid_Metal wrote: »

back to FF14 all over again~

seriously tho....rather than token i prefer fully craftable equipment that some of the ingridients are only obtainable in end game dungeon, no RNG, its guarantee to drop, but RNG the amount of it

That's the same thing lol. Instead of that one ingredient you will farm tokens though. That's the only difference.

BucFanJKE

I would prefer BoE gear.

Cuyler

+10

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

What's the point of the vote? Obviously, whoever didn't get their perfect traits will choose the first option.

If you want every item guaranteed, ok, ask for it. But then be fair and ask to have a cooldown on each dungeon too. That's why the token system in WOW made sense, but here - when you can run a dungeon as many times as you want in a row - the token system simply means that there will be no rare significant gear. Everything will be obtainable in a finite period of time. In that case might as well just make an NPC that gives you whatever gear you want, because everyone will wear the same thing anyway.

We already had one thread like this artis...Ill just let this poll tell you how wrong you are...

@liv3mind I suggest this as well, just let your poll numbers do the talking. @Artis is a very loud and small minority here.

Lenikus

So people can do teh content Once, get what they need, and them come cry in the forums because they have nothing to do all day while playing ?

Solid_Metal

Artis wrote: »

liv3mind wrote: »

no, if they have a progressively changing end game, with content and gear that is upgraded, this will be a non issue, because currently equipped gear becomes less valuable with level changes, find a way to make tokens/gear only echange for the level they were earned at. if the game stays stagnant and stale, and does not change content, armor sets, or raise cp, then yes, your argument is valid.

But they don't. When was the last time we got something new to replace old stuff? We got vMOL but vMA weapons are still sought after. We had the same CP cap for how long? That's what I'm saying, the game is stagnant. And it will be like that for a while. Since now it's b2p and they just release a small DLC every quarter, there's no reason to expect huge updates with lots of new dungeons and gear. We'll get 1-2 dungeons. They won't pack them with all new gear obviously. They will distribute gear over all DLCs to make people buy them. The best thing we can expect for keeping the content diverse is that they will scale all existing content to create an illusion that endgame content is huge.

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

No

Guess, the same answer goes to the token system question then. If that's all arguments it requires to post and not get warning for spam/flood, then it's indeed enough and well - No, close the thread please.

Solid_Metal wrote: »

back to FF14 all over again~

seriously tho....rather than token i prefer fully craftable equipment that some of the ingridients are only obtainable in end game dungeon, no RNG, its guarantee to drop, but RNG the amount of it

That's the same thing lol. Instead of that one ingredient you will farm tokens though. That's the only difference.

now that i read it again...yeah its the same damn thing lol

Cuyler

Lenikus wrote: »

So people can do teh content Once, get what they need, and them come cry in the forums because they have nothing to do all day while playing ?

Love this argument, like grinding gear is the only reason we play?

DjSolJAH

30+ vMA runs and have gotten every weapon EXCEPT the one I need. #downwithrngesus

hedna123b14_ESO

DjSolJAH wrote: »

30+ vMA runs and have gotten every weapon EXCEPT the one I need. #downwithrngesus

Young padowan much to learn you have, 200+ runs must you do to receive not your weapon. Cry must then you. Pain knoweth thou not yet.

Averya_Teira

I agree we need some sort of token system, anything xcept this RNG crap.

If ZOS wants to keep the RNG, I have an idea which keep SOME sort of RNG to the token system. Keep the loot as it is, but put a vendor in the world with every dropped set available to be bought with tokens from that NPC. You can sell the gear you get In trials/Dungeons/PvP bags/etc. for tokens. The amount of tokens for different pieces depends on the number of sales from players. So if a lot of players are selling X chestpiece to that vendor, you'll get less tokens for it. Sell Y rare piece that no one ever sells and get lots of tokens.

Juat a random thought I had.

Pink_Violinz

I've been running WGT and I'm fine with the rng system. I would rather that prosperous and training be removed, but fine. What I would rather see than MORE tokens would be trading Bind-on-Pickup items between group members.

Basically, if one player gets an item another needs, they could either have a countdown on how long until it is bound to them or make it tradeable in the group, and as soon as a person joins or leaves that item is then bound. Too often we have been left frustrated because the healer keeps getting the tank set, the dps get the healer sets, and the tank gets the dps sets.

The only system that I see that needs to be tweaked is VMA. I refuse to run that until a change is made to the rng there. For VMA, yeah. Go wild with the tokens. Zero complains from me and likely 90% of the player base.

Solariken

Add the ability to re-trait and re-motif gear via crafting.

Orynn

I've come to the reluctant conclusion that since none of the ZOS staff actually play their own game, they don't care that it's nigh impossible to ever actually acquire a full set of BiS BoP gear. They only care that we keep trying and paying for the frustrating privilege. I gave up trying to get Scathing Mage, Spell Power Cure and Sheer Venom as well as Infallible Aether and Vicious Ophidian in Divines traits. It appears they've never played MMOs before where, after acquiring satisfactory gear for one character a player can then move on to another character and have plenty to do before the next DLC, keeping them playing and coming back for more, despite having completed a single set of BiS gear. Not to mention spending additional time acquiring additional sets for the initial character, meaning more time spent playing.

How and in what way would it be to their detriment to give us a token system or the ability to change traits on gear we've paid to play for and accumulate? I played a game called City of Heroes wherein the token system only expanded my interest and the game's overall replay-ability. It didn't frustrate me or cause me to lose interest like the multi-layer RNG this game has. I've quit ESO over the sheer boredom and frustration of running the same content over and over again more than once and each time come back for shorter and shorter periods due to this single factor. The game itself, overall, is great but the loot tables are atrocious and mind-numbingly frustrating.

I'd like to know, specifically, how much time the developers conceive a single player with a single character "should" play their game in order to piece together a SINGLE set of BiS gear. From the loot tables and endless RNG I can only assume the goal is to keep us frustrated to the point of madness. It's almost as if they want the hardcore gamers to give up (because we call them on their BS most likely) and the casuals to only dream of completing a 5pc set of gear they just looted their first piece of... to dream a little dream... to only imagine what it would be like to use this awesome new set they have a single piece of... (likely with the Prosperous or Training trait on it)

I'd like to personally thank all of the non-existent, immersion-breaking NPC crafters who craft and disperse all of their useless Reinforced Light armor pieces, their CP160 Training garbage pieces and their Arcane Agility Rings that no one asked them or tasked them to create. Who in the living hell would BOTHER or WASTE EXPENSIVE MATS on crafting any of these pieces and in such abundance that the world of Tamriel is chock full of them to the point of bursting out of every corpse I and everyone else loots on a daily basis? How is this even a thing? You want me to immerse myself in a world that makes literally no sense and pay you for the privilege? What part of your money-making scheme here requires such a level of non-sense that it becomes obviously just that: a carrot dangling in front of each and every player hoping for an actual usable set of gear?

This aspect of the game sickens me, literally. I have to get up and walk away from my PC, sometimes for days due to this single issue alone. The only thing keeping me coming back is my friends and the fact that I grew up playing Dungeons & Dragons and love the idea of pretending to be an elf who can throw fireballs and lightning bolts like I did when I was 12. That's immersion... that's fun... days turning into weeks turning into months of grinding for a single set is absolutely not. Adding a token system would only expand the fun, expand the options AVAILABLE and increase my and others' interest in PLAYING. Not grinding... PLAYING... using the gear they put in the time to accumulate and, therefore, enjoy.

It's clear that fun isn't the goal, however, it's perpetual paychecks for this company's development team and its investors disguised as the hope that one day you'll actually be one of the lucky, persistent few who rolls those two d10s and rolls a "00", netting you a +5 Holy Avenger...

Pathetic.