What Is The Definition of Balanced?

Valrien

I'm just wondering what the community agrees on for the definition of balance.

Van_0S

Hahahahaha!
Ask Wrobel that same question!

Luigi_Vampa

From what I hear from most people it is when they win all the time.

GreenSoup2HoT

rock, paper, scissors

Tryxus

Balance is when all 4 classes can do every role equally (tank, dps and heal) as well as being evenly matched in Cyrodiil/PvP

Sounds more like "Boring" to me

Egonieser

Van_0S wrote: »

Hahahahaha!
Ask Wrobel that same question!

Datamined Stamina Armour set:

Gaze of the Radioactive Troll

1: Increases Weapon damage
2: Increases Weapon damage
3: Increases Weapon Critical
4: Increases Weapon Damage
5: Looking at an enemy player detonates a Nuclear Warhead sent back from the future after a failed Dragon break, killing everyone in Cyrodiil. 30% Chance of killing everyone in PvE zones.

We had vicious death, so why the heck not, eh @Wrobel ?

Lenikus

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

rock, paper, scissors

This.

Just because Magicka Sorcs have a hard time killing Magicka DKs, doesn't mean a Stam DK won't kill both and get his butt swooped by their healer's jeesus beams.

There ARE meta'ish* builds, of course, but those actually rely more on gear, and stats (namely regen and sustain) than actual classes, or even the Magicka / Stam duality thing.

Each Class has it's own pros and cons.

iam117

bal·ance
ˈbaləns/Submit
noun
1.
an even distribution of weight enabling someone or something to remain upright and steady.
"slipping in the mud but keeping their balance"
synonyms: stability, equilibrium, steadiness, footing
"I tripped and lost my balance"
2.
a condition in which different elements are equal or in the correct proportions.
"overseas investments can add balance to an investment portfolio"
synonyms: fairness, justice, impartiality, evenhandedness, egalitarianism, equal opportunity; More
verb
1.
keep or put (something) in a steady position so that it does not fall.
"a mug that she balanced on her knee"
synonyms: steady, stabilize, poise, level
"she balanced the book on her head"
2.
offset or compare the value of (one thing) with another.
"the cost of obtaining such information needs to be balanced against its benefits"
synonyms: weigh, weigh up, compare, evaluate, consider, assess, appraise, judge
"you need to balance cost against benefit"

Elsonso

Tryxus wrote: »

Balance is when all 8 classes can do every role equally (tank, dps and heal) as well as being evenly matched in Cyrodiil/PvP

Sounds more like "Boring" to me

All 8 classes. Don't forget that each ZOS class has two player classes.

ShedsHisTail

The game is balanced when everyone stops complaining.

Mojmir

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

The game is balanced when everyone stops complaining.

which neither of these thing will happen.

NateAssassin

Balance only exists when you can do the best dps and kill everyone the easiest, otherwise all else is OP and needs nerfed.

ShedsHisTail

Mojmir wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

The game is balanced when everyone stops complaining.

which neither of these thing will happen.

Agreed

Tryxus

lordrichter wrote: »

Tryxus wrote: »

Balance is when all 8 classes can do every role equally (tank, dps and heal) as well as being evenly matched in Cyrodiil/PvP

Sounds more like "Boring" to me

All 8 classes. Don't forget that each ZOS class has two player classes.

4, 8 or 10 if Warden gets added, Balance would still be Boring

PvP-wise, I want classes that are stronger than me for a challenge and classes that are weaker than me for strategy
PvE-Wise, I want classes that are better suited for a certain role than the others

Wollust

Perfect balance does not and will never exist. However, I do believe that all classes should be provided certain basic tools. And no, this is not about making every class the same. But some things should be available for everyone from the class skill lines, for example gap closer, major brutality/sorcery and others. Furthermore, individual tweaks to classes to not completely outperform others are required as well obviously. Having one class being able do to the best DPS is fine, but the difference shouldn't be as high as it is at the moment compared to an underperforming class (for example stamDK to stamblade).

Rune_Relic

All classes should be perfectly balanced through positives and negatives.
The players should choose what the postives are and the game what negatives will be.
This is static balancing.
Passive

Dynamic balancing is creating equally strong options and leaving the player to balance the game.
Which cant work unless all options are also counter balanced by default.
Active

ie All character builds must balance.
Its upto the player to make the difference (create imbalance) by exploiting another players lack of environmental awareness, reaction times and appropriate use of counters.

GivvumBoane

Balanced is whatever makes my character better, and yours not so much.... at least that's how it seems to me based on what I've read here

Egonieser

Even when balance is achieved, people will complain about something. In balance case - it will be about the opposite.

[url="Https://youtu.be/e31OSVZF77w"]Https://youtu.be/e31OSVZF77w[/url]

dday3six

In the simpliest form it's all reasonable strategies being viable under optimal conditions. Then a give and take of strengths and weaknesses.

Shunravi

Balance is a myth and the pursuit of it is a fools errand.

FriedEggSandwich

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

rock, paper, scissors

I agree but 3 doesn't go into 4 or 8, so achieving rock/paper/scissors level of balance in eso might be expecting too much.

Zorgon_The_Revenged

Any attempt at balance in PvP will always remind me of this....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkPdGZAYv2g



And PvE, in it's most basic form, seems to come down to "We just need a tank now".

Brutusmax1mus

Asymmetrical balance is what this game is trying to accomplish. People complain bc somet builds are more complete, as in have less weaknesses than others. Really it's mainly a l2p or accept your role has a weakness when people complain.

Lumenn

I'D say where each class can accomplish the same goal but by using their own unique method. But honestly if anyone here was an original EQ1 player at launch you know "class balance" is one of those phrases that get your mouth washed out with soap.....I DO have to admit though I've found the freedom of this game to design your own toon(with the exception of pure melee?) intriguing so far.

ShedsHisTail

Zorgon_The_Revenged wrote: »

Any attempt at balance in PvP will always remind me of this....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkPdGZAYv2g



And PvE, in it's most basic form, seems to come down to "We just need a tank now".

Nerf Whip, so OP.

STEVIL

Valrien wrote: »

I'm just wondering what the community agrees on for the definition of balance.

The community doesn't.

Miszou

Balance will be achieved when everyone wins more times than they lose.

Vangy

Valrien wrote: »

I'm just wondering what the community agrees on for the definition of balance.

Everything is balanced as long as Vangy's coffer is full with AP and gold...if not.. NERF NERF NERF NERF! DOWN WITH YOU ALL. BURN EVERYTHING WITH NERFS.

rfennell_ESO

Valrien wrote: »

I'm just wondering what the community agrees on for the definition of balance.

I'd say it would be everyone has a strength and a weakness; or strengths and weaknesses. In the context of pvp, of course.

Problem right now is there are many builds (and I don't actually know if it's the build, I suspect it's something more sinister) that really have no weaknesses (or minimal weaknesses) and nothing but strengths.

Balance is when, if you screw up.. bad things happen. If you play well, good things happen. Not the case with many of the builds you are seeing right now.

xboxone1Q

I don't know what balance feels like I have 1 guy a Templar at vet 16. ZOS hates Templars, when I get killed by like 20 NB in a row. I wonder why I even try on doing bountys in pvp.

SlayerTheDragon

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

rock, paper, scissors

Exactly what I was going to say. Each class should be able to dominate one, but be dominated by another. The way it is now is every class tries to dominated every other class which cannot ever work - there must be a compromise.