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Veteran Maelstrom Arena - It's Time For Balance

LegendaryArcher
LegendaryArcher
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Alright ZOS,

vMA has been out there long enough. The <1% Sorcerers have had their fun for quite some time now. It's time to make it available to your player base, at least for 5% of it.

What balancing it would look like:

Stage 1: No balance needed.
Stage 2: Slow down the blades.
Stage 3: Significantly reduce the damage. Disable pull attacks from enemies while the water is electrified. Remove the slow down dot from flowers.
Stage 4: No balance needed.
Stage 5: Significantly reduce the amount of enemies in the rounds. Make the troll always go to the platform closest to the player. Reduce the amount of Frost Atronachs to 1 at a time. Same for the giants. Reduce the last boss's health by 20%.
Stage 6: Reduce the frequency of Webspinner spawns and swarm attacks. Make Webspinners only appear when there are 3 or more pinions unwebbed. Remove the enrage mechanic from the last boss.
Stage 7: Remove the phase with 3 archers spawning at the same time. Prohibit Venomcallers from spawning or have them die instantly once the boss starts his "cry attack".
Stage 8: Remove the chain pull attack from the last boss or add a mechanic the prohibits pulls that end up in or go through AoE.
Stage 9: Boss fight: Reduce the Daedroths' HP by 50%. Reduce the crystals' HP by 20%. Reduce make the boss's attacks and mechanics (channeling, skull, etc.) depend on his health taken, not on time.

With these changes, ~5% of the player base might be able to complete it. It would still require 501 CP and best-in-slot min-maxed gear. It would NOT solve the fact that stamina builds would still struggle a lot through it and the amount of stamina players completing it would still be under 1%. But it's not vMA's fault. Stamina desperately needs buffs in the healing/damage shield area.

Now let the <1% and mundus stone cheater crying begin. B)

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GaryA @ZOS_TristanK @ZOS_KaiSchober when can we expect some balance? The normal version of MA it a cakewalk to 70%+ of your player base. And the best weapons are locked for <1% and mundus stone cheaters.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates
  • jamesharv2005ub17_ESO
    jamesharv2005ub17_ESO
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    Why even bother. For the amount of work and skill involved the reward simply is not worth it. Even if they did every suggestion I still wouldnt bother it with it. Not worth my time for no reward at the end.
  • The-Baconator
    The-Baconator
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    Lol
    First PS4 NA Grand Overlord, Stormproof, and Flawless Conqueror.
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  • Elijah_Crow
    Elijah_Crow
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  • Valrien
    Valrien
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    I do vMA with gear that isn't perfect and even though I have 430 now, I started around 300...fite me m8
    Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
    Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)
    Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake
  • rokrdt05
    rokrdt05
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    I think it's more than doable with the CP changes. I've completed it with all classes and each has different pros or cons, and I've also done this with sub par gear and races.

    At this point it's more of a you need more practice than anything else if you are still having issues.

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  • LadyNalcarya
    LadyNalcarya
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    Well, here's your message from another thread:
    WHY AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN'T COMPLETE IT?!?!

    Because you're not using the cheat that gives you all mundus stones. Since the developers aren't playing their own content, they don't see how impossible it actually is, they only judge based on completion numbers. Those <1% that can complete it are cheaters. I wouldn't waste my time until they fix the mundus stone cheat and realize that their content is actually impossible.

    So, since you're giving feedback about all stages... Are you an exceptional sorc or dirty cheater? ;)
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

    PC/EU
  • MaxwellC
    MaxwellC
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    I'm working on my vMA now since I took a break away from PvP and I believe the difficulty is fine (This is coming from a Stamina DK so you know my DPS = Wrecking Blow).

    I do agree on the frozen lake round they need to cut back on the monsters spawning just a little bit and the spider daedra round one they need to increase the rate the hoavers or w/e that exploding insects name is but they need to increase it's spawn rate.

    The archers on the behemonth Argonian round need to be toned down a bit (Pretty negligible)
    不動の Steadfast - Unwavering
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  • Skinzz
    Skinzz
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    Lol
    Anybody got a group? LFG, anybody? Hello?
  • LadyNalcarya
    LadyNalcarya
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    I do agree on the frozen lake round they need to cut back on the monsters spawning just a little bit and the spider daedra round one they need to increase the rate the hoavers or w/e that exploding insects name is but they need to increase it's spawn rate.

    The archers on the behemonth Argonian round need to be toned down a bit (Pretty negligible)
    Btw, if youre not going for the score, use shield sigils strategically. They make casters suicide, like dk wings, which works very good for those pesky mages and nereids. Here's a good guide with a list of spawns on each stage, so you can use sigils before the casters appear so you can concentrate on melee opponents.
    Edited by LadyNalcarya on March 21, 2016 3:49AM
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason

    PC/EU
  • code65536
    code65536
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    Let me tell you the dirty little secret: Most people who beat vMA and who make it look easy didn't start out that way. I've spent many tens of thousands in repair bills in that place. Hundreds of soul gems. Countless stacks of potions. There are mutilated plastic bottles that have been the recipient of my violent ventings of frustration. And hours after hours. But I also went from wiping literally hundreds of times on the final boss to consistently downing him in one try.

    No pain, no gain.
    Edited by code65536 on March 21, 2016 5:26AM
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  • DisgracefulMind
    DisgracefulMind
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    No. These are all pretty heavy nerfs to this content. Sure, I'd like some small rebalancing of VMA, but not to this extent. This just seems like a "give it all to me for free" sort of thread.

    I'd rather them just fix the bugs in VMA.
    Unfortunate magicka warden main.
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  • zyk
    zyk
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    No thanks.

    I despise this "I can't complete this content so nerf it" mentality. Almost every game has turned into ezmode because of players like you. Games are supposed to provide challenging obstacles. That's what gaming is at its core: problem solving.

    Even if nerfed to your liking, most ESO players would still be unable to complete it. What then? Nerf it more for them? Where do you draw the line? Mudcrab level difficulty? Jackals?

    Can there be no moderately challenging content in this game? Because as much as some people like to comfort themselves by calling vMA elite, it's not.
    Edited by zyk on March 21, 2016 5:53AM
  • TotterTates
    TotterTates
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    zyk wrote: »
    Mudcrab level difficulty?

    Man, you just gave me a flashback to getting brutalized by a VR1 mudcrab about 3 weeks after initial release.
    Cuppincakes
    • Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
    • Pre-TG vMA Score: 459,636 [55:36, 0 Sigils, 0 Deaths] (Stamina)
    • Post-TG vMA Score: 537,328 [53:36, 0 Sigils, 0 Deaths] (Stamina)
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  • zyk
    zyk
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    zyk wrote: »
    Mudcrab level difficulty?

    Man, you just gave me a flashback to getting brutalized by a VR1 mudcrab about 3 weeks after initial release.

    You know what? Meeto. Well, maybe not mudcrabs. For a couple of hours. 1-50 was so easy, I didn't have to learn the game to get to VR1. Upon hitting VR1 (prior to the VR difficulty nerf) I realized I didn't actually know how to play ESO. I was angry. I cursed ZOS. Then I looked in the mirror. I learned how to play and enjoyed VR gameplay very much. I was very sad to see it nerfed to oblivion.
  • Molag_Crow
    Molag_Crow
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    For someone who was clearing it weekly on my Templar, I have to agree. I'll never get a flawless run because of random RNG one-shots and ridiculous, cheesy combos lol.
    --ϟ-- Crows_Descend - Templar - Ebonheart Pact [PS4]&[PC] [EU] --ϟ--
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  • oibam
    oibam
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    vMSA: 20% luck + 40% map awareness + 40% gear / skill setup
  • X3ina
    X3ina
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    People still cry about vmsa difficulty ?
    SW GoH > ESO
  • strikeback1247
    strikeback1247
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    oibam wrote: »
    vMSA: 20% luck + 40% map awareness + 40% gear / skill setup

    That seems about right, however, I do think that the more skilled you are, the less luck is involved. I do agree that there is indeed a part of luck involved. That moment when a venomcaller spawns just before the roar stage on stage 7 and he spawns a plant on your shield...
    P.A.W.S. - Positively Against Wild Sasquatches - NO TO BIGFOOT!
  • flguy147ub17_ESO
    flguy147ub17_ESO
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    9Xq7zsd.png

    And People complain about Argonians, kinda OP the damage they can do
  • zyk
    zyk
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    oibam wrote: »
    vMSA: 20% luck + 40% map awareness + 40% gear / skill setup

    That seems about right, however, I do think that the more skilled you are, the less luck is involved. I do agree that there is indeed a part of luck involved. That moment when a venomcaller spawns just before the roar stage on stage 7 and he spawns a plant on your shield...

    IMO, it's not even about skill, it's about understanding the mechanisms, knowing when things will happen and prioritizing targets. I haven't done it anywhere close to flawlessly and do not intend to, but I do not believe it's as random as most people seem to think.

    Where others see, the player who completes vMA observes.
    Edited by zyk on March 21, 2016 7:14AM
  • Flak
    Flak
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    Difficulty is fine, it's a challenge but not too hard, especially after TG. If you still have issues completing it you should rather have a look on your build. Stamina is way behind Magicka I agree but that's a general problem has nothing to do with vMA.

    Btw: No I'm not playing it on Sorcerer (Templar and Nightblade)

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  • GnGEmpire
    GnGEmpire
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    Dear @LegendaryArcher

    There are 3 types of players
    • Good players - focus on improving their skills in order to overcome a challenge
    • Average players - do not care too much either way, they do what they enjoy
    • Terrible players - focus on trying to bring a challenge down to their current skill which is also very ignorant by the way

    Please stop being a terrible player.

    Thanks!
    Edited by GnGEmpire on March 21, 2016 7:24AM
    Casualty - small high end/end game PvE guild. Recruiting!
  • Usara
    Usara
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    It makes me laugh - or cry maybe ? - to see "only cheaters can beat it"...
    One of my friend who was the 1st DK for a long time (now second :p) worked relentlessly for days and nights on the PTS. And then live again. And tons of golds in mats, different gear and respec. His success did not came out of nowhere.

    Have a little respec for the people who just worked harder than you.

    And why should everyone be able to complete it ? It's not like VMA is a necessity. Ok, some pieces of gear are good. But why do you want it ? To beat your scores in Vet Fungal Grotto ?
    VMA is mostly for the challenge, and for some people, a way to improve their already next to optimal gear and build - for their character reaching/staying top score PvE and/or PvP.

    Back in the days, being an Emperor even in PvE was a major bonus. Some people farmed it just to improve their character in PvE. Even now, some people farm it just for the achievement.
    I know that's one achiev I will never get. And it's okay. No one is entitled to anything.

    And to be clear, don't tell me : "it's easy, cause you farm it with a sorc". I finished it only once, and rather painfully, with my NB - just to work the strats and be prepared for my main char, which is a healer. I spent a fortune for a whole new gear, farmed dungeons monster pieces I needed, ground in PvP for skills - even though I hate it - and I'm right now afk from a 8h-long run in front of the last boss... Just for the achievement. And as it should be.
    What? Lead? Me? No, no, no. No leading. Bad things happen when I lead. We get lost, people die, and the next thing you know I’m stranded somewhere without any pants.

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  • damtotb16_ESO
    damtotb16_ESO
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    Alright ZOS,

    vMA has been out there long enough. The <1% Sorcerers have had their fun for quite some time now. It's time to make it available to your player base, at least for 5% of it.

    Now let the <1% and mundus stone cheater crying begin. B)

    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GaryA @ZOS_TristanK @ZOS_KaiSchober when can we expect some balance? The normal version of MA it a cakewalk to 70%+ of your player base. And the best weapons are locked for <1% and mundus stone cheaters.

    I find your post disrespectful for myself and perhaps lot of other guys who worked hard on they game and learned mechanics to beat it.
    Just because you have hard time and probable can not finish it does not mean people who can are cheaters
    Your are trying to camouflage request for 'nerf' into 'balance' and the nerfs you are proposing would completely destroy vMA.
    I think Zeni should just sell vMA weapons in crown store and paint it differently so that it's distinct who earned one and who did not
    And please rename your character

  • boundsy88
    boundsy88
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    if we got these changes i'd definitely get the flawless conqueror title. it doesnt need this much changing though. maybe the last stage boss needs a bit more fixing. i got use to the mechanics on it where are u do your first initial burn on him and he ports to do his channel attack, if u are too close to him when he teleports he will do his necrotic pulse while u are up in his face trying to bash him because he should be channelling, causing your inevitable death. zos just needs to fix the mechanics so they work in the order they are suppose to and not skip vital mechanics
  • DRXHarbinger
    DRXHarbinger
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    DW. As soon as op completes it he'll be straight to the "hate rng malestrom weapon threads" to complain over that. This has been done already with sub 300CP and purple gear only. Play this enough like you truly claim to and you'll be able to smash it in your sleep. It's boring and frustrating yes but after a while you'll know it like your own ***.

    Even now I know every ad spawn at every turn. It's sad but lol at crem guard 50% nerf. Like 2 frags and they're gone.
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  • Destruent
    Destruent
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    Alright ZOS,

    vMA has been out there long enough. The <1% Sorcerers have had their fun for quite some time now. It's time to make it available to your player base, at least for 5% of it.

    What balancing it would look like:

    Stage 1: No balance needed.
    Stage 2: Slow down the blades.
    Stage 3: Significantly reduce the damage. Disable pull attacks from enemies while the water is electrified. Remove the slow down dot from flowers.
    Stage 4: No balance needed.
    Stage 5: Significantly reduce the amount of enemies in the rounds. Make the troll always go to the platform closest to the player. Reduce the amount of Frost Atronachs to 1 at a time. Same for the giants. Reduce the last boss's health by 20%.
    Stage 6: Reduce the frequency of Webspinner spawns and swarm attacks. Make Webspinners only appear when there are 3 or more pinions unwebbed. Remove the enrage mechanic from the last boss.
    Stage 7: Remove the phase with 3 archers spawning at the same time. Prohibit Venomcallers from spawning or have them die instantly once the boss starts his "cry attack".
    Stage 8: Remove the chain pull attack from the last boss or add a mechanic the prohibits pulls that end up in or go through AoE.
    Stage 9: Boss fight: Reduce the Daedroths' HP by 50%. Reduce the crystals' HP by 20%. Reduce make the boss's attacks and mechanics (channeling, skull, etc.) depend on his health taken, not on time.

    With these changes, ~5% of the player base might be able to complete it. It would still require 501 CP and best-in-slot min-maxed gear. It would NOT solve the fact that stamina builds would still struggle a lot through it and the amount of stamina players completing it would still be under 1%. But it's not vMA's fault. Stamina desperately needs buffs in the healing/damage shield area.

    Now let the <1% and mundus stone cheater crying begin. B)

    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GaryA @ZOS_TristanK @ZOS_KaiSchober when can we expect some balance? The normal version of MA it a cakewalk to 70%+ of your player base. And the best weapons are locked for <1% and mundus stone cheaters.

    My thouhts on this:

    Stage 2: With the changes to CP you can mitigate the damage a lot, this stage is now a lot easier than before TG.
    Stage 3: The Snare is fine, ever played it when you could get pulled by them? Just focus them when they spawn or just ignore the snare. Reagrding pull mechanics...there's only one mob in there pulling you, shouldn't be that big of a deal. It was manageable even before they changed the pull mechanics in there.
    Stage 5: although this stage is hard, i wouldn't change anything in there...most enemys just die in seconds, only the bigger one's need to be focused. Giants/attros are hard to beat, but you can just wipe them with ultimates so you shouldn't have more than one at the same time. Archers/Casters are hard in there...i agree. Reducing the boss health would also make it more complicated bc adds will spawn faster and he will also destroy the platforms faster...it's easier when the boss has more HP. Regarding trolls....if they walk to your own platform you can just delete them. They die so fast, i don't have to focus them if they choose my own location. They just die anyways.
    Stage 6: Mechanics needs to be fixed, not to be nerfed. Make sure, there is always a free pinion when spiders arrive. if there is at least one available it can happen...maybe fix the range of this wrecking blow miniboss -.-
    Stage 7: Archers....learn to position yourself correctly and it's easy. Venomcallers are only a problem for stambuilds, bc they (or atleast i) couldn't heal against it. For magicka builds healing ward will carry you through it.
    Stage 8: positioning is key there....
    Stage 9: The attacks are everytime the same and it's easy to predict what will happen and when it happens, so it doesn't need to change. Maybe nef the deadroths a bit...but even with a stamspecc and it was manageable to kill the daedroths fast. If you can't kill the crystals fast enough, just go to the lower stage, reset the dot and kill deadroth/clanbann and carry on upstairs...

    Nor more Nerfs in this game please....it will get easier with more experienced/CP...

    Destruent

    Note: All my chars have stormproof title and i cleared it within 4 days on the live server...it just needs a bit of practice and understanding of the mechanics. Maybe this is just something, most newer players haven't experienced bc it wasn't neccessary since patch 1.6.
    Noobplar
  • sagitter
    sagitter
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    Stop QQ L2VMA , double flawless here without sorc.
  • Destruent
    Destruent
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    sagitter wrote: »
    Stop QQ L2VMA , double flawless here without sorc.

    yep...seems like "legendary archer" is not that legendary at all :)
    Noobplar
  • r.jan_emailb16_ESO
    r.jan_emailb16_ESO
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    I tried it for the first time this weekend, currently at stage 7 I believe. Once I understood the mechanics it's been really doable so far, screwed up a lot though cause I lack the experience. Just need to figure out which enemies to kill first and keep up the concentration for some time. Overall I think it's challenging, but fair.
    Lairgren | DC Dragonknight - August Palatine
    playing for eXile


    I'm done, CU somewhere else.
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