Stop Building Weak Characters

Ethromelb14_ESO

It has become too commonplace for players to have no imagination, and constantly seek out generic builds, that some other cookie cutter player posted online. These orthodox players with their weak built characters are the ones more often than not picketing for nerfs all the time.

The majority of issues complained about - regarding received damage - are due to a player disillusioning themselves, to believe that all they need to do is have a very high damage output. They almost rarely ever consider that having a high damage threshold matters just as much.

I'm tired of going in to dungeons with Vet 16's to my Vet 10 and out living them. Then when I ask what their health is ... I get stupid replies like 10 to 13,000. What?? Are you insane?

Especially DPSes that go around feeling good about themselves because they can kill open-world creatures and bosses by themselves fairly fast ... Only to get in to a dungeon and get a rude awakening. They ask questions like, "Why am I dying so fast?" "Oh my God, this dungeon is impossible". "How do they expect anybody to beat this boss if he keeps destroying the cave?" Then they want to complain and whine for nerfs when they can't beat anything actually challenging and difficult.

Skilled players have to watch the mediocre at best get catered to because they can't fathom that dungeons require skill, strategy, attention, perseverance and patience - None of which will be to anyone's benefit if their constantly resurrecting your weak behind.

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild, that are required to have at least beaten the Maelstrom Arena on normal or (even better) veteran.

DenMoria

To respond to your title.

No. I will not. I will continue to create weaklings so that folks who are just in to ganking will have a steady flow of victims and leave the "real" players alone.

I refuse.

Rerollitis is a disease

Ethromelb14_ESO

DenMoria wrote: »

To respond to your title.

No. I will not. I will continue to create weaklings so that folks who are just in to ganking will have a steady flow of victims and leave the "real" players alone.

I refuse.

Rerollitis is a disease

There's a theory...

N0TPLAYER2

Jesus I hear you op.

I am about to give up on vet dungeons. I am a healer that can keep a group of 12 alive in the sewers. But every time I use group finder it's the same crap.

We get 30 minutes in, and suddenly it's...

"I'm out of soul gems"
"Anyone have any food?"
"My armor is busted, wait here while I FAST TRAVEL TO TOWN TO REPAIR MY ARMOR"

Yesterday I was providing everyone soul gems.
They said, damn you have a ton of these. I had 350 + 150 empties. My other char has at least 100.

They had maybe 25-30 between the 3.

It's frustrating for sure. It's like climbing a mountain without a chance of reaching the top while dragging 3 others behind. I'm going to have to give up on using group finder for vet dungeons.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Uh yes to no more cookie cutter builds but most of them aren't weak but are broken cause they exploit broken mechanics and abuse whats OP at them moment such as when NBs took over at IC launch. Now that NBs are getting rung in every one is switching over and copying magical DK builds cause that's gonna be the "in" class now.

Thing is DKs have DOT damage not burst like NB and yes DOTs are good for PvE not so much for PvP.

LionheartRichard

So you want everyone to go online and research the same cookie cutter builds? Sounds boring.

WalkingLegacy

I think the mistake was allowing us to spec into stamina/magicka/and health with no real direction.

I think this whole concept needs to be redesigned a bit better.

Something like health is auto folded into every level and we chose to increase stam or mag every level.

Or just auto fold the choice into level increases and any increases we want to make come from how we gear and spec passives.

Aevric

I think you might be happier playing WoW, where your "vision" has been commonplace for years... and the reason why most people leave.

Waffennacht

I feel that way about destro staff. As a mage, the most cliche thing ever is light armor, destro resto or destro dw. I refuse to do that, especially with the few useable moves for a sorc, it makes your build extremely cookie cutter.

Never I say!

Ethromelb14_ESO

LionheartRichard wrote: »

So you want everyone to go online and research the same cookie cutter builds? Sounds boring.

I doubt I said anywhere in the OP to go online and GET cookie cutter builds. Nope ... I could have sworn I was reprimanding it.

Volkodav

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It has become too commonplace for players to have no imagination, and constantly seek out generic builds, that some other cookie cutter player posted online. These orthodox players with their weak built characters are the ones more often than not picketing for nerfs all the time.

The majority of issues complained about - regarding received damage - are due to a player disillusioning themselves, to believe that all they need to do is have a very high damage output. They almost rarely ever consider that having a high damage threshold matters just as much.

I'm tired of going in to dungeons with Vet 16's to my Vet 10 and out living them. Then when I ask what their health is ... I get stupid replies like 10 to 13,000. What?? Are you insane?

Especially DPSes that go around feeling good about themselves because they can kill open-world creatures and bosses by themselves fairly fast ... Only to get in to a dungeon and get a rude awakening. They ask questions like, "Why am I dying so fast?" "Oh my God, this dungeon is impossible". "How do they expect anybody to beat this boss if he keeps destroying the cave?" Then they want to complain and whine for nerfs when they can't beat anything actually challenging and difficult.

Skilled players have to watch the mediocre at best get catered to because they can't fathom that dungeons require skill, strategy, attention, perseverance and patience - None of which will be to anyone's benefit if their constantly resurrecting your weak behind.

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild, that are required to have at least beaten the Maelstrom Arena on normal or (even better) veteran.

Oh,you pick the elite only? An elitist."creme de la creme" only in your special guild?
I cant stand elitists.
They snub their noses at others who are either lower levels or are just getting a grip on all the combat mechanics.And there are a lot of them.They never help those who are noobies and really could use a helping hand.
And your thread here confirms all of the above.
Those mediocre players,as you call them,may just be new to the game,even if their levels are good. Perhaps if someone gave their time to teach them a little,they wouldnt be the ones whining in the forums.They just might be helping others because they were helped.
Now,I do understand that the whining is annoying,however,it isnt always those with weak builds,or "generic" ones.You have no way to tell who does and who doesnt have one of those.Whiners can be players who are up above V1 levels,and even V16 whiners.They all whine because they dont like this or that.All of them.

Before you draw your little claws,just dont. My skin's thicker than you can imagine. :}

Ethromelb14_ESO

Aevric wrote: »

I think you might be happier playing WoW, where your "vision" has been commonplace for years... and the reason why most people leave.

Nah, people just need to stop building squishy characters and then complaining about the powers, environments and boss threats. It'll make other player's experiences a bit more enjoyable. It's one of the reasons why I try to help others get their ideal setup without sacrificing important survival elements.

Shelgon

I agree 100% percent, so many people use a weak a** build or class spec then cry, "IM A 3 HEAVY, 3 LIGHT, 1 MEDIUM, HEALTH RECOVERY/SPELL DAMAGE HYBRID TEMPLAR, WHY CAN'T I DO ANYTHING."

Yeah, you can do anything you want in this game, no one said it was going to work. Some people feel so entitled, i swear. Do what you want to do in this game, but man up to the downsides of it.

I don't have a problem with making weak characters, sometimes making weird builds is fun, but don't make an out of this world build then complain because it's not as good as a refined, theory crafted setup, cookie cutter builds are cookie cutter for a reason.

Callous2208

Problem isn't with those builds, it's the goofballs who copy it although they can't play it effectively. Also it sounds like you are running dungeons with pugs... which is always gonna have its share of mishaps. As for the broken armor, no soul gems, 13k hp. That's no cookie cutter build, that's just a bad player.

Ethromelb14_ESO

Shelgon wrote: »

I agree 100% percent, so many people use a weak a** build or class spec then cry, "IM A 3 HEAVY, 3 LIGHT, 1 MEDIUM, HEALTH RECOVERY/SPELL DAMAGE HYBRID TEMPLAR, WHY CAN'T I DO ANYTHING."

Yeah, you can do anything you want in this game, no one said it was going to work. Some people feel so entitled, i swear. Do what you want to do in this game, but man up to the downsides of it.

LOL- I've heard those same silly quotes, too. I help the ones really interested in being assisted.

WalkingLegacy

There will always be cookie cutter builds when there are options to spec into.

Taking some of the thought away is never bad...the more people running endgame content at a better level the better off the game is.

Volkodav

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

Aevric wrote: »

I think you might be happier playing WoW, where your "vision" has been commonplace for years... and the reason why most people leave.

Nah, people just need to stop building squishy characters and then complaining about the powers, environments and boss threats. It'll make other players experience a bit more enjoyable. It's one of the reasons why I try to help others get their ideal setup without sacrificing important survival elements.

But,you just posted a thread that said you only recruit the"creme de la creme" of players,and that you didnt like those lesser skilled players...
Now that you added this to your other words,it is nice to see that you do not snub those without your total skills.

DHale

I love op and agree. I hate running with pugs and have carried lots of pugs. Dungeon when not with my friends is really frustrating quite often. But using msa as the benchmark seems off the mark for me. I have some sick dps laying down Liguid lightning force pulse light attack (shock Detro) weave, curse, frags, endless fury execute with power surge running. It does not mean I am a skilled player per say. I know ppl who did vet msa quite easily they can't pvp to save their life literally. Also have done dungeons with pvp ers who need total carries and lots of soul gems. I think try outs run with us for 2 weeks then we eval you would be appropriate. Single target aoe fighting mobs and fighting bosses are all different and most important is boss mechanics. When you know those it's a lot easier.

SirAndy

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild

Volkodav

SirAndy wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild

This. XD

Ethromelb14_ESO

Callous2208 wrote: »

Problem isn't with those builds, it's the goofballs who copy it although they can't play it effectively. Also it sounds like you are running dungeons with pugs... which is always gonna have its share of mishaps. As for the broken armor, no soul gems, 13k hp. That's no cookie cutter build, that's just a bad player.

You are right ... At one point around last year I was pugging - not anymore. The OP involves my personal friends just as much as any stranger that fits the description. It's not to point fingers as much as it is to be a wake up call.

I play as a vampire and have none of the issues often brought up. I can stand in fire (on purpose) if I so choose, with fire resistance in my gear anywhere. I'm a NB and have never used stealth. I just don't need it. Yet I know I have to rely on other players to get throught the higher level stuff, and would like to see a more conscious approach to character development.

D0ntevenL1ft

Lol "agreed".. All DD should sit same health as tank right ? 13k health 4 lyfeeee. Quit ripping on everyone because group finder didn't workout for you.

LadyNalcarya

My sorc has 16,8k hp and nb has 17-something.
Cleared everything, including vMA and Sanctum hard mode and various no-death runs. Also I did no-death run of vCoA as a light armored vamp healer, when vampire dmg debuff was 40%.
Its just a matter of player's experience.

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

"Oh my God, this dungeon is impossible". "How do they expect anybody to beat this boss if he keeps destroying the cave?"

And looks like your dds have neither survivability nor dmg, if they cant beat the gargoyle. ^^ Just sayin'
And those are not glass cannot builds. Glass cannot should be able to kill anything before it kills them.

Xjcon

What? Dont use the cookie cutter build? Is that like saying don't setup exactly like someone who is optimized perfectly? I'm not sure the players you run in to are building cookie cutter builds. I'd wager a bet most times you run in to the fresh vet or the person who has no clue how to setup a build and just wears green junk cause that's what he/she found.

You may do better by not using the LFG tool if your not looking to join players that don't understand the game as well as yourself. Or even direct new players to go to a very good build site Tamriel Foundry where some of the best player post builds that work.

Ethromelb14_ESO

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

My sorc has 16,8k hp and nb has 17-something.
Cleared everything, including vMA and Sanctum hard mode and various no-death runs. Also I did no-death run of vCoA as a light armored vamp healer, when vampire dmg debuff was 40%.
Its just a matter of player's experience.

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

"Oh my God, this dungeon is impossible". "How do they expect anybody to beat this boss if he keeps destroying the cave?"

And looks like your dds have neither survivability nor dmg, if they cant beat the gargoyle. ^^ Just sayin'

That's exactly my point...

Ethromelb14_ESO

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

Lol "agreed".. All DD should sit same health as tank right ? 13k health 4 lyfeeee. Quit ripping on everyone because group finder didn't workout for you.

Stay on topic constructively or get out, go somewhere else and troll.

Xeven

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild, that are required to have at least beaten the Maelstrom Arena on normal or (even better) veteran.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

I think the problem is that so called cookie cutter builds are usually designed by good players that run in well-balanced groups. There is nothing wrong with a low health glass cannon build if you have a tank that holds aggro and a healer that does more than just heal, i.e. provide buffs and resources. 10-13k health is too low for anything at end game. Not sure how you get health that low at v16 unless you don't have food. I run everything between 17-19k health depending on my role and it is more than plenty. I don't put any points into health.

This logic doesn't hold in the typical pug group, and anyone that thinks it does is kidding themselves. If I plan to pug, I adjust my build slightly. I slot a shield or self heal because I refuse to rely an a healer and tank I don't know. I make sure to carry extra food for Stam and Magic users. It's dirt cheap and some people don't realize how important it is. I think communication is the biggest thing. Most bad/inexperienced players don't want to remain that way.

Ethromelb14_ESO

SirAndy wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild

Selstad

This is fairly interesting, you have your way of playing the game that you consider "the right one", you only recruit "the worthy" to your guild, playing your way. Now tell me; Why are your way the only way? Who are you to dictate how others can and should play the game? What makes you - OP - the de facto of all Elder scrolls: Online?

I see this attitude in many MMOs, in fact most of them; elites who think that the only way to play the game is their way, and if you're to group for dungeons, you better play their way or else they're 100% entitled to bash your head in with the flat side of a shield.

If you don't like the PuG community or the "commoner" as it seems like you want to call them, stick to your guild and only them. And let the "commoners" enjoy their game their way, without the nobles with their noes up high coming down and think that the only way is their way.

Ethromelb14_ESO

Volkodav wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

It's for this reason I started recruiting only the creme de la creme of players to my Sword masters Guild

This. XD