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Restoring Cyrodiil - Repurposing Ultimate
Rune_Relic
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@DeanTheCat Thanks for the inspiration 
In the beginning people were creating rapid ult generating builds and spamming ultis for 1vX damage AoE.
With the removal of rapid ult gen, ult spamming became a thing of the past along with the 1-shot 1vX ability.
General AoE then became more and more powerful and spammed in its stead.
It has come full circle to the point of people demanding that normal AoE replaces those 1 shot ultimates of the past.
With the weakened AoE vs Ultimate in the field, grouping up to mitigate damage had become a viable and indeed only option for survival.
People opted for the AoE with greatest impact and lowest cost overall meaning PVP aoe with highest caps were favoured,
along with raising the number of people that could be hit when grouped up when 1.6 dropped.
All of which eventually led to more players being hit every second and people surving those hits longer and longer.
The result was an ever more catastrophic collapse on server/network performance that simply couldnt meet the demands of all the player updates swamping the system.
Campaign sizes were reduced repeatedly.
Lag became ever worse as players found ways to hit more targets at once and groups found better ways to withstand the damage.
Here is a 3 step solution to Zerballs and lag.
1. Reduce every single AoE caps down to 4 group players...be it buff/debuff heal/damage PvP/PvE.
This will/should end all lag instantly.
This is designed to cater to the mainstay 4v4 group play and PvE dungeon runs.
This will ensure your team mates gets valuable heals and buffs rather than outsiders leech them.
This cuts away a large chunk of the selectable players reducing load through code savings.
This ensures the 4 player group hit by AoE damage can heal those 4 players at the same time.
2. Make ultimate what they were designed to be by making them 3 power versions for each class with a 24 player (PvP max Group) AoE cap with no falloff.
a. 6-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 17% damage ultimate that take 1 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to 6 AoEs per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
b. 4-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 25% damage ultimate that take 4 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to 1.5 AoEs per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
c. 2-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 50% damage ultimate that take 9 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to less than 1 AoE per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
This will give 2 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 9 minutes.
This will give 4 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 4 minutes.
This will give 6 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 1 minutes.
This uses time based control to reduce the avarage number of players hit rather than players hit using an AoE cap (max players hit / second).
This eliminates class/build synergy bias issues with ult generation.
This reduces any chance of lag as the occurrences are so rare.
This means single players cant one shot anything....but still do a heavy chunk of damage.
{NB there is a chance burst load could cause lag if everyone on flag/breech/ball all drop ultis at the exact same time..
..but it shoud be short lived as they take so long to charge afterward..unlike general AoE that can be spammed}
3. Now that the burst traffic issue is removed by cutting the load by upto 93% through reduction of the amount of hittable players scaling at any time..
a. Restore campaign population to higher than its original value (ie. when it was 6 player caps or considerably more for PvP AoE).
b. Reduce campaigns to no more than 2 so that 3 buff servers cant exist and "force" faction combat rather than allow dead servers.
c. Keep 1 seperate 0cp nonvet campaign for new players to get upto speed in PvP combat.
TL;DR
If there must be a 1 shot button:
1. Make it available to everyone equally.
2. Dont make it spammable.
3. The unstoppable damage done and charging time of these Ultimates should be debated by the playerbase.
4. Ultimates cease to become pretty special effects or multiple effects and focus on doing the proper job of ultimate damage.
WARNING: Anything that empowers a player, empowers a zergball more. The only saving grace here is that they can be wiped.
Edited by Rune_Relic on December 15, 2015 3:18PM In the beginning people were creating rapid ult generating builds and spamming ultis for 1vX damage AoE.
With the removal of rapid ult gen, ult spamming became a thing of the past along with the 1-shot 1vX ability.
General AoE then became more and more powerful and spammed in its stead.
It has come full circle to the point of people demanding that normal AoE replaces those 1 shot ultimates of the past.
With the weakened AoE vs Ultimate in the field, grouping up to mitigate damage had become a viable and indeed only option for survival.
People opted for the AoE with greatest impact and lowest cost overall meaning PVP aoe with highest caps were favoured,
along with raising the number of people that could be hit when grouped up when 1.6 dropped.
All of which eventually led to more players being hit every second and people surving those hits longer and longer.
The result was an ever more catastrophic collapse on server/network performance that simply couldnt meet the demands of all the player updates swamping the system.
Campaign sizes were reduced repeatedly.
Lag became ever worse as players found ways to hit more targets at once and groups found better ways to withstand the damage.
Here is a 3 step solution to Zerballs and lag.
1. Reduce every single AoE caps down to 4 group players...be it buff/debuff heal/damage PvP/PvE.
This will/should end all lag instantly.
This is designed to cater to the mainstay 4v4 group play and PvE dungeon runs.
This will ensure your team mates gets valuable heals and buffs rather than outsiders leech them.
This cuts away a large chunk of the selectable players reducing load through code savings.
This ensures the 4 player group hit by AoE damage can heal those 4 players at the same time.
2. Make ultimate what they were designed to be by making them 3 power versions for each class with a 24 player (PvP max Group) AoE cap with no falloff.
a. 6-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 17% damage ultimate that take 1 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to 6 AoEs per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
b. 4-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 25% damage ultimate that take 4 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to 1.5 AoEs per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
c. 2-shot kill unbuffable unstoppable 50% damage ultimate that take 9 minutes to charge or an equivalent ult cost (equivalent to less than 1 AoE per minute load @ 4 player AoE cap).
This will give 2 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 9 minutes.
This will give 4 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 4 minutes.
This will give 6 player groups the opportunity to take down a 24 man Zerg Ball with a coordinated 1-shot once every 1 minutes.
This uses time based control to reduce the avarage number of players hit rather than players hit using an AoE cap (max players hit / second).
This eliminates class/build synergy bias issues with ult generation.
This reduces any chance of lag as the occurrences are so rare.
This means single players cant one shot anything....but still do a heavy chunk of damage.
{NB there is a chance burst load could cause lag if everyone on flag/breech/ball all drop ultis at the exact same time..
..but it shoud be short lived as they take so long to charge afterward..unlike general AoE that can be spammed}
3. Now that the burst traffic issue is removed by cutting the load by upto 93% through reduction of the amount of hittable players scaling at any time..
a. Restore campaign population to higher than its original value (ie. when it was 6 player caps or considerably more for PvP AoE).
b. Reduce campaigns to no more than 2 so that 3 buff servers cant exist and "force" faction combat rather than allow dead servers.
c. Keep 1 seperate 0cp nonvet campaign for new players to get upto speed in PvP combat.
TL;DR
If there must be a 1 shot button:
1. Make it available to everyone equally.
2. Dont make it spammable.
3. The unstoppable damage done and charging time of these Ultimates should be debated by the playerbase.
4. Ultimates cease to become pretty special effects or multiple effects and focus on doing the proper job of ultimate damage.
WARNING: Anything that empowers a player, empowers a zergball more. The only saving grace here is that they can be wiped.
Anything that can be exploited will be exploited
-
Molag_Crow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Good suggestions and I agree. More steps to discourage lag and cheesy zergballs, along with the upcoming siege weapon buffs.
An ultimate should be called an ultimate for a reason.--ϟ-- Crows_Descend - Templar - Ebonheart Pact [PS4]&[PC] [EU] --ϟ--
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The greatest prison that people live in, is the fear of what other people think. - David Icke
Be your true, authentic self. -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I like the existing variance of our current ults. They are part of what makes combat enjoyable. I don't like your suggestion for changes to ultimates at all and disagree with many of your premises.
You don't amputate your leg because you have an ankle sprain. Yeah it sucks and it's painful but there are far better alternatives to fixing lag.
Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭I like the existing variance of our current ults. They are part of what makes combat enjoyable. I don't like your suggestion for changes to ultimates at all and disagree with many of your premises.
You don't amputate your leg because you have an ankle sprain. Yeah it sucks and it's painful but there are far better alternatives to fixing lag.
Such as ? If they are so good why haven't they been implemented and working ?Edited by Rune_Relic on December 15, 2015 4:18PMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Rune_Relic wrote: »I like the existing variance of our current ults. They are part of what makes combat enjoyable. I don't like your suggestion for changes to ultimates at all and disagree with many of your premises.
You don't amputate your leg because you have an ankle sprain. Yeah it sucks and it's painful but there are far better alternatives to fixing lag.
Such as ? If they are so good why haven't they been implemented and working ?
Because they've been breaking it faster than they've been fixing it until recently. They're on the right track now (finally).
I've seen lag much worse than it is right now as well. It's not anywhere fixed but I've seen it far worse.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube -
Makkir✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't like the idea of being grouped to receive healing benefit. Right now I can come up onto another player and hit him with my mutagen without having to stop first and group with him. That would be a huge pain if, say, he were being attacked by 3 other players and needed some quick heals. -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't like the idea of being grouped to receive healing benefit. Right now I can come up onto another player and hit him with my mutagen without having to stop first and group with him. That would be a huge pain if, say, he were being attacked by 3 other players and needed some quick heals.
That's a fair statement. It does take away game functionality.
However, if the only way to fix lag is to reduce players that can be hit and are hit by standing inside the healing ring,
the only real way is to make it group only.
The problem is flag situations and ball groups.
Everyone stands In every other healers ring with smart heals going off to protect the weakest of every player within.
Basically you can still heal fine with group members.
Its better from a group view as you ensure you are healing your team mates @ 5% rather than not healing them and healing someone else @ 1%.
You can only hit 6 people.....should they be your team mates or not ?
You just cant heal everyone and their dog.Edited by Rune_Relic on December 16, 2015 10:49AMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Ezareth ....
Regarding the fact you like ultimate the way they are.
Yes I concede changing the current ultimates would probably have too much of an impact on current builds and playstyles.
And empowering their abilities with 2/4/6 shot capability would probably make them too class specific with the addons.
So the other option is Weapon Ultimates
Currently none exist.
So there is scope for creating a 3 stage overcharge ultimate for every weapon.
Then you have the choice of existing ultimates or the new Weapon ones.
ie
Stage 1 @ 1-4 mins (6-shot) ..guaranteed 17% damage to 24 players within area
Stage 2 @ 4-9 mins (4-shot) ..guaranteed 25% damage to 24 players within area
Stage 3 @ 9+ mins (2-shot) ..guaranteed 50% damage to 24 players within area
[EDIT: Exception to this could be the Restoration Staff using a healing ultimate rather than damage ultimate]Edited by Rune_Relic on December 16, 2015 11:39AMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If there was a change to an ultimate that I agreed with (I'm fine with them adding new ultimates to weapon skill lines or whatever) it would be that *All* ultimates could scale up to 1000 ult like the Sorc Power Overload.
This way it would actually make sense sometimes for people to fire their ults at later times instead of as soon as they had enough built up. Granted it shouldn't be linear scaling with the amount of ultimate but I'd be fine with an ultimate that had a base cost of 200 doing double damage at 1000 ultimate. This would make them somewhat more in line with what you are saying without completely neutering their existing uses.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube
