Either NERF Dawn Breaker or give Vamps some Love, Use your Noggin ZOS!!!

Uriel_Nocturne

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

MaxwellCrystal wrote: »

Lol this OP, clouding swarm needs a nerf but you don't see me posting forums about being hit by a 14k swarm that I can't block or escape (if the opponent is a NB spamming ambush).

Radiant Mage Light and Detect Potion's are available to everyone which are huge counter's. Remember it is an ULTIMATE ability. Which should hold some significance.

One huge counter to clouding swarm user's is to use a stun ability that does not require a target. Like fear or templar shard's. A lot of the time when i personally use clouding swarm, ill immediately get cc'd and not realize it because i cannot see my own character. Which end's up making my combo worthless. This can be preventable with immovable potion's though.


This thread is not about Bat Swarm. The ultimate is the only reason why you should be a vampire. It is true, it is good. However mist form does not work correctly and drain essence is complete garbage.

Outside of Bat Swarm being a vampire has many more disadvantage's then advantage's. I believe that's all the op is trying to get across in this thread.

Us vampire's know, Bat Swarm can be very deadly. That's all we have though...

This. All. Day.

I made several powerful arguments against the changes after Zeni drove Drain Essence into the ground. The Bat Swarm Ultimate and Drain Essence were the only things vampires had going for them.

Then they take Drain Essence and rather than have it deal damage and Heal as an actually useful ability should (dealt decent damage, not great but descent, Healing at 150% of the damage done), and nerf it into worthlessness by having the damage stay the same, but the Heal is only for 10% of your missing health. Which means that for the 3 second duration, it heals less and less.

Add into that the fact that they made the damage taken from... pretty much everything hit harder, and Vampires are left with only one (1) useful skill. And that Ultimate takes ffffoooooooreeeeeeevvvvvvveeeeeerrrrrr to charge up.

Vampires need a rebalancing as quickly as can be done. Otherwise it's yet another character build that gets arbitrarily killed off due to poor planning...

UltimaJoe777

Resipsa131 wrote: »

Flawless Dawn Breaker/Smiting is pretty fuggin cheap though,

How so?

Spearshard

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Resipsa131 wrote: »

Flawless Dawn Breaker/Smiting is pretty fuggin cheap though,

How so?

I think he means literally, I think it has a cost of about 75 to cast it?

UltimaJoe777

Spearshard wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Resipsa131 wrote: »

Flawless Dawn Breaker/Smiting is pretty fuggin cheap though,

How so?

I think he means literally, I think it has a cost of about 75 to cast it?

I can't say since I don't have my morphs of it ranked up beyond Rank I yet but I sure hope not lol that would be cheap...

leepalmer95

Spearshard wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Resipsa131 wrote: »

Flawless Dawn Breaker/Smiting is pretty fuggin cheap though,

How so?

I think he means literally, I think it has a cost of about 75 to cast it?

Cost is 100, 85 for sorc.

Sav72

So many negative of being a vamp, other then Dark stalker..

ESO FU big time, once again...maybe they will fix stuff when , people are playing other games.

GreenSoup2HoT

Tors wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Vampire's get sneak speed and a little bit of damage mitigation with some regen. Hardly enough to warrant all the negative's.

So....why......are.....you.....still.....a.....vamp?

The fact you ARE a vamp tells me that the trade off is worthwhile for you.

Im a vamp and put up with all the same crap you do. But I think its worth it for the sneak speed alone.

Why am i a Vampire?! WHY AM I A VAMPIRE?!

>I have been a vampire since very early on.
>I was one of the first on console at level 19.
>A v14 pc transfer named Snowblade on Psn bite me.
>Since then i have never even considered dropping vampire.
>This is a curse i will bare for the rest of eternity.

I am a voice for vampire's. I would much rather see the skill line fixed and balanced then tell people to simply cure it.

I also like to role-play that i am a vampire, it's fun to get away from the meta pvp way of the game and do thing's that are different. Using mist form regardless of being broken and feeding on people in pvp for joke's. It's a video game, which many people take way to seriously.

However i am passionate about the skill line. I don't want to see it kicked under the rug and forgotten about either.

riverdragon72

Callous2208 wrote: »

Should have thought of that before you sold your soul to become an abomination. Burn in the light of Meridia's justice fiend!

^^ this

LBxFinalDeath

Bruh...15K minimum dmg guaranteed bats.

Vamps need no more love.

Just gap close spam someone like every other Vampire while you have bats and watch your opponent melt.

Werewolves need more love than Vamps such as reducing the stun animation length on stunned werewolves, its insanely long and leads to a WW near guaranteed death.

Leon119

welp, suck it up and eat meridia's light u filth of nature

Molag_Crow

All this 'hue hue u shouldn't have gone vampire den' won't change the fact that Vampire's are in a crap place, apart from their awesome ultimate & sneaking fast.

leepalmer95

CrowsDescend wrote: »

All this 'hue hue u shouldn't have gone vampire den' won't change the fact that Vampire's are in a crap place, apart from their awesome ultimate & sneaking fast.

and their 10% stamina and magicka regen, also the undeath passive.

Oh and you can cast skills while using the ult.

and you don't need to transform to use the passvies...

ADarklore

Considering that Vamp and WW bite are now available in the Crown Store, I doubt you will see ANY buffs to the line because too many would then have an argument about it being a P2W- even though it is readily available in-game... still, buffing the lines would give P2W a stronger argument.

Second, I have to laugh when people actually complain about the Health Regen debuff... because they don't want to FEED, they want to be lazy and allow their vampire to reach stage four and not suffer any consequences. I think there should be a lot more consequences to reaching stage four, but I also think they should have a slight buff for maintaining stage 1, 2 or 3.

I dropped the vampire line because I found it not worth using; there was nothing that actually provided any significant benefit to my character other than increased sneak speed which allowed me to drop Night's Silence in favor of more powerful crafted sets. Other than sneak speed, nothing else brought anything significant that my skill line didn't already have and/or did better... and my class skill line doesn't suffer any detrimental consequences.

Sav72

If Dark Brother Hood or Thief's guild, have any skill that increases speed in stealth. Vamps will be rare.

charisma316

hahahahaha ahahah if anything it should hit your harder

you want buffs in terms of magicka and using steatlh to do nothing more than be a nuissance and run away but you think you shouldnt be sacrifcing something to get the buffs vampirism gives you get outta here kid

RinaldoGandolphi

Nah No Vampire should be able to survive the power of Dawnbreaker:

Meridia, Lady of Infinite Energies, also known as the Glister Witch, is an obscure Daedric Prince, associated with the energies of living things. This is very important which i will get to in a moment.

In Skyrim Meridia gives us some background hints on what Dawnbreaker actually is:

"Mortals call it Dawnbreaker, for it was forged in a holy light that breaks upon my foes, burning away corruption and false life." - Meridia

"Take the mighty Dawnbreaker and with it purge corruption from the dark corners of the world. Wield it in my name" - Meridia

Meridia is the Daedric Prince of Energies, and has a very particular tie to the energy of living creatures. Its hinted that Meridia actually created Dawnbreaker out of the energies of living creatures...that means in essence Dawnbreaker IS the personification of every person that has ever been turned into a vampire, or an undead creature, all their their hopes, all their dreams, everything they were, their essence, is now inside of Dawnbreaker...Not their soul, but their consciousness...that energy essence, everything they were before they were turned into a Vamp resides inside that sword....

Meridia harnesses this energy with her own touch to make Dawnbreaker, and Dawnbreaker itself has a personal hatred for undead because the person its attacking, who they were before they were turned into a an undead or a vampire consciousness exists inside Meridia's artifiact and its vengeful that its life was stolen from it and Meridia harnesses this energy much like the the Ancient Nord's harnesses their hatred for Dragons to create the Dragonrend Shout.

Simply put Dawnbreaker is the balance...Vampires and Undead upset the normal balance of life and death, Dawnbreaker is like that "purgatory" where a persons consciousness without a soul goes, and the consciousness can't move on to Aetherious without its soul, and since a Vamps soul belongs to Molag Bal, the consciousness inside of Dawnbreaker are furious they can't move on....Who the Vampire was before he was turned is lost...Sure they can appear somewhat civilized, but the person they were before they were transformed no longer really exists, guys like Verandis simply learned to be civilized, but the loving tender person he was before his transformation no longer really exists, He is Verandis in name only and is a whole ner person that learned to live civilized as a soulness undead husk.

Sav72

Love the Lore, and I agree with you, Vamps should have a weakness, BUT, there abilities suck, other then Stalker.

And the Fact that I am a vamp 24/7 and do not get buffs anymore, unless I slot a ability. Is ignorant.

Do not complain about Swarm, when Steel Tornado is a bigger nuisance.

As a vamp, I personally only use stalker ability, (passive)

DRXHarbinger

Lol just now. In a group in 3 in sewers. We find a v12 so am easy meal right?? Before we get an attack off...silver shards to all 3 of us, dawnbreaker and flame impulse boom boom boom all dead and the guy got about 15k stones of the 3 of us. Well done sir. Seriously if I could actually bow to that I would.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Lord-Otto wrote: »

I think the problem with balancing vampires has roots in two fundamental strategies:

1.
Make vamps super powerful, just as you would expect them to be, seeing them in Skyrim and knowing that you have an even stronger bloodline in ESO... It's the very first vampire's, after all! Balance that by throwing in hard counters, which would be the Fighter's Guild.
This seemed to be the original approach, and vamps were truly immortal in the beginning days of ESO, as far as I can tell. for some reason, FG abilities didn't seem to provide enough counter... I'm guessing not everyone wants to ruin their builds just to counter a specific overpowered enemy type. Understandable, and it's the very same dilemma we have with Nightblades these days. Sure, there are some weak counters to cloak, but they screw up builds so much, that you're already at an disadvantage. Might as well not bother or just join the darkside.
So, this idea got scrapped for vamps. Hopefully for Nightblades, soon, but let's not discuss that here. I personally do like this overpoweredness with hard counters more than the following concept, though...

2.
"Balance" vamps. Make them just a "flavor", nothing spectacular, maybe some useful tools for certain builds. As in, nerf bats, nerf Supernatural Recovery, nerf Elusive Mist, nerf drain Essence... Admittedly, reduce some weaknesses as fire damage, as well.
This is the current approach... Unfortunately, ZOS forgot to tweak FG abilities accordingly, they are still balanced for OP vamps! What we get from this is a bat with very clipped wings that has to suffer from hard counters, as well. Which is not balanced at all. ZOS need to re-think this.


The good players on my FL, those that consistently compete for emperorship, have dropped vampirism because of this. Sure, bats are nice, but do not outweigh the cons, especially as you might as well use the next best ultimate and be stronger 95% of the time. The players you see in Cyrodiil with pale skin? Well, it's difficult to become vampire and to level it up. It also is pretty cool. Parting with vampirism is a big and difficult step, that people just don't want to make. That's the reason. Has nothing to do with gameplay.
I want more active vampire abilities, stronger ones. Throw in better FG passives if you are afraid of vampires becoming overpowered. But give us back the BAMF feel we deserve as being the bloody children of lamae Bal herself!
>=(

I highly doubt Lamae's Clan is as strong as the Volkihar is, Lamae Bal herself doesn't seem to be as powerful as Harkon either and here is some evidence to back that claim up, he is almost as old as her yet he survived all the way into the 4th era and mentioned by valerica to have never ever been beaten by anyone, Lame Bal however is in Coldharbour by the 2nd era so someone must have already killed her off...not to mention even after the ritual the Vestige isn't even a vampire lord so therefor you are a weaker and inferior vampire when compared to the Dragonborn.

Lamae Bals Blood doesn't turn you into a vampire lord meanwhile Lord Harkon's Blood does...what does that tell you?

TX12001rwb17_ESO

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Nah No Vampire should be able to survive the power of Dawnbreaker:

Meridia, Lady of Infinite Energies, also known as the Glister Witch, is an obscure Daedric Prince, associated with the energies of living things. This is very important which i will get to in a moment.

In Skyrim Meridia gives us some background hints on what Dawnbreaker actually is:

"Mortals call it Dawnbreaker, for it was forged in a holy light that breaks upon my foes, burning away corruption and false life." - Meridia

"Take the mighty Dawnbreaker and with it purge corruption from the dark corners of the world. Wield it in my name" - Meridia

Meridia is the Daedric Prince of Energies, and has a very particular tie to the energy of living creatures. Its hinted that Meridia actually created Dawnbreaker out of the energies of living creatures...that means in essence Dawnbreaker IS the personification of every person that has ever been turned into a vampire, or an undead creature, all their their hopes, all their dreams, everything they were, their essence, is now inside of Dawnbreaker...Not their soul, but their consciousness...that energy essence, everything they were before they were turned into a Vamp resides inside that sword....

Meridia harnesses this energy with her own touch to make Dawnbreaker, and Dawnbreaker itself has a personal hatred for undead because the person its attacking, who they were before they were turned into a an undead or a vampire consciousness exists inside Meridia's artifiact and its vengeful that its life was stolen from it and Meridia harnesses this energy much like the the Ancient Nord's harnesses their hatred for Dragons to create the Dragonrend Shout.

Simply put Dawnbreaker is the balance...Vampires and Undead upset the normal balance of life and death, Dawnbreaker is like that "purgatory" where a persons consciousness without a soul goes, and the consciousness can't move on to Aetherious without its soul, and since a Vamps soul belongs to Molag Bal, the consciousness inside of Dawnbreaker are furious they can't move on....Who the Vampire was before he was turned is lost...Sure they can appear somewhat civilized, but the person they were before they were transformed no longer really exists, guys like Verandis simply learned to be civilized, but the loving tender person he was before his transformation no longer really exists, He is Verandis in name only and is a whole ner person that learned to live civilized as a soulness undead husk.

"and since a Vamps soul belongs to Molag Bal, the consciousness inside of Dawnbreaker are furious they can't move on"

Vampires have souls in there body mate and so do Lichs. Molag Bal doesn't own them, other then that it a good theory.

Artjuh90

vampires have their perks so deal with the weakness.
don't want the weakness, cure your vampirism

Lenikus

Are you one of the guys I just go Ambush + Dawnbreaker from stealth ?
...You sound like one.


Most of them are actually rather sporty about that, tho'.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Here is another idea....

Instead of buffing or nerfing vampires, add something to Non-Vampires to balance it out? if your a mortal you should suffer from the folly of being mortal, you should need to eat food every now and again for example. seriously if mortals don't need to eat then why do vampires have to?

Artjuh90

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Here is another idea....

Instead of buffing or nerfing vampires, add something to Non-Vampires to balance it out? if your a mortal you should suffer from the folly of being mortal, you should need to eat food every now and again for example. seriously if mortals don't need to eat then why do vampires have to?

you kinda already do in pvp to be of any use

Catblade

Vamp lives matter

Solariken

I agree, the bonus damage from Dawnbreaker against vampires/undead is way too high.

Additionally, I think that players should have to slot a Fighter's Guild skill in order to receive any benefit from it's passives. It's really goofy that all players get a whopping 9% bonus damage against anyone who is a vampire/werewolf.

However in general I think Camo Hunter and Dawnbreaker are suitable counters to vamp/ww. It's really fun to seek out and blow up vamp/ww players on the battlefield using these skills.

SeventhWarlock

We vamps deserve some love, and not just because we're so sexy. Sometimes, it seems like the entire non-noob population in PvP i geared towards killing us. Either nerf DB or lower our fire vulnerability.

Sav72

Artjuh90 wrote: »

vampires have their perks so deal with the weakness.
don't want the weakness, cure your vampirism

What perks? Please explain.

leepalmer95

Sav72 wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

vampires have their perks so deal with the weakness.
don't want the weakness, cure your vampirism

What perks? Please explain.

Faster sneak speed
Undeath passive
10% magicka+stamina regen
Mobile aoe ultimate that allows you to use skills while it's cast and can heal or invis you.

KaleidoscopeEyz

You want Vampire love?