Sorc - Overload - Shock dmg as Stamina Sorc? Scales only of Spell penetration instead of Armor Pene

Alcast

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Problems:
1. Ultimates only work with Spellpenetrations instead of Armor or Spell penetration, depending on what setup you have.
2. All ultis (except Take flight) are Elemental or Magic damage type. So I have to invest MORE CP points to be as effective as mages. Ultis should work with either Elemental damage or physical damage depending on what setup you have.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

Dracane

Alcast wrote: »

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

How ? 5k spell damage ?

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

Ultimates should work with both Armor and Spell penetration depending on higher stat.

Also, for Stamina classes Ultis should be physical damage type

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

@Alcast
You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

edit: which morph of Overload do you want to test?

Merlin13KAGL

There's always going to be an imbalance this way until they do one of two things:

• Provide a passive that morphs all the Sorc stuff into a stamina equivalent.
• Branch stam sorc off into the separate subclass it really needs to be to get proper attention.
  Of course then they'll be *****ing that we have two class options and they don't.

As far as CP's are concerned, the same is true on the flipside, as there are not Magicka and Stamina equivalents at the same level (passive levels) or at all, and so many of the stars make zero sense in the constellations they reside in.

With the four class limit, they've cornered themselves into a place where it's hard, if not impossible, to balance out and give both sides what they need. Had they followed the standalone design, all things would be possible.

If they're going to keep it one class, there almost needs to be a defined moment where you choose to specialize in one or of the other (Magicka or Stamina), beyond when you set attribute points and put something other than a stave in your hand.

They're still fumbling with how to make it work.

(By the way, Ice will be next. It was fire, fire, fire for so long, now it's shock heavy, so ice is the next logical step.)

Good luck, stam sorcs. One day you might get what you need!

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Dracane

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

@Alcast
You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

edit: which morph of Overload do you want to test?

No need. It might scale with weapon damage, but it deals magical shock damage, therefore it needs spell penetration and is not affected by armor penetration.

FENGRUSH

You can stack weapon damage and enchants +CP for big ups on the damage department. Overload has always felt weak on stam even on live. I tried it with a half decent gear setup and never looked at it again.

He's right about magicka sorcs putting CP into trees that play into lightning damage while stam sorcs wouldnt be putting CP there - it essentially forces stam sorc to have more to make use of their skill class tree/ult

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

@Alcast

Ok with 0 CP and 3100 weapon damage, my overload (unmorphed) Light Attacks were doing 9111 damge to my v14 Bear target. When I crit I did 13666.

I then put 100 points into Piercing for 25% armor pen. This also gave me a little more Magicka. My damage was unchanged. I did the same amount for light attacks and crit.

I then cleared out my CP and point 100 into Erosion for 25% Magic Pen. My light attacks now did 9585 and 14378 crits. So I gained about 474 damage for light attacks and a little over 700 for crits.

I then cleared out CP and put 100 into Elemental Expert for 25% damage to Shock, Fire, Cold. Light attacks 11338 and crits for 17082. Now I am going to buff with Rally and see the damage. Light 12523 Crit 18785.

I did not test Thundering Presence as I have decided to not use it for PvP purposes and Boundless Storm being superior.


edit: Decided to morph Overload. Chose Power Overload, kept the CP in Elemental Expert, damage was less than Base unmoprh Overload... wtf? Should be 6% more.
light 11071 crit 16606

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

@Alcast

Ok with 0 CP and 3100 weapon damage, my overload (unmorphed) Light Attacks were doing 9111 damge to my v14 Bear target. When I crit I did 13666.

I then put 100 points into Piercing for 25% armor pen. This also gave me a little more Magicka. My damage was unchanged. I did the same amount for light attacks and crit.

I then cleared out my CP and point 100 into Erosion for 25% Magic Pen. My light attacks now did 9585 and 14378 crits. So I gained about 474 damage for light attacks and a little over 700 for crits.

I then cleared out CP and put 100 into Elemental Expert for 25% damage to Shock, Fire, Cold. Light attacks 11338 and crits for 17082. Now I am going to buff with Rally and see the damage. Light 12523 Crit 18785.

I did not test Thundering Presence as I have decided to not use it for PvP purposes and Boundless Storm being superior.


edit: Decided to morph Overload. Chose Power Overload, kept the CP in Elemental Expert, damage was less than Base unmoprh Overload... wtf? Should be 6% more.
light 11071 crit 16606

Okay, so we now know def that Ultimates dont work with Armor Penetration which makes them kinda "useless"

But that unmoprhed Overload does more damage makes absolutely no sense at all lol xD
Also, the damage difference should be a lot HIGHER than your testing shows, smth is off here.

Well, i guess I am not going to have 40k crits on my Stamina sorc

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

@Alcast

Ok with 0 CP and 3100 weapon damage, my overload (unmorphed) Light Attacks were doing 9111 damge to my v14 Bear target. When I crit I did 13666.

I then put 100 points into Piercing for 25% armor pen. This also gave me a little more Magicka. My damage was unchanged. I did the same amount for light attacks and crit.

I then cleared out my CP and point 100 into Erosion for 25% Magic Pen. My light attacks now did 9585 and 14378 crits. So I gained about 474 damage for light attacks and a little over 700 for crits.

I then cleared out CP and put 100 into Elemental Expert for 25% damage to Shock, Fire, Cold. Light attacks 11338 and crits for 17082. Now I am going to buff with Rally and see the damage. Light 12523 Crit 18785.

I did not test Thundering Presence as I have decided to not use it for PvP purposes and Boundless Storm being superior.


edit: Decided to morph Overload. Chose Power Overload, kept the CP in Elemental Expert, damage was less than Base unmoprh Overload... wtf? Should be 6% more.
light 11071 crit 16606

Okay, so we now know def that Ultimates dont work with Armor Penetration which makes them kinda "useless"


But that unmoprhed Overload does more damage makes absolutely no sense at all lol xD
Also, the damage difference should be a lot HIGHER than your testing shows, smth is off here.

Well, i guess I am not going to have 40k crits on my Stamina sorc

@Alcast

I am currently running 3 Toxic 4 Venom 4 agility which puts me at 3108 weapon damage before Rally. If I move the Overload ult and replace with Flawless Dawn I am 3886 weapon damage with rally. Which I keep up at all times in PvP. I might just put Overload on my non offense bar and see how much damage I do in PvP really quick. I get you wanted these findings for PvE purposes, I am curious how much I hit for though against players

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

@Alcast

Ok with 0 CP and 3100 weapon damage, my overload (unmorphed) Light Attacks were doing 9111 damge to my v14 Bear target. When I crit I did 13666.

I then put 100 points into Piercing for 25% armor pen. This also gave me a little more Magicka. My damage was unchanged. I did the same amount for light attacks and crit.

I then cleared out my CP and point 100 into Erosion for 25% Magic Pen. My light attacks now did 9585 and 14378 crits. So I gained about 474 damage for light attacks and a little over 700 for crits.

I then cleared out CP and put 100 into Elemental Expert for 25% damage to Shock, Fire, Cold. Light attacks 11338 and crits for 17082. Now I am going to buff with Rally and see the damage. Light 12523 Crit 18785.

I did not test Thundering Presence as I have decided to not use it for PvP purposes and Boundless Storm being superior.


edit: Decided to morph Overload. Chose Power Overload, kept the CP in Elemental Expert, damage was less than Base unmoprh Overload... wtf? Should be 6% more.
light 11071 crit 16606

Okay, so we now know def that Ultimates dont work with Armor Penetration which makes them kinda "useless"


But that unmoprhed Overload does more damage makes absolutely no sense at all lol xD
Also, the damage difference should be a lot HIGHER than your testing shows, smth is off here.

Well, i guess I am not going to have 40k crits on my Stamina sorc

@Alcast

I am currently running 3 Toxic 4 Venom 4 agility which puts me at 3108 weapon damage before Rally. If I move the Overload ult and replace with Flawless Dawn I am 3886 weapon damage with rally. Which I keep up at all times in PvP. I might just put Overload on my non offense bar and see how much damage I do in PvP really quick. I get you wanted these findings for PvE purposes, I am curious how much I hit for though against players

Ye in PvE i think you need quite a lot more recovery now due to the dodgeroll nerf. I will try out your setup because I intend to pvp too with my Stamina sorcerer

Tho with all those imbalances I am not sure what to think of Stamina right now. magicka classes still spamming shields at ease with no cost at all and stamina classes got robbed of their only defense, dodgeroll.

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

All those shock damage type skills + Ultimates like Power overload use Shock damage... So basically we need 2x the CP to be as effective as a Magicka Sorc.

My overload with 5,2k Weap dmg+34k stamina hits for 20k on STAMINA
My overload with 3,2k Spell dmg+40k magicka hits for 24k on MAGICKA
crits
Intended or bug?

Same with all the other classes basically.

I will check soon how much overload hits with 5k spelldmg.

Now that mages are getting pretty OP sets ZOS could at least fix the Armor/Spell penetration issue with stamina builds due to all Ultis and some Stamina skills being Elemental/magic dmg type

Regarding Overload you have a passive that scales with Spell Damage and Magicka oriented abilities: Expert Mage. This is why you will have a difference in damage.
Why are you saying we need 2x the CP as a magicka Sorc? This is false.

What "shock type" spells are you using as a Stamina Sorc? If you are using anything more than Overload, Streak, and Lightning Form you are doing it wrong. Moreover if you are going to stack penetration to make these do more damage you are gimping yourself. Considering the bulk of your damage will be 'on the fly' damage from whatever weapon skill line you use, you will likely focus on physical damage, crit damage, some pen, and weapon damage.

Thundering Presence damage scales off of Weapon Damage and Stamina. Boundless Storm and Lightning Form scale off of Magicka and Spell Damage.

Armor pen was already adjusted on PTS and unless you have a Sharpened Maul and "Heavy Weapon" passive, you can't really test the change. Those of us on NA megaserver are subject to premade templates and all of the weapons have the Infused trait at vr16. Those at vr14 that have Sharpened are the Master's Greatsword and Daggers which are moot. Those were always working as intended, it was only the combination of Sharpened and the 2 passives Heavy Weapons and Twin Blade & Blunt with Maul/maces. That said, none of us can test it yet unless we farm up items in IC to decon enough mats to craft a Maul or 2 maces with Sharpened.

Regarding your last statement, did you not notice that this "elemental" type switched over from Magicka to Stamina when you decided to be a Stam Sorc? Are you asking for Liquid Lightning to scale with Stamina? Sorry, your thread title is misleading to me.

Also how is Stamina Sorc ok? We are the only class neutral weapon spec in the game.

hm, prolly was 100% unclear what i am trying to say. I know that there are stamina morphs.

Its about the Spell vs Armor penetration.

Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess.

Also Why should I as Stamian build have to put points into Ele Expert to boost my Overload Ultimate?

You sound unsure with "Overload ONLY works with spellpenetration i guess."
We should test this out. I can hop on PTS and test it real quick. I will test light attacks as they are the easiest to gauge. Also explain to me how you have 5.2k weapon damage considering with the current access to stuff we can only top out around 3880 with Dawnbreaker as 2h and just over 4k with dw. Bow is like 3500ish, all of this with Rally buff.

I will do some tests later, just did some short stuff and could not reach the same values yet.

ravager + molag kena and here you go 5,2k weap dmg

Same for mages, you can also reach approx 5,2k spelldmg, did not have the right setup yet so all i could achiev was 3,2k spelldmg.


I mean you would not even have to do tests, Overload hits for 24k crits with 3,2k spelldmg compared to 20k crits with 5,2k weap dmg. Also, I have 20% Mighty increase so without CP it would be even lower. I should test that too

Oh. Yeah, that set kills your resources and adding Ravager to the mix as heavy also kills your Medium Armor passives, not to mention the change to Ravager. I don't think it's worth using in PvP mate. Unless you are doing this for PvE to rival your OP Jab-barian.

Either way I can test the base Overload pre morph with no CP and then with 100 Piercing and then with 100 Spell Erosion. I won't use those above mentioned sets and stick with my 4k Weapon Damage.

@Alcast I will have results in like 2-3 minutes, depending on if I kill my test subject.

Okay, if you have time please

Ye would be for PvE.

ZOS is so much focused on the PvP aspect of the game that they forgot to kinda "balance" PvE classes too with those new changes and new sets.

@Alcast

Ok with 0 CP and 3100 weapon damage, my overload (unmorphed) Light Attacks were doing 9111 damge to my v14 Bear target. When I crit I did 13666.

I then put 100 points into Piercing for 25% armor pen. This also gave me a little more Magicka. My damage was unchanged. I did the same amount for light attacks and crit.

I then cleared out my CP and point 100 into Erosion for 25% Magic Pen. My light attacks now did 9585 and 14378 crits. So I gained about 474 damage for light attacks and a little over 700 for crits.

I then cleared out CP and put 100 into Elemental Expert for 25% damage to Shock, Fire, Cold. Light attacks 11338 and crits for 17082. Now I am going to buff with Rally and see the damage. Light 12523 Crit 18785.

I did not test Thundering Presence as I have decided to not use it for PvP purposes and Boundless Storm being superior.


edit: Decided to morph Overload. Chose Power Overload, kept the CP in Elemental Expert, damage was less than Base unmoprh Overload... wtf? Should be 6% more.
light 11071 crit 16606

Okay, so we now know def that Ultimates dont work with Armor Penetration which makes them kinda "useless"


But that unmoprhed Overload does more damage makes absolutely no sense at all lol xD
Also, the damage difference should be a lot HIGHER than your testing shows, smth is off here.

Well, i guess I am not going to have 40k crits on my Stamina sorc

@Alcast

I am currently running 3 Toxic 4 Venom 4 agility which puts me at 3108 weapon damage before Rally. If I move the Overload ult and replace with Flawless Dawn I am 3886 weapon damage with rally. Which I keep up at all times in PvP. I might just put Overload on my non offense bar and see how much damage I do in PvP really quick. I get you wanted these findings for PvE purposes, I am curious how much I hit for though against players

Ye in PvE i think you need quite a lot more recovery now due to the dodgeroll nerf. I will try out your setup because I intend to pvp too with my Stamina sorcerer

Tho with all those imbalances I am not sure what to think of Stamina right now. magicka classes still spamming shields at ease with no cost at all and stamina classes got robbed of their only defense, dodgeroll.

@Alcast
I have put several hours in on the Stam Sorc this PTS build. So far I have had success with 2h/2h dw/2h(buff bar) bow/2h. To be quite honest, other than Lightning Form aggroing every damn thing around, I have been having some fun. It's not THAT bad. I mean I don't necessarily feel like a massive gimp compared to every other class, but I do see serious shortcomings and a lackluster playstyle. What I do appreciate though currently is I now know I am not bound to using a 2h. I do see bigger hits with 2h, but the DW set up is viable. I have yet to try 1hs. The one thing I don't care for about DW is the lack of a gap closer. That and Flying Blade/Steel Tornado seem to be the only skills worth slotting. I have used the Rune Cage/Flurry trick, Flurry just sucks for damage and it's like "1400 (crit), 900, 1400, 900, 900, etc" over the course of a few seconds. I think the final hit is something like 3800 if it crits. I have gotten a few kills with it though. Overall there are at least more options for weapon slots.


edit:
I am getting around 1-5k overload light attacks to people. I suppose it varies based on debuffs/shields etc. This is with over 4k weapon damage. My highest crit so far was 7336. I was getting 1200 crits on this dk earlier and then he started reflecting them. Yeah, I don't think it's worth giving up the Flawless Dawnbreaker passive (in pvp).

Alcast

@Xael

On my templar I am running 2H/DW, 2H dps bar and DW support + werewolf which is crazy Op atm.
check out my WW video > ESO - PVP - WW Afterlife #1

Sorc and DKs have 1 issue, no class burst skills so I guess I have to go 2h/s&b. I tried 2H/dw on DK but it felt too clunky due to Wblow spam.
In the next patch however, with stamina roll nerf W-blow might be a pretty darn solid choice

Every class is okay, you just need to adapt and learn first.

Maybe I will still try WW in the next patch but due to higher TTK it is kinda annoying with the Timer being still the same

Xael

Alcast wrote: »

@Xael

On my templar I am running 2H/DW, 2H dps bar and DW support + werewolf which is crazy Op atm.
check out my WW video > ESO - PVP - WW Afterlife #1

Sorc and DKs have 1 issue, no class burst skills so I guess I have to go 2h/s&b. I tried 2H/dw on DK but it felt too clunky due to Wblow spam.
In the next patch however, with stamina roll nerf W-blow might be a pretty darn solid choice

Every class is okay, you just need to adapt and learn first.

Maybe I will still try WW in the next patch but due to higher TTK it is kinda annoying with the Timer being still the same

@Alcast We (stam Sorcs) already use WB. We have no other "big" damage ability unless you count snipe. I have been a Sorc for 2 years now (including 2013 Beta) and I hate to say this but there is little for me to learn unless something gets bugged out during server down or an update. Granted as far as v2.1 goes I am learning new stuff, I think everyone is, but yeah.

DKs do have some serious damage though, especially when you synergize your weapon skills with the right DK passives. I have seen DKs use 1HS almost as well as Sorcs use 2h I need to start playing my Templar. I parked 2 of them around v1-v3 and just used them for writs. Most of my free time lately has gone to PTS.

I will check out your video later today, I watched one of your pve stam temp videos, made me consider making a Temp for PvE purposes hehe.

Alcast

Xael wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

@Xael

On my templar I am running 2H/DW, 2H dps bar and DW support + werewolf which is crazy Op atm.
check out my WW video > ESO - PVP - WW Afterlife #1

Sorc and DKs have 1 issue, no class burst skills so I guess I have to go 2h/s&b. I tried 2H/dw on DK but it felt too clunky due to Wblow spam.
In the next patch however, with stamina roll nerf W-blow might be a pretty darn solid choice

Every class is okay, you just need to adapt and learn first.

Maybe I will still try WW in the next patch but due to higher TTK it is kinda annoying with the Timer being still the same

@Alcast We (stam Sorcs) already use WB. We have no other "big" damage ability unless you count snipe. I have been a Sorc for 2 years now (including 2013 Beta) and I hate to say this but there is little for me to learn unless something gets bugged out during server down or an update. Granted as far as v2.1 goes I am learning new stuff, I think everyone is, but yeah.

DKs do have some serious damage though, especially when you synergize your weapon skills with the right DK passives. I have seen DKs use 1HS almost as well as Sorcs use 2h I need to start playing my Templar. I parked 2 of them around v1-v3 and just used them for writs. Most of my free time lately has gone to PTS.

I will check out your video later today, I watched one of your pve stam temp videos, made me consider making a Temp for PvE purposes hehe.

Only think I could consider is Flying blade, but the damage output is not so great against Wblow and it is even easier dodgeable/blockable the Wblow... >.>

Dks at least have the Dragon leap to put some pressure on enemy.

Well, if i will not get around with Sorc I might come to you to check it out, or just go full *** WW style haha :d

EgoRush

Poor stamina sorcerers but the same applies to all classes for ultimate usage - if you're stamina then armour penetration should be factored in, not spell penetration. It's not only CP passives that imbalance ultimate in favour of magicka users, the passives from light armour also do. I don't mind that I'll need points in elemental expert too as long as armour penetration is what affects my ultimate usage as a stamina user.

Waylander

I run flawless dawn breaker (2H) and WW as my ultimates on my Stamina Sorc. Quite effective on live. Only WW and dk's take flight deal physical dmg as far as I can see. Rolled a stam Orc DK to vr1 last night just to utilise take flight. Interestingly, both need to rely on WB too, but nothing feels as good as a wrecking blow > crit rush > executioner combo (jump before the executioner for extra style points).

I tried overload on the stam sorc, damage was lack lustre compared to magica due to no spell pen and no elemental dmg. At high enough CP this may balance out to make it viable again though. The third bar for utility abilities is nice but still clunky.

I agree WW timer is too short in PvP with dmg reduced. Battle spirit should triple the timer now there is barely anything to eat in cyrodiil.

Alcast

EgoRush wrote: »

Poor stamina sorcerers but the same applies to all classes for ultimate usage - if you're stamina then armour penetration should be factored in, not spell penetration. It's not only CP passives that imbalance ultimate in favour of magicka users, the passives from light armour also do. I don't mind that I'll need points in elemental expert too as long as armour penetration is what affects my ultimate usage as a stamina user.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_GinaBruno exatly what egorush said, this is the main issue with all ultimates in the game atm