Any chance we'll be able to gift crowns?

Phinix1

I really wanted that stupid ice horse, but I can't afford the $30 right now due to having a bleeding lesion in my brain and being out of work and denied any benefits from the state... I was hoping I would get some donations for Master Recipe List but that isn't happening.

I know guildies that don't have money but would give me spare crowns from their subs. Would be nice if such a system were in place for the next limited time offer I'd like to have.

HeathenDeacon

I would love to be able to gift crowns.
i have a bunch of crowns and wish i could share with my guildies.

Phinix1

Hopefully in time for the next limited time offer.

JamilaRaj

I, for one, second this request. I have recieved 1500 crowns for my loyalty as subscriber (though I am no longer loyal, let alone subscriber) and would like to gift them to my business partners friends, so they could in turn gift me valuable in game items that are not yet in the cash shop and thus impossible to buy directly.

Phinix1

JamilaRaj wrote: »

I, for one, second this request. I have recieved 1500 crowns for my loyalty as subscriber (though I am no longer loyal, let alone subscriber) and would like to gift them to my business partners friends, so they could in turn gift me valuable in game items that are not yet in the cash shop and thus impossible to buy directly.

If you were making this suggestion tongue-in-cheek as an argument against, I really don't see the problem. In my mind, Crowns are a virtual currency, like in-game gold. If someone wants a suit of armor made, and someone that can make it is willing to accept in-game gold, it is no problem. Likewise, if they are willing to accept crowns, I see no problem as it is also a virtual currency that is already in the game "economy" thus, would not violate any terms of service regarding real-money transactions.

This would also be a benefit to Zenimax, as it would be an incentive for people with little gold to buy crowns for things like player-crafted armor and other crafted stuff, that doesn't exist on the crown store, which is what it sounds like you were saying.

I see this as a win-win for the company and the consumer. It helps redistribute the wealth of whales who can afford to buy all the crowns they want to other customers that can provide things they want, and Zenimax profits.

Win-win-win actually.

Phinix1

JamilaRaj wrote: »

I think this is a terrible idea, people would just create new accounts, get the free Crowns, trade it to a friend, go back to their main account and trade for it. ZOS would never allow this and they are right not to because people would exploit this.

That makes no sense.

One does not simple "create a new account for free crowns." (Insert meme image here.)

You have neglected the part where you must PAY ZENIMAX for that new account.

It isn't an exploit if you are still paying.

/rolleyes

Gorthax

I see this turning out bad lol

tplink3r1

This would lead into people trading crowns for items. P2W

Xendyn

Not sure how this will turn out or if Z will ever do that sort of thing.
Mostly just wanted to say sorry for the difficulties life is handing you right now.

Chaos0720

As much as I agree with the OP that it would be nice to have this capability... there is a reason why we can't have nice things. While being designed with the idea of being for gifting to friends, it would quickly be abused, as mentioned above, by turning a pay to win game. If you have enough cash, you can get whatever you want... and this isn't that kind of game... yet.

JamilaRaj

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

JamilaRaj wrote: »

I, for one, second this request. I have recieved 1500 crowns for my loyalty as subscriber (though I am no longer loyal, let alone subscriber) and would like to gift them to my business partners friends, so they could in turn gift me valuable in game items that are not yet in the cash shop and thus impossible to buy directly.

If you were making this suggestion tongue-in-cheek as an argument against, I really don't see the problem. In my mind, Crowns are a virtual currency, like in-game gold. If someone wants a suit of armor made, and someone that can make it is willing to accept in-game gold, it is no problem. Likewise, if they are willing to accept crowns, I see no problem as it is also a virtual currency that is already in the game "economy" thus, would not violate any terms of service regarding real-money transactions.

This would also be a benefit to Zenimax, as it would be an incentive for people with little gold to buy crowns for things like player-crafted armor and other crafted stuff, that doesn't exist on the crown store, which is what it sounds like you were saying.

I see this as a win-win for the company and the consumer. It helps redistribute the wealth of whales who can afford to buy all the crowns they want to other customers that can provide things they want, and Zenimax profits.

Win-win-win actually.

If it is not tongue-in-cheek reply to further support my argument, then the problem you do not see is precisely that players with little gold/in game resources would simply use cash to buy to crowns to buy whatever in game, turning the game into flat out P2W garbage.
ZOS may actually prefer it to selling e.g. top gear in the crown store themselves for the very reason plenty of people would fail to see through it, and, of course, prefer it to shady behind the scenes RMT not involving their virtual currency, from which they would have no profit. So yeah, it may make it into "game" eventually.

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

JamilaRaj wrote: »

I think this is a terrible idea, people would just create new accounts, get the free Crowns, trade it to a friend, go back to their main account and trade for it. ZOS would never allow this and they are right not to because people would exploit this.

That makes no sense.

One does not simple "create a new account for free crowns." (Insert meme image here.)

You have neglected the part where you must PAY ZENIMAX for that new account.

It isn't an exploit if you are still paying.

/rolleyes

You however reply to "quote" the other guy doctored.

seratin

I don't see too much problem with this, if the crowns were already purchased does it really matter who spends them? As far as people buying crowns, there's really nothing in the store that's worth buying or will leave an impact. I suppose you could buy crowns to get future dlc, but someone is buying those crowns. You'd have to be pretty cold hearted to not want everyone to enjoy the game in it's fullest.

Jennifur_Vultee

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns, they are locked to the account that acquires them. To allow them to be transferred opens up a whole new avenue for botting.

Just imagine your zone chat filled with messages like, "BUY your discount CROWNS at website XYZ! LOWEST RATES on CROWN!" No thank you I had enough of that with the gold sellers.

Chaos0720

seratin wrote: »

I don't see too much problem with this, if the crowns were already purchased does it really matter who spends them? As far as people buying crowns, there's really nothing in the store that's worth buying or will leave an impact. I suppose you could buy crowns to get future dlc, but someone is buying those crowns. You'd have to be pretty cold hearted to not want everyone to enjoy the game in it's fullest.

What you stated is exactly why allowing us to gift crowns is a problem. "there's really nothing in the store... [that] will leave an impact." Anything that is bought in the crown story is eye candy or a comfort item.

If they implement a tool for us to gift crowns to other players, then crowns can be used for things that will leave an impact. Thus turning into a buy to win game.

I could start up the game. Reach the appropriate level to start PVP and then pay for equipment to give me an advantage. Equipment that I would have had to work for myself... whether to create it or to earn in game gold to buy it.

demendred

Do what most kids your age do. Steal from mothers purse.

seratin

Chaos0720 wrote: »

What you stated is exactly why allowing us to gift crowns is a problem. "there's really nothing in the store... [that] will leave an impact." Anything that is bought in the crown story is eye candy or a comfort item.

If they implement a tool for us to gift crowns to other players, then crowns can be used for things that will leave an impact. Thus turning into a buy to win game.

I could start up the game. Reach the appropriate level to start PVP and then pay for equipment to give me an advantage. Equipment that I would have had to work for myself... whether to create it or to earn in game gold to buy it.

Except no one is suggesting they add p2w in the store. There are plenty of meaningful things they can add that people might want, particularly dlc. What problem do you have with letting people who otherwise couldn't afford dlc to experience everything this game will have to offer?

michaelb14a_ESO2

It would be nice if here on the forums you could gift crowns. Sort of like Reddit's "Give gold".

Phinix1

JamilaRaj wrote: »

You however reply to "quote" the other guy doctored.

No, "other guy" edited his post after I quoted him.

Derp.

Phinix1

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns, they are locked to the account that acquires them. To allow them to be transferred opens up a whole new avenue for botting.

Just imagine your zone chat filled with messages like, "BUY your discount CROWNS at website XYZ! LOWEST RATES on CROWN!" No thank you I had enough of that with the gold sellers.

This makes no sense.

Crown price is fixed, unlike in-game gold. That means these "gold seller" companies would still have to buy them from ZOS at the fixed rate.

That means the only way anyone could offer "discount crowns" is to buy them from ZOS and sell them for less!

Tell me, what company in their right mind would do that?

Those thinks though.

JamilaRaj

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns...

Link?

Chaos0720

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns, they are locked to the account that acquires them. To allow them to be transferred opens up a whole new avenue for botting.

Just imagine your zone chat filled with messages like, "BUY your discount CROWNS at website XYZ! LOWEST RATES on CROWN!" No thank you I had enough of that with the gold sellers.

This makes no sense.

Crown price is fixed, unlike in-game gold. That means these "gold seller" companies would still have to buy them from ZOS at the fixed rate.

That means the only way anyone could offer "discount crowns" is to buy them from ZOS and sell them for less!

Tell me, what company in their right mind would do that?

Those thinks though.

You purchase the cheapers $/crown pack for $39.99, you end up with 5500 crowns at 0.73 cents per crown. Resell the crowns for 0.83 cents and you end up making a profit of $5.10.

Why would people do this? The way the crown store is set up you have to buy packs... so let's say I only need 300 crowns for something I want. Well now I can pay this dude $2.49 instead of purchasing a pack for $7.99. So now, not only has random dude A found a way to make money, it is also now costing zeni money.


If I could come up with that example in 5 minutes, imagine how much more exploitive a schemer who put some serious thought into it could be.

And yes, I know a $5 profit isn't that much... but it's something that literally requires no effort and even if he only got 1000 people to purchase from him, that's still $5 for every 5500 crowns he would sell.

Phinix1

Chaos0720 wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns, they are locked to the account that acquires them. To allow them to be transferred opens up a whole new avenue for botting.

Just imagine your zone chat filled with messages like, "BUY your discount CROWNS at website XYZ! LOWEST RATES on CROWN!" No thank you I had enough of that with the gold sellers.

This makes no sense.

Crown price is fixed, unlike in-game gold. That means these "gold seller" companies would still have to buy them from ZOS at the fixed rate.

That means the only way anyone could offer "discount crowns" is to buy them from ZOS and sell them for less!

Tell me, what company in their right mind would do that?

Those thinks though.

You purchase the cheapers $/crown pack for $39.99, you end up with 5500 crowns at 0.73 cents per crown. Resell the crowns for 0.83 cents and you end up making a profit of $5.10.

Why would people do this? The way the crown store is set up you have to buy packs... so let's say I only need 300 crowns for something I want. Well now I can pay this dude $2.49 instead of purchasing a pack for $7.99. So now, not only has random dude A found a way to make money, it is also now costing zeni money.


If I could come up with that example in 5 minutes, imagine how much more exploitive a schemer who put some serious thought into it could be.

Dude no one is going to risk getting banned buying from a Chinese gold farmer just to save a couple bucks on a crown pack! XD

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns,

They also stated the game would always require a subscription.

They also stated there would be regular content updates.

All The Best

Merlight

seratin wrote: »

Except no one is suggesting they add p2w in the store.

That's irrelevant. Once you're allowed to trade your gold for other player's Crowns, anyone can buy anything non-BoP for their Cash.

yodased

Well the issue of "gifting" crowns comes down to being able to buy in-game items with real money at that point.

As crowns are simply a currency change from physical to virtual, crowns have a monetary value.

If they allow you to gift items from the store to players then they are allowing real-world currency transactions on their servers, which I do believe it against the Terms of Service of both microsoft and sony.

There is also a moral issue at play allowing ingame transfer of goods to other people from real money. Comes to stolen credit cards and scams because you can now benefit from having mule accounts to sell items from.

It opens up a can of worms I don't think they want or need to handle

seratin

Chaos0720 wrote: »

You purchase the cheapers $/crown pack for $39.99, you end up with 5500 crowns at 0.73 cents per crown. Resell the crowns for 0.83 cents and you end up making a profit of $5.10.

Why would people do this? The way the crown store is set up you have to buy packs... so let's say I only need 300 crowns for something I want. Well now I can pay this dude $2.49 instead of purchasing a pack for $7.99. So now, not only has random dude A found a way to make money, it is also now costing zeni money.

If I could come up with that example in 5 minutes, imagine how much more exploitive a schemer who put some serious thought into it could be.

First ZOS is always going to make money off this, crowns don't spring up from thin air. Let's get cleared up from the get go.

Are gold sellers a problem, of course, always will be. Just ban them and remove all gold or crowns they've sold. If someone wants to risk wasting money more power to them, I'll buy my crowns legit.

Perhaps they could use the new found revenue from the increased crown purchases (as a market opens up) to hire a gm or two. If I could come up with a rebuttal in 2 minutes time your argument is baseless.

Chaos0720

D

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Chaos0720 wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Zenimax has already stated there will be no gifting/trading/buying/selling of crowns, they are locked to the account that acquires them. To allow them to be transferred opens up a whole new avenue for botting.

Just imagine your zone chat filled with messages like, "BUY your discount CROWNS at website XYZ! LOWEST RATES on CROWN!" No thank you I had enough of that with the gold sellers.

This makes no sense.

Crown price is fixed, unlike in-game gold. That means these "gold seller" companies would still have to buy them from ZOS at the fixed rate.

That means the only way anyone could offer "discount crowns" is to buy them from ZOS and sell them for less!

Tell me, what company in their right mind would do that?

Those thinks though.

You purchase the cheapers $/crown pack for $39.99, you end up with 5500 crowns at 0.73 cents per crown. Resell the crowns for 0.83 cents and you end up making a profit of $5.10.

Why would people do this? The way the crown store is set up you have to buy packs... so let's say I only need 300 crowns for something I want. Well now I can pay this dude $2.49 instead of purchasing a pack for $7.99. So now, not only has random dude A found a way to make money, it is also now costing zeni money.


If I could come up with that example in 5 minutes, imagine how much more exploitive a schemer who put some serious thought into it could be.

Dude no one is going to risk getting banned buying from a Chinese gold farmer just to save a couple bucks on a crown pack! XD

Dude. I don't know why your so blind to your own ambitions, but nobody would get banned. If zenimax implemented a system to give or trade crowns it would get abused. People abuse everything. PC players that came over to console with their accounts of fortunes of gold and bloated the market for the items. Did they get banned? Nope. It was a system that was part of the game and completely legit.

Merlight

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Crown price is fixed, unlike in-game gold. That means these "gold seller" companies would still have to buy them from ZOS at the fixed rate.

That means the only way anyone could offer "discount crowns" is to buy them from ZOS and sell them for less!

Or they could flood the game with bots like they did post-launch. Trade their bot-earned gold for Crowns (from players who can't see that Crown transfer equals buying gold/gear with cash). And voila, Crown price is no longer fixed, it's driven by the gold-farmers.

Chaos0720

seratin wrote: »

Chaos0720 wrote: »

You purchase the cheapers $/crown pack for $39.99, you end up with 5500 crowns at 0.73 cents per crown. Resell the crowns for 0.83 cents and you end up making a profit of $5.10.

Why would people do this? The way the crown store is set up you have to buy packs... so let's say I only need 300 crowns for something I want. Well now I can pay this dude $2.49 instead of purchasing a pack for $7.99. So now, not only has random dude A found a way to make money, it is also now costing zeni money.

If I could come up with that example in 5 minutes, imagine how much more exploitive a schemer who put some serious thought into it could be.

First ZOS is always going to make money off this, crowns don't spring up from thin air. Let's get cleared up from the get go.

Are gold sellers a problem, of course, always will be. Just ban them and remove all gold or crowns they've sold. If someone wants to risk wasting money more power to them, I'll buy my crowns legit.

Perhaps they could use the new found revenue from the increased crown purchases (as a market opens up) to hire a gm or two. If I could come up with a rebuttal in 2 minutes time your argument is baseless.

Yes. Because you have an opinion that adds nothing to the conversation you have completely made my argument baseless. All bow down before the great seratin.

Let's clear the air

Person A purchase a crown pack for $40.00

Person B only needs 300 crowns to purchase something. The way it is now, they would need to purchase the $8 pack of crowns. Thus money to ZOS. So ZOS earned $48.

If they added a gifting system (which would get abused), ZOS wouldn't have made that $8 profit, because person A would have gotten paid.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Trolling & Baiting]

seratin

Chaos0720 wrote: »

Yes. Because you have an opinion that adds nothing to the conversation you have completely made my argument baseless. All bow down before the great seratin.

Let's clear the air

Person A purchase a crown pack for $40.00

Person B only needs 300 crowns to purchase something. The way it is now, they would need to purchase the $8 pack of crowns. Thus money to ZOS. So ZOS earned $48.

If they added a gifting system (which would get abused), ZOS wouldn't have made that $8 profit, because person A would have gotten paid.

That's all well and good if you conveniently ignore the fact that lots of people would be buying crowns from other players, hence a lot more people will be buying the 40 packs. If they implement this the demand is going to skyrocket and naturally the supply will increase to match the level of demand. Let me break it down for you.

Players 1-1000 all want the new dlc but can't buy crowns. We'll be nice and say the dlc costs 2k crowns. that's 200,000 crowns that will purchased to match that demand. That's a bit more then 37 packs at 40 dollars each. or roughly $1,480. Sure beats 48 dollars doesn't it. And my numbers are very conservative.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Chaos0720

seratin wrote: »

Chaos0720 wrote: »

Yes. Because you have an opinion that adds nothing to the conversation you have completely made my argument baseless. All bow down before the great seratin.

Let's clear the air

Person A purchase a crown pack for $40.00

Person B only needs 300 crowns to purchase something. The way it is now, they would need to purchase the $8 pack of crowns. Thus money to ZOS. So ZOS earned $48.

If they added a gifting system (which would get abused), ZOS wouldn't have made that $8 profit, because person A would have gotten paid.

That's all well and good if you conveniently ignore the fact that lots of people would be buying crowns from other players, hence a lot more people will be buying the 40 packs. If they implement this the demand is going to skyrocket and naturally the supply will increase to match the level of demand. Let me break it down for you.

Players 1-1000 all want the new dlc but can't buy crowns. We'll be nice and say the dlc costs 2k crowns. that's 200,000 crowns that will purchased to match that demand. That's a bit more then 37 packs at 40 dollars each. or roughly $1,480. Sure beats 48 dollars doesn't it. And my numbers are very conservative.

Yup... sure beats 48 dollars as long as you ignore that fact that my example involved 2 people while your involving 1000. I don't care to figure out what you're trying to get, but if I involved 1000 people as you have it wouldn't just be $48, it would be $24,000.

Eh. You know what. I can't help myself so let me break some *** down for you. And I will use your figures for consistency.

Edit: Actually your math is off, 2000 * 1000 = 2,000,000.

But I'll fix it for ya. No worries.


DLC drops for 2k crowns and 100 people want it but can't afford crowns at the given price.

Person or Company A drops $1479.63 to purchase 203,500 crowns. They paid 0.73 cents per crown. They turn around and sell 2000 crowns for $16.60 (my before mentioned 0.83 cents per crown). They sell to 100 people and end up making $1,660. A net profit of $180+ multiply that by ten since you said 1000 not 100, and boom, 1800$ profit with no effort at all.

Customer gets discounted crowns to buy dlc.

Schemer makes off with money.

Zenimax sits with sad face.


And that's why it will never happen.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]