game still makes you hate being around other players while pveing

MrDenimChicken

I like many of the changes Zenimax has made, but i think it's messed up that I find myself saying: "I can't wait till i get to a higher level zone that has fewer people"...

It's so immersion breaking and dissapointing when I am on a quest to kill some boss at the end of a dungeon, and the whole dungeon is cleared with people just sitting over the boss respawn, only to kill it pretty much instantly. How has this not been changed? It makes me want to just press 11111 for the dialogues for the next 5 quests when something like this happens, because there just isn't a payoff for staying invested in what you are doing anymore. It's kinda of pathetic that this game puts so much investment into the single player questing, with thousands of hours of npc dialogue, only to have a many quests end in such a fizzle.

I get it's an MMO...but I feel like there needs to be some sort of change to fix this. More Instanced dungeons, or that GW2 mechanic where mobs instantly scale up in level depending on how many people are fighting it...just something. I want to actually give a crap about the quests I'm doing.

Akavir_Sentinel

<-- Skyrim is that way. This is an MMO, not an all-about-you single player RPG.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

This is a game where they want us to team up. Putting in solo only instances would be in my opinion a determent to the game.

HexWeaver

I like your idea, Final Fantasy 14 is my favourite MMO and most bosses in the game are instanced which result in big epic battles, always a let down when you arrive into the big boss chamber only to find you're lucky if you can even get a hit in before it drops.

Teiji

I have to politely disagree, I made an illustrious Altmer Templar for the sake of it earlier, stopped to /Flute and /Cheer with a couple of Mer who were engaging in /Drum antics in Khenarthi's Roost as I made my way to help out my homie Rurelion. Was amusing and reminded me to not be so bitter about interacting with other people.

I understand your frustration MrDenimChicken as I remember vividly when you'd see twenty + people in Del's Claim killing the boss every 10 seconds. It was an odd experience, but regardless; the person with the power on whether you give a Dreugh about quests or not - is you.

If the game is becoming a stressful negative experience, you can either get a stressball, play at off-peak times or simply not play. No one is forcing you to get stressed out nor make excuses as to why you can't enjoy quests my friend. I know it may seem that way, but you must find solace in the tranquillity which is Auriel and embrace compassion for your fellow Mer.

Then and only then, can we have an ideal society without the lesser races of beast and man.

MrDenimChicken

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

This is a game where they want us to team up. Putting in solo only instances would be in my opinion a determent to the game.

It seems like most of those people jumping on top of the boss spawn point are solo.....not in groups

and I didn't say "solo only" instances. How bout an option? solo or group? AN OPTION. Or have bosses scale up in lvl like in GW2. Something that makes the boss at the end of a quest not feel like an absolute joke that kills immersion....

it's a shame that so much work zenimax put in with the verbose dialogue and voice acting goes to waste like that

why bother putting so much investment into the single player story experience, to detract from it with mmorpg mechanics, rather than using the mmorpg mechanics to supplement it?

**edit** I like the zen master's response up there^^ but I just make this point because I feel like these changes would make this game so much better. But then again the chance that this post, or any posts we make for that matter, would make a difference to Zenimax is slimmer than winning the lottery while getting eaten by a shark that was struck by lightning all at once.

Taleof2Cities

Just a fair warning ahead of time: End game content contains its own set of errant player behavior, too. It's not just inherent to the lower levels.

There's the one guy in zone chat saying not to farm (insert enemy here) unless you "know the rotation".

Next person is shooting their fire staff at you (in vain) because you happen to be picking a lockbox before they did.

Best one so far, though, is when you're fighting a group of bandits and their welwa pets in Craglorn ... and someone swoops in on the resource node that was the original goal of the fight.

Phinix1

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

I get it's an MMO...but I feel like there needs to be some sort of change to fix this. More Instanced dungeons, or that GW2 mechanic where mobs instantly scale up in level depending on how many people are fighting it...just something. I want to actually give a crap about the quests I'm doing.

They tried lowering the spawn timer, but people were just standing there all day farming soul gems.

I like your idea of having the boss scale up based on how many were in his room. At least in hit points anyway, since people are petty and anything they can do to grief others they will, because they suck, and if the boss attack power increased as well people would just stand there not attacking to see how long someone else could survive the higher damage, maybe inviting some of their derping troll friends to the show.

Tennetty

Concur. We need instanced Delves.

AngryNord

Tennetty wrote: »

Concur. We need instanced Delves.

And then the next demand will be instanced cities? Instanced wilderness? Stop trying to make this game TES:VI, please.

Wyldman

There is a simple fix for this issue. I also am extremely unhappy with getting into a quest and when I get to the delve or boss fights is like was mentioned in the original post ... 8-10 ppl just standing there waiting for the boss to respawn. You get one MAYBE two hits on him and he is dead ... completely destroys the challenge of the game. EASY to fix ... all they have to do is kill the specific quest for all who have already passed it. Once ya kill the boss, you are done and can no longer do damage in that particular delve or boss fight. Would be very easy for them to do that.

stefan.gustavsonb16_ESO

Wyldman wrote: »

Once ya kill the boss, you are done and can no longer do damage in that particular delve or boss fight. Would be very easy for them to do that.

I think you underestimate the complexity of the problem. That would require combat damage calculations to make checks in the quest completion database. There are already too many server side checks being done, causing server lag, and I don't trust the ZOS developers with increasing the complexity of the game without breaking it. Adding this kind of check to the mix would probably just make the lag worse and add a whole new class of quest-breaking bugs. Also, being prevented from doing a certain boss or delve more than once would defeat the purpose of the game: instead of making most non-quest content repeatable to keep people playing, you would run out of things to do after a while.

Junipus

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Best one so far, though, is when you're fighting a group of bandits and their welwa pets in Craglorn ... and someone swoops in on the resource node that was the original goal of the fight.

If that's from Nirncrux farming then I'm assuming you're on the NA server. Every time I've done it on the EU server people have understood that gentlemen's agreement. I'd recommend following that person around next time and standing on each resource node so their interaction UI get screwed up.

Talcon

So many cry babies, just get over it, hit the boss and move on. I for one am glad when there are other people there, means it dies faster and im in and out.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

This is a game where they want us to team up. Putting in solo only instances would be in my opinion a determent to the game.

It seems like most of those people jumping on top of the boss spawn point are solo.....not in groups

and I didn't say "solo only" instances. How bout an option? solo or group? AN OPTION. Or have bosses scale up in lvl like in GW2. Something that makes the boss at the end of a quest not feel like an absolute joke that kills immersion....

it's a shame that so much work zenimax put in with the verbose dialogue and voice acting goes to waste like that

why bother putting so much investment into the single player story experience, to detract from it with mmorpg mechanics, rather than using the mmorpg mechanics to supplement it?

**edit** I like the zen master's response up there^^ but I just make this point because I feel like these changes would make this game so much better. But then again the chance that this post, or any posts we make for that matter, would make a difference to Zenimax is slimmer than winning the lottery while getting eaten by a shark that was struck by lightning all at once.

Just because you arent grouped up doesnt mean you arent working together and teaming up correct? There is no need to make solo only options of public delves. The very fact they are PUBLIC delves and PUBLIC dungeons should tell you something about the intent.

That being said I have yet to find anyone in any of the delves. If I do its one or two people. The days of farming the bosses are over. You dont get loot or xp for a period of time after killing the boss. So that ended that.

MaximumAttackG

bruh this is an mmo, people are always looking for a 1-up on everyone, always looking for the quickest way to do stuff. if you want immersion you should just go play a single player rpg cause I hate to break it to you but you're the minority. I, like most people dont even read the quests or dialog and just want to level, get the best gear and the most gold asap, it may not be that way for everyone buy I think thats the mindset everyone who stick around an mmo long enough gets pulled into.

lathbury

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Best one so far, though, is when you're fighting a group of bandits and their welwa pets in Craglorn ... and someone swoops in on the resource node that was the original goal of the fight.

If that's from Nirncrux farming then I'm assuming you're on the NA server. Every time I've done it on the EU server people have understood that gentlemen's agreement. I'd recommend following that person around next time and standing on each resource node so their interaction UI get screwed up.

nope can confirm there are quite a few of these Nirnc**ts as I call them on EU too. a few good eggs as well but always nervous if someone helps with the trash or is in my vicinty some are V1 alts who have no hope of killing the trash so they wait for you and bolt escape in and out.

Back to the subject in hand blame the folk who called for the nerfs to difficulty because they were bad players who have more than likely left to play witcher on care bear difficulty. If the content was harder with better exp gain a lot of problems would be solved and you would go into a delve relieved if there was someone else there.

I_killed_Vivec

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Best one so far, though, is when you're fighting a group of bandits and their welwa pets in Craglorn ... and someone swoops in on the resource node that was the original goal of the fight.

If that's from Nirncrux farming then I'm assuming you're on the NA server. Every time I've done it on the EU server people have understood that gentlemen's agreement. I'd recommend following that person around next time and standing on each resource node so their interaction UI get screwed up.

Oh it happens on the EU server too.

My attitude is that if you kill the mobs then you get the goods, but there are a lot of people who don't think this way

I've seen people hanging back from a chest until I went in and killed the wasps - sparking off a mad scramble for the chest while I was killing the insects. It's particularly galling when the freeloaders are VR1s who can't handle the mobs and rely on someone else doing the work for them...

At peak times there's parts of Craglorn that are a sprint fest - with sorcs Bolt "Escaping" between nodes

daemonios

You think you have it bad? At launch there were hundreds of bots (and players) farming gold and XP, and one of the most popular ways was camping delve bosses. You'd be lucky to even get a shot at the boss, let alone any immersion. Plus, the spawn time for bosses was absurdly long. I've created several alts recently and done delves all over again, and I rarely find more than 1 or 2 people inside with me. I don't see a problem doing the delve with them. Would you also instance open-world areas because other players can attack the same mob group as you?

eliisra

It's worse now. Many reasons.

They nerfed the difficulty of the landscape massively, while slightly reducing amount of enemies. They buffed player strength versus NPC's.

You will 1-3 shoot most mobs, that's so fast other players wont have time to get credit. Players will compete over the kills, instead of team working to finish the quest. Hostile areas will be wiped in one AoE. So no wonder it's empty when you get there.

Landscape, mob density and difficulty is balanced for one player now. But this is an MMO so there's still going to be 2-3 players doing the same delve or quest. That's when you run into these problems or immersion killers. Not enough monsters or objectives "to share" for everyone, because design for solo and the mobs just melt. So you're mostly waiting or running around in circles waiting for any NPC or a boss to respawn.

They also nerfed amount of exp you get from main quests, dolmens and delves, before they introduced CP. So everyone is a lot more focused on killing the actual mobs now, to get exp and CP. This also results in a lot of dead bodies.

Maybe the game needs more phasing, max 2 random players in one delve? Or they can keep working on and expanding their scaling feature, been good so far.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Two players in a delve? Come on. What kind of nonsense idea is that. You guys need to understand this is NOT Skyrim. There is going to be immersion breaking stuff ALL the time. A public delve is meant to be populated. Thats why its called a public delve.

sdtlc

Not beeing able to kill a delve boss after you killed it once brings us back to make it impossible to help out guildies or friends.

For everyone moaning about immersion breaking: You Sir, you, which believes he's the one and only hero of tamriel, defeating the tremendous evil named Molag Bal, you are breaking the immersion of the one standing next to you, cause he believes the same,....

my two cents

hollamears

I actually used to get irked about things like this as well my first day or two playing the game, but got over it pretty quickly. I remember the moment I stopped letting myself get upset was when I was doing some quest in one of the hundreds of available temples and the NPC mentioned having an option between fighting or not. I got a little excited and decided I wanted to see how far I could get through it by sneaking, and I got pretty far! But sure enough in came a rush of people who wanted to play differently than me, and that means it changed the environment I was creating for myself a great deal.

That moment made me stop holding onto the solo part of the game (even though it seems encouraged) because really, that's not what it is. I do prefer playing alone but I'm starting to appreciate my play time with others more and more as I do it, especially once I stopped acting as if I was the only player in the game.

What you mentioned can seem frustrating but really, it is what it is. This is an online game that houses thousands of other players and they're all going to play how they want to as well. You kind of just have to accept that's how it's going to be and either find other things to enjoy about it, or realize the game just isn't for you and move onto another game (or just wait for an actual TES sequel, since that isn't what this is).

AlnilamE

Is this on console?

Because on PC, the only time you see 8-10 people in a delve is when it's your own guild having an event...

GreySix

AngryNord wrote: »

Tennetty wrote: »

Concur. We need instanced Delves.

And then the next demand will be instanced cities? Instanced wilderness? Stop trying to make this game TES:VI, please.

As the alternative is for Bethesda to release an ES game that facilitates cooperative play (and they haven't and most likely never will), ESO is the only viable alternative.

As it is, ESO already instances much of its content, so not sure where the pushback for a bit more comes from.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

You arent sure where the push back is? You want to limit PUBLIC spaces to only two people.

GreySix

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

You arent sure where the push back is? You want to limit PUBLIC spaces to only two people.

No. Make the boss-fight in said public spaces instanced, so we don't have to see a bunch of other players camping the darn corpse.

Pallmor

MrDenimChicken wrote: »

I like many of the changes Zenimax has made, but i think it's messed up that I find myself saying: "I can't wait till i get to a higher level zone that has fewer people"...

It's so immersion breaking and dissapointing when I am on a quest to kill some boss at the end of a dungeon, and the whole dungeon is cleared with people just sitting over the boss respawn, only to kill it pretty much instantly. How has this not been changed? It makes me want to just press 11111 for the dialogues for the next 5 quests when something like this happens, because there just isn't a payoff for staying invested in what you are doing anymore. It's kinda of pathetic that this game puts so much investment into the single player questing, with thousands of hours of npc dialogue, only to have a many quests end in such a fizzle.

I get it's an MMO...but I feel like there needs to be some sort of change to fix this. More Instanced dungeons, or that GW2 mechanic where mobs instantly scale up in level depending on how many people are fighting it...just something. I want to actually give a crap about the quests I'm doing.

I assume you're playing console. It was like that at first on the PC too. After a few months, things will spread out a little and you'll see less of this boss-camping/overcrowding stuff.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

GreySix wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

You arent sure where the push back is? You want to limit PUBLIC spaces to only two people.

No. Make the boss-fight in said public spaces instanced, so we don't have to see a bunch of other players camping the darn corpse.

No and No. Public spaces are public spaces. You cant just instance the boss area. They already have a system in place for this. You kill the boss once and you get no loot or xp for I think 15 minutes. Possibly longer I dont remember.

GreySix

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

GreySix wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

You arent sure where the push back is? You want to limit PUBLIC spaces to only two people.

No. Make the boss-fight in said public spaces instanced, so we don't have to see a bunch of other players camping the darn corpse.

No and No. Public spaces are public spaces. You cant just instance the boss area. They already have a system in place for this. You kill the boss once and you get no loot or xp for I think 15 minutes. Possibly longer I dont remember.

Yeah, know how it already works, and it's stupid.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

GreySix wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

GreySix wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

You arent sure where the push back is? You want to limit PUBLIC spaces to only two people.

No. Make the boss-fight in said public spaces instanced, so we don't have to see a bunch of other players camping the darn corpse.

No and No. Public spaces are public spaces. You cant just instance the boss area. They already have a system in place for this. You kill the boss once and you get no loot or xp for I think 15 minutes. Possibly longer I dont remember.

Yeah, know how it already works, and it's stupid.

Can you expand on how it is "stupid"? Ive been playing this game since day one. I never see people camping bosses in public spaces anymore because it is pointless. After the first kill you get nothing. Waste of time. Hence why its not a problem anymore.